06-02-17 09:47 PM
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  1. Emaderton3's Avatar
    The US is full of teen girls who would annihilate almost every PKB phone user in "text volume entered into a phone per month", and most of them are "not fully literate" by your definition. Oh, and those same teen girls do this on iPhones.

    So, be careful what claims you make, and what conclusions you draw from them.
    Preach on Troy!

    Posted via CB10
    05-19-17 07:08 PM
  2. tickerguy's Avatar
    Here's where I really do wish I had one a few days ago....

    I'm out in the woods. REALLY in the woods. A system I'm responsible for went down. I can get into it remotely, and I have a signal (not a good one, but a signal) but to restore service I HAVE TO type several long, error-free commands. ONE MISTAKE (like a "return" when you didn't mean it!) and you're screwed -- you are LOCKED OUT and now you're done. The laptop is ~40 miles (roughly 2 days hike!) away (on which I could tether if I had it, but no, I'm not bringing that BACKPACKING!)

    Well, I got it done on the DTEK60, but I won't tell you it was easy. It was NOT. With a PKB? It would have been 5 minutes MAX instead of the 30 it took me, and the "sweating bullets" factor would have been MUCH smaller. Oh, and the bashing away on the DTEK KILLED the battery. The KeyOne wouldn't have been phased at all...

    Will I buy a KeyOne? Don't know yet, but that's the use case for it.
    05-19-17 09:08 PM
  3. stlabrat's Avatar
    The US is full of teen girls who would annihilate almost every PKB phone user in "text volume entered into a phone per month", and most of them are "not fully literate" by your definition. Oh, and those same teen girls do this on iPhones.

    So, be careful what claims you make, and what conclusions you draw from them.
    Oh boy, I just going to buy a key one for teen girl. Look like she is going to like it based on her commitment to study the feature on line. I guess that 15% literacy in teen would be more girls than boys. (she did get English act of 35).

    Posted via CB10
    05-19-17 09:26 PM
  4. maxpowerxiii's Avatar
    TCL will be releasing or announcing an all touch phone in the fall (September possibly). It'll be in the vein of the DTek line but will have a different naming scheme.
    05-19-17 10:40 PM
  5. mister2d's Avatar
    Here's where I really do wish I had one a few days ago....

    I'm out in the woods. REALLY in the woods. A system I'm responsible for went down. I can get into it remotely, and I have a signal (not a good one, but a signal) but to restore service I HAVE TO type several long, error-free commands.
    That's funny. I had a similar incident, but it was an integration system. Fortunately my daily driver was a Passport at the time.
    05-19-17 11:37 PM
  6. C_McD's Avatar
    TCL will be releasing or announcing an all touch phone in the fall (September possibly). It'll be in the vein of the DTek line but will have a different naming scheme.
    That would be of interest to me, but I may not wait. Since the last OS update broke a business apk I need.

    I don't do much social media and never do music or movies, so the KEYone will be a good business fit for me.

    Z30 10.3.3.2205 USA
    05-20-17 07:24 AM
  7. donnation's Avatar

    Literacy has everything to do with preference for a PKB. It's ONLY valuable if you enter a lot of text.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    This may be the most fantastic and ridiculous claim I've ever heard in regards to pkb vs vbk. Congratulations!!!
    05-20-17 08:07 AM
  8. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    If literacy is defined as competence (which it is), you are saying that people who prefer anything other than a PKB are not competent at all. I think you have hit the rev limiter on the amount of hubris you're spewing. Time to back off the throttle or change gears.
    No that is absolutely the opposite of what I am saying. I'm saying that there is a maximum number of users who would likely value a PKB.

    It's possible that lots of fully literate people would prefer a VKB because they prioritize the screen over a keyboard. But it's unlikely that people who rarely type would prefer a PKB.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 11:45 AM
  9. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    The US is full of teen girls who would annihilate almost every PKB phone user in "text volume entered into a phone per month", and most of them are "not fully literate" by your definition. Oh, and those same teen girls do this on iPhones.

    So, be careful what claims you make, and what conclusions you draw from them.
    I am not trying say that highly literate people would prefer a PKB or that it's a better choice for highly literate people. I'm just saying that people who don't type WON'T likely get much value from a PKB.

    I am not one of those people that think one is absolutely superior to the other. I have used both extensively, and have been using BB10's VKB for almost four years now.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 11:49 AM
  10. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    This may be the most fantastic and ridiculous claim I've ever heard in regards to pkb vs vbk. Congratulations!!!
    So, in what way is a PKB useful you don't enter very much text. Is there a use for PKBs I'm not familiar with? I can see that someone who enters a lot of text might prefer a VKB, but I don't know why someone who doesn't would want to give up the screen real estate for a feature they don't use much.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 11:51 AM
  11. Emaderton3's Avatar
    So, in what way is a PKB useful you don't enter very much text. Is there a use for PKBs I'm not familiar with? I can see that someone who enters a lot of text might prefer a VKB, but I don't know why someone who doesn't would want to give up the screen real estate for a feature they don't use much.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Perhaps older folks may benefit. I know my Dad (in his late 70s) has issues typing on VKB.

    Posted via CB10
    05-20-17 02:09 PM
  12. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Perhaps older folks may benefit. I know my Dad (in his late 70s) has issues typing on VKB.

    Posted via CB10
    That's a good point. Also anyone who can't see the keyboard clearly can use touch on a PKB. But MOST PKB users will be very heavy text entry users.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 02:35 PM
  13. thurask's Avatar
    But MOST PKB users will be very heavy text entry users.
    In one language.
    05-20-17 02:52 PM
  14. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    In one language.
    Very true, unless they make each key a tiny screen so they can display multiple alpha-numerics! (Seriously, how cool would that be?)

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 03:06 PM
  15. cgk's Avatar

    Literacy has everything to do with preference for a PKB. It's ONLY valuable if you enter a lot of text.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Where to start with this?

    I am an academic - all of my staff (me included) have PhDs - and our jobs basically involve writing all day every day. Guess what percentage of my staff use PKBs - by your logic the number must be high.

    So what do you think the number is? To the nearest 10% is fine.
    jmr1015 likes this.
    05-20-17 03:10 PM
  16. Q10Bold's Avatar
    #slabex

    Posted via P'9983
    05-20-17 03:23 PM
  17. thurask's Avatar
    Very true, unless they make each key a tiny screen so they can display multiple alpha-numerics! (Seriously, how cool would that be?)

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Cool, yes. Affordable, no. Durable, probably not.
    05-20-17 03:24 PM
  18. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Where to start with this?

    I am an academic - all of my staff (me included) have PhDs - and our jobs basically involve writing all day every day. Guess what percentage of my staff use PKBs - by your logic the number must be high.

    So what do you think the number is? To the nearest 10% is fine.
    Honestly, I have no way of knowing. The number could be zero. I'm saying that, in general, the upper bound on PKB users will be a fraction of the general population. There is no lower bound.

    My whole point is that, no matter how great a PKB phone is, it will AT MOST appeal only to people who need to produce significant quantities of text on their handsets. That excludes most of the world 's mobile phone buyers. I am not saying anything about whether the fraction of people who have to produce large quantities of text on a handset would prefer a PKB or a VKB.

    I use and like both myself. I don't have a preference for text entry, but I have a strong preference for a PKB when editing long documents, because I find the cursor control for selecting and inserting text much more precise.

    Please reread my original post for context. I am only claiming that people who type a lot are more likely to prefer a PKB than people who don't type, not that people who type a lot are more likely to prefer a PKB to a VKB.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 03:50 PM
  19. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Literacy has everything to do with preference for a PKB. It's ONLY valuable if you enter a lot of text.
    I'm quoting myself to explicate what I wrote for people who are having a hard time parsing it.

    I'm saying that someone who prefers a PKB is likely to be someone who has to produce a lot of text on their phone. But I am NOT saying that someone who has to produce a lot of text on their phone is likely to prefer a PKB. One does not imply the other.

    If

    1) A is the set of all mobile phone users.
    2) B is the set of highly literate phone users who have to produce text on their phones
    3) C is the set of mobile phone users who prefer PKBs

    Then I am suggesting that, in general,
    1) C is a subset of B
    2) Members of set B are more likely to prefer a PKB than members of A who are not members of B.

    Note that this in no way implies that members of B are more likely to prefer a PKB than a VKB.

    Finally, if it's still not clear, imagine this scenario:
    2.5 billion members of set A
    250 million members of set B
    10 thousand members of set C
    9 thousand of the members of set C are in set B.

    In that example, membership in C is highly correlated with membership in B, but the converse is not true.
    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Last edited by bb10adopter111; 05-20-17 at 04:14 PM.
    05-20-17 03:59 PM
  20. stlabrat's Avatar
    Where to start with this?

    I am an academic - all of my staff (me included) have PhDs - and our jobs basically involve writing all day every day. Guess what percentage of my staff use PKBs - by your logic the number must be high.

    So what do you think the number is? To the nearest 10% is fine.
    Just curious, you mean all your team writing all day using vkb?no desk top or laptop kb?or you means no body use pkb smartphone?
    In addition, what field you are in? Voice activated? But that is not consider writing all day.
    Posted via CB10
    05-20-17 06:38 PM
  21. keyboardweeb's Avatar
    This thread last couple of days: everybody reading way too much into a simple remark by @bb10adopter111. Sometimes deliberately.
    05-20-17 06:42 PM
  22. anon(679606)'s Avatar
    Writing all day on a phone whatever method is a two thumb affair. I can manage about 30+ WPM or a bit more depending while on my favorite computer keyboard (IBM SpaceSaver II) on which I can manage around 50+ WPM and have exceeded 70 on a roll... generally, NOBODY will bang out that kind of production on a phone...
    05-20-17 07:02 PM
  23. anon(679606)'s Avatar
    Oh yeah, the PhDs noted above, and I would guess NONE are on PKB phones..
    05-20-17 07:04 PM
  24. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Writing all day on a phone whatever method is a two thumb affair. I can manage about 30+ WPM or a bit more depending while on my favorite computer keyboard (IBM SpaceSaver II) on which I can manage around 50+ WPM and have exceeded 70 on a roll... generally, NOBODY will bang out that kind of production on a phone...
    Right. A full-sized keyboard would always be better, but it's not always an option. With flick to type, I can get close to 60 WPM on my VKB BB10 phone vs. 75 WPM on a computer KB, but I make more mistakes on the VKB and complex editing (moving paragraphs and larger sections of text) is a PITA.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    05-20-17 07:15 PM
  25. cgk's Avatar
    Just curious, you mean all your team writing all day using vkb?no desk top or laptop kb?or you means no body use pkb smartphone?
    I purely meant smartphones and the answer is... ZERO.

    In addition, what field you are in?
    Management with a concentration on information management and mobile technology.
    05-21-17 06:43 AM
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