06-14-17 06:00 PM
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  1. ofesad's Avatar
    Hi guys. Marcelo here from Argentina.
    I've been expecting the K1 since day 1 it was announced. It was very sad for me when it was delayed, but even more with the stock problems: Here in Argentina we don't get the phone yet. So I booked a flight to Chile next week, where a importer did a pre-sale and ordered K1's to USA.
    Anyway... now I'm going to Chile just for fun because he has no stock of the K1 or even know when he would receive'em.

    Any case, I was following the issue with the #BBBendGate and I was thinking: Could it be really solved just with glue?

    For example, my old and trusty Q10 it doesn't have any glue on the screen to hold it. (I know, I open it and changed the display).
    However, if you try to bend it is hard as f... mostly beacause of the chasis (aluminun alloy).

    So... Maybe the K1 has a poorly designed chasis / lack of reinforcements or the alluminum/alloy grade it's not strong enough.
    Last edited by ofesad; 06-09-17 at 03:42 PM.
    06-09-17 03:17 PM
  2. CrackNutRun's Avatar
    Very thoughtful of you to reverse the order of appearance of the answer-quote.
    06-09-17 03:33 PM
  3. cbvinh's Avatar
    Hi guys. Marcelo here from Argentina.
    I've been expecting the K1 since day 1 it was announced. It was very sad for me when it was delayed, but even more with the stock problems: Here in Argentina we don't get the phone yet. So I booked a flight to Chile next week, where a importer did a pre-sale and ordered K1's to USA.
    Anyway... now I'm going to Chile just for fun because he has no stock of the K1 or even know when he would receive'em.

    Any case, I was following the issue with the #BBBendGate and I was thinking: Could it be really solved just with glue?

    For example, my old and trusty Q10 it doesn't have any glue on the screen to hold it. (I know, I open it and changed the display).
    However, if you try to bend it is hard as f... mostly beacause of the chasis (aluminun alloy).

    So... Maybe it's a poorly designed chasis / lack of reinforcements or the alluminum/alloy grade it's not strong enough.
    Have you tried putting your thumbs at the center back of the Q10 and pushing as hard as you can?
    06-09-17 03:35 PM
  4. CrackNutRun's Avatar
    CrackBerry Kevin
    CrackBerry Founder
    Dude. Hesitation to drop because if anything *did* happen -- scratches, dents, etc. -- I wouldn't be able to get another one.

    Originally Posted by CrackNutRun
    The problem was known from the beginning. Watch CB Kevin's hesitation to drop-test the phone:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_con...&v=7PjA3uxQu60.


    Very thoughtful of you to reverse the order of appearance. Usually the quote is followed by the answer, isn't it?
    06-09-17 03:40 PM
  5. conite's Avatar
    So, according to CNET (not fans of BlackBerry by any means):

    "CNET editor Roger Cheng also has the phone, and said he can't replicate the problem with a bend test or prying off the display."

    David Katzmaier:
    "After some pretty extreme tests -- dropping the phone ten different times on carpet and then on wood, and bending it forcibly four times -- the screen did finally pop off."
    ray689 and stlabrat like this.
    06-09-17 03:43 PM
  6. krazyatom's Avatar
    So, according to CNET (not fans of BlackBerry by any means):

    "CNET editor Roger Cheng also has the phone, and said he can't replicate the problem with a bend test or prying off the display."

    David Katzmaier:
    "After some pretty extreme tests -- dropping the phone ten different times on carpet and then on wood, and bending it forcibly four times -- the screen did finally pop off."
    He probably received review units with glue on it?
    06-09-17 03:54 PM
  7. conite's Avatar
    He probably received review units with glue on it?
    No. They said there was no adhesive.
    06-09-17 03:56 PM
  8. stlabrat's Avatar
    look like K1 passed drop test... good to know. thx
    06-09-17 04:14 PM
  9. ray689's Avatar
    Still waiting on the CBK video. I remember him mentioning on a podcast that he does his videos in 15 minutes typically so this one must be real in depth.
    06-09-17 04:21 PM
  10. ofesad's Avatar
    Have you tried putting your thumbs at the center back of the Q10 and pushing as hard as you can?
    I did. And I did it again. Just for you.

    06-09-17 04:26 PM
  11. CrackBerry Kevin's Avatar
    Just finished shooting my CBK KEYone Durability video!

    Took a couple hours to shoot as we switched locations a few times (not just in the studio). Friday afternoon and my editor had to head out, so she can't get the editing done today... she's going to try and work on it Sunday evening, but may be later Monday before the final edit is ready to go up.

    Can definitely share some spoiler alerts though since this is such a hot topic.

    Bought FOUR new KEYones from Rogers for it (1 was the Pre-Order unit I unboxed on last CB Podcast, and 3 I bought last night). I labeled each of them at the start so you'd know if I would try to bait and switch you. Lol. I only used 2 of the 4. Also had an iPhone 7 Plus and Galaxy S8+ for comparisons.

    I did a bunch of "real world" tests....

    1. In the House Test - dropped them all on carpet from waste height. No issues. Then tossed them up in the air like 8 feet. Hard lands. No screen issues at all. Had a couple of the battery door pins on the KEYone pop out, but they snap back into place right away and hold well.

    2. Switched up to the Office test, and from my standing desk let them slide off the edge and they fell flat on the ground. Everything survived.

    3. Then I did the Roll out of Bed or off the couch and step on my phone test. I actually do this accidentally all the time, so stepped on the KEYone a bunch of times (w/ 205lbs on it). A little jumping too! Survived that.

    4. Then the fun part.... went outside and did the Tesla Launch Mode Drop Test. Put 2 KEYones and iPhone 7 Plus and S8+ on roof of car, put in launch mode and gunned it. Devices slammed to concrete. iPhone 7 Plus shattered it's screen, and the S8+ shattered the back. Both KEYones survived this OK! So after that, just left to destroy BB's...

    5. The Angry Spouse Throws Phone at You Test... went old school here and put an BlackBerry 8700 and 9700 up against the KEYone. Threw the phones against brick wall (fully expecting them all to break). KEYone display did break here. Same with the 8700. 9700 actually survived!

    6. After that, I took the KEYone apart... bent it hard and popped out display. So, interesting thing here is that THERE IS adhesive.... it's all around the edges of the display. Like a thin strip of black-ish caulking. If you watch JerryRig's video, there IS the same caulking in that video -- he's wrong to say there's "absolutely no adhesive" because there absolutely is. I just watch the video and you can see it. It's not under the metallic parts, but on the perimeter around the edge. Could more be done to cement that display into place? Maybe.... but given the testing and the real "normal world abuse" I've given my KEYone over the past few months, don't think it's really an issue issue. Though given the occurrences of some letting go, I'd assume they do even more to lock in place. But if you own a KEYone already, I dunno.. I wouldn't worry about it unless you plan on twisting and bending the hell out of it. And if you do end up having an issue, I'm going to assume it'll be covered under warranty, etc.

    7. After that, I took another KEYone and did a toilet test. It's not rated for being water proof but I was curious to see how it would hold up. It survived a dunk (where it was in water for just a couple seconds fully submerged). I then put it back in for a full out swim and drowned it. This did kill it... didn't take too long. So, I definitely wouldn't take your KEYone swimming. But splashes on it, etc. should be totes fine (just like any other BB).

    8. After I killed that one swimming, I tried to straight out bend it in half. Wasn't easy at allll to make it bend. Eventually did bend it, but I think this was plenty tough my normal standards (I'm not a weakling).

    9. Also did the good 'ole sit test, which I always sit on my KEYone and never have an issue with.

    So overall, I'd say you're all going to hopefully appreciate the video. Think it'll be a pretty solid / fair assessment (and if you're not happy with it we can always do more).

    My takeaways:

    - Overall, held up well on its own and against iPhone 7 Plus and S8+

    - When it comes to drops, more than display letting go, I'd say first likely thing to happen is that the battery door clips that hold it in might let go, but you should be able to pop them back into place pretty easily if that happens without issue.

    - There is adhesive holding in the display -- I can even see it in JerryRig's video -- but it's more like this caulking adhesive around all of the edges of the display (not under the metal). Is there more they can do to lock that sucker down? Maybe. Would I worry about it? Based on my experiences today and over the past few months... Nope.

    JerryRigEverything's KEYone video is out...-img_20170609_1315419.jpgJerryRigEverything's KEYone video is out...-img_20170609_1415161.jpgJerryRigEverything's KEYone video is out...-img_20170609_1456006.jpg
    06-09-17 04:51 PM
  12. Scovik's Avatar
    So, according to CNET (not fans of BlackBerry by any means):

    "CNET editor Roger Cheng also has the phone, and said he can't replicate the problem with a bend test or prying off the display."

    David Katzmaier:
    "After some pretty extreme tests -- dropping the phone ten different times on carpet and then on wood, and bending it forcibly four times -- the screen did finally pop off."
    So what is your conclusion after this? Could it be bad QC? Could it be that the newer units have already resolved this issue?
    06-09-17 04:53 PM
  13. Scovik's Avatar
    Just finished shooting my CBK KEYone Durability video!

    Took a couple hours to shoot as we switched locations a few times (not just in the studio). Friday afternoon and my editor had to head out, so she can't get the editing done today... she's going to try and work on it Sunday evening, but may be later Monday before the final edit is ready to go up.

    Can definitely share some spoiler alerts though since this is such a hot topic.

    Bought FOUR new KEYones from Rogers for it (1 was the Pre-Order unit I unboxed on last CB Podcast, and 3 I bought last night). I labeled each of them at the start so you'd know if I would try to bait and switch you. Lol. I only used 2 of the 4. Also had an iPhone 7 Plus and Galaxy S8+ for comparisons.

    I did a bunch of "real world" tests....

    1. In the House Test - dropped them all on carpet from waste height. No issues. Then tossed them up in the air like 8 feet. Hard lands. No screen issues at all. Had a couple of the battery door pins on the KEYone pop out, but they snap back into place right away and hold well.

    2. Switched up to the Office test, and from my standing desk let them slide off the edge and they fell flat on the ground. Everything survived.

    3. Then I did the Roll out of Bed or off the couch and step on my phone test. I actually do this accidentally all the time, so stepped on the KEYone a bunch of times (w/ 205lbs on it). A little jumping too! Survived that.

    4. Then the fun part.... went outside and did the Tesla Launch Mode Drop Test. Put 2 KEYones and iPhone 7 Plus and S8+ on roof of car, put in launch mode and gunned it. Devices slammed to concrete. iPhone 7 Plus shattered it's screen, and the S8+ shattered the back. Both KEYones survived this OK! So after that, just left to destroy BB's...

    5. The Angry Spouse Throws Phone at You Test... went old school here and put an BlackBerry 8700 and 9700 up against the KEYone. Threw the phones against brick wall (fully expecting them all to break). KEYone display did break here. Same with the 8700. 9700 actually survived!

    6. After that, I took the KEYone apart... bent it hard and popped out display. So, interesting thing here is that THERE IS adhesive.... it's all around the edges of the display. Like a thin strip of black-ish caulking. If you watch JerryRig's video, there IS the same caulking in that video -- he's wrong to say there's "absolutely no adhesive" because there absolutely is. I just watch the video and you can see it. It's not under the metallic parts, but on the perimeter around the edge. Could more be done to cement that display into place? Maybe.... but given the testing and the real "normal world abuse" I've given my KEYone over the past few months, don't think it's really an issue issue. Though given the occurrences of some letting go, I'd assume they do even more to lock in place. But if you own a KEYone already, I dunno.. I wouldn't worry about it unless you plan on twisting and bending the hell out of it. And if you do end up having an issue, I'm going to assume it'll be covered under warranty, etc.

    7. After that, I took another KEYone and did a toilet test. It's not rated for being water proof but I was curious to see how it would hold up. It survived a dunk (where it was in water for just a couple seconds fully submerged). I then put it back in for a full out swim and drowned it. This did kill it... didn't take too long. So, I definitely wouldn't take your KEYone swimming. But splashes on it, etc. should be totes fine (just like any other BB).

    8. After I killed that one swimming, I tried to straight out bend it in half. Wasn't easy at allll to make it bend. Eventually did bend it, but I think this was plenty tough my normal standards (I'm not a weakling).

    9. Also did the good 'ole sit test, which I always sit on my KEYone and never have an issue with.

    So overall, I'd say you're all going to hopefully appreciate the video. Think it'll be a pretty solid / fair assessment (and if you're not happy with it we can always do more).

    My takeaways:

    - Overall, held up well on its own and against iPhone 7 Plus and S8+

    - When it comes to drops, more than display letting go, I'd say first likely thing to happen is that the battery door clips that hold it in might let go, but you should be able to pop them back into place pretty easily if that happens without issue.

    - There is adhesive holding in the display -- I can even see it in JerryRig's video -- but it's more like this caulking adhesive around all of the edges of the display (not under the metal). Is there more they can do to lock that sucker down? Maybe. Would I worry about it? Based on my experiences today and over the past few months... Nope.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Well, your post is encouraging, waiting for the video
    nolimits7 likes this.
    06-09-17 05:02 PM
  14. ofesad's Avatar

    6. After that, I took the KEYone apart... bent it hard and popped out display. So, interesting thing here is that THERE IS adhesive.... it's all around the edges of the display. Like a thin strip of black-ish caulking. If you watch JerryRig's video, there IS the same caulking in that video -- he's wrong to say there's "absolutely no adhesive" because there absolutely is. I just watch the video and you can see it. It's not under the metallic parts, but on the perimeter around the edge. Could more be done to cement that display into place? Maybe.... but given the testing and the real "normal world abuse" I've given my KEYone over the past few months, don't think it's really an issue issue. Though given the occurrences of some letting go, I'd assume they do even more to lock in place. But if you own a KEYone already, I dunno.. I wouldn't worry about it unless you plan on twisting and bending the hell out of it.
    Maybe it's something like it happend to the Nintendo Switch controllers that a production machine was malfunctioning causing some controllers to have problems.

    Could be that the machine putting glue has some issue or the glue used in a specific machine is bad or a bad batch.

    That would explain a lot
    06-09-17 05:04 PM
  15. cbvinh's Avatar
    I did. And I did it again. Just for you.

    Thanks for going through the effort. The reason I requested the center of the Q10 is because that's the part without frame support.
    06-09-17 05:08 PM
  16. The_Dark_Knight_Forever's Avatar
    Caulking is not adhesive. Caulking is meant to cover gaps & keep moisture, debris, etc out. Not to secure things. It should've been designed with screws & tabs securing the display. Will be interesting to see the video.
    eldeadache likes this.
    06-09-17 05:13 PM
  17. Meok's Avatar
    I am returning my k1 to Amazon after watching this video.
    I wouldn't return it based on his test. Kevin is going to do a test. At least see how many people can reproduce it
    krazyatom likes this.
    06-09-17 05:15 PM
  18. eldeadache's Avatar
    - There is adhesive holding in the display -- I can even see it in JerryRig's video -- but it's more like this caulking adhesive around all of the edges of the display (not under the metal). Is there more they can do to lock that sucker down? Maybe. Would I worry about it? Based on my experiences today and over the past few months... Nope.
    Caulking adhesive does not solve anything. Okay, the screen might be protected against things getting under it, but it is not really held down. JerryRig is right - there is "zero adhesive holding it in place". And that's why 10 people (+JerryRig) had their screen fall off or come loose.

    Thank you for testing, I am very happy with how much this phone is able to survive, but I'm really more afraid of my screen coming off without any incentive than myself stepping on it or letting it fall from my desk/car.

    Would I buy a phone that will fall to pieces if I drop it? I would. Will I buy a phone that survives drops but can't keep the screen in place? Nope, because I trust myself more than I trust the phone.
    ofesad likes this.
    06-09-17 05:18 PM
  19. mikeydodds's Avatar
    Tesla drop test?
    jamesharmeling and Dave Liao like this.
    06-09-17 05:28 PM
  20. CrackBerry Kevin's Avatar
    Look, I'm using the word "caulking"... that may or may not be accurate. It's a thin strip of "something" around all of the edges.. it's tacky/sticky.. so seems adhesive-like in nature. Not a chemist nor have the equipment here to tell you what it's made of. But if there's more that can be done to hold that sucker down, obviously a good thing to do and I'm all for it. Again, I was 3 months on a single unit with quite a lot of abuse and didn't see issue and wasn't trying to baby it. But if there are issues (still seems like we're talking a couple handfuls reported out of I'm guessing many thousands sold) I'm sure BBMobile will work to improve it. Durability a hallmark of BlackBerry - so hate to see anything like this every get experienced even if only a few. I like my BB's to be built like brick **** houses. Still love my 8700

    Caulking is not adhesive. Caulking is meant to cover gaps & keep moisture, debris, etc out. Not to secure things. It should've been designed with screws & tabs securing the display. Will be interesting to see the video.
    06-09-17 05:29 PM
  21. CrackBerry Kevin's Avatar
    Tesla drop test?
    Put them on the roof of my Tesla. Put car in launch mode. Floor it. Phones fly off and land on concrete.
    nolimits7 and FF22 like this.
    06-09-17 05:29 PM
  22. anon(9353145)'s Avatar
    6. After that, I took the KEYone apart... bent it hard and popped out display. So, interesting thing here is that THERE IS adhesive.... it's all around the edges of the display. Like a thin strip of black-ish caulking. If you watch JerryRig's video, there IS the same caulking in that video -- he's wrong to say there's "absolutely no adhesive" because there absolutely is. I just watch the video and you can see it. It's not under the metallic parts, but on the perimeter around the edge. Could more be done to cement that display into place? Maybe.... but given the testing and the real "normal world abuse" I've given my KEYone over the past few months, don't think it's really an issue issue. Though given the occurrences of some letting go, I'd assume they do even more to lock in place. But if you own a KEYone already, I dunno.. I wouldn't worry about it unless you plan on twisting and bending the hell out of it. And if you do end up having an issue, I'm going to assume it'll be covered under warranty, etc.
    THANK YOU for #6 in particular. Now can all the Chicken Littles on this forum please remove your fist from the panic button and stop screaming about the end of the world, lol.

    TCL should still make a statement on the issue and if necessary, add a little bit more adhesive to the screen just to kill this issue for once and for all.

    And maybe we can have a few days peace on the forum and the KeyONE owners can maybe talk about how much they like their new devices without someone encouraging us to immediately return our wonderful devices (because they're really defective, don't ya know?)

    This is in no way directed at KeyONE users who had legitimate issues with unresponsive keys, screen lift / pop or any other defect. It's at the non-owners who have latched onto the issue and gone to town on the forums with hysteria and hyperbole.

    The Sky, it seems, is not falling.

    /rant
    Roadie29, king benny and nolimits7 like this.
    06-09-17 05:32 PM
  23. anon(10255518)'s Avatar
    Thanks for doing the testing, video, and spoiler.
    06-09-17 05:39 PM
  24. krazyatom's Avatar
    I wouldn't return it based on his test. Kevin is going to do a test. At least see how many people can reproduce it
    Well I can always wait for modified batch. No adhesive just doesn't make sense to me.
    06-09-17 05:44 PM
  25. anon(10255518)'s Avatar
    Same thing twice because crackberry.
    Last edited by AwkwardUnkleHug; 06-09-17 at 05:59 PM.
    jamesharmeling likes this.
    06-09-17 05:44 PM
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