[slagman5]

Apple and Samsung spend tens of millions on market research. If there was an appreciable market, they would have serviced it.

We also know that the desire for a pkb was weak enough to not warrant buying BB10 in any real numbers.

I have to respectfully disagree. When Apple first made the iPhone, pkb's were the popular thing. I'm sure market research would tell you the majority of people would not want to be forced to buy proprietary charging cables, the majority would want expandable memory, and the majority would want a headphone jack. Apple doesn't go by what people want, they tell the people what they should want. They choose not to make pkb phones because it goes against their image. I'm sure it would cost them more in r&d and in manufacturing costs so it makes no sense for them since they make more than enough profit from their existing style phones.

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[conite]

I have to respectfully disagree. When Apple first made the iPhone, pkb's were the popular thing. I'm sure market research would tell you the majority of people would not want to be forced to buy proprietary charging cables, the majority would want expandable memory, and the majority would want a headphone jack. Apple doesn't go by what people want, they tell the people what they should want. They choose not to make pkb phones because it goes against their image. I'm sure it would cost them more in r&d and in manufacturing costs so it makes no sense for them since they make more than enough profit from their existing style phones.

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

There are dozens of Android manufacturers that try to cover every conceivable niche. Where are the pkb devices?

[slagman5]

There are dozens of Android manufacturers that try to cover every conceivable niche. Where are the pkb devices?

They existed until Apple made all-touch phones cool. I don't personally like Apple because of several reasons, but there's no arguing that they are great at selling an image.

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[conite]

They existed until Apple made all-touch phones cool. I don't personally like Apple because of several reasons, but there's no arguing that they are great at selling an image.

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

So you think that market research has indicated that pkb devices have a significant following, but device makers aren't making them because it's "not cool" ?

[slagman5]

So you think that market research has indicated that pkb devices have a significant following, but device makers aren't making them because it's "not cool" ?

No, I'm simply saying that companies like Apple and Samsung are not all-touch only due to this type of market research. I never said that I think the demand for pkb is somehow the majority, but any survey I've ever seen for mobile phones don't even bother to mention a pkb. It's simply not an option and none of the companies want to venture into it because they know they can make their sales just fine with all-touches, whether there's a demand for pkb's or not. I guess whatever demand there is for pkb's, it's not strong enough for enough consumers to not buy an Android or iOS phone just to get it. Doesn't mean that if there was a pkb device that meets all of the other needs (good camera, apps, decent specs, etc) that people won't buy it.

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[mrsean2k]

We are years down the line from the point that the notion of the superiority of an all-touch interface was first evangelised by Apple

It's been an interesting experiment. My conclusion is that a PKB is far more productive for a wide range of tasks.

The market for 3rd-party cases with built in PKB for tablet devices, cheap devices like the MIIX series, and swish magnetic hybrid high end devices like the Surface PRO would indicate I'm not alone.

We are a whole generation further on, and this is a generation who don't feel uncomfortable using keyboard shortcuts in a non-technical context.

So I'd say we're at a point in the cycle where a PKB on a phone will again be seized on as an advantage - even if it just seems an ironic novelty purchase at first.

[chagheill]

That's an interesting perspective. I'm definitely on the side that believes PKB > all touch especially when it comes to typing efficiency.
The questions is: when that time comes, will BB be able to capitalize, or will the Apple's and Samsung's still dominate the market.

[Exoskell256]

The market for 3rd-party cases with built in PKB for tablet devices, cheap devices like the MIIX series, and swish magnetic hybrid high end devices like the Surface PRO would indicate I'm not alone.

No doubt about it, a PKB will be more productive for certain tasks, but all of the example devices you mention are tablets with removable PKBs. Having a PKB baked into a small form-factor device is a whole different matter.

There are still plenty of scenarios where the keyboard has no significant use case - many games, web browsing, etc. Would people trade off screen real estate (or a bigger phone) to have a permanent PKB in those scenarios? Not sure about that but I am somewhat skeptical (switching back and forth between my personal Q10 and work iPhone 6s makes me wish they hadn't cancelled that BB10 slider). Combine that with a usable (with autocorrect) touchscreen keyboard and I don't see a large number of people clamouring for a PKB phone. Some, sure, but enough to justify the R&D, manufacturing, and marketing for an extra model?

Another complication would be app support if the device screen is shrunk down, Q10-style, to make room for the PKB. Developers would have to decide whether the effort required to add support for another aspect ratio/resolution is worthwhile. Missing apps or lousy app experience won't help with the popularity of the device either.

Short of a slider form factor, I think the best compromise would be a removable attachment, but seeing as how BB nuked Typo I'm not sure if we'll see anything from a third party in the near future.

If all the big manufacturers come out with slider phones one day, that would be pretty cool. One day...

[pineapple2607]

2017 is too late

Posted via CB10

[Edward Ochume]

The vkb for now is for blackberry to at least break even. But pkb have always been their speciality of which once they are afloat they will now specialize in.

Posted via CB10

[chagheill]

2017 is too late

Posted via CB10

i agree!
im hoping that the extended wait will translate to a better (and reasonably priced) handset for consumers.

[Niels B]

Everyday, when iPhone ansd Galaxy users see my Passport they tell me: Oh, I wish I still had a pkb...

[BB-JAM215]

Everyday, when iPhone ansd Galaxy users see my Passport they tell me: Oh, I wish I still had a pkb...

But how many would actually buy one if it wasn't made by Apple or Samsung?

[qwerty4ever]

Does anybody know the size of the rumoured phone with pkb for early 2017 release?

I searched but didn't find anything useful.

Posted via CB10

The new BlackBerry smartphones with physical keyboard will measure 30 cm wide and 5 cm high plus the option of an IBM Model M keyboard for those of us who appreciate high-quality keyboards that last decades if not your lifetime. Was this answer helpful? ROFLMAO

BlackBerry Priv with CrackBerry App for Android

[Travis Dobrovolny]

Do you guys remember the keyboard attachment for Iphones that came out a couple of years ago and how popular they were? I think it was Ryan Seacrest (?) who was a backer of some kind. Granted they totally ripped off the BlackBerry keyboard and were shut down due to it........ but that shows there is a market for the pkb's on other platforms. Even the Isheeple users.

Posted via CB10

[idssteve]

Do you guys remember the keyboard attachment for Iphones that came out a couple of years ago and how popular they were? I think it was Ryan Seacrest (?) who was a backer of some kind. Granted they totally ripped off the BlackBerry keyboard and were shut down due to it........ but that shows there is a market for the pkb's on other platforms. Even the Isheeple users.

Posted via CB10

The "Typo" ?? Seems like BB's lawyers got involved, if I recall... ???

[idssteve]

Oops, Typo already mentioned by name earlier, I see:

No doubt about it, a PKB will be more productive for certain tasks, but all of the example devices you mention are tablets with removable PKBs. Having a PKB baked into a small form-factor device is a whole different matter.

There are still plenty of scenarios where the keyboard has no significant use case - many games, web browsing, etc. Would people trade off screen real estate (or a bigger phone) to have a permanent PKB in those scenarios? Not sure about that but I am somewhat skeptical (switching back and forth between my personal Q10 and work iPhone 6s makes me wish they hadn't cancelled that BB10 slider). Combine that with a usable (with autocorrect) touchscreen keyboard and I don't see a large number of people clamouring for a PKB phone. Some, sure, but enough to justify the R&D, manufacturing, and marketing for an extra model?

Another complication would be app support if the device screen is shrunk down, Q10-style, to make room for the PKB. Developers would have to decide whether the effort required to add support for another aspect ratio/resolution is worthwhile. Missing apps or lousy app experience won't help with the popularity of the device either.

Short of a slider form factor, I think the best compromise would be a removable attachment, but seeing as how BB nuked Typo I'm not sure if we'll see anything from a third party in the near future.

If all the big manufacturers come out with slider phones one day, that would be pretty cool. One day...

[idssteve]

If it's the size of a permanently extended Priv, they can count me out. At least until my Classic and/or 9900 become unusable. My Classic sits on desk more than in hand simply because my 9900 is more invitingly comfortable in hand.

How much screenestate is needed while typing on pkb?
Top heavy proportions of excess screenestate is too frequently counterproductive to comfortable PKB operation, in my experience. Fwiw.

My brief exposure to Priv convinced me that the thing is too long and too top heavy WHILE TYPING. Sliding to access the Priv's PKB alters handset size in the wrong direction WHILE TYPING! For me, anyway. The device then shortens to its most compact length while movie watching. Who cares about a compact handset for movie watching. ?? Priv's "screen-centric" prioritization makes it the wrong size for the wrong activity. Imo.

Fwiw, my "dream handset" would relocate Priv's PKB to the FRONT of the handset where it can be used while retracted and device is most compact. And then extended to uncover the bottom half of screen when more sceenestate is wanted. Added benefit of ready access to PKB shortcuts, also.

Obviously, AR would need to transition from 4:3 to whatever... While dreaming, how about a front PKB slider with retracted form reminiscent of Bold/Q and extended form approaching extended Priv? ???

Just my .02. Of course Chen hasn't called seeking my advice lately. (Ever!) Lol.