[Mercuryuser]

Not going to name stores cos don't want to affect anyone's job but these guys are the Halford mechanics of the phone world. Just for those outside the UK who don't get the Halford reference, think chimpanzees with hammers.

Half these guys haven't heard of the device and act very sniffy when you ask them anything about it.

One store when I asked about the cases told me to go on ebay and buy a third party case. Didn't offer to investigate when they might be available. I told this guy that customer service was dying and he personally delivered the death blow. He didn't seem to understand that to direct me to ebay isn't helpful and the correct thing to do would be to investigate and contact me when they become available.

Finally a friend of mine was actively dissuaded from buying one. Upon speaking to my mate I was able to realise he wasn't even talking about the keyone as all the info related to the priv.

Now I don't wanna mess with minimum wage which is why I'm not naming stores , but I really think CPW need to deal with this. Lack of marketing is one thing but these guys are actively damaging sales

[BBRYQ10]

Not going to name stores cos don't want to affect anyone's job but these guys are the Halford mechanics of the phone world. Just for those outside the UK who don't get the Halford reference, think chimpanzees with hammers.

Half these guys haven't heard of the device and act very sniffy when you ask them anything about it.

One store when I asked about the cases told me to go on ebay and buy a third party case. Didn't offer to investigate when they might be available. I told this guy that customer service was dying and he personally delivered the death blow. He didn't seem to understand that to direct me to ebay isn't helpful and the correct thing to do would be to investigate and contact me when they become available.

Finally a friend of mine was actively dissuaded from buying one. Upon speaking to my mate I was able to realise he wasn't even talking about the keyone as all the info related to the priv.

Now I don't wanna mess with minimum wage which is why I'm not naming stores , but I really think CPW need to deal with this. Lack of marketing is one thing but these guys are actively damaging sales

Nothing new. BlackBerry has been the redheaded stepchild for a few years now.

[Mercuryuser]

Nothing new. BlackBerry has been the redheaded stepchild for a few years now.

You telling me I bought the phone equivalent of Ed sheeran ?

[Mikey_NNG]

Anytime I see people complain about this type of thing, I always wonder if they see the other side. This is a phone which is for the most part online-only from a company with less than 1% share of the market. It's available in limited stores and of the stores that does have them, few will have it on display. You going into CPW asking for detailed info on the Keyone, is like going into Sports Direct asking when the Hoffenheim FC kit will be released.

Sure, they should know about every phone but the reality is that few will outside of iPhone and the major Android players. Heck, when I went to the Keyone launch, the guy who was showing off the phone didn't even know much.

The CPW near me has a BlackBerry booth with a Passport, DTEK50 and PRIV on display. When I enquired about the Passport, it was as if they didn't even realize they had a booth. I don't blame them to be honest. It's a niche product and this is what comes with a niche product with no niche reps.

Also, as a final point... Please be aware that sales representatives are given specific phones to promote from time to time. So when they offer you something else or seem disinterested in what you want, sometimes thats just how it is.

[yessuz]

Anytime I see people complain about this type of thing, I always wonder if they see the other side. This is a phone which is for the most part online-only from a company with less than 1% share of the market. It's available in limited stores and of the stores that does have them, few will have it on display. You going into CPW asking for detailed info on the Keyone is like going into Sports Direct asking when the Hoffenheim FC kit will be released.

Sure, they should know about every phone but the reality is that few will outside of iPhone and the major Android players. Heck, when I went to the Keyone launch, the guy who was showing off the phone didn't even know much.

The CPW near me has a BlackBerry booth with a Passport and DTEK50 and PRIV on display. When I enquired about the Passport, it was if they didn't even release they had a booth. I don't blame them to be honest. It's a niche product and this what comes with a niche product with no niche reps.

Also, as a final point... Please be aware that sales representatives are given specific phones to promote from time to time. So when they offer you something else or seem disinterested in what you want, sometimes thats just how it is.

excuse me, but how did you determine the market share?

[Mikey_NNG]

Google is your friend my man - http://bfy.tw/Cdo0

[draculito01]

Not going to name stores cos don't want to affect anyone's job but these guys are the Halford mechanics of the phone world. Just for those outside the UK who don't get the Halford reference, think chimpanzees with hammers.

Half these guys haven't heard of the device and act very sniffy when you ask them anything about it.

One store when I asked about the cases told me to go on ebay and buy a third party case. Didn't offer to investigate when they might be available. I told this guy that customer service was dying and he personally delivered the death blow. He didn't seem to understand that to direct me to ebay isn't helpful and the correct thing to do would be to investigate and contact me when they become available.

Finally a friend of mine was actively dissuaded from buying one. Upon speaking to my mate I was able to realise he wasn't even talking about the keyone as all the info related to the priv.

Now I don't wanna mess with minimum wage which is why I'm not naming stores , but I really think CPW need to deal with this. Lack of marketing is one thing but these guys are actively damaging sales

They are inadvertently taking care of their customers, LOL. This phone is totally in a disaster territory now and it's not CPW fault.

[qwerty4ever]

You telling me I bought the phone equivalent of Ed sheeran ?

No, we bought the smartphone equivalent of Carrot Top. LOL Loving my BlackBerry KEYone since May 30th!

[draculito01]

Still on my launch handset. Robust as you like.

Good for you. However, it's just a matter of time, I'm afraid.

[The Chosen]

Not going to name stores cos don't want to affect anyone's job but these guys are the Halford mechanics of the phone world. Just for those outside the UK who don't get the Halford reference, think chimpanzees with hammers.

Half these guys haven't heard of the device and act very sniffy when you ask them anything about it.

One store when I asked about the cases told me to go on ebay and buy a third party case. Didn't offer to investigate when they might be available. I told this guy that customer service was dying and he personally delivered the death blow. He didn't seem to understand that to direct me to ebay isn't helpful and the correct thing to do would be to investigate and contact me when they become available.

Finally a friend of mine was actively dissuaded from buying one. Upon speaking to my mate I was able to realise he wasn't even talking about the keyone as all the info related to the priv.

Now I don't wanna mess with minimum wage which is why I'm not naming stores , but I really think CPW need to deal with this. Lack of marketing is one thing but these guys are actively damaging sales

Exactly, minimum wage. Why would these guys bother doing their homework on niche devices like Blackberry when they're being paid chicken feed.

I'm not condoning bad customer service. There's no excuse for a poor attitude, but to get a gold star all these guys have to know are some high level details of the latest iPhone, Samsung and a handful of other devices.

They'll likely get a weekly brief with the latest release info on the most popular handsets, which is what they'll relay to the customers.

Ultimately, if they aren't going to make a sale since they don't stock the item you want, then they probably won't put any effort in helping you find where you can buy one.....not for minimum wage anyway.

[yessuz]

Google is your friend my man - http://bfy.tw/Cdo0

It's a bit dodgy. I am sure, Blackberry = bb10 devices in these stats.


Posted via CB10

[blackburberry]

I'm not at all surprised at all as BB, in whatever iteration, simply does not place any effort on customer education, marketing or follow up.

To my knowledge carriers and retail employees have no script or appropriate training from BB with respect to how to describe a BB's features and benefits ( without laughing) or how to protect it's reputation when talking to potential and current customers.

When left to their own devices most retail employees will happily rag on a product all day long if they work a minimum wage job and have poor relations with their vendors and employer.

Only once in a while will BB be so lucky as to have a real BB enthusiast work at retail level that will represent them in a positive light.

It's all irrelevant now, I suppose. They're in a place where none of that matters anymore. They just build the software now. They should really take their brand off anything they don't intend to stand behind.

[pizzawheel]

You get paid more to sell an apple, less for an android, and presumably less again for a blackberry.

Do you want Steak, Burger or Gruel for dinner?

I'm not at all surprised at all as BB, in whatever iteration, simply does not place any effort on customer education, marketing or follow up.

To my knowledge carriers and retail employees have no script or appropriate training from BB with respect to how to describe a BB's features and benefits ( without laughing) or how to protect it's reputation when talking to potential and current customers.

When left to their own devices most retail employees will happily rag on a product all day long if they work a minimum wage job and have poor relations with their vendors and employer.

Only once in a while will BB be so lucky as to have a real BB enthusiast work at retail level that will represent them in a positive light.

It's all irrelevant now, I suppose. They're in a place where none of that matters anymore. They just build the software now. They should really take their brand off anything they don't intend to stand behind.

[Stuartgd]

Not going to name stores cos don't want to affect anyone's job but these guys are the Halford mechanics of the phone world. Just for those outside the UK who don't get the Halford reference, think chimpanzees with hammers.

Half these guys haven't heard of the device and act very sniffy when you ask them anything about it.

One store when I asked about the cases told me to go on ebay and buy a third party case. Didn't offer to investigate when they might be available. I told this guy that customer service was dying and he personally delivered the death blow. He didn't seem to understand that to direct me to ebay isn't helpful and the correct thing to do would be to investigate and contact me when they become available.

Finally a friend of mine was actively dissuaded from buying one. Upon speaking to my mate I was able to realise he wasn't even talking about the keyone as all the info related to the priv.

Now I don't wanna mess with minimum wage which is why I'm not naming stores , but I really think CPW need to deal with this. Lack of marketing is one thing but these guys are actively damaging sales

When in hospital you expect the nurses to know every thing . It's their job, same applies to shops

[Troy Tiscareno]

When in hospital you expect the nurses to know every thing . It's their job, same applies to shops

If that's the case, then you have unrealistic expectations based on a lack of knowledge of the market.

A salesperson's job is to SELL ITEMS CURRENTLY IN STOCK AT THAT STORE, and, then, to sell items that aren't likely to be returned or exchanged. That generally means that they're going to focus on market leaders (Apple, Samsung, and maybe LG, Moto, and HTC) - all of whom sell orders of magnitude more phones per store than BB-branded phones.

Of course YOU don't care about any of that, you just want a BB phone, sold to you by a BB fan and expert. Well, they'll sell you the phone, but the only BB fans and experts to be found for the most part will be right here on CB.

Keep in mind that this is a phone that had its world-wide launch in the UK with 700(!!!) phones in a single store. To date, I'd guess that less than 20,000 have been produced, and probably 100,000 will sell by Dec 31st of this year. Apple sells more iPhones than that every day, and more new Android phones than that are activated every HOUR of every day. Compared to the overall smartphone marketshare, the K1 is a tiny mote of dust - a fraction of a percent.

To expect salespeople to be knowledgeable about a phone whose marketshare is a fraction of a percent is just unrealistic. A given person in a store may only ever have one or two customers ask him about a K1 in his entire career there.

I'm not trying to speak badly of the K1 here, but just strictly by production numbers, it's insignificant in the marketplace, and you need to understand what that MEANS when you go to a store and speak to someone about it. It means you'll likely know a lot more about the product than they do.

[Stuartgd]

So what you're saying is - sales people do not listen to their customers, instead the go by what they have to push at that time. That doesn't make a good customer salesperson relationship.
If someone asks about the blackberry then they shouldn't try and be sold Iphone.
It isn't just phone sales but all sales. Why stock something then not sell it to customers

[Stuartgd]

A salesperson job is to sell the customer what he/she wants. it's good customer relations. a customer that feels appreciated and listen to will come back to you, doesn't matter what you are selling.

please do not assume things about me! this is not a site for verbal attacks.

[Troy Tiscareno]

So what you're saying is - sales people do not listen to their customers, instead the go by what they have to push at that time. That doesn't make a good customer salesperson relationship.

No, that's not what I'm saying. I was quite literal with what I wrote, with not much room for interpretation.

Salespeople focus on selling people items which generate the greatest profits and least problems for the company they work for. BB phones neither generate the greatest profits nor create the fewest problems (per phone sold) than other brands, and BB sales volumes and demand are extremely low - plus BB doesn't even provide marketing materials, much less in-store area reps to personally train the sales staff like the other brands provide.

Naturally, all of these factors means that the sales staff puts very little focus on selling BB products, if any. They'll sell you one if you insist, but they'd much rather sell you something else, and if they suspect that you might return the phone, they'd rather not sell you anything (because they lose money on returns).

If someone asks about the blackberry then they shouldn't try and be sold Iphone.

I'm not sure you understand the job of a salesperson. Their job is to (at best) try to match a customer's needs with a product they have for sale, or, failing that, to sell them a product that's best for the store (which means, among other things, one that they aren't likely to return). It doesn't mean just selling you what you inquire about by default. You don't need salespeople for that, just order fulfillers. The Amazon website can do that, for example.

It isn't just phone sales but all sales. Why stock something then not sell it to customers

They're likely doing it as a favor to TCL. It's pretty certain that they aren't selling K1s because they expect to make any significant amount of money from doing so - sales volumes aren't anywhere close to being large enough for that.

[Mercuryuser]

That's as maybe but I don't expect to be advised to go on ebay to buy a case. Nor do I expect to be given patently incorrect information about a device as happened when friend enquired about the keyone.

The bottom line is if a product is sold by their company they should have knowledge of it. They certainly shouldn't be taking a hostile stance to a product. They are overstepping here and BB should be concerned. I accept that Perhaps there are wider issues such as blackberry lack of marketing to consider.

Overal though it's a problem that sadly infects the whole of the UK. The art of customer service is a dying art with only isolated individuals who are essentially anomalies, keeping it going.

[app_Developer]

A salesperson job is to sell the customer what he/she wants. it's good customer relations. a customer that feels appreciated and listen to will come back to you, doesn't matter what you are selling.

please do not assume things about me! this is not a site for verbal attacks.

By the time a typical customer returns to buy another phone, the salesperson is long gone.

Most retail sales jobs are not careers. Other than a few very high end retailers, these are mostly low wage jobs that require little training and are hopefully just stepping stones to something else. These guys are not selling houses or Porsches, they're just selling phones.

On average they will sell what they have in stock to get paid and move on to the next customer. That's what their bosses want to see.

[Mercuryuser]

By the time a typical customer returns to buy another phone, the salesperson is long gone.

Most retail sales jobs are not careers. Other than a few very high end retailers, these are mostly low wage jobs that require little training and are hopefully just stepping stones to something else. These guys are not selling houses or Porsches, they're just selling phones.

On average they will sell what they have in stock to get paid and move on to the next customer. That's what their bosses want to see.

Sadly even career sales jobs are suffering. Went to the Jag dealership and the guy didn't know that the engine in the current 3.0 model is still a legacy engine. That sort of error could result in a fifty grand mis-sale and a large compensation bill.

Bad service is there at every level. Bad service actually resulted in me getting my Keyone handset for free and a fifty quid credit to my account. It's always been there in the UK to some extent ( the whole idea of cars built on a friday ) and its very much a cultural thing.
You wont find that with the japs or germans. Its only getting worse with the current young generation rising up partly because the youth culture is more corrosive than ever and the education system is the worst its ever been due to low wages for teachers discouraging the more talented.

Good service is an anomaly and comes purely as a result of intelligence, integrity and good upbringing. Companies cannot instil those things no matter how hard they try but the least they can do is educate them on the products they sell and ensure they do not take a hostile stance towards a product. By taking such a stance they go against not only the product but also their own employer.

[rx8er]

Good for you. However, it's just a matter of time, I'm afraid.

Time? Before what exactly?

[rx8er]

You get paid more to sell an apple, less for an android, and presumably less again for a blackberry.

Do you want Steak, Burger or Gruel for dinner?

Looks like no gruel again for you. Just pineapple pizza. :-)

[cgk]

So what you're saying is - sales people do not listen to their customers, instead the go by what they have to push at that time.

Absolutely and that is partly driven by how confident the retailer is about the OEM - when you sell a samsung device, you know that Samsung will spending hundreds of millions themselves on marketing and advertising, they will provide decent training and incentives, they will provide POS materials.

It's a good relationship.

When you deal with TCL - you know that they might maybe be able to send you a couple of phones now and them and the marketing budget consists of a few paid stories on crackberry and a few tweets by an intern.

It's not rocket-science that the sales people then know more about Samsung than TCL and are happier selling devices.

[pizzawheel]

Absolutely! And an opportunity to again recognise the brilliance of its Canadian inventor, who passed away recently.

Looks like no gruel again for you. Just pineapple pizza. :-)

Tip o'the hat to the RX-8 btw.