1. jfalkingham's Avatar
    Use the eBay app and with the code PICKFAST you get 15% off up to $100. BestBuy sells them via eBay at $429, then 15% off comes down to $365 with free shipping. If you use Samsung Pay as the payment method you get 5% via gift card back.

    Good luck, I just bought 2.
    11-21-18 11:43 AM
  2. knibbeone's Avatar
    If I can get an answer on WiFi calling I’m in! No cell service at home at all. WiFi is a deal breaker. I also fly a lot and the WiFi features keep my texts and emails updated while in the air. Love that part.
    phuoc likes this.
    11-21-18 12:40 PM
  3. tickerguy's Avatar
    Yep.... sadly no WFC or I would have bought one instantly this morning. Oh well TCL...
    phuoc likes this.
    11-21-18 07:26 PM
  4. Matthew Davis7's Avatar
    Yep.... sadly no WFC or I would have bought one instantly this morning. Oh well TCL...
    TLC built the capability into the phone, but it's up to carriers to provision for it. Unfortunately TLC dosen't have the necessary relationships with carriers to pull that off. A PKB is far more important to some than having WFC, myself included.
    11-25-18 12:37 PM
  5. tickerguy's Avatar
    TLC built the capability into the phone, but it's up to carriers to provision for it. Unfortunately TLC dosen't have the necessary relationships with carriers to pull that off. A PKB is far more important to some than having WFC, myself included.
    That's just plain old-fashioned false.

    The reason it doesn't connect is that TCL intentionally used a non-US "user agent" string in the build. Since the phone prohibits rooting (and will lock you out if you manage to do it) you can't change said string. This was investigated in detail when it started happening with previous TCL-built devices.

    The DTEK60 and Priv both connect to WFC on T-Mobile just fine, and the DTEK60 was never sold by any of the US carriers. That's because the DTEK60 uses a US user-agent string.

    This is not an accident nor a function of TCL not "having a relationship" with anyone. In the case of AT&T it might be, because they whitelist IMEI prefixes and if you're not in the whitelisted range it doesn't work. But in the case of T-Mobile this is just flat-out not the case; if you meet the technical requirements to connect on their network it will work, and it is definitely NOT the case that TCL doesn't know what those requirements are.

    They do know and have intentionally decided not to comply with them.

    I'm not buying an intentionally-crippled device; in my specific use case no WFC means I have unusable service at my home and in multiple other places I travel to where there is perfectly good WiFi but poor-to-nonexistent cell penetration.
    11-25-18 12:43 PM
  6. Matthew Davis7's Avatar
    If true, why would intentionally TCL do that?? Has T-Mobile made WFC a thing to compensate for their historically poor coverage? I'm on AT&T and have never noticed much of a need. The question remains, however, why would TCL potentially cripple sales?
    11-25-18 12:51 PM
  7. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    That's just plain old-fashioned false.

    The reason it doesn't connect is that TCL intentionally used a non-US "user agent" string in the build. Since the phone prohibits rooting (and will lock you out if you manage to do it) you can't change said string. This was investigated in detail when it started happening with previous TCL-built devices.

    The DTEK60 and Priv both connect to WFC on T-Mobile just fine, and the DTEK60 was never sold by any of the US carriers. That's because the DTEK60 uses a US user-agent string.

    This is not an accident nor a function of TCL not "having a relationship" with anyone. In the case of AT&T it might be, because they whitelist IMEI prefixes and if you're not in the whitelisted range it doesn't work. But in the case of T-Mobile this is just flat-out not the case; if you meet the technical requirements to connect on their network it will work, and it is definitely NOT the case that TCL doesn't know what those requirements are.

    They do know and have intentionally decided not to comply with them.

    I'm not buying an intentionally-crippled device; in my specific use case no WFC means I have unusable service at my home and in multiple other places I travel to where there is perfectly good WiFi but poor-to-nonexistent cell penetration.
    You’re confusing different things I believe. The user string issue pertains to non-domestic hardware.

    Blocked as enhanced calling features is done by the carrier.
    11-25-18 08:19 PM
  8. tickerguy's Avatar
    No.

    VoLTE is reported to work on T-Mobile with the Key2LE. So the "enhanced calling feature" thing is not at-issue here.

    WFC is deliberately not compatible, and it's TCL that did it on purpose, just as they with the original Key2 that *was* working originally, then they pushed a firmware update and it disappeared. The most-likely reason (if I had one I could poke around I could tell you for certain) is that they once again played with the user-agent string.
    11-25-18 08:22 PM
  9. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    No.

    VoLTE is reported to work on T-Mobile with the Key2LE. So the "enhanced calling feature" thing is not at-issue here.

    WFC is deliberately not compatible, and it's TCL that did it on purpose, just as they with the original Key2 that *was* working originally, then they pushed a firmware update and it disappeared. The most-likely reason (if I had one I could poke around I could tell you for certain) is that they once again played with the user-agent string.
    Same problem with AT&T. The carriers are blocking enhanced features more and more and it’s not limited to BBMo/TCL hardware. It’s all for additional revenue streams. BYOD is total BS marketing since even T-MOBILE relies heavily on device sales. BYOD causes lost device sales revenue and limiting enhanced features to premium hardware not only increases carrier hardware sales, it pushes sales of the higher end hardware. Why do you think BBMo would care to block WFC and VoLTE on their devices unless carrier demanded? What’s the benefit to BBMo?
    elfabio80 likes this.
    11-25-18 09:09 PM
  10. tickerguy's Avatar
    You need to stop with this garbage -- it's a bald lie and not the first time you've run it here.

    AT&T has a *long* history of blocking ALL enhanced calling (including VoLTE) on BYOD units but T-Mobile never has. It's an utterly INSANE thing for AT&T to do as VoLTE calls require *far* less bandwidth on their network than dropping back to circuit-switched (which is constant-bandwidth consuming while the call is up), but if they want to blow their own brains out that's on them.

    You've repeatedly said here "they will" in the context of T-Mobile but they have not. I have multiple, non-carrier BYOD devices here and every one of them works just fine on T-Mobile and gets WFC.

    This is *specific* to the latest BlackBerry devices and TCL has done it deliberately. Proof of this is found in the fact that those same devices had WFC until a software update was pushed *by TCL* and then it "magically" broke. The IMEI obviously didn't change so there's no whitelisting issue with regard to the carrier here -- it's simply that TCL has decided not to play nice, on purpose, screwing their customers.

    I have a PH-1 sitting right here on my desk that has "P" on it, and has received MULTIPLE updates. It had WFC working on the first release with it, and still does. Then again Essential hasn't tampered with the firmware on purpose to break it.
    jfalkingham likes this.
    11-25-18 09:29 PM
  11. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    You need to stop with this garbage -- it's a bald lie and not the first time you've run it here.

    AT&T has a *long* history of blocking ALL enhanced calling (including VoLTE) on BYOD units but T-Mobile never has. It's an utterly INSANE thing for AT&T to do as VoLTE calls require *far* less bandwidth on their network than dropping back to circuit-switched (which is constant-bandwidth consuming while the call is up), but if they want to blow their own brains out that's on them.

    You've repeatedly said here "they will" in the context of T-Mobile but they have not. I have multiple, non-carrier BYOD devices here and every one of them works just fine on T-Mobile and gets WFC.

    This is *specific* to the latest BlackBerry devices and TCL has done it deliberately. Proof of this is found in the fact that those same devices had WFC until a software update was pushed *by TCL* and then it "magically" broke. The IMEI obviously didn't change so there's no whitelisting issue with regard to the carrier here -- it's simply that TCL has decided not to play nice, on purpose, screwing their customers.

    I have a PH-1 sitting right here on my desk that has "P" on it, and has received MULTIPLE updates. It had WFC working on the first release with it, and still does. Then again Essential hasn't tampered with the firmware on purpose to break it.
    Relax. As I’ve said before, why do you think BBMo would block something that benefits them in no way. Think about it, you are saying BBMo would spend money to rollout update to upset their factory unlocked customers, it makes no sense.
    11-25-18 11:47 PM
  12. tickerguy's Avatar
    Well, the fact is that TCL did exactly that. They rolled out an update that killed WFC on devices they had sold and on which WFC worked and ever since all of their devices released after that point have incorporated same. BTW it's not just T-Mobile; it appears it also hit Rogers customers.

    And, of course since these devices all have ARB protection you can't reload the older firmware which doesn't have WFC deliberately blocked.
    11-26-18 09:23 AM
  13. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Well, the fact is that TCL did exactly that. They rolled out an update that killed WFC on devices they had sold and on which WFC worked and ever since all of their devices released after that point have incorporated same. BTW it's not just T-Mobile; it appears it also hit Rogers customers.

    And, of course since these devices all have ARB protection you can't reload the older firmware which doesn't have WFC deliberately blocked.
    Since you mention Rogers, this would suggest again, carrier-driven. It may have been “encouraged” by a different carrier or carriers. Obviously, we don’t know for anything for certain. OEMs want to keep the carriers happy since the carriers are viewed as the primary customers of the OEMs and distribution is getting more focused and limited than ever.
    11-27-18 07:09 AM
  14. RadioTech's Avatar
    I downgraded to software ABA044 and wifi calling works perfectly on T-Mobile. So BlackBerry Mobile disabled it in their software upgrade.
    12-08-18 08:26 PM
  15. jfalkingham's Avatar
    Since you mention Rogers, this would suggest again, carrier-driven. It may have been “encouraged” by a different carrier or carriers. Obviously, we don’t know for anything for certain. OEMs want to keep the carriers happy since the carriers are viewed as the primary customers of the OEMs and distribution is getting more focused and limited than ever.
    Nobody on a BlackBerry key 2 LE with latest firmware will have WiFi calling. It's not carrier dependant. They stripped the option from settings. Something somewhere went wrong and the downside of having a company like TCL manage this is not being responsive to know issues. They'll fix it when they fix it.
    12-09-18 10:43 AM
  16. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Nobody on a BlackBerry key 2 LE with latest firmware will have WiFi calling. It's not carrier dependant. They stripped the option from settings. Something somewhere went wrong and the downside of having a company like TCL manage this is not being responsive to know issues. They'll fix it when they fix it.
    Sure. OK. If that’s what you want to believe. I’ve learned that OEMs cater to important customers, the carriers, who purchase the bulk of their products. OEMs that want carrier relationships, are quietly encouraged and guided behind the scenes, by those carriers.
    12-09-18 10:52 AM
  17. jfalkingham's Avatar
    Sure. OK. If that’s what you want to believe. I’ve learned that OEMs cater to important customers, the carriers, who purchase the bulk of their products. OEMs that want carrier relationships, are quietly encouraged and guided behind the scenes, by those carriers.
    What is your proof? What unlocked bb key 2 LE has WiFi calling on latest unlocked firmware? None
    12-09-18 01:42 PM
  18. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I’m not disagreeing on it missing. I’m stating that it’s removed under carrier pressure. Even my BBMo/TCL AT&T KEYone never had functioning WFC although carrier locked and sold device. Per AT&T CSR manager, Enhanced Calling Features are going to be offered with carrier sold Premium Flagship devices. This will also vary on the strength of the OEM, like Apple, but it’s being used as reason to “encourage” customers to purchase higher priced flagships instead of same brand mid tier or low tier hardware. For instance, WFC on LG V and G lines but not on the K line is the example I was given. Since AT&T KEYone is midtier priced and does limited sales promotions (BOGO and soft dollar reimbursement), it’s not as profitable on per unit basis for sales objectives.

    Since WFC feature is there by default in the original designs, and takes effort to remove, it didn’t just disappear in error. Think about it. Would any OEM with limited resources, spend additional resources, to remove a desired feature, unless it could lead to potential higher volume somehow? Let’s see when the WFC gets added back in? My bet is on never unless a future carrier sold device when approved by the supporting carrier.
    12-09-18 02:29 PM
  19. jfalkingham's Avatar
    I hear you and was a big reason I returned my black keyone to att and left for TMO because they have a long track record of letting wfc or any 'enhanced' feature work on your device as long as the device itself can support.

    I just don't buy that TCL would purposefully disable wfc after it was originally enabled, especially on a global basis because of a carrier or carrier cartel. I'd think it would be the opposite since no carrier (in US anyway) actually has them as a branded device.

    I'm convinced they removed it either on purpose (due to it breaking something else) or it was a mistake when fixing another defect and wfc was turned off.

    But since I don't work for them, just pure speculation. I'm sure they'll reach out and respond to their customers on this, right?

    Posted via CB10
    12-10-18 07:19 AM
  20. tickerguy's Avatar
    Well they have refused comment back to me when I asked for the reason.

    They DID acknowledge that it was intentional in my original query, and not a result of a mistake (e.g. when fixing something else) but have refused to say why.

    I replied that while I am very much interested in buying a Key2LE I won't buy without WFC enabled as both my work and home use pattern pretty-much requires it to have a usable, global device I can take with my on business and pleasure while expecting it will work, including in places where I have no cell service but DO have WiFi available -- which is quite-frequent in my travels.

    TCL apparently does not care about that subset of their potential customers as I got no reply back and no explanation for why it was removed.
    12-10-18 02:47 PM
  21. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Have to wonder if there is some kinda fee based licensing associated with "technology" that allows this to happen. And TCL is unwilling to pay the fee....

    I get one or two carrier's blocking access... but everyone?


    Anyway... Post hurricane Michael, I can say that WFC can be very important.
    12-10-18 03:10 PM
  22. tickerguy's Avatar
    Dunt, I very-much doubt it. The underlying protocol is IPSEC and it's an industry-standard thing now that crosses national boundaries. The underlying transport became compatible when VoLTE showed up which is why you can start a WiFi call, walk out of the house and have it transition to VoLTE without losing it. Walk back in the house and it can reconnect over WFC, picking it back up.

    This doesn't work with any of the circuit-switched predecessors because you're going from packet-based voice to circuit-switched (TDMA, basically) and the various vendors (switch folks) never did figure out how to make that work cleanly. So if you go out of WFC range while all you have there is HSPA+ (or previous) the call drops.
    12-10-18 07:20 PM

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