[spork141]

Yes, we've been over this before. It's never a good thing to be excluded from half the US subscriber population. BlackBerry and TCL deserve the blame for selling so poorly with the Priv and KeyOne that not only will Verizon not carry the K2 they won't even whitelist it. And the lack of CDMA may not have hurt but it certainly didn't help their cause.

It's really not TCL's fault either. The world moved on from BB forever ago. No business deal would have made these efforts worth it. I give it to Verizon for sticking with it up to the priv, and for TCL still making one option left.

If anyone is to blame its Blackberry for the huge cluster of not listening to their customers when the iphone was unveiled. These sins were committed 10 years ago. It's shocking that we are still holdng on.

I personally hate the BB perception that lives today. I really think the form factor is so much more practical and powerful paired with a modern OS. But the name is toxic now and nobody will even give it a chance. Neither BB, VZ, TCL, can make a good dish out of it now and im grateful with each BB release that I have at least 1 or 2 more years with it

[HostessCupcake]

It's really not TCL's fault either. The world moved on from BB forever ago. No business deal would have made these efforts worth it. I give it to Verizon for sticking with it up to the priv, and for TCL still making one option left.

If anyone is to blame its Blackberry for the huge cluster of not listening to their customers when the iphone was unveiled. These sins were committed 10 years ago. It's shocking that we are still holdng on.

I personally hate the BB perception that lives today. I really think the form factor is so much more practical and powerful paired with a modern OS. But the name is toxic now and nobody will even give it a chance. Neither BB, VZ, TCL, can make a good dish out of it now and im grateful with each BB release that I have at least 1 or 2 more years with it

Yes, I agree with most of what you said, but it's hard to see how the poor sales of the K1 didn't further destroy what's left of the BlackBerry-Verizon relationship.

[JeddClampet]

JeddClampet - You could always use that car phone that Jethro installed in your truck. Hahaha
I got my Key2 and spent 30 mind last night with Verizon support without and success. Using my T-Mobile SIM and as soon as I put it in everything worked.

Exactly!!

[Chuck Finley69]

Yes, we've been over this before. It's never a good thing to be excluded from half the US subscriber population. BlackBerry and TCL deserve the blame for selling so poorly with the Priv and KeyOne that not only will Verizon not carry the K2 they won't even whitelist it. And the lack of CDMA may not have hurt but it certainly didn't help their cause.

I was only addressing your “Dumb move by Verizon” comment. If BBMo/TCL has gotten onto Verizon’s sales network with the KEYone instead of just carrier approved, we’d have seen a totally different Key2 rollout. Instead, even AT&T is publicly missing. At initial rollout, Sprint was present with AT&T stating “coming soon”.

There’s a CDMA variant approved but no Verizon or Sprint. I’m concerned that BBMo/TCL was told not to bother. The old “don’t call us, we’ll call you”.

[Emaderton3]

I was only addressing your “Dumb move by Verizon” comment. If BBMo/TCL has gotten onto Verizon’s sales network with the KEYone instead of just carrier approved, we’d have seen a totally different Key2 rollout. Instead, even AT&T is publicly missing. At initial rollout, Sprint was present with AT&T stating “coming soon”.

There’s a CDMA variant approved but no Verizon or Sprint. I’m concerned that BBMo/TCL was told not to bother. The old “don’t call us, we’ll call you”.

That variant is not for the US. The I thought it was for China.

[JeddClampet]

It's really not TCL's fault either. The world moved on from BB forever ago. No business deal would have made these efforts worth it. I give it to Verizon for sticking with it up to the priv, and for TCL still making one option left.

If anyone is to blame its Blackberry for the huge cluster of not listening to their customers when the iphone was unveiled. These sins were committed 10 years ago. It's shocking that we are still holdng on.

I personally hate the BB perception that lives today. I really think the form factor is so much more practical and powerful paired with a modern OS. But the name is toxic now and nobody will even give it a chance. Neither BB, VZ, TCL, can make a good dish out of it now and im grateful with each BB release that I have at least 1 or 2 more years with it

I agree that the world has moved on from BB, as an OS. But today, we're not talking about an OS that nobody uses or cares about anymore. To a certain extent, Android is Android regardless of form factor.

So where is the disconnect at VZW? There are a boat load of Android phone brands available, each with their own take on the presentation. Why should BB be shunned over any other offering? T-MO and AT&T could care less that I prefer BB's take on Android. I'm not even expecting any of them to carry the Key2. If BYOD is a thing, then why roadblock BBmo, or any other offering?

[Chuck Finley69]

That variant is not for the US. The I thought it was for China.

Merely stating that CDMA was created if carrier demand present... I understand it would be a different version, but it demonstrates an OEM commitment to manufacturing if carrier willing to commit to offering.

[mtalinm]

maybe we should start a thread on alternatives to Verizon. I have personally looked into AT & T and T-Mobile. It looks like for the same price you get a higher number of gigabytes without slow down, 50 versus 22, plus some international coverage and no extra charge. AT & T throws in a bunch of weird entertainment stuff I don't care about, but maybe people appreciate that

[Emaderton3]

Merely stating that CDMA was created if carrier demand present... I understand it would be a different version, but it demonstrates an OEM commitment to manufacturing if carrier willing to commit to offering.

Yes, but how many carriers exist over there and what is the basis of their current infrastructure for different types of technologies? Context is everything.

[Chuck Finley69]

I agree that the world has moved on from BB, as an OS. But today, we're not talking about an OS that nobody uses or cares about anymore. To a certain extent, Android is Android regardless of form factor.

So where is the disconnect at VZW? There are a boat load of Android phone brands available, each with their own take on the presentation. Why should BB be shunned over any other offering? T-MO and AT&T could care less that I prefer BB's take on Android. I'm not even expecting any of them to carry the Key2. If BYOD is a thing, then why roadblock BBmo, or any other offering?

Carriers don’t want BYOD, that’s why AT&T, Verizon and Sprint push carrier devices. Sprint, more because of CDMA technology and Verizon uses CDMA partially as move to LTE happens over time. AT&T could be like T-MOBILE but uses it’s competitive advantage with coverage to block factory unlocked devices from enhanced services. BYOD isn’t a thing as long as enhanced services matter to consumers.

[Chuck Finley69]

Yes, but how many carriers exist over there and what is the basis of their current infrastructure for different types of technologies? Context is everything.

Context is that CDMA market demand and cooperation from carrier(s) is large enough for BBMo/TCL willingness to produce. Verizon doesn’t seem to offer enough certainty for BBMo/TCL for a KEYone type certification for the Key2.

[JeddClampet]

Carriers don’t want BYOD, that’s why AT&T, Verizon and Sprint push carrier devices.......

Oh yeah. Free market. Right!

[Sporkguy3]

I am a new AT&T customer, just got set up. Maybe Verizon and I will meet again someday, when they activate Key2 to their network, or a phone of the future.

[spork141]

I agree that the world has moved on from BB, as an OS. But today, we're not talking about an OS that nobody uses or cares about anymore. To a certain extent, Android is Android regardless of form factor.

So where is the disconnect at VZW? There are a boat load of Android phone brands available, each with their own take on the presentation. Why should BB be shunned over any other offering? T-MO and AT&T could care less that I prefer BB's take on Android. I'm not even expecting any of them to carry the Key2. If BYOD is a thing, then why roadblock BBmo, or any other offering?

Well, I totally agree with you on Android is Android, but the reality is that BB name and form factor is so toxic that I don't think it matters to the average consumer. I work in mid-town manhattan on the corporate level in consumer technology for companies most people heard of. I should be in the heart of technology open-mindedness, as well as the segment BB claims to still have many fans. Over the past 4 years the only reaction that I get when I put my BB on the conf room table is a mix between confusion and horror. And no, none of them were aware BB still exists, and none of them knew or care that they are android now. We are beyond reason at this point. And in case you were wondering, I might see 1 person every 2 months in the subway with a BB and it's usually either a classic or a Bold. THe blackberry segment is now loose fans like you and I spread all over the world far apart from other people.

TCLs power to negotiate with sales leverage is non existent. LG can pump out 10 mid range phones a year to sell to grandma, and verizon will take it because collectively it means money. The 1 lukewarm BB that TCL can offer isn't worth the time to even vet the phone for whitelisting. People prioritize time to where the money is

As for why Verizon doesn't just open their network, I just dont know. Maybe it's why they are getting off CDMA, or just becasue they are doing fine right now to take the risk. Either way, I know why TCL is in the place they are in, and I know Verizon isnt terribly concerned about but it or us. At this point I am just happy that we haven't hit a dead end like WebOs did.

[mtalinm]

leaving Verizon, I am pretty sure that I'm headed to T-Mobile instead of AT & T. I live in an urban area with great coverage for both of them, so I mostly swayed by T-Mobile's higher data limit plus the in-flight an international benefits. If I missing anything let me know

[JeddClampet]

Well, I totally agree with you on Android is Android, but the reality is that BB name and form factor is so toxic that I don't think it matters to the average consumer. I work in mid-town manhattan on the corporate level in consumer technology for companies most people heard of. I should be in the heart of technology open-mindedness, as well as the segment BB claims to still have many fans. Over the past 4 years the only reaction that I get when I put my BB on the conf room table is a mix between confusion and horror. And no, none of them were aware BB still exists, and none of them knew or care that they are android now. We are beyond reason at this point. And in case you were wondering, I might see 1 person every 2 months in the subway with a BB and it's usually either a classic or a Bold. THe blackberry segment is now loose fans like you and I spread all over the world far apart from other people.

TCLs power to negotiate with sales leverage is non existent. LG can pump out 10 mid range phones a year to sell to grandma, and verizon will take it because collectively it means money. The 1 lukewarm BB that TCL can offer isn't worth the time to even vet the phone for whitelisting. People prioritize time to where the money is

As for why Verizon doesn't just open their network, I just dont know. Maybe it's why they are getting off CDMA, or just becasue they are doing fine right now to take the risk. Either way, I know why TCL is in the place they are in, and I know Verizon isnt terribly concerned about but it or us. At this point I am just happy that we haven't hit a dead end like WebOs did.

Oh I know. I get the confusion, horror and chuckles all the time, even with my Priv, which doesn't immediately stand out as "Alienware". But I just don't care what the masses think of my device and I really could care even less what slab they have chosen. It's as insane as the social media frenzy of who has more followers. Who gives a F@*#! Like I said. I just want to buy the phone I like and go about my business.

[Radmd74]

Come to T-Mo guys!

[Edietel]

Come to T-Mo guys!

As soon as they care to expand their coverage to where I live (like Verizon did years ago), I'm in.

[rkanazawa]

Not sure if T-Mobile still offers the 1 week trial. Great way to see if the coverage works for you.
We use both at the office and in town T-Mobile is great. Once out of the Bay Area Verizon has a bit of an edge.
So used to carrying two phones from the days we used BlackBerry for the office and a flip phone for my personal line. In those days the Blackberry didn’t even have a color screen.
Now the Key2 on T-Mobile and another phone on Verizon.

[RWIndiana]

There are other phones that don't make it to Verizon. Friend of mine bought the Razer phone and had to switch to ATT.

[spork141]

Oh I know. I get the confusion, horror and chuckles all the time, even with my Priv, which doesn't immediately stand out as "Alienware". But I just don't care what the masses think of my device and I really could care even less what slab they have chosen. It's as insane as the social media frenzy of who has more followers. Who gives a F@*#! Like I said. I just want to buy the phone I like and go about my business.

Totally. It just highlights for me how none of the BB support issues are really with Verizon or TCL. It's really the fault of the BB brass from yesteryear. Can you really blame Verizon for not supporting BB with that kind of consumer climate out there? Don't forget this issue has been with all the carriers including TMO.

The only real issue is Verizon not letting all unlocked phones on it's network and that's not limited to BB. Hopefully one day that will be a thing of the past but for now it does hold us back from our only options.

I would try out TMO but my company pays for my phone and they only do VZ. So im sticking with my Key 1 until the Key 2 is whitelisted. If it i'sn't by Oct then I might make my company buy me a Pixel 3 and hold me over until whatever new BB comes out that I can get on VZ. I do want to try Android P. I am originally a weOs holdout and a return to cards will fill some primal void in me. Having a physical keyboard and cards will be a dream for me so I'll buy the key 2 / key 3 with my own money if Verizon whitelists after OCT.

[JeddClampet]

. The only real issue is Verizon not letting all unlocked phones on it's network and that's not limited to BB. Hopefully one day that will be a thing of the past but for now it does hold us back from our only options.........

Agreed. Their white list is not very long. It's definitely not just BB. Just drives me crazy seeing only the Key1 under the BlackBerry heading.

[JeddClampet]

Come to T-Mo guys!

Unfortunately TMO or ATT are not an option. I have surveyed others around me and everyone on TMo has coverage issues where we work. ATT complaints are nearly as bad. I can honestly say I never have a complaint about VZW service. My only complaint is limited acceptance of unlocked devices.

My phone is an important tool. I can't tolerate spotty service in my work. That coupled with my corporate discount would mean I would pay the same or more to switch carriers for lower quality service. That doesn't make sense just for the sake of satisfying my BB fix. Hence my sadness.

[brian_peterson]

You could literally go back to 2007 forum and copy and paste complaints about Verizon carrying BlackBerry phones. This is a tale, almost as old, as BlackBerry.

[HostessCupcake]

Carriers don’t want BYOD, that’s why AT&T, Verizon and Sprint push carrier devices.

Definitely part of it. BB10 devices sold poorly on VZW, the Priv sold horribly with lots of returns so that was the final straw. The KEYone was barely there. So if they're not going to offer it for retail sale they don't really care. But the fact that they whitelisted the K1 but not the K2 seems to me evidence that the lack of CDMA bands might be one of the reasons why.