[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Had it not? I think actual sales figures are never going to be published (and no one cares since their absence in the yearly financial report does not bother shareholders at all)

If you are talking BlackBerry.... I doubt shareholders ever expected the licencing to do much, Chen hasn't made a big deal about it in a long time. I doubt he ever mentions smartphones again.

As for TCL Communications... they had to go private few years ago due to declining sales, there is not reporting for the public. TCL Ltd is till the majority owner, but they don't talk much about the failing smartphone division either.

There was an unofficial leaked document last summer... that's probably all we'll ever have.

[arkenoi]

So Chen buried the once thriving smartphone business and expensive well-recognizable brand name and is proud of it. And the shareholders are ok as well. Ok, ok.

[bb10adopter111]

So Chen buried the once thriving smartphone business and expensive well-recognizable brand name and is proud of it. And shareholders are ok as well. Ok, ok.

The die was cast long before BlackBerry ever asked John Chen to come in and save the company by ditching hardware.

They never made any money selling hardware, even at their height. They made billions on the monthly fees for BIS. Once those went away, only an iPhone-like demand could have saved them. They tool a huge swing with BB10 and missed. The rest has been pretty inevitable.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[joeldf]

So Chen buried the once thriving smartphone business and expensive well-recognizable brand name and is proud of it. And the shareholders are ok as well. Ok, ok.

Shareholders hired Chen to transition out if the phone business from the very beginning. So, yeah, he did exactly what they wanted.

[arkenoi]

Well, a transition to a stable niche market seemed wiser for me than pipe dreams about regaining world domination. "All or nothing" is not a smart way to do business, right?

[conite]

Well, a transition to a stable niche market seemed wiser for me than pipe dreams about regaining world domination. "All or nothing" is not a smart way to do business, right?

Taking Chinese companies out of the mix, the only folks making money out of handsets are Apple and Samsung.

BlackBerry was extremely lucky to get out alive.

[arkenoi]

Taking Chinese companies out of the mix, the only folks making money out of handsets are Apple and Samsung.

LG?

[conite]

LG?

They have been on the razor's edge for years - just like Sony, Moto, and HTC.

[arkenoi]

They have been on the razor's edge for years - just like Sony and HTC.

So, this far the rule is "to make a profit from your own handsets not based on a generic reference design you need to selll it in sub-billion quantities", right? And no other secret sauce is known yet?

[conite]

So, this far the rule is "to make a profit from your own handsets not based on a generic reference design you need to selll it in sub-billion quantities", right? And no other secret sauce is known yet?

Apple gets away with large profit margins on hardware. Samsung does it by ungodly volume. That leaves only scraps for others.

[Sporkguy3]

The secret sauce was effective marketing. Apple did it by first dominating the MP3 space and carrying over to revolutionizing smartphones. Samsung created an effective campaign to market itself as the iPhone killer.

I wouldn't say it is impossible to get into that market, but you need money and momentum. BlackBerry has no momentum anymore, which stinks because they make darn good phones.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Apple gets away with large profit margins on hardware. Samsung does it by ungodly volume. That leaves only scraps for others.

I suspect the only companies making money in smartphones these days....

Apple
Samsung
Huawei
BKK Electronics
Xiaomi

Which combined account for over 75% of all sales....

That leaves the "others", which the top players are Tecno, Sony, Lenovo/Moto, TCL, HTC, LG and HMD/Nokia. Few of whom are turning a profit on smartphones. For all the growth and news that HMD makes... they aren't making a profit yet.

[bb10adopter111]

Well, a transition to a stable niche market seemed wiser for me than pipe dreams about regaining world domination. "All or nothing" is not a smart way to do business, right?

Blame the previous CEO for that. Chen was recruited long after that decision had been made and had proved catastrophic.

John Chen refocused the company on its core competency, which was secure mobile communications in the enterprise space. That's what they had actually made money doing for their entire history. Then, with their acquisition of Cylance, they doubled down on the strategy of securing mobile endpoints.

Given a choice between

[app_Developer]

So Chen buried the once thriving smartphone business and expensive well-recognizable brand name and is proud of it. And the shareholders are ok as well. Ok, ok.

The smartphone business stopped thriving long before the first meeting/interview with Chen. He was hired to find a good landing place for BB. The smartphone engine was already in flames by then.

[whatnow00]

Here we go again.

BBMo expected to sell (eventually) about 2 million devices a year (thus having a user base of 4-6 million). $20 per phone on marketing and advertising gets you $40 million a year. That doesn't go far these days.

BUT sales in 2017 were likely less than 800,000 units - so that's $16 million.

I believe you spent a lot of time on the forums denying the 800,000 number was credible, but I digress. Where are you getting your numbers now?

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I believe you spent a lot of time on the forums denying the 800,000 number was credible, but I digress. Where are you getting your numbers now?

The 800K or 850K was that guess that IDC’s Francisco Jeronimo made....

[conite]

I believe you spent a lot of time on the forums denying the 800,000 number was credible, but I digress. Where are you getting your numbers now?

I'm just picking a rough number for argument sake. Make it a million - same answer.

[Emaderton3]

So, this far the rule is "to make a profit from your own handsets not based on a generic reference design you need to selll it in sub-billion quantities", right? And no other secret sauce is known yet?

Multiple companies licensed BlackBerry software and failed. Small numbers were not profitable.

[kile6666]

when do we get Pie for Key2?

[Chuck Finley69]

when do we get Pie for Key2?

Scheduled for end of month. Depending on your region either February 30th or February 31st before TCL PKB new device announcement.

[chain13]

when do we get Pie for Key2?

They will pass the pie, and roll android 10 instead. Haven’t you heard the news recently?

[the_boon]

They will pass the pie, and roll android 10 instead. Haven’t you heard the news recently?

They will also update the BB10 runtime to 8.1

[whatnow00]

A court will eventually rule on whether it's misappropriation of IP or not. If it is, then so be it.

What will you have the world do instead? Just say it's ok to steal?

Did they go to court with Typo or Unihertz? Or just threaten to?

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Did they go to court with Typo or Unihertz? Or just threaten to?

Took Typo to court twice.... But there are questions about how successful Typo was at that point.

Unihertz... there seemed to only be a threat that Unihertz was willing to make adjustments for.

[BlackBlurry]

Thank you for your reply.
I can't find any link where the UniHertz Titan can be bought.