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If those BlackBerry Android phones had come out 5 years earlier instead of BB10, it would have been a jump straight from BBOS to BBAndroid and things would have gone quite differently.This is simply true. A lot of BlackBerry Android users will disagree because all they want is a PKB on Android, and it was clear that BB10 was a dead end. But the fact remains that many, many more people bought the lowly Z10 slab than ever bought all of the BlackBerry Android phones combined!
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android
The iPhone was still on the rise by 2012 and it was the year people were leaving their BBOS devices in droves, so had a KEY like device with a 4.5" screen and full QWERTY been available by then (and it would have been carried by most major carriers) they wouldn't have lagged so behind in the race02-03-20 06:53 AMLike 0 -
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Doubtful. I would bet that 90%+ of BlackBerry users would still have jumped to iPhone as Android was an unsecurable hot mess that was not supported on most enterprise networks. It wasn't ready for prime time until Lollipop.If those BlackBerry Android phones had come out 5 years earlier instead of BB10, it would have been a jump straight from BBOS to BBAndroid and things would have gone quite differently.
The iPhone was still on the rise by 2012 and it was the year people were leaving their BBOS devices in droves, so had a KEY like device with a 4.5" screen and full QWERTY been available by then (and it would have been carried by most major carriers) they wouldn't have lagged so behind in the race02-03-20 07:01 AMLike 0 -
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And what makes you say casual consumers care about having "the most secure OS" ?
The failure of BB10 and BBAndroid's DTEK security proved just that, that consumers want all their apps, they want 'em now, and a nice display to enjoy them on.
They can care less about security.02-03-20 07:04 AMLike 0 -
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Sure, the few REMAINING casual user PKB fans like you would have preferred a BlackBerry Android back in 2010-13. But that isn't a viable market segment Now and it wasn't then.And what makes you say casual consumers care about having "the most secure OS" ?
The failure of BB10 and BBAndroid's DTEK security proved just that, that consumers want all their apps, they want 'em now, and a nice display to enjoy them on.
They can care less about security.
The same number of people would have left PKBs, like me. Android was not the answer to BlackBerry's problems in 2010-13. There was nothing BlackBerry could have done that would have worked in competition with consumer electronics giants except somehow preserve it's corporate near monopoly by having BB10 ready sooner.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-03-20 07:32 AMLike 0 -
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Are you serious right now?
People left BlackBerry in droves, mostly because they wanted larger screens and app availability.
Had the KEYone come out about 5-6 years before it did, it would have been a completely different story.02-03-20 01:46 PMLike 0 -
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You think most people who left BlackBerry wanted another PKB when it was no longer needed to write? Most were very happy to get off of the PKB. That's also why they didn't come back. Don't let the fact that you like a PKB fool you into thinking the other 99% of the population wants one.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-03-20 01:57 PMLike 0 -
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People loved their Berrys, but they wanted to enter an ecosystem full of apps instead of being very limited like BBOS was.You think most people who left BlackBerry wanted another PKB when it was no longer needed to write? Most were very happy to get off of the PKB. That's also why they didn't come back. Don't let the fact that you like a PKB fool you into thinking the other 99% of the population wants one.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android
Yes, again, I am 1000% confident that the KEYone came to market 5-6 years too late.
That doesn't mean that it would have crushed the iPhone right there and then, but we wouldn't be where we are now.02-03-20 02:18 PMLike 0 -
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I loved my BlackBerry phones a lot more than most people, but it wasn't because of the PKB. It was for what I could accomplish with the devices. The PKBs were the only way to type before capacitive glass. And the BlackBerry PKB was still superior to the iPhone's keyboard. But my last BlackBerry PKB daily driver was the 9700, though I think the BB10 PKBS were all special, too. But on Android, the ONLY benefit I found for the PKB was the hardware shortcuts.People loved their Berrys, but they wanted to enter an ecosystem full of apps instead of being very limited like BBOS was.
Yes, again, I am 1000% confident that the KEYone came to market 5-6 years too late.
That doesn't mean that it would have crushed the iPhone right there and then, but we wouldn't be where we are now.
To me, the PKB is like my spouse's appearance when we first met. It was an important part of our early relationship, but it doesn't define what that person brings to the relationship.
The form factor is critical. Unfortunately, the KEY phones are mongrel Frankenphones with poor ergonomics that try to be two incompatible things at once.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-03-20 02:29 PMLike 0 -
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If BlackBerry had tried to use Android in 2012/2013... they'd have ended up with a Silent Circle like product in order to do "their thing" (security). And it would have crash and burned....
Only reason BlackBerry could do what they did in 2015 with Android, is because of work Google and Samsung had already done. They couldn't have done it any sooner.
Now maybe they could have formed a consumer division and made Blueberries that were not considered secure and tried to carve out a niche in consumer phones... but in the end they would have never have competed with other OEMa, as they didn't have the volume. (and because people didn't want PKB phones).02-03-20 02:31 PMLike 0 -
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Without BIS revenues, BlackBerry handsets really had nowhere to go. I think the demise of devices was inevitable.If BlackBerry had tried to use Android in 2012/2013... they'd have ended up with a Silent Circle like product in order to do "their thing" (security). And it would have crash and burned....
Only reason BlackBerry could do what they did in 2015 with Android, is because of work Google and Samsung had already done. They couldn't have done it any sooner.
Now maybe they could have formed a consumer division and made Blueberries that were not considered secure and tried to carve out a niche in consumer phones... but in the end they would have never have competed with other OEMa, as they didn't have the volume. (and because people didn't want PKB phones).Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.02-03-20 02:34 PMLike 1 -
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While I agree with this statement, the end result would have remained the same. The biggest problem for BlackBerry was having no control with Android to monetize it’s users directly. Depending on carrier, BIS revenues were $5-$20USD per month. Think about cash flow, $60-$240USD per year guaranteed high margin software revenues. It’s why Apple has the margins and the Android OEMs, except for Google and Samsung, fighting over scraps and then exit the business.And what makes you say casual consumers care about having "the most secure OS" ?
The failure of BB10 and BBAndroid's DTEK security proved just that, that consumers want all their apps, they want 'em now, and a nice display to enjoy them on.
They can care less about security.02-03-20 02:37 PMLike 0 -
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Even if that's true, BlackBerrys would have had a hell of a better head start then, instead of playing catch up in 2017, and we wouldn't be where we are now.While I agree with this statement, the end result would have remained the same. The biggest problem for BlackBerry was having no control with Android to monetize it’s users directly. Depending on carrier, BIS revenues were $5-$20USD per month. Think about cash flow, $60-$240USD per year guaranteed high margin software revenues. It’s why Apple has the margins and the Android OEMs, except for Google and Samsung, fighting over scraps and then exit the business.02-03-20 02:39 PMLike 0 -
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That's your assertion. I am extremely skeptical that more than a few million people would have stayed with the PKB even if BlackBerry had done everything possible at the perfect time starting in 2007!
The PKB was a necessary component of two-way paging. But most people don't type all that much anymore and would rather have more screen real estate. I know lots of people who lived their BlackBerrys who would never go back to a PKB no matter how perfect the device.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-03-20 02:43 PMLike 0 -
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But where would the revenue have come from? You don't make money off hardware - unless you are Apple. The average bulk Android OEM makes $10-20 of profit per device.
It's all about content.02-03-20 02:47 PMLike 0 -
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That pretty much describes everyone I know, and I work at a major university medical Center that was dominated by BlackBerry. They all moved on from BBOS and didn't even consider BB10.That's your assertion. I am extremely skeptical that more than a few million people would have stayed with the PKB even if BlackBerry had done everything possible at the perfect time starting in 2007!
The PKB was a necessary component of two-way paging. But most people don't type all that much anymore and would rather have more screen real estate. I know lots of people who lived their BlackBerrys who would never go back to a PKB no matter how perfect the device.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-04-20 08:02 AMLike 0 -
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And, I would imagine that the vast majority of them, given a choice between an Android PKB with the hot mess Android of 2010-2012 and an iPhone, would have chosen the iPhone.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-04-20 08:32 AMLike 0 -
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That's correct. The only exception is the Amazon Store that I can't remove, but I force stop that every time I reboot my phone as it send data to Amazon.
I have sometimes installed Android apps to help people troubleshoot but I uninstall them immediately after I'm done.
I don't believe any Android apps prior to Android M are securable due to the lack of permission controls.
Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android02-05-20 08:28 AMLike 0
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