12-04-18 08:13 PM
145 ... 456
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  1. Bbnivende's Avatar
    There, fixed it for you

    Do people really think they should still bother with any slab at this point? I thought the abysmal sales and media hype and availability of the Motion made it clear that almost no one wants to type on a GlassBerry.
    The Motion was clearly a very poor value proposition. Multiple reviews said basically that.

    The question is whether they can sell enough PKB’s to be a viable brand. I think at the very least they could use a portrait slider and perhaps a wider device that uses a Passport like keyboard to broaden their offerings.

    Their Enterprise ambitions were doomed from the start.

    I note that TCL thinks they can sell a LOT of LE’s in Nigeria. It was one of BlackBerry’s largest markets.

    I think there is the potential for an all touch but they need to add more value.
    12-04-18 01:28 PM
  2. conite's Avatar
    The Motion was clearly a very poor value proposition. Multiple reviews said basically that.

    The question is whether they can sell enough PKB’s to be a viable brand. I think at the very least they could use a portrait slider and perhaps a wider device that uses a Passport like keyboard to broaden their offerings.

    Their Enterprise ambitions were doomed from the start.

    I note that TCL thinks they can sell a LOT of LE’s in Nigeria. It was one of BlackBerry’s largest markets.

    I think there is the potential for an all touch but they need to add more value.
    Tell me how BBMo can compete against a Nokia 6.1 with the BlackBerry suite at $199?

    Better yet, why would they want to? Nokia probably makes less than $10 per device.
    12-04-18 01:34 PM
  3. The_Passporter's Avatar
    Nokia still makes phones? Lol
    12-04-18 01:57 PM
  4. iHadLastBB's Avatar
    It only shows that slab folks aren't willing to trade top-25% performance for added security and durability.

    Physical keyboard fans, for the most part, have different priorities in a device.
    Security and durability? I member Dtek50 who was 350€ then same Alcatel Idol4 was for 250€.

    Front screen of Dtek50 started peel off after second week.. you're talking about durability, right? Only good thing was a BB battery pack as a gift. Idol4 had full language support then Dtek's was limited to the same BB10 language pack. Camera was terrible, I doubt Motion is any better. Speakers was meh, worse then Z30 and Passport, still stereo though.

    BB android devices have terrible hardware since start and you should admit this?
    Attached Thumbnails KEY2 is a wacky product?-1748686346.jpg  
    12-04-18 02:11 PM
  5. conite's Avatar
    Security and durability? I member Dtek50 who was 350€ then same Alcatel Idol4 was for 250€.

    Front screen of Dtek50 started peel off after second week.. you're talking about durability, right? Only good thing was a BB battery pack as a gift. Idol4 had full language support then Dtek's was limited to the same BB10 language pack. Camera was terrible, I doubt Motion is any better. Speakers was meh, worse then Z30 and Passport, still stereo though.

    BB android devices have terrible hardware since start and you should admit this?
    DTEKs are not BBMo devices. Motion is the only example.

    Say what you want about the specs, but durability has never been questioned.

    Android Authority:
    "The build quality however rivals even the most top tier of smartphones"

    Knowyourmobile:
    "Solid and premium-feel design with waterproofing,"

    DigitalTrends:
    "The BlackBerry Motion is well-built and sleek."

    Engadget:
    "Sturdy build quality"

    Pocket-Link:
    "Solid design looks the business"

    Android Central:
    "It's rugged and water resistant"

    Tech Spot:
    "Solid design for a mid-range device"

    ZDnet:
    "Solid build quality"

    Mobile Syrop:
    "Tasteful and rugged design"
    Last edited by conite; 12-04-18 at 02:36 PM.
    the_boon likes this.
    12-04-18 02:12 PM
  6. Bbnivende's Avatar
    Tell me how BBMo can compete against a Nokia 6.1 with the BlackBerry suite at $199?

    Better yet, why would they want to? Nokia probably makes less than $10 per device.
    They want to because Alcatel only makes $10 per device too. The challenge for Nokia and TCL is to move up market. Nokia seems to be doing that.

    TCL may have to strike a better deal with BlackBerry in order to successfully move up market. They chose BlackBerry because they perceived that there would be carrier support and Enterprise take up. Not happening.

    Customer’s are not willing to pay very much for a skin, any skin. I am not sure that BlackBerry as a separate brand can work for TCL. BlackBerry clearly overvalues their contribution to this partnership.

    Ultimately, to survive as a smartphone OEM, TCL needs phones with a higher gross margin. Can BlackBerry phones sell in sufficient numbers to keep TCL smartphones afloat?
    12-04-18 02:37 PM
  7. conite's Avatar
    They want to because Alcatel only makes $10 per device too. The challenge for Nokia and TCL is to move up market. Nokia seems to be doing that.

    TCL may have to strike a better deal with BlackBerry in order to successfully move up market. They chose BlackBerry because they perceived that there would be carrier support and Enterprise take up. Not happening.

    Customer’s are not willing to pay very much for a skin, any skin. I am not sure that BlackBerry as a separate brand can work for TCL. BlackBerry clearly overvalues their contribution to this partnership.

    Ultimately, to survive as a smartphone OEM, TCL needs phones with a higher gross margin. Can BlackBerry phones sell in sufficient numbers to keep TCL smartphones afloat?
    How do you move up-market with a slab phone, when there are dozens of other 5% profit slab OEMs at every price point?
    12-04-18 02:39 PM
  8. iHadLastBB's Avatar
    DTEKs are not BBMo devices. Motion is the only example.

    Say what you want about the specs, but durability has never been questioned.

    Android Authority:
    "The build quality however rivals even the most top tier of smartphones"

    Knowyourmobile:
    "Solid and premium-feel design with waterproofing,"

    DigitalTrends:
    "The BlackBerry Motion is well-built and sleek."

    Engadget:
    "Sturdy build quality"

    Pocket-Link:
    "Solid design looks the business"

    Android Central:
    "It's rugged and water resistant"

    Tech Spot:
    "Solid design for a mid-range device"

    ZDnet:
    "Solid build quality"

    Mobile Syrop:
    "Tasteful and rugged design"
    So you're talking about make-up 💄like this?



    Beautiful design makes it even worse, because you're gonna be disappointed no matter how "solid design" is.. + you get even more disappointed after you use and see what is inside 😞
    The_Passporter likes this.
    12-04-18 02:41 PM
  9. conite's Avatar
    So you're talking about make-up like this?
    I guess I can't compete with your exhaustive evidence.
    12-04-18 02:44 PM
  10. the_boon's Avatar
    They want to because Alcatel only makes $10 per device too. The challenge for Nokia and TCL is to move up market. Nokia seems to be doing that.

    TCL may have to strike a better deal with BlackBerry in order to successfully move up market. They chose BlackBerry because they perceived that there would be carrier support and Enterprise take up. Not happening.

    Customer’s are not willing to pay very much for a skin, any skin. I am not sure that BlackBerry as a separate brand can work for TCL. BlackBerry clearly overvalues their contribution to this partnership.

    Ultimately, to survive as a smartphone OEM, TCL needs phones with a higher gross margin. Can BlackBerry phones sell in sufficient numbers to keep TCL smartphones afloat?
    Worse case, if the BBMo KEY line stops (man I hope that never happens, love those keys) then can we hope to even get generic TCL branded PKB phones or something ?
    12-04-18 03:36 PM
  11. The_Passporter's Avatar
    How do you move up-market with a slab phone, when there are dozens of other 5% profit slab OEMs at every price point?
    Promise Security and stay loyal to your word regarding Security update schedules.
    12-04-18 03:45 PM
  12. conite's Avatar
    Promise Security and stay loyal to your word regarding Security update schedules.
    You really think that would make a significant impact on slab sales?

    Anyone that cares about security is already well aware than a BlackBerry Android device a few patches behind is still far better off than a more current vanilla device.

    Although, in reality, 90% of BlackBerry Android devices are within 60 days.
    Last edited by conite; 12-04-18 at 04:09 PM.
    12-04-18 03:49 PM
  13. The_Passporter's Avatar
    You really think that would make a significant impact on slab sales?

    Anyone that cares about security is already well aware than a BlackBerry Android device a few patches behind is still far better off than an more current vanilla device.

    Although, in reality, 90% of BlackBerry Android devices are within 60 days.
    Well what other gimmick do they have up their sleeve other than a physical keyboard that only a nich market want?
    12-04-18 04:02 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    Well what other gimmick do they have up their sleeve other than a physical keyboard that only a nich market want?
    That's pretty much it.

    They never claimed to be anything other than a niche player.

    The security circle and the physical keyboard circle are probably 90% overlapping.
    Byrese and astrodan13 like this.
    12-04-18 04:03 PM
  15. Bbnivende's Avatar
    How do you move up-market with a slab phone, when there are dozens of other 5% profit slab OEMs at every price point?
    Branding BlackBerry helps . It beats a name no one can pronounce. Cannot be rooted. Delivery channels in place. Carrier relations in place for Alcatel and TCL phones. They control manufacturing. They are suppliers of parts. They can offer security updates.

    What they lack is technical expertise and realistic and strategic business plans. They seem to be falling into the pattern of making grandiose goals lacking in follow through . Let’s see what they can deliver in Nigeria.
    12-04-18 05:16 PM
  16. conite's Avatar
    Branding BlackBerry helps . It beats a name no one can pronounce. Cannot be rooted. Delivery channels in place. Carrier relations in place for Alcatel and TCL phones. They control manufacturing. They are suppliers of parts. They can offer security updates.
    Apart from rooting, how does any of that differ from Nokia, Huawei, Xiaomi, OnePlus, Asus, and Motorola?
    12-04-18 05:21 PM
  17. Bbnivende's Avatar
    Apart from rooting, how does any of that differ from Nokia, Huawei, Xiaomi, OnePlus, Asus, and Motorola?
    Huawei is the second best selling phone in the world. You left out ZTE ( what is left of it ).

    I guess the hope is that TCL can repeat their TV success. Their phone business is in disarray with huge losses in market share over the last two years. Perhaps TCL might sell their phone business to concentrate in products for your home that are connected.

    It seems very hard , extremely hard for Chinese businesses to admit any kind of failure.
    12-04-18 06:20 PM
  18. conite's Avatar
    Huawei is the second best selling phone in the world. You left out ZTE ( what is left of it ).

    I guess the hope is that TCL can repeat their TV success. Their phone business is in disarray with huge losses in market share over the last two years. Perhaps TCL might sell their phone business to concentrate in products for your home that are connected.

    It seems very hard , extremely hard for Chinese businesses to admit any kind of failure.
    As far as BBMo is concerned, we are all in the dark as far as success/earnings is concerned.

    If it were the case, they would probably be happy with a slow and steady build in profits.
    Last edited by conite; 12-04-18 at 07:23 PM.
    12-04-18 06:24 PM
  19. iHadLastBB's Avatar
    Huawei is the second best selling phone in the world. You left out ZTE ( what is left of it ).

    I guess the hope is that TCL can repeat their TV success. Their phone business is in disarray with huge losses in market share over the last two years. Perhaps TCL might sell their phone business to concentrate in products for your home that are connected.

    It seems very hard , extremely hard for Chinese businesses to admit any kind of failure.
    In that case they definitely need to come up with a HuaweiBerry hardware device with a PocophoneBerry or OneplusBerry pricing 🍻
    12-04-18 07:16 PM
  20. Bbnivende's Avatar
    As far as BBMo is concerned, we are all in the dark as far as success/earnings is concerned.

    If it were the case, they would probably be happy with a slow and steady build in profits.
    I have not studied the issue but TCL Communications appears to consolidate Alcatel and BlackBerry. I guess I could be wrong. The financial statements are on the internet. At the very least there are news releases showing TCL phone sales dropping for the last two years.

    The essential problem is that TCL has factories geared for much larger sales. They neither have large sales or high ASP’s.


    BlackBerry Mobile is TCL . Who knows why Chinese companies do what they do? They do take the long game.
    12-04-18 08:13 PM
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