[chain13]

I understand your frustration, but my question is why you thought their forward-looking statements were "promises" in the first place.

I'm speechless afer reading this LOL. I know it's a fansite, but.. never mind.

Antivirus is useless without root. It's a waste of phone resources.

Agree. Including cylance.

[bb10adopter111]

I'm speechless afer reading this LOL. I know it's a fansite, but.. never mind.

Agree. Including cylance.

So, because I'm a fan, I can't be skeptical when marketers and executives make promises???

Caveat emptor. I know that businesses make plans all the time and say all kinds of promotional stuff based on what they think/plan for the future. But I disregard anything that isn't included in the written warranty as simple optimism, because if they didn't believe that they'd be successful they wouldn't even try.

I honestly have no sympathy for people who think any of these companies are making "promises" to us about the future. The only promise made to me when I bought my KEYone was a one-year warranty on the device and an "as-is" software disclaimer. The rest was a plan, not a promise. It represented their intentions at the time, not a firm commitment.

In the case of BlackBerry Mobile, I wrote in these forums in 2017 that I would not expect an upgrade to Oreo when buying my KEYONE unless BlackBerry Mobile planned to produce a successor phone. When people started talking about the Android for Enterprise 36 month update requirement, I said that it would only happen if BlackBerry Mobile was successful; otherwise all bets were off.

I don't consider myself a "fan" of any company. I am a fan of workplace productivity and come to CB to discuss tips for being more effective.

If you expect me to be a fan and say glowing things about BlackBerry Limited Or BlackBerry Mobile or TLC, it ain't me.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[chain13]

So, because I'm a fan, I can't be skeptical when marketers and executives make promises???

Caveat emptor. I know that businesses make plans all the time and say all kinds of promotional stuff based on what they think/plan for the future. But I disregard anything that isn't included in the written warranty as simple optimism, because if they didn't believe that they'd be successful they wouldn't even try.

I honestly have no sympathy for people who think any of these companies are making "promises" to us about the future. The only promise made to me when I bought my KEYone was a one-year warranty on the device and an "as-is" software disclaimer. The rest was a plan, not a promise. It represented their intentions at the time, not a firm commitment.

In the case of BlackBerry Mobile, I wrote in these forums in 2017 that I would not expect an upgrade to Oreo when buying my KEYONE unless BlackBerry Mobile planned to produce a successor phone. When people started talking about the Android for Enterprise 36 month update requirement, I said that it would only happen if BlackBerry Mobile was successful; otherwise all bets were off.

I don't consider myself a "fan" of any company. I am a fan of workplace productivity and come to CB to discuss tips for being more effective.

If you expect me to be a fan and say glowing things about BlackBerry Limited Or BlackBerry Mobile or TLC, it ain't me.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

Yeah. People buy phone that expected to get 2 years updates and 1 upgrade. They expected they would get and you DON'T. They don't get it and it's their fault to expect that way?

[bb10adopter111]

Yeah. People buy phone that expected to get 2 years updates and 1 upgrade. They expected they would get and you DON'T. They don't get it and it's their fault to expect that way?

Companies have armies of lawyers who get paid huge amounts of money to make sure they don't cross the line when it comes to deceptive advertising. Consumers should always read the fine print, and the fine print on EVERY phone is the device warranty and the terms of use they sign when they set up their phone.

If consumers feel lied to by marketers, then they are right, but if they are surprised, then they are being naive. If they think that the law is on their side when the fine print was accurate, they are wrong.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[chain13]

Companies have armies of lawyers who get paid huge amounts of money to make sure they don't cross the line when it comes to deceptive advertising. Consumers should always read the fine print, and the fine print on EVERY phone is the device warranty and the terms of use they sign when they set up their phone.

If consumers feel lied to by marketers, then they are right, but if they are surprised, then they are being naive. If they think that the law is on their side when the fine print was accurate, they are wrong.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

I know. It's fine. For me it's just a phone. Instead of sue them by law, it's easier for them to not buy the blackberry branded phone anymore. In fact, I believe all the key2 buyers (new buyer or upgrade from keyone) were expecting to get it.

But can you tell me what's the meaning of "guaranteed os upgrade"?

[bb10adopter111]

I know. It's fine. For me it's just a phone. Instead of sue them by law, it's easier for them to not buy the blackberry branded phone anymore. In fact, I believe all the key2 buyers (new buyer or upgrade from keyone) were expecting to get it.

But can you tell me what's the meaning of "guaranteed os upgrade"?

I don't know. To me it sounds like the next letter upgrade. But someone could try to claim it was patching. Where was it written?

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[conite]

Yeah. People buy phone that expected to get 2 years updates and 1 upgrade. They expected they would get and you DON'T. They don't get it and it's their fault to expect that way?

Only the KEYᵒⁿᵉ and Motion came with a letter upgrade and 2 years of patches commitment.

The KEY², frustratingly, never did.

[The_Passporter]

There is no way to answer a general question like that. You need to decide WHAT you wish to protect and FROM WHOM. Once you know your threat profile, Then you can evaluate your risk profile.

For example, if you wish to secure your bank account from cyber criminals, you might do any of the following:

[LIST] [*]Never access your account on a public WiFi network without using a VPN.[*] Use a unique email address and password not associated with any other account. [*] Use a hardware key or trusted authenticator app as a 2nd factor.[*] Don't use Mint.com or any other online service with your account.[*] Don't use a mobile banking app at all.[*] Never provide your debit card number on any online transactions (use only prepaid credit cards, or masked card numbers through a service like Blur or Privacy.com)[*] Don't check the box to stay logged on to your banking app.[*] Uninstall your mobile banking app and reinstall it whenever you need it
Etc.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

Never mind I just saw your answer

[bb10adopter111]

How would you adjust your answers if using a VPN?

A good VPN is critical for using public WiFi, but it doesn't replace other mitigations. A VPN won't do anything to protect you from a bad app on your phone or from someone who is trying to gain access to your account through customer service using your stolen credentials.

If you're looking for a personal cybersecurity checklist approach, just do the following:

• No public WiFi without a VPN
• Use a password manager with long, complex passwords that are unique for each account
• Use 2nd factor authentication with a hardware token or authenticator app. SMS 2FA is 1000x better than nothing but leaves you vulnerable to a targeted attack.
• Be very selective with the apps you install on your phone, and delete ones you don't use at least weekly (you can always reinstall them
• Always lock your phone, back nippy our valuable data, and be prepared to wipe it remotely if it's lost or stolen

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android.

[The_Passporter]

@bb10adopter111
Why do you say to not use a mobile banking app?
Don't banks keep them safe and updated?

Hammered out on my Precious Passport.

[bb10adopter111]

@bb10adopter111
Why do you say to not use a mobile banking app?
Don't banks keep them safe and updated?

Hammered out on my Precious Passport.

I'm saying that the easiest way to reduce risk to 0% chance of loss is to not use something at all. There is no such thing as 100% safe, so we each have to decide on a level of risk and reward that is acceptable.

I receive almost all of my payments from clients through electronic means so the biggest benefit of mobile banking (depositing checks) is mostly lost on me. On those rare occasions when I need to deposit a check and don't want to go to an ATM or branch, I install my bank's mobile app, use it, and immediately uninstall it.

However, if I received checks daily, I might leave the app on my phone because the convenience might be worth the risk.

Risk is the estimated outcome of an uncertainty. It's equal to the likelihood of occurrence times the net impact. Given my setup, I'd say the likelihood of a compromise of my bank's mobile app on my phone is between 1 in a million and 1 in 10,000 over a year. If I install and uninstall the app 6 times per year for a day each time, I reduce the risk by a factor of approximate 60 (365/6=60).

That's a no brainer for me.

[whatnow00]

I think you'd have a very difficult time proving a false advertising claim against BlackBerry Mobile for any of their phones. In the US, the Federal Trade Commission would have to prove in court that there were specific advertisement that were misleading at the time that they ran.

But, if there's a case against BlackBerry Mobile I agree it would be for the CDMA variant of the KEYone that never received an upgrade to Nougat.

But feel free to file a complaint with the appropriate consumer regulatory authority. I don't have a dog in this hunt, as I don't care about TCL/BlackBerry Mobile. But don't call me as a witness, as I definitely never felt deceived.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

Why does it have to be in federal court? Every state has some sort of law false advertising and/or deceptive trade practices. Complaints have been filed.

[bb10adopter111]

Why does it have to be in federal court? Every state has some sort of law false advertising and/or deceptive trade practices. Complaints have been filed.

Now it's clear you don't know what you're talking about. It's interstate commerce and would have to be in federal court in the US.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[Chuck Finley69]

Yeah. People buy phone that expected to get 2 years updates and 1 upgrade. They expected they would get and you DON'T. They don't get it and it's their fault to expect that way?

Expectations and guarantees aren’t the same.

[The_Passporter]

I'm saying that the easiest way to reduce risk to 0% chance of loss is to not use something at all. There is no such thing as 100% safe, so we each have to decide on a level of risk and reward that is acceptable.

I receive almost all of my payments from clients through electronic means so the biggest benefit of mobile banking (depositing checks) is mostly lost on me. On those rare occasions when I need to deposit a check and don't want to go to an ATM or branch, I install my bank's mobile app, use it, and immediately uninstall it.

However, if I received checks daily, I might leave the app on my phone because the convenience might be worth the risk.

Risk is the estimated outcome of an uncertainty. It's equal to the likelihood of occurrence times the net impact. Given my setup, I'd say the likelihood of a compromise of my bank's mobile app on my phone is between 1 in a million and 1 in 10,000 over a year. If I install and uninstall the app 6 times per year for a day each time, I reduce the risk by a factor of approximate 60 (365/6=60).

That's a no brainer for me.

So you are saying to be certain there are no threats we should smash our phones and cook them in an oven then only use mail and hand-deliver it but use invisible ink? Lol

[bb10adopter111]

So you are saying to be certain there are no threats we should smash our phones and cook them in an oven then only use mail and hand-deliver it but use invisible ink? Lol

LOL. Hardly. I believe that people should make their own risk-reward calculations and decisions. I don't keep a banking app on my phone because it increases risk without a corresponding benefit TO ME. If the reward for using a banking app was higher, I would be more inclined to use it.

This is no different than the decisions we make every day. I know when I drive in Florida, if I'm typical, I have approximately a 1/8000 chance of dying in an accident each year. If I drive half as often as the average driver, that risk is cut in half.

It's just silly to add apps to your phone that increase risk if you have no use for them.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[Chuck Finley69]

LOL. Hardly. I believe that people should make their own risk-reward calculations and decisions. I don't keep a banking app on my phone because it increases risk without a corresponding benefit TO ME. If the reward for using a banking app was higher, I would be more inclined to use it.

This is no different than the decisions we make every day. I know when I drive in Florida, if I'm typical, I have approximately a 1/8000 chance of dying in an accident each year. If I drive half as often as the average driver, that risk is cut in half.

It's just silly to add apps to your phone that increase risk if you have no use for them.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

Was there a reason you specified Florida regarding driving? LMAO

[bb10adopter111]

Was there a reason you specified Florida regarding driving? LMAO

Not really. I happened to know the numbers , and it's a large sample size. The risk of being killed in a car in Florida is higher than in most states, but not the highest (4x more likely in Montana!).

As an aside, the risk of being a pedestrian killed by a cat in Florida is the highest of any state in the US.

Z10 = BB10 + VKB > iOS + Android

[RKSSDBB]

you can't be too careful about cats!

[joeldf]

Guess it depends on the cat...

[Chuck Finley69]

Does anyone want to know my favorite kind of cat?

[conite]

Does anyone want to know my favorite kind of cat?

[cyberdoggie]

Pardon my ignorance. What does pie have that oreo doesn't? Asking seriously. Is it that big of an upgrade over what we have now?

Patches beyond the middle of this year?

[roba5263]

Patches beyond the middle of this year?

Besides patching, what features are we really missing?

[cyberdoggie]

They promised best-in-class monthly updates. Not monthly updates monthly.

They were second-to-none outside of Android One devices.

Mission accomplished.

Nor can you blame BlackBerry Mobile for Verizon's refusal to update to Oreo.

For a normal person I would argue that 'best-in-class monthly updates' means issuing the monthly Google updates.
If that's not what they meant to do, then I'd say this was cheeky not to say misleading language.