07-31-18 07:02 AM
77 123 ...
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  1. guizmox's Avatar
    Hello !
    I started to make some comparison shots using the exact same (manual) settings on the 4 devices :

    I dropped a low-light shot here :

    https://1drv.ms/f/s!AjXwOsvc6am5nAt1DRLWdhihPsX6

    Parameters :
    ISO 100
    Shutter speed 1/4s
    White Balance 4500k
    High Quality

    You can now fairly compare the devices with what is it comparable : how does the cameras perform when using the same settings.

    Will add new shots later !
    Qorax and nonamenomore like this.
    07-14-18 05:03 AM
  2. oldmangeddyboy's Avatar
    Good post, does seem that the key 2 takes the better shot ahead of the keyone..
    07-14-18 05:22 AM
  3. chrispmoto's Avatar
    Nice. this makes me feel a bit better about the camera!
    Good job! thank you!
    07-14-18 05:43 AM
  4. guizmox's Avatar
    I added in the drive a comparison picture (extracted a few zones from each shot and putted them on the same picture). I still feel the Priv to be the best camera, but it may depend of the scene we're shooting, that's why I'll make some other tests.
    07-14-18 05:45 AM
  5. Qorax's Avatar
    Thanks for the share. Here's opened for everyone...

    Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-bb-pics-compare.jpg

    Based on your pics my opinion: Key1 and Passport took better shots. Key2 is the lousiest.
    07-14-18 05:47 AM
  6. guizmox's Avatar
    ... weird thing is that the white balance is different between devices despite the settings I applied (you can check EXIF data)
    07-14-18 05:55 AM
  7. chetmanley's Avatar
    I've been comparing all my blackberry cameras since I got my key2. The key2 is the worst. My Z10 can take better shots.

    The best camera is the Priv. It really shines when you try long range digital zoom shots. It completely crushes the key1 and key2 (although the Key2 is the worst).

    I did some experimenting with the Key2 to figure out how to take a decent low light shot. You need to use manual mode, and drive the shutter to the slowest speed (1/3). For some reason, this causes the camera view finder to lag (probably at 1/3 frames per sec), but it takes the best low light shots in this scenario.
    07-14-18 08:11 AM
  8. chetmanley's Avatar
    Daylight
    Max Zoom
    Auto camera mode (except for max zoom key 2 f1.8 lens - need manual to force out of 2x optical)
    HDR off to avoid blurring

    Note the detail in bricks, road signs and trees.
    The 8mp Z10 has more detail than the K2!

    Priv
    Z10
    Key1
    Attached Thumbnails Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-priv-max-zoom-auto.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-z10-max-zoom.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key1-max-zoom.jpg  
    Last edited by chetmanley; 07-14-18 at 09:00 AM.
    07-14-18 08:44 AM
  9. chetmanley's Avatar
    Key 2 Max Digital Zoom using 2x optical lens f2.6 in auto mode (no HDR)
    Key 2 Max Digital Zoom using f1.8 in manual (no HDR)
    Attached Thumbnails Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-max-zoom-f2.2.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-max-zoom-f1.8.jpg  
    Last edited by chetmanley; 07-14-18 at 05:58 PM.
    07-14-18 08:46 AM
  10. gizmo21's Avatar
    Thx all for comparison and info (subscribed).
    guizmox likes this.
    07-17-18 11:28 PM
  11. Privacymatters's Avatar
    I've been comparing all my blackberry cameras since I got my key2. The key2 is the worst. My Z10 can take better shots.

    The best camera is the Priv. It really shines when you try long range digital zoom shots. It completely crushes the key1 and key2 (although the Key2 is the worst).

    I did some experimenting with the Key2 to figure out how to take a decent low light shot. You need to use manual mode, and drive the shutter to the slowest speed (1/3). For some reason, this causes the camera view finder to lag (probably at 1/3 frames per sec), but it takes the best low light shots in this scenario.
    Yes I just bought a new priv yesterday and it's amazing it's almost a 4 year old phone now and it has a better chip set...screen..and camera then either of the keyones. I loved my keyone but I returned my key2 because it just doesn't feel like a blackberry I am now using a PRIV and I just love this device
    Qorax likes this.
    07-17-18 11:34 PM
  12. the_boon's Avatar
    Yes I just bought a new priv yesterday and it's amazing it's almost a 4 year old phone now and it has a better chip set...screen..and camera then either of the keyones. I loved my keyone but I returned my key2 because it just doesn't feel like a blackberry I am now using a PRIV and I just love this device
    Ok you can say you enjoy the Priv more than the KEYone/KEY2 because 16:9 AMOLED etc... but don't say it has a better chipset because it's kind of hard to do worse than Qualcomm's 808 which plagued the damn thing.

    I owned 5 different Privs btw, I know that phone pretty damn well
    07-18-18 01:12 AM
  13. AhabSnake's Avatar
    all passable photos, that's all that matters
    tfitzpat03 likes this.
    07-18-18 02:07 AM
  14. Fred98TJ's Avatar
    Key 2 Max Digital Zoom using 2x optical lens f2.6 in auto mode (no HDR)
    Key 2 Max Digital Zoom using f1.8 in manual (no HDR)

    Ouch, both of those are pretty bad.
    07-18-18 03:39 AM
  15. chetmanley's Avatar
    I've been experimenting with lighting conditions using the Key1 and 2. I've actually found that in bright sunlight (not overcast), the Key2 out shoots the Key1 in most areas, especially long range zoom using the Optical lens.

    The Key2 has also surprised me in some challenging lighting conditions:

    Here is the:
    Key2 f1.8 lens no HDR
    Key2 f2.6 lens HDR
    Key1 HDR
    Attached Thumbnails Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-f1.8-no-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-f2.6-max-zoom-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key1-hdr.jpg  
    Qorax likes this.
    07-18-18 07:07 AM
  16. chetmanley's Avatar
    And I decided to redo the preivous long range Max zoom test, but this time in bright sunlight (not overcast)

    This improved all shots naturally, but now the Key2 shots aren't nearly as blurry and show nice detail now. With the brighter light, I took these shots with HDR on.

    Priv Max Zoom HDR
    Z10 Max Zoom HDR
    Key1 Max Zoom HDR
    Attached Thumbnails Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-priv-max-zoom-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-z10-max-zoom-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key1-max-zoom-hdr.jpg  
    Qorax likes this.
    07-18-18 07:11 AM
  17. Qorax's Avatar
    Nice pics @chetmanley. However, I find the K2's images seem washed out.
    07-18-18 07:13 AM
  18. chetmanley's Avatar
    And here I've included the Passport, plus the Key2 shots.

    If you compare these shots to the originals a few posts above which were shot on an overcast day, the details are far better and the optical zoom lens (with digital on top to max) is really nice.

    Passport SE Max Zoom HDR
    Key2 Max Zoom f1.8 HDR (Still looks aweful compared to the all the other phones)
    Key2 Max Zoom f2.6 HDR
    Attached Thumbnails Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-pp-max-zoom-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-max-zoom-f1.8-hdr.jpg   Cameras Comparisons (Passport, Priv, K1, K2)-key2-max-zoom-f2.6-hdr.jpg  
    Last edited by chetmanley; 07-18-18 at 05:01 PM.
    Qorax likes this.
    07-18-18 07:14 AM
  19. guizmox's Avatar
    I added 4 extreme low-light shots for comparison purposes (Priv, K1, K2)

    https://1drv.ms/f/s!AjXwOsvc6am5nAt1DRLWdhihPsX6

    ISO 4800, Shutter 1/3s, 4000k
    ISO 3200, Shutter 1/30, 4000k
    ISO 1600, Shutter 1/8, 4000k
    ISO 100, Shutter 1/8, 4000k

    As far as I can observe, the most problematic thing on the K2 is the ISO increase.
    - With 4800, it's the worse picture between the 3 devices (blurry, noisy) but
    - With 3200, it starts to produce a significantly better picture.
    - With 1600, it's the best of the 3 devices althought I find the picture a little "smooth" ... Not sharp enough.
    - With 100, it's still the best of the 3 devices (but still miss a bit of sharpness - K1 is the best with it)

    The 3 devices seems to have a pretty much equally sensibility to light despite the wider aperture of the KeyTwo (1.8 against 2.0 (K1) and 2.2 (Priv))

    KeyOne have bigger pixels (1.55um against 1.28um (K2) and 1.12um (Priv)) but I can't find any difference ! It confirms that most of the "work" is done in the post-processing chain (CPU->Driver->Software)

    About the sharpness, maybe the 1.8 aperture from the Key2 is responsible of the lack of sharpness (a common issue with wide apertures). But it could be the lens quality. Who knows ? I don't think it can be improved without adding noise to the pictures. It's -for me- more because of the hardware design.
    Last edited by guizmox; 07-18-18 at 04:18 PM.
    chetmanley likes this.
    07-18-18 02:51 PM
  20. chetmanley's Avatar
    I added 4 extreme low-light shots for comparison purposes (Priv, K1, K2)
    ...
    The 3 devices seems to have a pretty much equally sensibility to light despite the wider aperture of the KeyTwo (1.8 against 2.0 (K1) and 2.2 (Priv))

    KeyOne have bigger pixels (1.55um against 1.28um (K2) and 1.12um (Priv)) but I can't find any difference ! It confirms that most of the "work" is done in the post-processing chain (CPU->Driver->Software)
    I hope that's the case and they can improve it with software. I hope they also unleash the f2.6 lens because right now, unless you point the thing at a nuclear explosion, it always defaults back to the 1.8 digital zoom.

    If they lower the threshold or just remove it all together, and allow the user to play with the optical zoom settings, I think it would make for better zoom shots than we can get right now out of just the 1.8 lens in low light.
    07-18-18 04:53 PM
  21. Fred98TJ's Avatar
    I added 4 extreme low-light shots for comparison purposes (Priv, K1, K2)

    https://1drv.ms/f/s!AjXwOsvc6am5nAt1DRLWdhihPsX6

    ISO 4800, Shutter 1/3s, 4000k
    ISO 3200, Shutter 1/30, 4000k
    ISO 1600, Shutter 1/8, 4000k
    ISO 100, Shutter 1/8, 4000k

    As far as I can observe, the most problematic thing on the K2 is the ISO increase.
    - With 4800, it's the worse picture between the 3 devices (blurry, noisy) but
    - With 3200, it starts to produce a significantly better picture.
    - With 1600, it's the best of the 3 devices althought I find the picture a little "smooth" ... Not sharp enough.
    - With 100, it's still the best of the 3 devices (but still miss a bit of sharpness - K1 is the best with it)

    The 3 devices seems to have a pretty much equally sensibility to light despite the wider aperture of the KeyTwo (1.8 against 2.0 (K1) and 2.2 (Priv))

    KeyOne have bigger pixels (1.55um against 1.28um (K2) and 1.12um (Priv)) but I can't find any difference ! It confirms that most of the "work" is done in the post-processing chain (CPU->Driver->Software)

    About the sharpness, maybe the 1.8 aperture from the Key2 is responsible of the lack of sharpness (a common issue with wide apertures). But it could be the lens quality. Who knows ? I don't think it can be improved without adding noise to the pictures. It's -for me- more because of the hardware design.

    The ISO (which is baked into the sensor and fixed) is probably 100 for all those sensors so all have the same (sensitivity).
    Lens quality (lack of) is probably a factor with the K1 and k2.
    Remember the Priv has OIS and most likely better optics (or so it’s claimed in the specs).
    07-18-18 07:28 PM
  22. Fred98TJ's Avatar
    I hope that's the case and they can improve it with software. I hope they also unleash the f2.6 lens because right now, unless you point the thing at a nuclear explosion, it always defaults back to the 1.8 digital zoom.

    If they lower the threshold or just remove it all together, and allow the user to play with the optical zoom settings, I think it would make for better zoom shots than we can get right now out of just the 1.8 lens in low light.

    We’re not comparing everything equally here, in regards to the lens speed.
    The specs (focal length and everything) is or should be the 35mm (think full frame) equivalent. The longer lens is around 45mm equiv. But what almost everyone (non photographers and even some “photographers”) fail to understand is that the aperture also needs the crop factor applied.
    Long story shortened, that “f2.6” long lens is roughly equivalent to f22 on a full frame.
    Thats why the camera won’t use it unless there is a lot of available light. It’s a very slow lens.
    07-18-18 07:50 PM
  23. Fred98TJ's Avatar
    I added 4 extreme low-light shots for comparison purposes (Priv, K1, K2)

    https://1drv.ms/f/s!AjXwOsvc6am5nAt1DRLWdhihPsX6

    ISO 4800, Shutter 1/3s, 4000k
    ISO 3200, Shutter 1/30, 4000k
    ISO 1600, Shutter 1/8, 4000k
    ISO 100, Shutter 1/8, 4000k

    As far as I can observe, the most problematic thing on the K2 is the ISO increase.
    - With 4800, it's the worse picture between the 3 devices (blurry, noisy) but
    - With 3200, it starts to produce a significantly better picture.
    - With 1600, it's the best of the 3 devices althought I find the picture a little "smooth" ... Not sharp enough.
    - With 100, it's still the best of the 3 devices (but still miss a bit of sharpness - K1 is the best with it)

    The 3 devices seems to have a pretty much equally sensibility to light despite the wider aperture of the KeyTwo (1.8 against 2.0 (K1) and 2.2 (Priv))

    KeyOne have bigger pixels (1.55um against 1.28um (K2) and 1.12um (Priv)) but I can't find any difference ! It confirms that most of the "work" is done in the post-processing chain (CPU->Driver->Software)

    About the sharpness, maybe the 1.8 aperture from the Key2 is responsible of the lack of sharpness (a common issue with wide apertures). But it could be the lens quality. Who knows ? I don't think it can be improved without adding noise to the pictures. It's -for me- more because of the hardware design.

    You’re aware, or maybe not, that increasing the ISO setting does NOT increase the sensitivity of the sensor to light.
    07-18-18 09:10 PM
  24. gizmo21's Avatar
    @guizmox and @chetmanley have you also tried alternative camera apps for K2 just to see if software could change a view things?

    I hear Google camera XDA version seems not to work, but perhaps open camera or others could work: https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...-key2-1150610/
    07-18-18 10:24 PM
  25. guizmox's Avatar
    You’re aware, or maybe not, that increasing the ISO setting does NOT increase the sensitivity of the sensor to light.
    Of course !
    07-19-18 12:30 AM
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