06-28-19 12:36 PM
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  1. conite's Avatar
    It maybe possible to make an all touch version of the LE. Could sell for about $40 less. TCL sells Alcatel for far less and BBMO can use some parts . For example the screen etc. Just a thought.
    Would you pay $400 for a 4GB 636 SoC?

    You can get a Nokia 7.1 or Moto Z3 Play for $50 less still.
    Last edited by conite; 12-23-18 at 10:32 PM.
    12-23-18 10:05 PM
  2. DamianWarS's Avatar
    The Evolve seems to be suffering from same perception as Motion. On Amazon, it’s MSRP was $430 and discounted 27% to $315 at current exchange rates.

    I found a pretty objective review from a verified purchaser.

    “I am die hard BB fan and been using BB phones for years from curve 8520 to my recent device BB keyone black edition (which is a very good device on all parameters except media viewing experience as the effective screen is only 4 inches).So I thought to go for evolve thus I get dual sim / oreo / dual camera and a big display with BB features and I dont have to carry any second device for media.
    But amazon evolve reviews are mixed and mostly critics..so I postponed my decision for some time and finally last week I exchanged my Keyone to Evolve with lot of doubts and anticipations what I am going to experience this time.
    But Optiemus did really a good job with some little issues which seems to be due to their rush to launch the phone at the earliest as commited.
    Let me give review of the phone...
    Pros
    1.The design and look and build quality of the phone is premium and awesome and it remembers my older BB phones (Z3/Z30) and it is very solid and doesn't require any screen guard or back cover for daily wear and tear like the older one.Oh that textured back I just love it.
    2.The battery is good enough for a day and call quality is super.
    3.All apps run smoothly and hardly I find difference between my SD625 in keyone vs SD450 on evolve when it comes to multitasking.
    4.No heating / lagging / crash of apps.Clear and crisp display (403 PPI)
    5.Finger print / face unlock all works fine.
    Cons
    1.Camera - the way Optiemus handled this area is not at all acceptable and it is surely a lack of responsibility...the camera app needs to be revisited by them and they should correct the same with a update asap....It seems due to hurry burry they have not design the interface and controls inside the camera app properly ( for example : if i select 16:9 it shows still the 4:3 screen only ) and if I go for wild selfie it shows nothing & if you remember during the launch event of Evolve we got the news that the demo units didn't have the camera app itself.So that means they made this app in last minute with lack of proper controls.Since the regular rear and front shot is not having any issues with my phone...I haven't asked for any replacement and I know that the new unit also will have some other area problems in camera.For such a premium cost they should correct this camera app issue at the earliest to build some reputations for their further launches.
    2.When I choose the adaptive brightness the screen brightness level sometimes go to 100% and eats the battery very fast..so i disable it always and control the brightness manually & it seems there is some system control missing here.
    3.BB Contacts app inbuilt - the saved local contacts disappear suddenly without any trace and I never faced this issue in my keyone or any other BB phones before and this I think may be not Optiemus problem but the latest update of BB contacts app with dark theme creates this issue but still it has to be corrected immediately.

    Verdict
    ---------
    If you are BB fan (very feeble left out of % in crowd) who use the phone moderately ( not heavy gamer and not addicted to HQ photos and varieties ) and who wants to have rich android phone with all BB features with decent performance you can really go for this phone provided your wallet should be thick enough.

    Hope my review could be helpful for your purchasing decisions.”

    Perhaps the Evolve X, if ever released, is delayed to sort out various complaints like the camera, from Evolve release and sales feedback.
    No objective review is prefaced with "I am die hard BB fan..." there a bias OOB that influences their perception of the product.
    12-23-18 10:57 PM
  3. Bbnivende's Avatar
    Would you pay $400 for a 4GB 636 SoC?

    You can get a Nokia 7.1 or Moto Z3 Play for $50 less still.
    Fair point . I was thinking $350. If the BlackBerry had carrier support I might consider it.
    12-23-18 11:09 PM
  4. Red_BB's Avatar
    You sell what people want and not what you think people should have.
    You know apple NEVER does this but still sell like hot cakes right?
    12-24-18 02:33 AM
  5. Red_BB's Avatar
    What is there for me to sell? I love BBAndroid and it’s potential. I don’t want it to fail but I’m a realist. Besides, since I’m a fan, I should encourage people to buy something not right or important for them? I want BB licensed products to succeed. The reality is that PKB will be lucky to survive and VKB has virtually no chance.
    I'm a fan.. 6 of my friends who owned apple own BB phones.. Right from PRIV to KEY2.. I did my part.. I sold them on BB when the brand couldn't.

    I see no problem in selling someone on something they think they don't want but it is actually far better than what that have at that moment! An upgrade is always welcomed by everyone.
    12-24-18 02:39 AM
  6. Red_BB's Avatar
    No objective review is prefaced with "I am die hard BB fan..." there a bias OOB that influences their perception of the product.
    If there was bias he would have never detailed the con's so well.. He would have said the camera needs improvement and that's it..

    This sentence would never come out of the mouth of someone who is bias!
    'the way Optiemus handled this area is not at all acceptable and it is surely a lack of responsibility'

    The review was by no way a bias reviews!
    12-24-18 02:44 AM
  7. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    You know apple NEVER does this but still sell like hot cakes right?
    Apple has the money and product line to maintain product culture. Google Android OEM similar. LG and couple others have the money and no profits still. BBMo/TCL doesn’t have the resources to waste for no profits.

    What exactly is your reason that people should buy Evolve or Evolve X at higher price over similar or higher specs device at lower price?
    12-24-18 06:43 AM
  8. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Fair point . I was thinking $350. If the BlackBerry had carrier support I might consider it.

    If the Motion had carrier support I would have paid the asking price. The carrier knew that wouldn’t be successful. You want BBMo/TCL matching Nokia/Moto price which isn’t possible if they want to make a profit and have to pay for BB license. This and that leaves nothing for carrier....
    12-24-18 06:48 AM
  9. Amaroni's Avatar
    perhaps you could list out devices that retail at under US Dollars 315 that have higher specs and the same level of Blackberry security built in ?
    12-24-18 06:49 AM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I'm a fan.. 6 of my friends who owned apple own BB phones.. Right from PRIV to KEY2.. I did my part.. I sold them on BB when the brand couldn't.

    I see no problem in selling someone on something they think they don't want but it is actually far better than what that have at that moment! An upgrade is always welcomed by everyone.
    Here in the USA, phones are purchased through carriers if you want enhanced calling features. Carriers don’t handle BBMo devices other than AT&T KEYone or Sprint KEYone and it still doesn’t get enhanced calling features. Therefore, nothing to “sell” and that's only regarding PKB as no carrier has BBMo VKB device.
    12-24-18 06:54 AM
  11. Amaroni's Avatar
    so you can't list devices with higher specs or similar that are available at lower prices ? Yet you ask the question why people should buy the Evolve or Evolve x at a higher price over similar or higher specs at a lower price?
    12-24-18 07:03 AM
  12. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    perhaps you could list out devices that retail at under US Dollars 315 that have higher specs and the same level of Blackberry security built in ?
    BlackBerry tried with DTEK and no carrier wanted to handle the device. Nobody in the mainstream consumer space pays for security. Without carrier support, the DTEK struggled and quietly disappeared just like the Motion afterwards. I bought each DTEK and learned to buy the Motion only if offered through carrier.
    12-24-18 07:14 AM
  13. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    so you can't list devices with higher specs or similar that are available at lower prices ? Yet you ask the question why people should buy the Evolve or Evolve x at a higher price over similar or higher specs at a lower price?

    The Evolve device is top seller and people are lined up with Optiemus making lots of money?
    12-24-18 07:16 AM
  14. Amaroni's Avatar
    I asked you to qualify your own statement and you are unable to do so. perhaps you should refrain from making sweeping statements unless you have the facts to back them up.

    I have never said that the licensees are making money or offering the very best product , at the same time I haven't continually talked down the efforts and the products ....if you have facts about the sales of the evolve.... produce them....
    12-24-18 07:33 AM
  15. anon(10562251)'s Avatar
    Nobody in the mainstream consumer space pays for security.
    We'll see about that. BlackBerry killed the DTEKs, and now the market killed them.

    Google is going to fill that niche (and then some) with the Pixel Lite.
    12-24-18 07:45 AM
  16. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I asked you to qualify your own statement and you are unable to do so. perhaps you should refrain from making sweeping statements unless you have the facts to back them up.

    I have never said that the licensees are making money or offering the very best product , at the same time I haven't continually talked down the efforts and the products ....if you have facts about the sales of the evolve.... produce them....
    Look, you’re new here. We’ve been here making the arguments you’re making back at the introduction of BB10 hardware in 2013. Then when BBAndroid rolled out at end of 2015, we began making the arguments you’re making today. So three years ago, we argued your point of view. Guess what has been learned in three years??

    We’ve learned people (small number) will pay decent premium for PKB devices. We’ve learned BB licensees (all three) have tried selling VKB devices with really NO success. The Aurora, Motion and Evolve don’t appear to have any traction against cheaper, better spec’d VKB hardware.

    After three years, we’ve learned that we’re lucky BBMo/TCL is hanging on with little to no carrier support. We’d all like for BB licensees to succeed but that means they’ll sell only what’s profitable if that’s even possible.

    The facts are in front of us for everyone to see... Retailers are selling limited numbers of Key2 and Key2 LE now. The KEYone is sold discounted, when some remain. After the initial runs of Aurora or Motion, licensees didn’t make anymore.....
    12-24-18 07:49 AM
  17. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    We'll see about that. BlackBerry killed the DTEKs, and now the market killed them.

    Google is going to fill that niche (and then some) with the Pixel Lite.
    BlackBerry was almost dead at the beginning of 2013. Exiting hardware began five years ago and was completed two years ago. Nothing to do with DTEK hardware. The reason BB exited hardware was that nobody cared about security and paying for it with BB10 or BBAndroid so that it could be offered profitably...
    12-24-18 07:54 AM
  18. Amaroni's Avatar
    I have been here since 2015 and found the information contained within the forum informative and very helpful in the most part. I tend to ignore the "blackberry is dead" posts even when the very existence of the Company was being called into question....and what did we learn? those of you who insisted the Company was dead were wrong , those of you who insisted that there would be no more than one or two device releases under the licensing agreement were wrong ....those of you who continually talk down the brand do so for some self satisfaction that one day you will be able to say " see we were right "

    you have made plenty of statements today regarding pricing, other devices, sales etc and you have no hard facts to back up your views and now you want to tell me you have been saying the same thing for 3 years ?

    Heck I wonder what it would be like If you weren't a fan ?
    12-24-18 07:58 AM
  19. Amaroni's Avatar
    on a lighter note, I have enjoyed shooting the breeze with you Chuck. I wish you a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year...
    12-24-18 08:03 AM
  20. conite's Avatar
    I have been here since 2015 and found the information contained within the forum informative and very helpful in the most part. I tend to ignore the "blackberry is dead" posts even when the very existence of the Company was being called into question....and what did we learn? those of you who insisted the Company was dead were wrong , those of you who insisted that there would be no more than one or two device releases under the licensing agreement were wrong ....those of you who continually talk down the brand do so for some self satisfaction that one day you will be able to say " see we were right "

    you have made plenty of statements today regarding pricing, other devices, sales etc and you have no hard facts to back up your views and now you want to tell me you have been saying the same thing for 3 years ?

    Heck I wonder what it would be like If you weren't a fan ?
    The question is whether BlackBerry Mobile (or Optiemus) can provide enough value-add to the saturated slab market.

    Licencing fees and economies of scale have them sitting in an unfavourable position even before the starting gun.

    Does security appeal to a significantly large market segment to warrant paying the extra $100 to $200 premium? History says no, but we can always hope.

    On the other hand, the KEY series offers a second - much larger - differentiating factor.
    12-24-18 08:12 AM
  21. Amaroni's Avatar
    I have been waiting in anticipation for your input , no doubt you have factual information to back your claims that the licensing fees and economies of scale have "them" sitting in an unfavourable position.

    I don't see how US Dollars 315 is a premium for security and the functionality of the Evolve device but I am happy to proved wrong . I asked for examples which might offer a comparison and no one seems to be able to provide one , so when you say warrant paying an extra 100/200 us dollars perhaps now you could provide a list of devices with similar specs and blackberry secure software ?

    in answer to your first question ....with the brand in tatters perhaps not especially when people refuse to recognise that just to get TCL / Optiemus to take the brand on board is a major achievement in itself .

    I respectfully suggest that since you haven't had hands on the Evolve device you are not in a position to compare or provide an opinion on the viability or otherwise of VKB under the BlackBerry name .....
    12-24-18 08:38 AM
  22. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I have been here since 2015 and found the information contained within the forum informative and very helpful in the most part. I tend to ignore the "blackberry is dead" posts even when the very existence of the Company was being called into question....and what did we learn? those of you who insisted the Company was dead were wrong , those of you who insisted that there would be no more than one or two device releases under the licensing agreement were wrong ....those of you who continually talk down the brand do so for some self satisfaction that one day you will be able to say " see we were right "

    you have made plenty of statements today regarding pricing, other devices, sales etc and you have no hard facts to back up your views and now you want to tell me you have been saying the same thing for 3 years ?

    Heck I wonder what it would be like If you weren't a fan ?
    I’m not one that called the company dead. As shareholder, I only want company to live. That BB still lives without devices. I made the statements you made and have learned that BBMo is struggling to compete just like BB did 5-6 years ago. The bigger OEMs are crowding out the smaller OEMs and have been for sometime. Compare top 5 Android OEMs 1-5-10 years ago. Compare the names. You’ll see 1-2 same and that’s all. BB is no longer same OEM and neither is Nokia today.

    The hard facts to backup my view is the state of health of each licensee and how the future looks. I’ve dual carried phones the last 12 years. Always one BB and sometimes two BB phones.

    With each OS, from 2003, I’ve relied on BB to help me earn my food. When I began to dual carry, my second device was just second number. Within six months, I had two BB for the PKB for quicker texting on second line.

    I’ve always loved dual carry BB until around 2010 when I got first Android phone to keep up with client demands since BBOS lacked certain apps. Two years before I purchased first iPhone for my teenage son. With BB10, after 10.2.1 and before 10.3.2, I was able to dual carry BB again while ART 4.3 was fairly modern. Then I moved onto Android dual carry for certain app that needed Lollipop 5.0 and soon the PRIV came along. With two DTEK models, I dual carried BB again. What I learned was that AT&T blocked certain features on factory unlocked devices and this was going to get worse instead of better.

    I bought the carrier locked AT&T KEYone for WFC and VoLTE and it’s no longer supported. I dual carried A30 Plus from Alcatel/TCL but again, missing carrier features. I then dual carried six year old iPhone 5 for better signal coverage but WFC and VoLTE aren’t compatible because too old. So I waited for Key2 or Key2 LE through AT&T until 6-7 weeks ago. I purchased two iPhone XR for $750USD special offer. So $375/each and state of the art everything. I dual carry with KEYone and gave the other to youngest daughter as early Christmas present.

    When BBMo can’t have my business, there’s a problem. I’ve used old 3G/4G signal booster from AT&T for 8 years. It’s no longer offered and isn’t as reliable as once was. Since AT&T has discontinued for WFC and VoLTE instead, what do modern customers purchase? So BBMo/TCL and other different OEMs are being attacked through natural technology evolution.

    So lack of consumer demand and carrier support is the problem. In my case, the consumer demand is there and still can’t be leveraged without carrier support. The reality is the mobile landscape in 2019 going forward.
    Troy Tiscareno likes this.
    12-24-18 08:50 AM
  23. Amaroni's Avatar
    your acceptance that Blackberry devices have until recently helped out food on your table is admirable..... perhaps that sentiment is the one you should be shouting about . yes the mobile landscape is changing, we now have Blackberry devices being manufactured in India , who would have imagined that possibility. TCL launched the Keyone and Motion... added the Keytwo and Keytwo Light and the various variations ( dual sim etc).

    is this enough to demonstrate that a Blackberry labelled device has a place in this market place ? I don't profess to know , but they are still present in 2018 and will be in 2019 ....even my 6 year old z30 will still be around and in daily until the end of 2019 ....not bad huh?
    12-24-18 09:01 AM
  24. Red_BB's Avatar
    Apple has the money and product line to maintain product culture. Google Android OEM similar. LG and couple others have the money and no profits still. BBMo/TCL doesn’t have the resources to waste for no profits.

    What exactly is your reason that people should buy Evolve or Evolve X at higher price over similar or higher specs device at lower price?
    Man you're such a misinformed person it's funny.. You call yourself a fan and don't know the background
    of TCL and Optiemus? Man.. Go do some homework about those companies.. You'll know they more than adequate resources to back up all their adventures even without profit!

    The reason to pay a premium for a blackberry is.. And this maybe a surprise for you.. *drumroll*
    SECURITY!
    12-24-18 11:17 AM
  25. Red_BB's Avatar
    Here in the USA, phones are purchased through carriers if you want enhanced calling features. Carriers don’t handle BBMo devices other than AT&T KEYone or Sprint KEYone and it still doesn’t get enhanced calling features. Therefore, nothing to “sell” and that's only regarding PKB as no carrier has BBMo VKB device.
    There is more to the world than United States Of America buddy.. Its not even the main targeted market anymore.. Canada Europe UK Arab Nations and Russia are!
    12-24-18 11:21 AM
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