[conite]

All I know, that if I were still in college (30 yrs ago) I would pick you to be on my debate team... lol, keep on spinning it, good job!

Probably pays about the same. Lol.

[bb10adopter111]

Sure, but if it's Under New Management, it has as little to do with the predecessor as another brand. This really is about punishment, because the only thing that Blackberry gets out of it now is a small pittance of a licensing fee. Everything else is on TCL.

I think the disconnect here is you're thinking about rational business transactions, while others are talking about less sophisticated consumers who only consider their emotional connection to the Brand.

There's no question that the BlackBerry Brand has sustained damage with the average consumer, and we'll have to wait and see if TCL can resuscitate it.

But, if we're honest, BlackBerry was never much of a retail company. The whole idea of comparing them with Samsung or Apple is absurd, in terms of their business model. Their miscalculation was that they could enter that space due to the success of their handsets in the early 00s.

IMO, People's irrational expectations of BlackBerry as a consumer-oriented company simply validates the current management's recognition that they needed to run far and fast in the opposite direction.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[bb10adopter111]

No it's not, it's about finding the sauce you like. Nothing to do with owner, management, nothing like what you keep spinning, Just satisfaction, end user satisfaction, being personally satisfied with the brand you like (personal taste), just that simple.

That's the consumer business. It's fickle and belongs to marketers. I prefer the B2B space where functionality and value have more weight.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[HughJarsse]

Is crackberry really stopping these posts from appearing on the "Trending Discussions" ?

Sure they are, there are posts that are 'trending' that have far, far less posts/replies to them, so it appears this one is deliberately being hidden from view!!
Why?? probably because it is so emotive, and there are so many 'against' BB than 'for' and that won't look good on the headline banners now, will it??

PS it's the 29th June, yet STILL no June updates... less than a week to release date of the 'July' ones, IF they ever appear!!

[dlmsd]

I think the disconnect here is you're thinking about rational business transactions, while others are talking about less sophisticated consumers who only consider their emotional connection to the Brand.

There's no question that the BlackBerry Brand has sustained damage with the average consumer, and we'll have to wait and see if TCL can resuscitate it.

But, if we're honest, BlackBerry was never much of a retail company. The whole idea of comparing them with Samsung or Apple is absurd, in terms of their business model. Their miscalculation was that they could enter that space due to the success of their handsets in the early 00s.

IMO, People's irrational expectations of BlackBerry as a consumer-oriented company simply validates the current management's recognition that they needed to run far and fast in the opposite direction.

Posted with my trusty Z10

Yep, but you keep making too much since. I just want a good burger, with so good sauce. That's not too much to ask.

[anon(10123624)]

Well that's a whole new thing.

We were talking about letting BlackBerry know you're upset with them by not buying a TCL device.

If you don't like the products to begin with, then there is nothing else to say. It's academic.

We said not to buy anything branded as a Blackberry by the way.

[conite]

We said not to buy anything branded as a Blackberry by the way.

Unless you live in India or Indonesia, you specifically mean TCL.

[anon(10123624)]

I'll make this really clear and simple. If TCL makes a phone with Blackberry name and logo don't buy it.

Since you like to use Mcdonalds as comparison if Mcdonalds makes a phone with Blackberry name and logo DON'T BUY IT!

[conite]

I'll make this really clear and simple. If TCL makes a phone with Blackberry name and logo don't buy it.

Just to be clear (as apparently different people perceive different conversations happening here) is this for the satisfaction of denying BlackBerry their $10-20 licence fee, or is it something to do with the actual TCL phone(s) made, sold, and supported by TCL (that happen to have a BlackBerry logo on them)?

[anon(10123624)]

Just to be clear (as apparently different people perceive different conversations happening here) is this for the satisfaction of denying BlackBerry their $10-20 licence fee, or is it something to do with the actual TCL phone(s) made, sold, and supported by TCL (that happen to have a BlackBerry logo on them)?

Do you have a document to prove your $10-20 fee.
You think Blackerry is providing software for free and is only paid on each device sold. I don't think so

[HughJarsse]

Just to be clear (as apparently different people perceive different conversations happening here) is this for the satisfaction of denying BlackBerry their $10-20 licence fee, or is it something to do with the actual TCL phone(s) made, sold, and supported by TCL (that happen to have a BlackBerry logo on them)?

Both are party to the crime...colusion between them both has lead to the ill feeling..
corporate decisions, made to suit both parties, with nothing for those who were caught in the colusion... both KNEW what they were doing, and decided that they would suit themselves regardless..
No more BB for me, (and I have had them since the old 8700v) my next phone will either be a Nokia 6 or a Moto G..
Shafted just once too often I'm afraid..

[conite]

Both are party to the crime...colusion between them both has lead to the ill feeling..
corporate decisions, made to suit both parties, with nothing for those who were caught in the colusion... both KNEW what they were doing, and decided that they would suit themselves regardless..
No more BB for me, (and I have had them since the old 8700v) my next phone will either be a Nokia 6 or a Moto G..
Shafted just once too often I'm afraid..

So TCL, PT BB Merah Putih, and Optiemus Infracom are somehow responsible for BlackBerry's past failings or decisions simply because they were interested in licencing the product? Ok. Interesting life view. Nothing much else I can say to that.

[bb10adopter111]

Yep, but you keep making too much since. I just want a good burger, with so good sauce. That's not too much to ask.

Well, if you're like me, you focus on the business, not the brand.

I am happy to see what kind of products TCL brings to market. I finally got to play with a KEYone last week, and it is, quite simply, my favorite Android phone ever, and by a wide margin.

When I finally give up on BB10, it's the only Android phone costing more than $200 that I would even consider.

I don't care if it's branded BlackBerry, TCL, Alcatel or Hello Kitty.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Xerograv]

We went from burgers, tomato sauce to make this comparison between Blackberry and Blackberry Mobile (TCL). What's next, flavor of ice cream or shaved Ice? The bottom line, TCL/Blackberry or both should give the folks further software release for DTEK50/60. Period. We all know it's not going to happen no matter what comparison everyone uses. Sorry to be so blunt... We lived this once with BB10... Shame on both parties...

At least with BB10 it was supported for like 3 years after the passport and classic came out. If you bought a Leap you got a meagre year and 9 months which is a year and 2 months longer than the dtek60.

[dlmsd]

Well, if you're like me, you focus on the business, not the brand.

I am happy to see what kind of products TCL brings to market. I finally got to play with a KEYone last week, and it is, quite simply, my favorite Android phone ever, and by a wide margin.

When I finally give up on BB10, it's the only Android phone costing more than $200 that I would even consider.

I don't care if it's branded BlackBerry, TCL, Alcatel or Hello Kitty.

Posted with my trusty Z10

Me too, on the business. But as with the Dtek, brand loyalty was way down with BlackBerry so the consumer didn't buy the Priv, Dtek, and K1 in any big numbers, they were tired of buying so many phones that ended up on their EOL list. Me for one, three phones over the years. So they choose not to update the two former phones OS. So I do look at both. Google P2 seems to fit my wants from a phone, and will most likely drop with oreo.

[chi-town311]

But that's the reality.

No its not. The same old blackberry will have a major influence on the Keyone. They are doing the software for it. It's not like BlackBerry is gone from the equation. They are still a major part of the Keyone.

[conite]

No its not. The same old blackberry will have a major influence on the Keyone. They are doing the software for it. It's not like BlackBerry is gone from the equation. They are still a major part of the Keyone.

We've covered that, yes. BlackBerry supplies the software, but nothing else - including decision making.

BlackBerry is a vendor to TCL, and probably one of the smallest ones at that.

[Bay 13]

We've covered that, yes. BlackBerry supplies the software, but nothing else - including decision making.

BlackBerry is a vendor to TCL, and probably one of the smallest ones at that.

I saw a UTB Blogcast with Alex Thurber on youtube... the Blogcast was about 1 month ago. He said Blackberry has a say in the external design of the phone hardware. So TCL have to have Blackberry sign off on that before they can make a phone.

[conite]

I saw a UTB Blogcast with Alex Thurber on youtube... the Blogcast was about 1 month ago. He said Blackberry has a say in the external design of the phone hardware. So TCL have to have Blackberry sign off on that before they can make a phone.

Brand marketing fluff. Honestly, if the DTEK50 and Aurora pass the test, what wouldn't? Those are as generic as slabs can get.

[Bay 13]

Brand marketing fluff. Honestly, if the DTEK50 and Aurora pass the test, what wouldn't? Those are as generic as slabs can get.

Alex would not lie to us...he is as transparent as they come!!!

[bb10adopter111]

At least with BB10 it was supported for like 3 years after the passport and classic came out. If you bought a Leap you got a meagre year and 9 months which is a year and 2 months longer than the dtek60.

To me, stable is the most important thing. BB10 is stable as heck for me on my four year old phone. If it ain't broke it don't need fixin'!

Posted with my trusty Z10

[chi-town311]

We've covered that, yes. BlackBerry supplies the software, but nothing else - including decision making.

BlackBerry is a vendor to TCL, and probably one of the smallest ones at that.

I know, yet you somehow keep minimizing their influence on TCL's Keyone. If a consumer is upset because BlackBerry left them hanging on the DTEK I think it makes perfect sense to avoid any product that BlackBerry has a role in. Why would I rely on them to follow through with consistent OS patches and future updates for the Keyone if they didn't deliver when the product was 100% theirs. I know you'll say... cause it's in the contract (that we haven't seen). Well, if the sales numbers aren't right, BB might abandon that relationship too. Who will then do the software development for the Keyone if BlackBerry decides it isn't worth their time to fulfill their obligation to their new customer TCL?

[chi-town311]

Except reality is the opposite.

If you had a bad experience with a McDonald's burger, and then they subsequently closed their stores, how far would you go to punish the entrepreneur who built a brand new store and paid McDonald's corporate to licence the name Big Mac amongst his own other products.

You can bark from your stump in front of the poor guy's new restaurant as much as you want, but I'm not sure what he did.

You left out the fact that the old company is still integral to the success of the new restaurant. It's not just the name, it's the OS, security know-how, software, etc. You know, all the stuff they stopped providing to the now abandoned DTEK/PRIV customers.

[crackberry_geek]

I know, yet you somehow keep minimizing their influence on TCL's Keyone. If a consumer is upset because BlackBerry left them hanging on the DTEK I think it makes perfect sense to avoid any product that BlackBerry has a role in. Why would I rely on them to follow through with consistent OS patches and future updates for the Keyone if they didn't deliver when the product was 100% theirs. I know you'll say... cause it's in the contract (that we haven't seen). Well, if the sales numbers aren't right, BB might abandon that relationship too. Who will then do the software development for the Keyone if BlackBerry decides it isn't worth their time to fulfill their obligation to their new customer TCL?

Of course BlackBerry is still involved... and responsible to a moderate extent.

All this gibberish based on speculation of what somebody THINKS is written into a contract that none of us has seen... yet somehow supposedly absolves johnny of all responsibility?

Ludicrous!

[evodevo69]

I think the disconnect here is you're thinking about rational business transactions, while others are talking about less sophisticated consumers who only consider their emotional connection to the Brand.

There's no question that the BlackBerry Brand has sustained damage with the average consumer, and we'll have to wait and see if TCL can resuscitate it.

But, if we're honest, BlackBerry was never much of a retail company. The whole idea of comparing them with Samsung or Apple is absurd, in terms of their business model. Their miscalculation was that they could enter that space due to the success of their handsets in the early 00s.

IMO, People's irrational expectations of BlackBerry as a consumer-oriented company simply validates the current management's recognition that they needed to run far and fast in the opposite direction.

Posted with my trusty Z10

Except that they also lost their corporate customers as well. At least the ones that don't need military level security.

Don't forget that it was their handsets that drove people to use their software, not the other way around. Companies didn't install bes because it was superior, they did it because it was the only way to use the BlackBerry devices.

I hope people can see, that even though they've been pushing security and software, they're losing business in that realm too.

I never knew this but apparently good technology wasn't even doing that well to begin with...thus the easy sale for much less than what was offered to good the year before.

I think once BlackBerry gets into an ok healthy shape, they're going to be bought out. I don't have faith anymore that they can grow anything at this point, people in IT apparently also view bes like how consumers view BlackBerry phones... that ain't good loll