Why the Q20 is so unbelievably annoying

Originally Posted by xBURK

My guess: On the day the Q20 is launched, this will all be forgotten and everyone will want it.

Posted via CB10

If the announced Q20 will be something similar to this... Yes i will want it!

Originally Posted by joao_malveiro

If the announced Q20 will be something similar to this... Yes i will want it!

No, just no.


Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums

Originally Posted by BullGuard8

I have a Q10, and no matter how much I got used to it. I miss the trackpad, now I am always hesitant to select test, with a trackpad, it's so much easier. give meh teh trackpad now!!

Easier and slow too!

Posted via CB10

Originally Posted by systemvolker

I don't see either... but,
Chen doesn't make mistakes. Lol

It's the people. They asked for this. I hope Chen will not produce lots of this because this is for sure not going to sell a lot.

Most advanced People here in North America are looking for one high end BlackBerry phone and they are willing to pay for it.

Even though those ones who doesn't have extra money/ income for it to buy, I'm pretty sure they will do something just to get it. Unless the device is a flop.

But with this one, I don't know.
If it's just the "track pad" and no other buttons, it would be nice I think. If it's the whole package of buttons, then I would say good luck.

I hope Chen is didn't forget that BlackBerry has 1shot left.

Posted via CB10

Do not forget the 70 million Blackberry legacy users!

Originally Posted by Omnitech

Well it's a relief that you're not banging the drum for the legacy OS, anyway. I was wondering if this item would pique your interest again, heh.

I'm a fence-sitter. I like the call/end buttons and trackpad, don't see much need for the menu/back keys. Maybe for Android apps.

But they need to fix the BB10 UI so it doesn't further handicap the small square screen. When I spent some time with a Q10 recently I was a bit shocked about that.






That's not really the point.

The company needs a vision, and the vision needs to be consistent. They need to represent something so they can develop a following. Right now, they are all over the map.

Secondly, resources are very limited with this company right now. They simply cannot afford to build a dozen different devices to try to appeal to every tiny niche group of users. (Or 45 devices, like Samsung does) So whatever they choose to sell, it behooves them to ensure that they will actually sell a lot of them. This is a large part of what people are wringing their hands over. (In addition to the usual simplistic partisanship)






I doubt you have the statistics to back that up. Unless of course you simply define "die-hard Blackberry users" as people who prefer the old layout. :p :rotfl:






The problem with the Metro UI is not simply that it is different, it is that it is a piece of garbage productivity-wise, no matter how you slice it. It is inferior to OS-X, it is inferior to Linux/KDE/Gnome, it is inferior to almost any decent desktop UI. What it is is basically a touch interface shoehorned onto a desktop OS, and it's a complete disaster. What made it even more ridiculous is that when Windows 8 came out, a LARGE percentage of essential system tools were not even available in Metro, you STILL had to go back to the legacy desktop to use things like the disk management tools and so forth. Microsoft totally shot themselves in the foot with that one.

Sometimes the old stuff is better just because it's better, not because it's old.

And some of the key reasons why people are pining for the legacy BlackBerry layout is because the new OS is poorly implemented. BB10 does NOT have to have lousy cursor management and copy/paste functionality, but because it does, it plays into these stereotypes of "touch interface bad, legacy interface good" for people who have their mind made up anyway.

And in the "shooting one'self in the foot department" - it took Blackberry months after release to finally get around to providing a way to use the Q10 keys as direct speed dial shortcuts - an obvious feature that was around for years with legacy devices, but inexplicably wasn't available when the Q10 was introduced.

A vision is not much use if you don't have customers.
Oh, but Blackberry have 70 million legacy customers.
Wouldn't it be nice if a large number of them have something from Blackberry to upgrade to?
This combination of the best from legacy with a new OS seems like a no-brainer.

I cant believe there are bb users out there who wouldn't want a trackpad! its only adding to the device, not taking away anything (screen size? come on guys). Honestly if the q20 is the last high end bb with a trackpad, then that's the one I will keep for years.

I want to see BB launch a few trackpad trackball keypad models, it will be exciting.

Originally Posted by belfastdispatcher

Let's see, the menu button will activate menu, and the back button will move you back :) self explanatory :)


Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums

How often does the menu get used on BlackBerry 10, Belfast... seriously? ;)


In BlackBerry OS, navigating the menu and screens was critical to the way the os worked. BlackBerry 10, not so much. Doesn't have anywhere the same utility to warrant a button imo

Posted via CB10

Originally Posted by TinMan555

I cant believe there are bb users out there who wouldn't want a trackpad! its only adding to the device, not taking away anything (screen size? come on guys).

Are you telling people they are full of crap for having a different opinion than you? Screen size does matter to many. Or are the people who bought Z10s and Z30s over Q10s imagining doing so?

Originally Posted by RubberChicken76

How often does the menu get used on BlackBerry 10, Belfast... seriously? ;)


In BlackBerry OS, navigating the menu and screens was critical to the way the os worked. BlackBerry 10, not so much. Doesn't have anywhere the same utility to warrant a button imo

Posted via CB10

I don't know about you but I used it the overflow all the time in the Q10, not enough screen up show all the options.


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Originally Posted by belfastdispatcher

I don't know about you but I used it the overflow all the time in the Q10, not enough screen up show all the options.


Sent from my iPhone using CB Forums

Fair enough. I still don't see myself pressing menu or back even 1/10th the time I would on BlackBerry OS because the navigation is so different.

Know what I would like? A camera button!

Originally Posted by RubberChicken76

Fair enough. I still don't see myself pressing menu or back even 1/10th the time I would on BlackBerry OS because the navigation is so different.

Know what I would like? A camera button!

I want sure press back. The whole screen is buttons. I'm just kidding :D

Originally Posted by RubberChicken76

Fair enough. I still don't see myself pressing menu or back even 1/10th the time I would on BlackBerry OS because the navigation is so different.

Know what I would like? A camera button!

Long press on the back button to close the app you're in like on BBOS? Surely that's better and easier then swipe up, tap X

Camera button is an absolute must.


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Everybody here seems to be in disagreement with everybody else on what is a stupid move by BB or not, and who has to like which form factor and why. So let me try this approach, from my personal point of view:

• I love the 9900, because operating a BBOS device became 2nd nature for me. However, I miss a larger screen, a flawless OS, a better web surfing experience etc.
• I love the Z30, because of its great screen, smooth operation, battery lifetime etc., as long as I don't have to write loads of messages during a working day, which drives me crazy, and does not really work well when walking, standing in the subway, lying on the couch, or even when sitting at the desk and having to edit text very often before feeling it's good enough to not embarrass me.
• I love the Z10, for its classy shape, and for some of the above, not so for its battery, and typing a lot means even more hassle for me.
• I love the Q10, for its great build & looks, an its marvellous keyboard, but sometimes I wish to have a larger screen, when surfing the web in particular, and editing text often drives me crazy.
• I love the Q5, although build & looks are not so classy as the Q10, but typing is even easier on the more spacy keyboard than on the Q10.

After trying ALL of these devices, I now narrowed my private collection down to owning the Q5 and the Z30, while still driving myself crazy by changing phones on a weekly basis: when on the Q5 I miss the Z30 and vice versa. And the text editing sometimes drives me crazy on both devices, and my thumb still looks for a trackpad or call end key from time to time, all by itself.

Now BB announced the Q20. A slightly larger screen than the older Q's. Awesome keyboard (assumption). Enhanced text editing. No more try to hit target and miss sometimes, and no more having to look at the phone when ending a call.
And it gets even better: there will be a Q30 (hopefully) with an even bigger screen than the Q20 (assumption, likely), if I will make the conclusion of preferring a no-belt version with a significantly (compared to 9900) or somewhat (compared to Q20) bigger screen.

I cannot see what is wrong with that, and why so many people are getting upset. There will be something for everybody! This is not a step backwards for BB or "annoying", and no user who prefers either a Z30 or any of the Qs or even legacy features deserves to be called stupid nor retro nor to be stigmatized in any way or form.

I think that wonderful BB times are right ahead of us. No other vendor offers us that much freedom of choice! What a great concept, thank you BB!

Originally Posted by belfastdispatcher

Long press on the back button to close the app you're in like on BBOS? Surely that's better and easier then swipe up, tap X

I prefer the gesture myself ... don't think I'd consider it as anything more than a convenience to also do it by a button. It's not like the gesture is hard and I think it's more obvious to a lot of people, personally.

I'm really interested to see how the belt is implemented. By design, BlackBerry 10 got away from a lot of the functionality that it originally provided. I'd worry that if they don't implement it well and perhaps test it with legacy customers, it will get in the way more than it will help.

There are a large group of Blackberry power users that use the phone for all day, 24/7 communication. News, Sports, Music, Acting. They only care about getting things done quick.

Do you spend 6 or 7 hours a day talking on the phone? Do you send hundreds of text and emails a day with your phone?

Do you never watch videos, play games or surf the web on your phone?

Do you never use apps?

These are the people that I am talking about. They make up a very large % of the BB users still on legacy.

They need things to be very simple. They don't have Crackberry. Having a keyboard and a trackpad with a belt will be perfect for them.

If BB can't keep these users, they are in deep dookie.

Originally Posted by Omnitech

I'm a fence-sitter. I like the call/end buttons and trackpad, don't see much need for the menu/back keys. Maybe for Android apps.

I think the menu button will be almost essential when using the trackpad. You select some text. Now what do you want to do with it? Menu -> copy. You select some messages. What do you do with them? Menu -> mark read. I think the menu key is part of what made the trackpad fast.

The challenge for BB here will be making the OS consistent, without inventing another yet another context menu. For instance, what if you're editing something in CB10 which has no side menu? What does the menu button do? Does it just focus the popup text menu?

Originally Posted by Omnitech

And some of the key reasons why people are pining for the legacy BlackBerry layout is because the new OS is poorly implemented. BB10 does NOT have to have lousy cursor management and copy/paste functionality, but because it does...

Well said. When I was waiting for the Q10, and I knew there would be no trackpad, I thought "well, this is a company that knows navigation and text editing. They're probably working on a killer touchscreen method that works just as well."

Of course BlackBerry didn't prioritize text editing and navigation at all, and because the development team was different than the old BBOS team, I get the feeling that they don't really understand or respect text editing and navigation as important UI goals.

I think they figure that the keyboard is only for data entry.

Originally Posted by Omnitech

It took Blackberry months after release to finally get around to providing a way to use the Q10 keys as direct speed dial shortcuts...

I know of one executive who used BBOS. He waited for the Q10 to be released to give it a try. When there was no speed dial and no good text editing, he concluded "this is a touch screen phone with a keyboard bolted on it". He switched to iphone.

If he couldn't have good keyboard control, he decided he might as well have access to all the apps.



Posted via CB10

Originally Posted by F2

Why do you need a real keyboard. The full touchscreen should be more than sufficient for any BB user. The touchscreen has worked well for Android and definitely for Apple. Please, just give up the keyboard q10 and move on and simplify BB's entire line of devices. No BELT, no keys, it should definitely work for you and everyone.

See, quite simple actually.

Have you not had any problems getting the damn cursor spot on for tight editing? Or selecting precisely the exact text you want? Well, I have. I don't know if the entire belt is necessary but why the heck not.

So, let's make the tradeoff. You give up the entire keyboard and the whiners can give up the Belt and Trackpad.

But the physical keyboard is the only reason I MIGHT buy a BlackBerry.


Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile app

Originally Posted by JAS0NB0URNE

John Chen has spoke to a lot, and came to the decision from his conversations to have this phone developed.

Posted with my ?Q10 running 10.2.1.1925.

You are supposed to let us know when the post is sarcasm.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile app

Originally Posted by Bbnivende

But the physical keyboard is the only reason I MIGHT buy a BlackBerry.


Sent from my Nexus 7 using CB Forums mobile app

I don't know, I think he was joking or being sarcastic or something...

Q20? Smaller screen than my Z30, slower processor, not until the end of the year? No thanks, will wait for my Z50, and they'd better not to waste any screen real state on any buttons for my Z50.

Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2141

Originally Posted by slagman5

I don't know, I think he was joking or being sarcastic or something...

Or haven't seen a Z30 in action before.

Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2141

Originally Posted by aha

Q20? Smaller screen than my Z30, slower processor, not until the end of the year? No thanks, will wait for my Z50, and they'd better not to waste any screen real state on any buttons for my Z50.

Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2141

No specs yet. Your psychic powers must have kicked in to know about the CPU speed...

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

Z50..are you kidding? Tapping on glass and mutilple gestures to accomplish what a simple click of a keyboard does? No thanks. I'll wait for the Q20.

Originally Posted by aha

Q20? Smaller screen than my Z30, slower processor, not until the end of the year? No thanks, will wait for my Z50, and they'd better not to waste any screen real state on any buttons for my Z50.

Posted via CB10 with Z30 on 10.2.1.2141

Originally Posted by waterfrontmgmt

Z50..are you kidding? Tapping on glass and mutilple gestures to accomplish what a simple click of a keyboard does? No thanks. I'll wait for the Q20.

that is true. i used to be able to call my mom with two clicks with my 9000 without looking. muscle memory locates 'm' (right above the keyboard) and click dial and thats it