11-04-17 02:32 PM
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  1. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    My $.02. I've used a Q10, Q5 , and a Classic. Yes I like BB10. It's good . Yet my backup both to the BB10 and more recently Windows Phone devices, has been my Torch 9810. BB10 is better for some things. Yet I've never felt under gunned with the Torch . Is BB7 beginning to show its age ? Certainly . And I have to do some work arounds in BB7 . But , to be honest, you have to do work arounds for BB10 too , and BB10 is considerably younger than BB7. Indeed it's a testament to BB7's robustness and quality that it works as well as it does six years later . I wouldn't have a issue using a BB7 device as my daily driver for a while. Speaking of which...
    My last WP device, the Nokia Lumia 830, is dying. I plan to replace it with the Passport and Leap but my finances are rather limited just now . I would switch to my Torch except that I accidentally destroyed the SIM card slot... So I'm looking to pick up a couple of BB7 devices to hold me until I can get the BB10 devices. My choices are the Curve 9360, Curve 9380, Torch 9810, Torch 9860, Bold 9900 and the Bold 9790. Which two would you pick and why ? Thanks in advance!
    10-29-17 10:39 PM
  2. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    My $.02. I've used a Q10, Q5 , and a Classic. Yes I like BB10. It's good . Yet my backup both to the BB10 and more recently Windows Phone devices, has been my Torch 9810. BB10 is better for some things. Yet I've never felt under gunned with the Torch . Is BB7 beginning to show its age ? Certainly . And I have to do some work arounds in BB7 . But , to be honest, you have to do work arounds for BB10 too , and BB10 is considerably younger than BB7. Indeed it's a testament to BB7's robustness and quality that it works as well as it does six years later . I wouldn't have a issue using a BB7 device as my daily driver for a while. Speaking of which...
    My last WP device, the Nokia Lumia 830, is dying. I plan to replace it with the Passport and Leap but my finances are rather limited just now . I would switch to my Torch except that I accidentally destroyed the SIM card slot... So I'm looking to pick up a couple of BB7 devices to hold me until I can get the BB10 devices. My choices are the Curve 9360, Curve 9380, Torch 9810, Torch 9860, Bold 9900 and the Bold 9790. Which two would you pick and why ? Thanks in advance!
    I moved on to BB10 over four years ago leaving my 9900 for the Q10, then Classic and finally the Passport. I gave the Passport up for the PRIV. Recently, I set up another line on my account, had BIS reactivated and fired up my old device. Well, BIS still exists on AT&T for now, email was fun but that was about it plus texting.

    So many things nowadays require updated web browser or updated apps. Too many convenience features in life now with smartphones that BB Android is the future. BB10 was really a waste of time in my opinion. BB should have gone with Android back in 2008 while keeping and upgrading BBOS to maintain BIS revenue. We'll never really know what could have been......
    10-30-17 05:30 AM
  3. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    So your advice is what? Go with BlackBerry Android? Sorry but like I said,not an option now due to limited finances just now, as you should know from reading my post. BB10 is still very much relevant in 2017 . Probably not for much longer , not more than a year at most . And if you think BB10 isn't useable these days , let alone BB7, go explain that to Jan Ole Helmbold and J Williams on YouTube.
    As for BB7 , I used my Torch 9810 on wifi and it ran just fine, including the browser . Of course I don't need the latest and greatest apps ; as long as I can do what I need to do, I'm good . Judging from your post , I'd say that you're the sort who wants the latest and greatest apps . If it works for you, good . But I note in passing that there are still many BlackBerry users using BB10 and BB7 devices . And I stand by what I said in my prior post.a
    Speaking of which, I notice that you didn't answer my questions...
    rayporsche likes this.
    10-30-17 11:54 PM
  4. Invictus0's Avatar
    It depends on your needs but if you're on a budget I don't see a BBOS or BB10 device being a great investment at this point, especially until we know more about KRACK.

    Are you looking at a new BlackBerry primarily for the physical keyboard?
    10-31-17 12:16 AM
  5. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    So your advice is what? Go with BlackBerry Android? Sorry but like I said,not an option now due to limited finances just now, as you should know from reading my post. BB10 is still very much relevant in 2017 . Probably not for much longer , not more than a year at most . And if you think BB10 isn't useable these days , let alone BB7, go explain that to Jan Ole Helmbold and J Williams on YouTube.
    As for BB7 , I used my Torch 9810 on wifi and it ran just fine, including the browser . Of course I don't need the latest and greatest apps ; as long as I can do what I need to do, I'm good . Judging from your post , I'd say that you're the sort who wants the latest and greatest apps . If it works for you, good . But I note in passing that there are still many BlackBerry users using BB10 and BB7 devices . And I stand by what I said in my prior post.a
    Speaking of which, I notice that you didn't answer my questions...
    I only use a limited set of apps that are necessary in my business and I don't use social media on a regular basis and when I do, not from my phone. I'm sure I've run BB10 longer than most and I still own each of the BB10 devices (8) made. It's a relic OS that I don't have time for with side loaded apps or the other nonsense. The apps that I use for my clients and my business have been or are being updated past ART 4.3 and I just need a device that is a tool and not a toy (like what I did there).

    I tried using BBOS7 on extra line but the browser was further behind than BB10 version browser for my business uses. It's almost 2018 and my clients dictate my tools and their apps included. My clients pay my bills so I can't afford to lose clients or not land new clients as well. If you don't like BBAndroid, use regular Android or IOS. Most companies publish their commercial grade apps on both platforms. I just mention BBAndroid since it's more similar to BB10 and BBOS7 for me and I appreciate the close similarities.

    There aren't many old users out there when you look at the data, less than 1%, and that includes users like me with multiple old devices that show active but aren't really being used actively.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-31-17 01:10 PM
  6. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Not a good investment ? Why ? I beg to differ. Like I said , there are quite a few users who are using BB7 devices and from personal experience, my Torch 9810 worked fine. Butt if you have some insight that can convince me otherwise, please share!
    My plan on the BB7 devices is to get a pair , preferably one with a PKB and one without , until I can afford better because: 1) they're dirt cheap, 2) they still get the job done. I plan to use them for a few months as daily drivers, then as backups.
    I notice that thus far, no one has answered my questions . Of the six BB7 devices which would you recommend and why? And if you have a better alternative in the same price range , sub $100, what is it and why do you recommend it?Thanks in advance.
    10-31-17 01:14 PM
  7. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Not a good investment ? Why ? I beg to differ. Like I said , there are quite a few users who are using BB7 devices and from personal experience, my Torch 9810 worked fine. Butt if you have some insight that can convince me otherwise, please share!
    My plan on the BB7 devices is to get a pair , preferably one with a PKB and one without , until I can afford better because: 1) they're dirt cheap, 2) they still get the job done. I plan to use them for a few months as daily drivers, then as backups.
    I notice that thus far, no one has answered my questions . Of the six BB7 devices which would you recommend and why? And if you have a better alternative in the same price range , sub $100, what is it and why do you recommend it?Thanks in advance.
    You resurrected almost two year old thread that last comment was almost year old. The negatives only become stronger against spending any money on a previous EOL OS previous to BB10 which is practically EOL due to lack of any real development and support. Even the biggest supporters in thread, now carry and use alternative OS devices for certain tasks.

    If you want, can walk around with BBOS device for MiFi and XP laptop.....for less than $100. You can also buy Q10,Z10 or Z30 for each under $100 according to CB posters on various CB threads.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-31-17 01:34 PM
  8. DallinCrump's Avatar
    My $.02. I've used a Q10, Q5 , and a Classic. Yes I like BB10. It's good . Yet my backup both to the BB10 and more recently Windows Phone devices, has been my Torch 9810. BB10 is better for some things. Yet I've never felt under gunned with the Torch . Is BB7 beginning to show its age ? Certainly . And I have to do some work arounds in BB7 . But , to be honest, you have to do work arounds for BB10 too , and BB10 is considerably younger than BB7. Indeed it's a testament to BB7's robustness and quality that it works as well as it does six years later . I wouldn't have a issue using a BB7 device as my daily driver for a while. Speaking of which...
    My last WP device, the Nokia Lumia 830, is dying. I plan to replace it with the Passport and Leap but my finances are rather limited just now . I would switch to my Torch except that I accidentally destroyed the SIM card slot... So I'm looking to pick up a couple of BB7 devices to hold me until I can get the BB10 devices. My choices are the Curve 9360, Curve 9380, Torch 9810, Torch 9860, Bold 9900 and the Bold 9790. Which two would you pick and why ? Thanks in advance!
    Of the choices you listed, it would be between the Torch 9810 and Bold 9900 for me. Torch has the larger screen and better camera, Bold has the quintessential physical keyboard experience.

    The 9900 also has charging contacts, so you could get a couple of OEM Charging Pods for it and not have to worry about plugging in a cable to charge it.

    If I had to pick just one of those two, I'd go Bold without hesitation.
    10-31-17 01:56 PM
  9. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    FWIW , according to another CB thread in FY2015 , BB7 devices accounted for 30% of sales . Extrapolating from that data , 10% nowadays seems likely. According to Blai1ze in a 10/12/2017 article CB's older device forum threads still see plenty of traction . Worth noting .
    10-31-17 01:57 PM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    FWIW , according to another CB thread in FY2015 , BB7 devices accounted for 30% of sales . Extrapolating from that data , 10% nowadays seems likely. According to Blai1ze in a 10/12/2017 article CB's older device forum threads still see plenty of traction . Worth noting .
    FY2015 would have been 2014 year sales for devices. There's been a rapid falloff is BBOS7 device sales and usage since then. BB stopped offering BBOS7 devices back then I believe. Also, BB left hardware altogether plus their software EMM/MDM solutions are developed around IOS/Android since their acquisition of Good. At same time BES isn't their primary EMM/MDM development thrust anymore.

    Because of this, many carriers have been, are or will be pulling their BIS data offerings now. This further hampers BBOS7 and earlier devices. The older device forum threads have activity from old users like myself. Old devices are discussed, argued or debated. However, as stated before, most of us have moved on to BB10 and then BBAndroid. The data is misleading at worst, skewed at best.
    10-31-17 02:11 PM
  11. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Newfangled thanks for your suggestions! Chuck , thanks for the Z10 suggestion! I'll keep it in mind . Checked EBay and Amazon and most of the sub $100 offers are either carrier locked or Verizon; might get lucky . Judging from my research , I think I'd be better off waiting and buying the Passport and Leap .
    On the Q10 , had one and it perished from a fall it should've survived so I'm leery. The issue with the Z30 is that there are 6 versions, finding one of the 2 versions that would work for sub $100 is difficult.
    As for BB7 , granted there has been a rapid falloff , they're six years old! 10% is a guess but an educated one. On the BIS , did you seriously think that I wouldn't look into BB7 usability? Several carriers still offer BIS, AT&T an example. Moreover there are several reports of BB7 devices working well on Cricket, my carrier. Even if there's no BIS , BB7 devices can be configured to work without BIS . That's doable for a few months assuming that I don't get the Z10 or find a really good deal on the Leap....
    10-31-17 02:45 PM
  12. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Newfangled thanks for your suggestions! Chuck , thanks for the Z10 suggestion! I'll keep it in mind . Checked EBay and Amazon and most of the sub $100 offers are either carrier locked or Verizon; might get lucky . Judging from my research , I think I'd be better off waiting and buying the Passport and Leap .
    On the Q10 , had one and it perished from a fall it should've survived so I'm leery. The issue with the Z30 is that there are 6 versions, finding one of the 2 versions that would work for sub $100 is difficult.
    As for BB7 , granted there has been a rapid falloff , they're six years old! 10% is a guess but an educated one. On the BIS , did you seriously think that I wouldn't look into BB7 usability? Several carriers still offer BIS, AT&T an example. Moreover there are several reports of BB7 devices working well on Cricket, my carrier. Even if there's no BIS , BB7 devices can be configured to work without BIS . That's doable for a few months assuming that I don't get the Z10 or find a really good deal on the Leap....
    Do a Leap if possible. My Leap was much better in terms of battery life than my Z10, almost guaranteed to be factory unlocked, especially in the USA, it was never carrier offered. Avoid Z30 as never had one Cricket/AT&T LTE compatible bands in USA. My factory unlocked Z30 could only get LTE on T-Mobile.

    I'm on AT&T with long-term corporate account. I was set-up with BIS, however, I was told it couldn't be guaranteed for how much longer, they would provide BIS for my device.
    10-31-17 03:52 PM
  13. Lincoln Allen's Avatar
    Hi there fellow crackberries

    I've been using Bold 9900, and even with the Classic I still can't find compelling reason to upgrade.

    I'm so disappointed that Blackberry still hasn't learned that users want MAXIMIZED SCREEN REAL ESTATE. There's really no need for that "Blackberry" logo on top, and the screen could've easily have been 4 inches.
    For a phone with such size 3.5 is not acceptable in 2015/16. Even if it was a little bit taller, I am sure many of us would've appreciated the extra screen size. And the screen size has always been an issue with Blackberries and I'm disappointed that continues to be the case in 2015.

    The Bold 9900 performs like the first day I got it, and I've had it for 5 years now. I only tried BB10 for a few days, but find os7 to be much quicker for most basic tasks such as calls, texting/emails, memo pad, calendar, password keeper, tasks. If the bold 9900 had acceptable camera with auto-focus, and more decent maps app, I don't see need to upgrade in the next few years neither.

    The bold 9900 is also more pocketable device (lighter and smaller).

    I would buy Classic-like device with a 4 - 4.5 inch screen, with streamlined bezels in a heartbeat. Until then, I don't think there are huge advantages to upgrade from Bold 9900 to the Classic IMHO.

    To the Classic owners: What are your thoughts on the screen size and overall functionality advantages over the bold 9900? Thanks
    Ok so you want larger screen size but you still use a Bold I'm confused Bold display is even smaller than 9900
    11-01-17 04:14 PM
  14. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Yeah , I'd love ❤ to grab a Leap , would have to be lucky on it and the Z10 . Keeping an eye on EBay and Amazon....
    Invictus0 ,what is KRACK ? Ideally I'd like to get 2 devices , one with a PKB and one without.
    I'll also keep an eye on the BB7 devices because I must do something next Tuesday ( payday) ,; much depends on what's available as well as what I consider to be the best deals. Thanks for your help guys !
    11-01-17 05:40 PM
  15. bobshine's Avatar
    Yeah , I'd love to grab a Leap , would have to be lucky on it and the Z10 . Keeping an eye on EBay and Amazon....
    Invictus0 ,what is KRACK ? Ideally I'd like to get 2 devices , one with a PKB and one without.
    I'll also keep an eye on the BB7 devices because I must do something next Tuesday ( payday) ,; much depends on what's available as well as what I consider to be the best deals. Thanks for your help guys !
    Krack is a wifi encryption vulnerability that can allow an attacker to view everything that goes through your wifi.
    11-01-17 05:59 PM
  16. Invictus0's Avatar
    Yeah , I'd love ❤ to grab a Leap , would have to be lucky on it and the Z10 . Keeping an eye on EBay and Amazon....
    Invictus0 ,what is KRACK ? Ideally I'd like to get 2 devices , one with a PKB and one without.
    I'll also keep an eye on the BB7 devices because I must do something next Tuesday ( payday) ,; much depends on what's available as well as what I consider to be the best deals. Thanks for your help guys !
    It's a wifi vulnerability, BlackBerry hasn't commented yet on if BBOS and BB10 are impacted,

    https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...-life-1128555/
    11-01-17 06:03 PM
  17. thurask's Avatar
    It's a wifi vulnerability, BlackBerry hasn't commented yet on if BBOS and BB10 are impacted,

    https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...-life-1128555/
    If they followed the WPA specification then they are vulnerable.

    It should be noted that BBOS is actually EOL (the last OS update came in 2013-14 or so) so don't expect a patch.
    11-01-17 06:07 PM
  18. Invictus0's Avatar
    If they followed the WPA specification then they are vulnerable.

    It should be noted that BBOS is actually EOL (the last OS update came in 2013-14 or so) so don't expect a patch.
    Agreed, the best BBOS users can hope for is an advisory on its status like the one BlackBerry posted for BlueBorne.
    11-01-17 07:36 PM
  19. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Ah yes , I recall now on KRACK . thurask I checked the link you provided and while BB7 is EOL ( No surprise there!) BB10, isn't, at least for 10.3 and up. Moreover both Chen and Thurber promised 4 updates and unless I'm missing something, we've had 3 so far .
    ChuckFinley06, I understand your POV. If your clients dictate what apps you need to use then you need to at least stay current with your mobile devices. I'd be the same way. But my clients don't dictate which apps I use so my freedom of choice OS wise is greater.
    So the suggestions on devices are the Leap, Z10 , Bold 9900 and the Torch 9810; duly noted and appreciated! Keeping a sharp eye on EBay and Amazon and will keep an eye also on the other four BB7 devices . If anyone has more suggestions I'll be grateful! Again , many thanks!
    11-01-17 09:46 PM
  20. Invictus0's Avatar
    Ah yes , I recall now on KRACK . thurask I checked the link you provided and while BB7 is EOL ( No surprise there!) BB10, isn't, at least for 10.3 and up. Moreover both Chen and Thurber promised 4 updates and unless I'm missing something, we've had 3 so far .
    ChuckFinley06, I understand your POV. If your clients dictate what apps you need to use then you need to at least stay current with your mobile devices. I'd be the same way. But my clients don't dictate which apps I use so my freedom of choice OS wise is greater.
    So the suggestions on devices are the Leap, Z10 , Bold 9900 and the Torch 9810; duly noted and appreciated! Keeping a sharp eye on EBay and Amazon and will keep an eye also on the other four BB7 devices . If anyone has more suggestions I'll be grateful! Again , many thanks!
    I don't remember four updates being promised, the last we've heard mention of BB10 updates was in this interview at the 40 minute mark, make of it what you will.



    If you're worried about KRACK, I'd say hold off on buying any BBOS/BB10 device until there's comment from BlackBerry. Your Lumia 830 (assuming it's on Windows 10) should have been patched for it already.
    11-01-17 11:26 PM
  21. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    In 2 articles dated 1/11/16 on Gadgets 360 and the Inquirer Chen confirmed that there will be continued investment in BB10 and a 10.3.4 update . By my reckoning that'll be 4 updates. In another article on the Financial Post site dated 1/17/17, Alex Thurber confirmed continued BB10 support and that another BB10 device was possible if it met their customers' needs , made sense technologically and if they could make money on it . Sorry , didn't have time for a extended Google search.
    On the UTB I watched from 30-47 minutes and I saw nothing to counter the earlier articles; quite the contrary in fact . Thurber reaffirmed BB10 support and that they're working on a update , the holdup being a security certification. Thurber also confirmed that they still have millions of BB10 users and , surprisingly, millions of BB7 users ! Thurber even confirmed continued support for BB7 !
    On the Lumia 830, as I said above , it's dying and must be replaced post haste. The 830 didn't make the WP10 upgrade list so it's not being supported, yet another reason to replace it. Hence no KRACK fix. Speaking of which...
    Am I concerned about KRACJ ? Somewhat. I don't usually have access to wifi so my vulnerability is rather limited.
    Hold off ? No can do , as I explained. Cheers !
    11-02-17 09:49 AM
  22. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    In 2 articles dated 1/11/16 on Gadgets 360 and the Inquirer Chen confirmed that there will be continued investment in BB10 and a 10.3.4 update . By my reckoning that'll be 4 updates. In another article on the Financial Post site dated 1/17/17, Alex Thurber confirmed continued BB10 support and that another BB10 device was possible if it met their customers' needs , made sense technologically and if they could make money on it . Sorry , didn't have time for a extended Google search.
    On the UTB I watched from 30-47 minutes and I saw nothing to counter the earlier articles; quite the contrary in fact . Thurber reaffirmed BB10 support and that they're working on a update , the holdup being a security certification. Thurber also confirmed that they still have millions of BB10 users and , surprisingly, millions of BB7 users ! Thurber even confirmed continued support for BB7 !
    On the Lumia 830, as I said above , it's dying and must be replaced post haste. The 830 didn't make the WP10 upgrade list so it's not being supported, yet another reason to replace it. Hence no KRACK fix. Speaking of which...
    Am I concerned about KRACJ ? Somewhat. I don't usually have access to wifi 📶 so my vulnerability is rather limited.
    Hold off ? No can do , as I explained. Cheers !
    11-02-17 09:49 AM
  23. Invictus0's Avatar
    In 2 articles dated 1/11/16 on Gadgets 360 and the Inquirer Chen confirmed that there will be continued investment in BB10 and a 10.3.4 update . By my reckoning that'll be 4 updates. In another article on the Financial Post site dated 1/17/17, Alex Thurber confirmed continued BB10 support and that another BB10 device was possible if it met their customers' needs , made sense technologically and if they could make money on it . Sorry , didn't have time for a extended Google search.
    On the UTB I watched from 30-47 minutes and I saw nothing to counter the earlier articles; quite the contrary in fact . Thurber reaffirmed BB10 support and that they're working on a update , the holdup being a security certification. Thurber also confirmed that they still have millions of BB10 users and , surprisingly, millions of BB7 users ! Thurber even confirmed continued support for BB7 !
    On the Lumia 830, as I said above , it's dying and must be replaced post haste. The 830 didn't make the WP10 upgrade list so it's not being supported, yet another reason to replace it. Hence no KRACK fix. Speaking of which...
    Am I concerned about KRACJ ? Somewhat. I don't usually have access to wifi ������ so my vulnerability is rather limited.
    Hold off ? No can do , as I explained. Cheers !
    10.3.3 was the update that needed security certifications, it was delayed quite a bit as a result so many assume 10.3.3 and the planned 10.3.4 update were combined. Thurber is basically saying they're open to more updates and support but nothing is confirmed. BB7 is already EOL (see thurask's link) so it won't see anymore updates.

    The Lumia 830 actually did upgrade to Windows 10. You have to download the upgrade advisor app to get access to it,

    http://forums.crackberry.com/e?link=...token=YfkC_fQ5
    11-02-17 10:26 AM
  24. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    10.3.3 was the update that needed security certifications, it was delayed quite a bit as a result so many assume 10.3.3 and the planned 10.3.4 update were combined. Thurber is basically saying they're open to more updates and support but nothing is confirmed. BB7 is already EOL (see thurask's link) so it won't see anymore updates.

    The Lumia 830 actually did upgrade to Windows 10. You have to download the upgrade advisor app to get access to it,

    http://forums.crackberry.com/e?link=...token=4ZTjjnDU
    First, many thanks Invictus0 for the WP10 advice , wasn`t aware that a app was . Would have been nice if MS had sent me an email .... Ironically the update comes as the 830 is dying . Ah well...
    Went through the UTB broadcast that you so kindly linked to and I must stand by what I said except for the following : Thurber did confirm the 10.3.4 update but that it`s in the strategy phase and that NIAP certification is the issue . Also Thurber didn`t specify how many were still on BB10 , but he did say that they were "incredibly loyal". He did confirm milliosns of BBOS users , mostly BB7 I should think . Thurber also confirmed support for their "BB customers " , and he didn`t limit that statement to BB10 .
    11-02-17 04:02 PM
  25. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Blackberry Android is , according to Chen , is meeting sales targets , though he doesn`t specify what said targets were . So Blackberry`s doing ok , but , to be honest , they`re just another Android OEM in a sea . I think that if Blackberry wants to become truly relevant again , they must look to their propietary OSes . what follows is conjecture on my part.
    Here`s the thing.one of bb10`S USPs is the ability to run Android apps. But Blackberry can`t update the ART due to contractural obligations so in a year at most , BB10 will become obsolete. Maybe BB will do something before then but...
    BBOS , on the other hand , doesn`t have that problem . what if Blackberry were to update and /or evolve BB7 to , say , BB11? before you say that this is insane , remember that in the UTB broadcast that Invictus0 linked to , that , as I said above , Thurber confirmed support forbut didn`t limit that statement to BB10 . Moreover , he also confirmed that BBOS still had millions of users .
    11-02-17 04:45 PM
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