[j_the_p]

So what? There were redundant uses in BBOS as well.

Ok. I'm not disagreeing.

But you didn't answer how that means it's going backwards (which implies it's taking away advances), you just said it gives the user more choices. Many people thought BB10 was going backwards since so many great BB features were taken away. That's why BB when to great lengths to tell people on the 17th that most of their shortcuts, and moves, etc. etc have been restored.

I did answer it.

Going backwards = Releasing a second rate phone with blatant and admittedly redundant technology.

Ah....so.....some of the 9900 users (not part of this "subset" you refer to) are just holding onto the phone because they are delaying their move to Iphone? Otherwise....there is no "subset"...it's pretty much everyone still using a 9900 (which is the majority of BB handsets in service. Darn numbers.)

Lol. Surely you jest. You first spoke of those that were "responsible for BB's existence in the handset market." Most of those "responsible" have left for other platforms. When you have less than 1% of the market, it means most have moved on. If you are implying that the old-timers that won't give up their 9900s are responsible for BB's existence, well...it's just not the case. Sorry.

You might want to research what "market share" means. While they have lost users to other platforms, the reason the "market share" has shrunk so much is that the market grew so much (thanks to Apple inviting kids and the average Joe to the party). BB's share would have grown smaller even if it never lost a single customer.

Give it a rest. I understand that before Apple and others came to the "party" that BB was really the only player. With the introduction of new players, then the pie gets sliced in a few more ways. But seriously, if you think that having less than 1% of the market share is a reasonable position, then I hope you're not an investor. Maybe you should research market share and what it means to actually have some.

AND...part of the reason many left was because of what Iphone had and BB didn't. But they did this by sacrificing the things they LOVED from BB. Many wished BB would give them the best of both. THUS.....Classic. Keyboard. Buttons. Touchscreen. Apps.

I don't disagree with your first sentence here. However if the rest is true, I hope you bought BB stock because the masses should be flooding back any time now ...<crickets>.

You just wrote 3 sentences but didn't say anything. WHAT technology? Specifically? What technology of BB10 did people "resist" and what evidence do you have that that was their intention in not switching? I could just as easily say that people that won't buy a classic don't like change. Or people that won't switch from an Iphone to a BlackBerry dont' like change.

The technology of BB10. Faster, modern, beautiful and powerful OS... but ...<shed a tear> without any buttons!!! Oh NO!

You're reaching.

Specifically, what "hardware" ? You mean a phone you hold in your hand? Perhaps the way of doing things wasn't "scary" so much as it was SLOWER THAN HELL. Or perhaps you meant that losing precious time all day long is "scary" when time is money.

I don't really know what point you're going for here. Are you saying that the BB10 hardware is slower than hell? I'm seriously asking because I don't understand what you're saying.

Again, you just said the same words as before, but just included a sarcastic opening. You repeated your vague "going backward" phrase with no explanation of how it's actually going backwards. Perhaps your perspective is that you were "freed" while others were "robbed". But, hey...it's all about you, chief.

Ha ha. No, it's not all about me. I just find your staunch support of the classic to be amusing. I told you what I meant about going backwards. Introducing a toolbelt to an OS that doesn't need it (i.e. redundancy). It's a complete waste of real estate in an effort to coerce those that won't change...to change. I'm not saying it's a horrible idea (I mean, somehow you have to convince the cavemen to come out of their cave). I just find it pathetic that BB had to stoop to this level.

The baby step.....towards what? Is your neck sore from looking down at others so much?

Oh come on now. Buck up old chum. You needed a toolbelt to join a modern OS...when a toolbelt isn't needed. So yes...a baby step.

WHY? Why would you be disappointed that people FINALLY might buy BlackBerry again?

Nice misdirect. No, I said I was disappointed that BB had to compromise.

In my first post to you I invited you to answer those questions and not change the subject. I am renewing my invitation to answer the questions with more than vague generalities.

Lol...I didn't change the subject. You just don't like what I have to say.

Look, I love BB. I'm disappointed that they're in the position where they just have to bend over and take it and compromise on their BB10 vision (not that it's been super visionary to begin with). It sucks. And I'm entitled to that disappointment. But really, in the end, it won't matter. Their handset division is dying and will continue to do so. And it's a combination of two things that have killed them. 1 - not innovating fast enough; and 2 - when they did innovate, the die-hards (not unlike yourself) were too scared to come along for the ride.

[slagman5]

Ok. I'm not disagreeing.



I did answer it.

Going backwards = Releasing a second rate phone with blatant and admittedly redundant technology.



Lol. Surely you jest. You first spoke of those that were "responsible for BB's existence in the handset market." Most of those "responsible" have left for other platforms. When you have less than 1% of the market, it means most have moved on. If you are implying that the old-timers that won't give up their 9900s are responsible for BB's existence, well...it's just not the case. Sorry.



Give it a rest. I understand that before Apple and others came to the "party" that BB was really the only player. With the introduction of new players, then the pie gets sliced in a few more ways. But seriously, if you think that having less than 1% of the market share is a reasonable position, then I hope you're not an investor. Maybe you should research market share and what it means to actually have some.



I don't disagree with your first sentence here. However if the rest is true, I hope you bought BB stock because the masses should be flooding back any time now ...<crickets>.



The technology of BB10. Faster, modern, beautiful and powerful OS... but ...<shed a tear> without any buttons!!! Oh NO!

You're reaching.



I don't really know what point you're going for here. Are you saying that the BB10 hardware is slower than hell? I'm seriously asking because I don't understand what you're saying.




Ha ha. No, it's not all about me. I just find your staunch support of the classic to be amusing. I told you what I meant about going backwards. Introducing a toolbelt to an OS that doesn't need it (i.e. redundancy). It's a complete waste of real estate in an effort to coerce those that won't change...to change. I'm not saying it's a horrible idea (I mean, somehow you have to convince the cavemen to come out of their cave). I just find it pathetic that BB had to stoop to this level.




Oh come on now. Buck up old chum. You needed a toolbelt to join a modern OS...when a toolbelt isn't needed. So yes...a baby step.




Nice misdirect. No, I said I was disappointed that BB had to compromise.



Lol...I didn't change the subject. You just don't like what I have to say.

Look, I love BB. I'm disappointed that they're in the position where they just have to bend over and take it and compromise on their BB10 vision (not that it's been super visionary to begin with). It sucks. And I'm entitled to that disappointment. But really, in the end, it won't matter. Their handset division is dying and will continue to do so. And it's a combination of two things that have killed them. 1 - not innovating fast enough; and 2 - when they did innovate, the die-hards (not unlike yourself) were too scared to come along for the ride.

This was TLDNR, but just wanted to point out one thing, the percent of current marketshare doesn't show anything about where the majority of original users went. It COULD be true what you say, but this percentage doesn't prove it. BB might be only 1% of total marketshare of smartphone users today, that doesn't mean that if it used to be 60% that means 59% went away. You have to keep in mind that the total number of smartphones being in use back when BB was #1 was MUCH less than it is now. Actually BB is selling more handsets now than they were back then when they were #1... We scoff at numbers like 1.5 - 2 million handsets. Sales were in the hundreds of thousands back then... Majority of phone users back then were using dumbphones. The 1% now could very well be an even larger number than the number of users back when BB was at top position in smartphones...

[vbdwork]

The 1% now could very well be an even larger number than the number of users back when BB was at top position in smartphones...

It is probably a larger number, but still under 1% market share and that put the company on the verge of survival. BlackBerry failed to foresee global market trends and missed the opportunity to stay on top. Releasing 1 new device (Passport) and 1 update to existing one (Q10 -> Classic) in a 2 years period doesn't make things any better. Classic is not really an upgrade to Q10 and Passport is not the phone many people want. Many existing BlackBerry users simply have nothing to upgrade to and are forced to move to other manufacturers. Looks like Chen is trying to fix the numbers on paper cutting expenses and minimizing development costs. I wouldn't be surprised if he is preparing the company for sale. He was sent there to save the investors, not to satisfy customers nor to expand the company.

[Katnis]

I'm based in London, UK so we don't have the handset yet. For now I'm using the z10 and Bold 9900 but knowing how much of a Blackberry addict (my first device was a 7730) I am there is no doubt I will get the Classic in due time.

[world traveler and former ceo]

It is probably a larger number, but still under 1% market share and that put the company on the verge of survival. BlackBerry failed to foresee global market trends and missed the opportunity to stay on top. Releasing 1 new device (Passport) and 1 update to existing one (Q10 -> Classic) in a 2 years period doesn't make things any better. Classic is not really an upgrade to Q10 and Passport is not the phone many people want. Many existing BlackBerry users simply have nothing to upgrade to and are forced to move to other manufacturers. Looks like Chen is trying to fix the numbers on paper cutting expenses and minimizing development costs. I wouldn't be surprised if he is preparing the company for sale. He was sent there to save the investors, not to satisfy customers nor to expand the company.

You are wrong on so many counts don't know where to begin...

Posted via CB10

[djsvet]

No (q10)

Posted via CB10

[mcstravi]

Nope.
I played with my wife's new Classic yesterday for a bit and love the keyboard and 10.3.1 but the overall experience doesn't match my Z30.
Smaller screen compared to the Z30 obviously, gestures are more awkward with the keyboard in the way and it seemed a bit slower to navigate and launch apps.

Posted via CB10

[mcstravi]

Releasing 1 new device (Passport) and 1 update to existing one (Q10 -> Classic) in a 2 years period doesn't make things any better.

Unless I slept through a year, they introduced the Z30 and affordable Z3 in the past year or so as well

Posted via CB10

[Fr3lncr]

Was going to but not anymore. While I would love the form factor, I can't see myself going for a phone which is slower than my Z30. Some of the Android apps I run are already painfully slow on the Z30 so it would just be worse on the Classic. After trying out a Passport, I much prefer the performance a quad core offers on BB10 and I can't see myself going for a slower BlackBerry. The downside is that the form factor of the Passport doesn't meet my needs as much.

In addition, from reading the forum threads from Classic users, I'm getting the sense that the OS still needs some more tweaks to fully take advantage of the keyboard. 10.3.1. is a lot better than 10.3 in that regard (as I believe they brought back keyboard shortcuts) but I'm thinking it still needs more work.

So, it looks like I will stick with my Z30 and either jump on a Passport if they end up having another sale (i.e. $499 or less) or wait for the next high end BB (keyboard or touch) which may be a while from the looks of it.

[vbdwork]

You are wrong on so many counts don't know where to begin...

I hope I'm not right. I like BlackBerry products and that's why I'm using one. Unfortunately their market share will shrink further to under 0.5% in next 2 years. Selling the company may remain the only survival option for investors.

Unless I slept through a year, they introduced the Z30 and affordable Z3 in the past year or so as well

Oh, yes! Forgot about Z30. It's >1 year old now with no product to replace it. Z3 was never released in North America, it doesn't exist here. There is Q5 as well, stripped down all plastic Q10... like Z30, I've never seen someone using it.

[funnyman1111]

Yes and YES

[slagman5]

It is probably a larger number, but still under 1% market share and that put the company on the verge of survival. BlackBerry failed to foresee global market trends and missed the opportunity to stay on top. Releasing 1 new device (Passport) and 1 update to existing one (Q10 -> Classic) in a 2 years period doesn't make things any better. Classic is not really an upgrade to Q10 and Passport is not the phone many people want. Many existing BlackBerry users simply have nothing to upgrade to and are forced to move to other manufacturers. Looks like Chen is trying to fix the numbers on paper cutting expenses and minimizing development costs. I wouldn't be surprised if he is preparing the company for sale. He was sent there to save the investors, not to satisfy customers nor to expand the company.

You're missing the point. Read the post I'm replying to and you'll get the purpose of my statement. Nowhere did I ever state that having only 1% is somehow not a bad thing for the company. It would be helpful in the future to put a comment in context before you reply. That'll be cool, but it's not a requirement, it's your prerogative to do so. :-)

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[TgeekB]

Q10 to Classic and couldn't be happier. The larger screen along with the toolbelt make it much easier to navigate and select text. Very happy.

Posted from my Classic.

[w_scott]

Already had a Q10. Just ordered a Passport. So no Classic.

Posted via CB10

[vbdwork]

You're missing the point...

You're right. From a business perspective I see no point in your statement.

[slagman5]

You're right. From a business perspective I see no point in your statement.

Still over your head. But that's ok. I see you still didn't bother to read the comment I was directly replying to. Trust me, it helps... ;-)

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[vbdwork]

Merry Christmas Slag and everyone on CrackBerry!
Let's hope we see more BlackBerry devices in 2015 we want to switch to.

[mmk1954]

I'm on the classic having switched from the Z10 and am very happy I did. While I really liked the Z10 the classic is working very well!

Using my BlackBerry Classic :-)

[slagman5]

Merry Christmas Slag and everyone on CrackBerry!
Let's hope we see more BlackBerry devices in 2015 we want to switch to.

You too dude. :-)

Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10

[Amy wineBerry]

I find the move from a Q10 to the Classic to be lovely. However, I don't feel as good about a move from the Passport to the Classic. I'm having an internal conflict over which device will be tied to my second line.

Posted via CB10

[Chrisy]

Actually I find I'm not missing the trackpad like I thought. Coming from a 9930 and iPhone. Guess I got used to all touch.

[dmateo]

Very content with my pp so no I highly doubt it. As many others have said it feels like I'd be taking a step backwards and I can't mentally justify the loss I'd take on the pp...

Posted via CB10

[MarsupilamiX]

With better specs I might have thought about it as my secondary phone.
Like this however, there is no chance at all, that I'll buy the Classic.
For 450$, the overall package just doesn't warrant the price and I'd feel ripped off.

This however, doesn't mean that those who bought it, shouldn't enjoy it. I hope that your Classic makes you happy!

[Alain_A]

With better specs I might have thought about it as my secondary phone.
Like this however, there is no chance at all, that I'll buy the Classic.
For 450$, the overall package just doesn't warrant the price and I'd feel ripped off.

This however, doesn't mean that those who bought it, shouldn't enjoy it. I hope that your Classic makes you happy!

it sure does

[TgeekB]

With better specs I might have thought about it as my secondary phone.
Like this however, there is no chance at all, that I'll buy the Classic.
For 450$, the overall package just doesn't warrant the price and I'd feel ripped off.

This however, doesn't mean that those who bought it, shouldn't enjoy it. I hope that your Classic makes you happy!

While I agree the price is high, I was willing to spend it because it is the first BB10 device I feel worthy of it based on my needs.

Posted from my Classic.