04-27-15 12:25 PM
82 1234
tools
  1. kvndoom's Avatar
    Some people prefers the 9900 form factor. I would buy a 1:1 copy of the 9900 with BB10!
    We get that with the Q10 but without toolbelt...! And no! the Classic is not a newer 9900! its too big and with a nonremovable battery bla bla bla
    I'm the opposite- I would LOVE the larger screen and extra speed/memory of the Classic with OS7.
    Mr4aces likes this.
    04-26-15 08:25 AM
  2. baarn's Avatar
    @Baarn
    Never said I could program in COLBOL2010 or anything after C74.
    Just making a suggestion. For people like you to give reasons why not.
    Wasn't a personal attack, and I rarely name call.

    @Baarn
    OK BlackBerry does nothing for BIS subscribers.
    ...
    It is not unfeasible for them to lose $500M+ in SAF revenue in 2016.
    I'm only a bb10 user, so less familiar with the legacy stuff. But my understanding is that BIS will die sooner rather than later. Why does a subscriber want to be tied to a BlackBerry only plan, when other devices can just use any old one. Cheaper the better.
    Obviously things may be a little different in markets where the telco infrastructure is not yet fully developed and where things like data compression are still useful. But what is BIS really offering a subscriber other than cost and a proprietary tie in?
    (I don't know).
    04-26-15 09:02 AM
  3. ChrisLeNeve's Avatar
    I've been thinking about this before. Since OS7 exists and is mature, why not keep building it ? It has loads of potential, and would have even more so if the phones equipped with it had a little more power. There are loads of possibilities. I'm talking widgets on the wallpaper, a fresher and more modern UI. I think both OS7 and OS10 should be continued.
    Mr4aces and Frehley like this.
    04-26-15 09:59 AM
  4. AllanQuatermain's Avatar
    cheaper option just produce a limited run of 9900's again as many owners staying put and some returning to a 9900 and will be looking for a replacement, the Classic is not the phone to encourage all 9900 owners to move to BB10.
    Mr4aces likes this.
    04-26-15 10:09 AM
  5. theotherjoeboy's Avatar
    get over it folks....this is as bad as the die hards who don't want to switch from windows xp...technology moves forward...bb does not need the expense of supporting and upgrading an old obsolete os....they barely have the resources for bb10....this is not a car (yes they take old bodies but put new motors, etc into them)....yes I guess you could put new mb in 9900 but then have it run bb10....that makes sense ....but upgrading os 8 is like going from windows xp to vista.....move on everyone....join the 21st century....it was the inability of bb to see that future that hurt the company in the first place....lets move forward....living in the past is a total waste of time....nice memories but that's it.....
    eduzojordan and jas1978 like this.
    04-26-15 10:32 AM
  6. eduzojordan's Avatar
    "It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best MANAGE CHANGE." BlackBerry took too long to react/adapt to changes on mobile paradigm (all-touch devices have the biggest market share for a reason) and you want them to go backwards? I think it'is time for "loyal" BlackBerry users to move forward instead...adapt.
    jas1978 and Blacklatino like this.
    04-26-15 11:04 AM
  7. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    OP

    All or very nearly all of the people that understand the BBOS furball are gone.
    RIM chose a new platform because the old one had severe limitations.

    On top of that, one of the problems that most software teams face is that the kludges made to ship this time make it progressively harder to ship next time.

    So you would have to recruit a whole new team that doesn't know where the radioactive bits are buried to turn OS7 into OS8.
    This team(if you can get them) is going to be a bit older and wiser so they won't work themselves to death for free pizza and go-cart excursions.
    Your idea is spectacularly bad.
    How bad? Like borrowing from a loan shark to pay off your credit card bad.
    Last edited by DrBoomBotz; 04-26-15 at 02:41 PM.
    04-26-15 01:07 PM
  8. Mr4aces's Avatar
    I'm only a bb10 user, so less familiar with the legacy stuff. But my understanding is that BIS will die sooner rather than later. Why does a subscriber want to be tied to a BlackBerry only plan, when other devices can just use any old one. Cheaper the better.
    Obviously things may be a little different in markets where the telco infrastructure is not yet fully developed and where things like data compression are still useful. But what is BIS really offering a subscriber other than cost and a proprietary tie in?
    (I don't know).
    BIS was forced upon the carriers when RIM was at the height of RIM's Empire. Apparently the contract had no expiration as long as the user had a Legacy device registered with the carrier.

    As these devices are replaced with other devices the SAF or BIS frees are no longer paid to BlackBerry. In the last quarter that was $300 million showing a drop of 15% from the previous quarter. Meaning the quarter before was $352 million. They write the report in quarter to give it a average financial status. No telling what the tending is, I would assume each month being worst.

    Also don't know if any of the BIS fees were renegotiated to win the carriers back.

    It is very hard to replace $50 million profit. (assuming little or no cost) Maybe $200-250M+?? That's a lot of phones and other revenue.

    From CB By Chris Umiastowski

    http://crackberry.com/blackberry-cas...tware-business

    The consistent drop in SAF (service) revenue is an interesting problem for BlackBerry, because they have to do their best to offset this drop with growth in hardware (BB10) and software (BES licensing, BBM features, etc) revenue. This quarter service revenue was about $310 million or 47% of total revenue for the company. It's expected to drop about 15% per quarter going forward, so after another year we're talking about another halving of this number. Roughly speaking they expect to lose on the order of $600 million per year in service revenue over the next year.



    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 04-26-15 at 01:43 PM.
    04-26-15 01:14 PM
  9. Mr4aces's Avatar
    I guess 47% of the total revenue is a brain fart?

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 01:44 PM
  10. slagman5's Avatar
    Allowing for BBOS apps to run on the phone, even if through a runtime like the Android runtime would be a neat idea on its own in my opinion. And now that we have the Classic with the toolbar, implementing a UI similar to BBOS to help the transition would be nice. The only problem is that things like BIS and push email cannot be brought through, but I'm sure it'll bring a lot of legacy users on board.

    Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10
    Mr4aces likes this.
    04-26-15 02:55 PM
  11. Mr4aces's Avatar
    Allowing for BBOS apps to run on the phone, even if through a runtime like the Android runtime would be a neat idea on its own in my opinion. And now that we have the Classic with the toolbar, implementing a UI similar to BBOS to help the transition would be nice. The only problem is that things like BIS and push email cannot be brought through, but I'm sure it'll bring a lot of legacy users on board.

    Posted without the aid of AutoCorrect with my physical keyboard via CB10
    Good point. So the email/SMM/MMS accounts would have to be set up the same as BB10? or would they just make an exception and just give the BIS free since it is a BB10 device?

    If you were a carrier paying out SAF for Legacy devices I would think they tell the sales people to push the Classic. Maybe a trade in?

    I think that this should be limited to 2 years then phase out the OS8 because the Classic is a BB10 device. Don't know

    Think about it, less migration to other platforms and increase in gross revenue from sales of new and less returns from unhappy Legacy customers.
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 04-26-15 at 03:57 PM.
    04-26-15 03:45 PM
  12. bobshine's Avatar
    OK do you have a way to use a similar OS that would transition Legacy users?

    What is the maximum memory Java will run on?

    So maybe the cost to rewrite the OS would be prohibitive.

    And maybe the replacement mother board would work. With the max CPU java will handle.

    I don't know. Just stroming

    Posted via CB10
    Yeah it's called BlackBerry 10. They are slowly bringing back more and more of the BBOS features.

    I had been here since 10.0 and I can assure you that lots of them are back.


    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 05:57 PM
  13. bobshine's Avatar
    Agree. Misinformed.
    OK it is still possible to learn Java... but tell me, if you learn Java, what are your job prospects?

    Who would learn Java nowadays? My brother learnt Java and it was a pain

    If BlackBerry decide to work on BBOS, who program for it? Where are they gonna find programmers? Where would the apps come from? All in house?

    Even if they get developers to program in Java, all apps had to be installed in RAM? How would that work nowadays? The cost of a device with that much RAM would be exorbitant.

    Memory leaks? Remember that? It's was just a normal occurrence in Java.

    Java wasn't designed for sophisticated use, but rather small, self contained software.

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 06:06 PM
  14. Mr4aces's Avatar
    Yeah it's called BlackBerry 10. They are slowly bringing back more and more of the BBOS features.

    I had been here since 10.0 and I can assure you that lots of them are back.


    Posted via CB10
    You are dedicated being on BB10.0 at start up.

    People are coming back, but only a small percentage compared to the ones that left Or have not switched to BB10.


    Posted via CB10
    Frehley likes this.
    04-26-15 06:09 PM
  15. Frehley's Avatar
    There are a lot of features from BBOS7 that still are not available on BB10, the one I miss most is how to handle notifications while the device is holstered.

    But the thing that I miss the most since moving on to the Classic and BB10 is BIS! Data compression!

    Even though we are still loyal and using a BlackBerry device, all data usage is just like any other mobile device.

    I would pay a small ($5/month) fee to have BIS back.
    Mr4aces likes this.
    04-26-15 06:27 PM
  16. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    There are a lot of features from BBOS7 that still are not available on BB10, the one I miss most is how to handle notifications while the device is holstered.

    But the thing that I miss the most since moving on to the Classic and BB10 is BIS! Data compression!

    Even though we are still loyal and using a BlackBerry device, all data usage is just like any other mobile device.

    I would pay a small ($5/month) fee to have BIS back.
    Why do you want BIS?
    Is your data connection slow or expensive?
    Just curious.
    04-26-15 06:31 PM
  17. Mr4aces's Avatar
    There are a lot of features from BBOS7 that still are not available on BB10, the one I miss most is how to handle notifications while the device is holstered.

    But the thing that I miss the most since moving on to the Classic and BB10 is BIS! Data compression!

    Even though we are still loyal and using a BlackBerry device, all data usage is just like any other mobile device.

    I would pay a small ($5/month) fee to have BIS back.
    Is there is little or no coast for BIS? The server should be already written off?

    So what do you think would help Legacy users transition to BB10? Maybe BlackBerry jsut some key features that would make 10 look or act like 7?

    I think the tutorial could be improved upon. Maybe have tips pop up everyday. "Tip of the day" that could be turned off for experienced users.



    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 06:41 PM
  18. bobshine's Avatar
    Also remember that the phone had to be rebooted each time you you install an application? That was also inherent to BBOS and Java.

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 06:45 PM
  19. kbz1960's Avatar
    OK it is still possible to learn Java... but tell me, if you learn Java, what are your job prospects?

    Who would learn Java nowadays? My brother learnt Java and it was a pain

    If BlackBerry decide to work on BBOS, who program for it? Where are they gonna find programmers? Where would the apps come from? All in house?

    Even if they get developers to program in Java, all apps had to be installed in RAM? How would that work nowadays? The cost of a device with that much RAM would be exorbitant.

    Memory leaks? Remember that? It's was just a normal occurrence in Java.

    Java wasn't designed for sophisticated use, but rather small, self contained software.

    Posted via CB10
    Bob. I think you're confusing Java the programming language with BlackBerry's java OS. I agree BlackBerry's java OS was a dead end.
    04-26-15 06:48 PM
  20. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    OK it is still possible to learn Java... but tell me, if you learn Java, what are your job prospects?

    Who would learn Java nowadays? My brother learnt Java and it was a pain

    If BlackBerry decide to work on BBOS, who program for it? Where are they gonna find programmers? Where would the apps come from? All in house?

    Even if they get developers to program in Java, all apps had to be installed in RAM? How would that work nowadays? The cost of a device with that much RAM would be exorbitant.

    Memory leaks? Remember that? It's was just a normal occurrence in Java.

    Java wasn't designed for sophisticated use, but rather small, self contained software.

    Posted via CB10
    I am sure Java is still being taught in lots of schools, industry popularity is not usually their primary criteria for selection.
    Still getting competent people to fix and extend a legacy OS written in Java is going to be challenging.
    Especially when the company is Blackberry.
    Reminds me of the mid 90's when IBM had to pay through the nose to get back all the COBOL programmers that they had axed in the 80's.
    Not sure where the new 3rd party apps are going to come from.

    "apps installed in RAM" not sure what you are talking about.
    As for memory leaks Java has garbage collection so I can only guess you are talking about something specific to BBOS.

    Java can and is used for very large projects.
    However it has not been a popular choice for OS development.
    04-26-15 06:50 PM
  21. Mr4aces's Avatar
    Also remember that the phone had to be rebooted each time you you install an application? That was also inherent to BBOS and Java.

    Posted via CB10
    Rebooth to set up the new software is common software

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 06:56 PM
  22. bobshine's Avatar
    Rebooth to set up the new software is common software

    Posted via CB10
    I'm talking about reboot after installing an app. That was always an issue with BBOS

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 07:02 PM
  23. Mr4aces's Avatar
    @DrBoomBotz

    Thank you enlightening.

    What do think would be the easiest way to help Legency users to transition to BB10?

    It's a given there is no way to make everybody happy.

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 07:04 PM
  24. bobshine's Avatar
    Bob. I think you're confusing Java the programming language with BlackBerry's java OS. I agree BlackBerry's java OS was a dead end.
    No, even BBOS had the same characteristics.

    The reason why BlackBerry used Java was that it evolved Java based dumb phones into a smartphone.

    Dumb phone used java cause it was small and self contained. But it was never intended to run complex smartphones.

    Posted via CB10
    04-26-15 07:04 PM
  25. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    @DrBoomBotz

    Thank you enlightening.

    What do think would be the easiest way to help Legency users to transition to BB10?

    It's a given there is no way to make everybody happy.

    Posted via CB10
    As others have said, make a BBOS runtime similar to the android runtime for BBOS applications.
    It might be the easiest solution but it will still be very hard and very expensive.
    04-26-15 07:09 PM
82 1234

Similar Threads

  1. How do I flash a bricked Blackberry Q10 OS With .BAR Files?
    By CrackBerry Question in forum Ask a Question
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 04-27-15, 08:34 AM
  2. BlackBerry Classic Calendar
    By ArjunC in forum Ask a Question
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-26-15, 07:08 AM
  3. When will be viber available on blackberry classic??
    By aakdanish in forum Ask a Question
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-26-15, 03:38 AM
  4. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 04-25-15, 11:40 PM
  5. What is the best podcast app for BlackBerry Classic?
    By CrackBerry Question in forum BlackBerry Motion
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-25-15, 10:22 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD