04-07-15 09:47 AM
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  1. AllanQuatermain's Avatar
    The Classic was supposed to lure 9900 owners to BB10, reading various posts Classic appears to be not quiet there and no curved keyboard and fixed battery, Blackberry could make another limited run of 9900's if the last ones sold well, or make a Classic 2, it's up to Blackberry to provide what customers want.
    03-08-15 08:01 AM
  2. dmsbang's Avatar
    Palms are returning...http://www.phonearena.com/news/Palm-...ficial_id64480

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    03-08-15 09:19 AM
  3. BbClassic's Avatar
    ITA. I felt really bad about retiring my Bold. It's been a great device and I would be happily using it now but I just got the Classic and will have to learn it and deal with the sucky calendar feature and so on and hope BB gets it fixed at some pt.
    03-08-15 09:51 AM
  4. anon(8063781)'s Avatar
    Also, for anyone who just assumes that the market will offer a physical keyboard even if BB eventually goes away - think again. I thought about it carefully and realized that the amount of work it takes to create a physical keyboard for Android or iPhone is pretty immense. as they basically have to "retrofit" their OS to a physical keyboard device with a toolbelt. That takes a LOT of work, given that no OS (including BB10) was designed for a physical keyboard + toolbelt.
    It's actually not that much work.

    To begin with, both android and iOS are built to use with bluetooth keyboards. I had one of those bluetooth slider cases for my work issued iPhone and it worked perfectly. They even added the home button to the keyboard. The feel of the keyboard was awful though -- really low quality.

    Similar android examples abound:

    • the slider keyboards were available for Samsung Galaxy S4s as well



    • I have an android TV stick that works very nicely with a little keyboard remote.



    • my android tablet works with a USB keyboard



    Last year, a Chinese company produced a Q10 knockoff. I'm sure that company had limited resources, and yet it looked like they did a reasonable job of it.

    I'm sure someone will argue that the marriage of a physical keyboard with android or iOS would be an unholy mess of physical keyboard and touchscreen interaction, but don't even go there. Think about it first....
    03-08-15 10:41 AM
  5. kobnyc's Avatar
    9900/30 efficiency Vs. BB10 phones like the Classic is a myth. It's all in the user's head. I've used them all in both business and personal environments and BB10 is the way to go.

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    Totally agree. BB10 way outshines OS7 in functionality and performance. No comparison. It's different, yes, and if you're not going to learn it, then keep whining. God bless.

    Posted via CB10
    MarsupilamiX likes this.
    03-08-15 11:34 AM
  6. John Crist's Avatar
    The point should be to learn how to effectively use BB10 before saying it's not efficient. I can't believe there are people still hung on their archaic devices. To each their own. BB10 is the place to be for mobile computing now. Case closed.

    And there will always be physical keyboard phones available. Just wait til the Samsung BlackBerry phones come out...

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    I've been using BB10 since the launch of the Z10. I've had plenty of time to observe and learn how to effectively and efficiently use BB10. I was a Day 1 owner of the Classic.

    Ended up boxing the Classic after a month of use, and I gave it an honest to goodness fair try. Ended up going back to my Z30, and now back to a 9900.

    BB10 is very feature rich, yes. It's the next step for BlackBerry, yes. It is far from matching the speed and agility that is OS7. OS7 represented the pinnacle of mastery of what it was designed to do: be a top of the line communications system. BB10 represents a modernization, and today mobile OS's are about doing everything. Sadly, NONE of them do any one thing well. Jack of all trades, master of none. BB10 falls into that camp.

    It isn't up to me to blindly devote myself to a brand because it's a brand. It's up to the brand to produce something I would want to use. You, nor anyone else, can be the judge of what people want to use. That's up to the individual user.

    You like BB10. Great. I like OS7. Neither of us are wrong, but in calling OS7 users out, you certainly aren't right.
    03-08-15 11:39 AM
  7. Loc22's Avatar
    I've been using BB10 since the launch of the Z10. I've had plenty of time to observe and learn how to effectively and efficiently use BB10. I was a Day 1 owner of the Classic.

    Ended up boxing the Classic after a month of use, and I gave it an honest to goodness fair try. Ended up going back to my Z30, and now back to a 9900.

    BB10 is very feature rich, yes. It's the next step for BlackBerry, yes. It is far from matching the speed and agility that is OS7. OS7 represented the pinnacle of mastery of what it was designed to do: be a top of the line communications system. BB10 represents a modernization, and today mobile OS's are about doing everything. Sadly, NONE of them do any one thing well. Jack of all trades, master of none. BB10 falls into that camp.

    It isn't up to me to blindly devote myself to a brand because it's a brand. It's up to the brand to produce something I would want to use. You, nor anyone else, can be the judge of what people want to use. That's up to the individual user.

    You like BB10. Great. I like OS7. Neither of us are wrong, but in calling OS7 users out, you certainly aren't right.
    Great that you have tried & hated the BlackBerry 10 & that you are now back to your 9900. Hope you enjoy it coz that's the last one.

    It's no longer in production, when your 9900 dies on you then you will have to change. Remember nothing is constant except change.

    Posted via CB10
    03-08-15 12:57 PM
  8. andy957's Avatar
    My first smartphone was a Handspring, I love the calendar there. Until now nobody has produced another device that has the same efficiency as the handspring. Not Apple, not BlackBerry & certainly not Android nor Windows.

    I'm still sticking to the BlackBerry as it is still the most bearable calendar available.

    Posted via CB10
    Ah the Handspring! It was a beauty for its time.

    Posted via CB10
    03-08-15 01:08 PM
  9. John Crist's Avatar
    Great that you have tried & hated the BlackBerry 10 & that you are now back to your 9900. Hope you enjoy it coz that's the last one.

    It's no longer in production, when your 9900 dies on you then you will have to change. Remember nothing is constant except change.

    Posted via CB10
    ...Did I say I hated BB10? I don't hate BB10. It just doesn't do the things I need it to do as efficiently as BBOS7 does them, in my opinion.

    I do enjoy my 9900. I'm not ignorant, I'm very aware it's the last of it's kind and that no further production of BBOS devices will occur. I don't see why you feel the need to remind me of something everyone is very aware of, except to rub in my face that I'm some old fart making a decision that you in your opinion is a poor one. Fortunately for me, my 9900 is brand spanking new -- Not refurbished and not used. I'll get a good 5 years of life out of it easily, assuming proper care and assuming BIS isn't shut down by then. Considering the size of the market that still carries BBOS devices for corporate, enterprise, and government use, I don't see that happening. Hopefully sometime between now and then a Classic refresh will occur offering me the things I need in my daily driver. Hopefully the toolbelt won't feel like a bolt on, either, as opposed to a bottom up essential part of the device.
    03-08-15 01:30 PM
  10. aluiziomachado's Avatar
    We do not have to get used to something that is not so good just because we are an enthusiath of it and want them to continue. This is ridiculous. If they are not able to do something that really satisfies the consumers than the consumers obviously will change the platform. If there isnt any good replacement for 9900, than one option is to give up from blackberry when they retire the 9900. It is not our mission to save the company giving them our money until they find out a solution.
    03-08-15 02:19 PM
  11. jeremyr4's Avatar
    It's actually not that much work.
    I very much disagree. While it's clearly not that much work to integrate a physical keyboard into an already-existing touchscreen OS, integrating a keyboard AND a toolbelt is a whole different story, which is why is took so long for BB to release the Classic AND which is why, despite all of the time that BB took to try to get the Classic right with the toolbelt, it's not quite there yet (this is one of the reasons why many 9900 users are going back to their phone).

    This is why I am concerned about BB going away. If there aren't enough 9900 users that upgrade to the Classic then BB will stop being a hardware manufacturer and at the moment NO ONE seems to be wanting to create physical keyboard devices. The longer everyone else makes touchscreen only phones the more likely it is that no one will ever produce a physical keyboard phone, except for BB, as Samsung, Apple, LG, HTC, etc users will have become accustomed to touchscreen use. As time goes on it's a bigger and bigger risk for anyone else to release a physical keyboard phone.

    It's BB is nothing as far as I'm concerned and that's why it's critical that 9900 users upgrade to the Classic even if they think it's less efficient (and I happen to agree with them)!!
    andy957 and Loc22 like this.
    03-08-15 02:39 PM
  12. jeremyr4's Avatar
    Palms are returning...Palm returns as TCL makes purchase official

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    Thanks for pointing this out. While I would LOVE for there to be a second physical keyboard manufacturer out there, I'm guessing they won't last very long if they don't have US carrier support. That's going to be a huge challenge for them. I certainly hope it works out but I'm not holding my breath (unfortunately)...
    03-08-15 02:43 PM
  13. anon(8063781)'s Avatar
    I very much disagree. While it's clearly not that much work to integrate a physical keyboard into an already-existing touchscreen OS, integrating a keyboard AND a toolbelt is a whole different story, which is why is took so long for BB to release the Classic AND which is why, despite all of the time that BB took to try to get the Classic right with the toolbelt, it's not quite there yet (this is one of the reasons why many 9900 users are going back to their phone).

    This is why I am concerned about BB going away. If there aren't enough 9900 users that upgrade to the Classic then BB will stop being a hardware manufacturer and at the moment NO ONE seems to be wanting to create physical keyboard devices. The longer everyone else makes touchscreen only phones the more likely it is that no one will ever produce a physical keyboard phone, except for BB, as Samsung, Apple, LG, HTC, etc users will have become accustomed to touchscreen use. As time goes on it's a bigger and bigger risk for anyone else to release a physical keyboard phone.

    It's BB is nothing as far as I'm concerned and that's why it's critical that 9900 users upgrade to the Classic even if they think it's less efficient (and I happen to agree with them)!!
    Well, to add a little more to this discussion, there is pointer/trackpad support in android.

    I think it took BlackBerry considerable time to adapt OS10 because they laid everyone off.

    As to the likelihood of anyone else actually making a physical keyboard phone, I can't say. There's always kickstarter...

    Sent from my Q10 using Tapatalk 2
    03-08-15 04:10 PM
  14. John Crist's Avatar
    It's BB is nothing as far as I'm concerned and that's why it's critical that 9900 users upgrade to the Classic even if they think it's less efficient (and I happen to agree with them)!!
    There's that little voice in the back of my head that can't help but ask, who are you to dictate to us how we spend our money?

    If BlackBerry folded tomorrow, it's BlackBerry's fault. Not ours. When they produce a BB10 device I want to use, I'll buy it. Otherwise, I won't. I most certainly won't just because some anonymous person on an enthusiast forum asked me to. Doesn't matter how much you believe in what you're saying.
    WES51 likes this.
    03-08-15 04:17 PM
  15. dmsbang's Avatar
    Problem on here is everyone is an "Expert" these days with the power to voice their "Expertise" via Internet forums. Instead, why don't we all just be who we truly should be...fans and customers?

    You know how many old school Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles fans bashed the new movie and didn't even give it a chance? Well, it's grossed nearly $600 million dollars Worldwide with box office and DVD/BluRay sales combined.

    BB10 is NOW!

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    BB_Junky likes this.
    03-08-15 04:35 PM
  16. diehardbbuser's Avatar
    Office is a prime example of change without advance. All they've done since the 90s is screw up my keyboard shortcuts and move the menus to the ribbon which was kind of a lateral move in my opinion. It's just a different UI, but not better or worse.

    I think many of the changes in BB10 really are less efficient, which is too bad, since QNX is a rock solid base for an OS. They really did throw out the baby with the bathwater. So much from BBOS could have been integrated into BB10 without a detrimental effect on the new, more touch-centric approach.

    Sent from my Q10 using Tapatalk 2
    Agreed, 2007 was as good as it got with office, updates are just for corporations to fork out for new licenses for 99% of users. I actually prefer it to the latest generation, much easier to navigate. Just like os7 vs bb10. It's a shame corporations have to do that to try convince others to spend money on something again without real enhancements or innovations. At least apple introduce stuff like fingerprint and a broadly accepted pay solution etc. and keep core the same as not to complicates matter for no reason. It's so easy to go between iPhone 1, iPhone 6, ipad 1 to mini to whatever latest ipad is out to all the pods.. They get it right (like bbos) and just keep it current vs destroying it releasing something all new which isn't better, just more stable backend and oh.. A bigger screen but bbos had large screen touch devices years ago...

    And 10.3.1 calendar.... How anyone thought that was a good idea should be fired and every coder involved in it should be banned from every stepping foot in bb offices. Chen should be ashamed he allowed it's release.
    03-08-15 05:02 PM
  17. John Crist's Avatar
    BB10 is NOW!
    Sweet. BBOS7 was THEN! What's your point?

    You know how many old school Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles fans blah blah rant
    Do you know how many BBOS7 users gave BB10 a try and dismissed it? Do you know how many gave it a try since release and still dismiss it? I'm one of them.

    When BB10 can do what I need to do AS EFFICIENTLY as BBOS7 can, I'll make the transition permanently. I don't care if it takes different steps, or if it 'looks' different. I should be able to accomplish the same tasks in the same amount of time, and there's still a lot BB10 needs to do to get there. It's closer than it's ever been, but there's still a long road ahead.

    And for God's sake, unify and standardize the UI... I find so many menus in so many weird places across the core OS. It'd be great if menus were in the same place every time, kinda like... Oh, I dunno... BBOS7.
    nah.uhh, diehardbbuser and WES51 like this.
    03-08-15 05:30 PM
  18. dmsbang's Avatar
    I admit, I DID love the Bold 9930 I HAD...and the Classic is closest to it. I love the overall speed of BB10 though and could never go back.

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    anon(8063781) likes this.
    03-08-15 07:23 PM
  19. jeremyr4's Avatar
    John Crist,

    I think you're missing my point (I'm the OP). I actually don't think BB10 is better than OS7 and I'm not trying to tell anyone what they need to buy. I'm making the point that if you and the other 9900 users don't support BB even though the Classic is clearly less efficient than the 9900 in some ways (and perhaps overall) then there might be a next version with the improvements that you and the other 9900 users want. You and the other 9900 users who have reverted back to their 9900s are essentially making the decision that you would rather use your 9900 for a couple more years and then have a choice of NO physical keyboard devices in the future. Because if all of the 9900 users go back to their 9900s and don't adopt the Classic then that will likely be the end result. So, as a die hard physical keyboard user, I'm pleading to you and the other 9900s users to think twice before returning your Classics. Like it or not, BB is offering an inferior product to the 9900 in many ways BUT they're the only game left in town. And I, for one, don't want them to stop producing hardware in the future because they are my only choice... You can argue that BB should have made a better product to attract you and the other 9900 users and, frankly, I don't disagree. But ignoring the fact that BB is our only and last hope doesn't bode well for anyone in the long run (at least for those who want to be able to buy physical keyboard phones in the future).

    I hope that all makes sense...
    andy957 and EAFD like this.
    03-08-15 11:08 PM
  20. dmsbang's Avatar
    At some point, BlackBerry needs to end this madness and shut down all support to legacy devices and make it BB10 or nothing. It's such a great OS and the few things it may lack Vs. a 9900, it more than makes up for with everything else. If only they never released BBOS7 and had BB10 ready back in 2011...But oh well...

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    BB_Junky and MarsupilamiX like this.
    03-08-15 11:43 PM
  21. John Crist's Avatar
    At some point, BlackBerry needs to end this madness and shut down all support to legacy devices and make it BB10 or nothing. It's such a great OS and the few things it may lack Vs. a 9900, it more than makes up for with everything else. If only they never released BBOS7 and had BB10 ready back in 2011...But oh well...

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    That's kind of the thing. As you said, there are things it lacks. For those "clingers" it isn't about all the other fluff. Generally we couldn't give two poops less about all the other stuff. Those things don't make up for what it lacks at all. That's like saying, you have a nice luxury car with all these bells and whistles, but they put a two stroke motor in it. I couldn't give a **** less about free Sirius radio for life and awesome cameras everyone on the vehicle if I can't even go 25mph down the road.

    Posted via CB10
    03-09-15 01:45 AM
  22. Adam Rees's Avatar
    That's kind of the thing. As you said, there are things it lacks. For those "clingers" it isn't about all the other fluff. Generally we couldn't give two poops less about all the other stuff. Those things don't make up for what it lacks at all. That's like saying, you have a nice luxury car with all these bells and whistles, but they put a two stroke motor in it. I couldn't give a **** less about free Sirius radio for life and awesome cameras everyone on the vehicle if I can't even go 25mph down the road.

    Posted via CB10
    John your opinion is your opinion, we get that!! So here i'll put it simply for you. IF you have only two options, which would you choose?

    1. Selling the Classic and going back to 9900 because of the little bit better efficiency it has, this is not just you, but a lot of legacy users. This in turn will mean that BlackBerry will not be able to make further phones or tweak OS10 to become as efficient as OS7 because the company will die off.

    2. Bite the bullet and buy a classic, sure it may not be as efficient right now as OS7, BUT it could become better with every update. This will effectively save BlackBerry from not closing it's doors on developing these beautiful devices and you may be helping to create the upgrade you and most OS7 users are craving.

    BB10 is the future whether you like it or not, OS7 is the past, being stubborn and not moving onto current devices because of milliseconds of extra efficacy is going to put the company who made that phone you love (9900) in the grave. By the time your 9900 dies, Blackberry will be in the grave along side it.


    Posted via CB10
    mike350 and BB_Junky like this.
    03-09-15 03:23 AM
  23. redlightblinking's Avatar
    BB10 is the future whether you like it or not, OS7 is the past, being stubborn and not moving onto current devices because of milliseconds of extra efficacy is going to put the company who made that phone you love (9900) in the grave. By the time your 9900 dies, Blackberry will be in the grave along side it.


    Posted via CB10
    For a user of a phone, they don't give a rats **** about what some other people say is "the future" or "the past". They only care what works.

    It's not a case of "milliseconds", it's a case of actual full....multiple...seconds. Each and every time. Multiple times a day. Some people may have all the time in the world to wait for their phone to catch up after doing some cute animation they've seen 18 billion times, and some may not. Some may be willing to accept 2-3 actions to do something that used to take just 1, and some people may not.

    Choosing a 9900 instead of a Classic isn't going to necessarily going put the company "in the grave". If that happens, it would be due to a variety of failures, not just failing to convert customers that don't need converting.....they just need a phone that works for them.

    Finally, why do users have to accept some inferior product or experience simply on the hopes that someday later BB might get their act together and fix it? If BB fails because the Classic doesn't do the job the 9900 does....that's BlackBerry's fault. Until then, many people will have a row of stand-by 9900's on their desk like Kim Kardashian. The very fact that people behave this way should be a wake up call for the engineers and managers at BlackBerry who seem completely disconnected from what made BB so successful to begin with.
    03-09-15 09:45 AM
  24. lmcteo's Avatar
    why should one have to go out of his way to like something for the sake of bb's existence? if it doesn't work for him, why should bb's future even matter at all? sorry, it just doesn't make any sense.

    Posted via CB10
    03-09-15 10:36 AM
  25. diehardbbuser's Avatar
    At some point, BlackBerry needs to end this madness and shut down all support to legacy devices and make it BB10 or nothing. It's such a great OS and the few things it may lack Vs. a 9900, it more than makes up for with everything else. If only they never released BBOS7 and had BB10 ready back in 2011...But oh well...

    Posted via Ocarina the Classic
    They'd still be in the same boat, the simple fact is bb10 isn't what bb users by the masses wanted and now it's a fringe operating system because they went completely a different way then what built the company and brought about such a large user base.

    I know tones of people pissed about the playbook mess and bb10 not being supported and left just cause of that.

    The people spoke and they didn't like the z10, didn't like the bb10 os, too long to launch q and didn't like no available replacement for the bold directly ... Simply put, the masses didn't like bb10... Too gimmicky and z10 was a poor effort..

    Not user-bases fault we don't like bb10 as much as bbos... It just is fact and number don't lie. Apple, android get it and don't mess up by alienating its user base by changing things that drastically and expect people just to accept it. No one disagrees that the battery pulls, slightly unstable os, bb19 should have been just a backend fix and not affect the look, usability features...

    People need to stop bullying bbos people like bb did and just accept it for what it is... If bb ever Launch a proper bb10 os, a worthy device and passport was close but to wide, a smaller classic with flagship specs and good slider... Maybe .. People will come back.. There's a huge base who don't want large devices.. The classic is too largeish for many..

    I've had my q for what seems ever now and still don't like a lot of things and I never complained about bbos except for the lack of apps and battery pulls... That said, why don't I jump to another os is simply I hate android and apple doesn't offer a keyboard and I don't like how email functions on it... So no option. I hate windows tiles both desktop and on mobile so not an option either so I'm with blackberry not by choice but by default... Want keyboard.. Don't like android or windows mobile ... And from others I know it's the same reasoning. It's not great but other options or worse.. Not exactly a great way to build brand loyality when we loved our bbos bolds...
    Last edited by diehardbbuser; 03-09-15 at 11:16 AM.
    03-09-15 10:40 AM
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