09-11-11 12:10 PM
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  1. sleepngbear's Avatar
    I think I'm going to get the 9900 as soon as I'm able and then quit CrackBerry. With all the ******** that's already going on and the damn thing is still months away, the last thing I'm going to need is to see even more of it after I've bought one. Good christ will you people ever lighten up, especially those of you who have absolutely no clue of what different types of memory are or how the BB OS uses them.
    05-07-11 05:05 PM
  2. sleepngbear's Avatar
    I don't think that is correct. On-board memory is NOT the same as removable memory.

    The Bold 9000 had 1GB on-board memory for media storage, and I believe the 9900/9930 has the same... only more

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Good point for comparison. Where the 9000 had 1gb of internal storage, the 9900/9930 will have 8gb. The 9000 had 256 mb of app memory (Torch and some newer Bolds have 512 mb), 9900/9930 will have 768 mb. I'm not sure what the max mem card size was on the 9000, but the 9900/9800 will go up to 32gb.

    If you've got a device with 512 mb of app memory and have used it all up, you'll be glad for the extra 256. If you haven't yet used it up (and I've yet to see or hear from anyone who has), then 768 mb will most likely be more than you'll need.
    05-07-11 05:14 PM
  3. mechanic_joe's Avatar
    I think I'm going to get the 9900 as soon as I'm able and then quit CrackBerry. With all the ******** that's already going on and the damn thing is still months away, the last thing I'm going to need is to see even more of it after I've bought one. Good christ will you people ever lighten up, especially those of you who have absolutely no clue of what different types of memory are or how the BB OS uses them.
    Thanks for your opinion
    05-07-11 05:50 PM
  4. Pearl9100's Avatar
    im not a huge app user. 200mb is fine for me. at most, ill have 10mb of apps. google maps, google phone, and thats about it. works for me
    05-07-11 08:13 PM
  5. phonegeek#AC's Avatar
    Ok so forgive me folks but I believe this to be an interim device that is laying the ground work for next years devices that will be based on qnx. Getting more memory on the devices, testing battery life, faster processors, etc.

    This will all be necessary with the next round of devices but it is such a large leap that RIM really needs to get some of the architecture worked out and in peoples hands so they'll really know how it does in real world conditions.


    PG
    05-07-11 08:27 PM
  6. Pearl9100's Avatar
    Ok so forgive me folks but I believe this to be an interim device that is laying the ground work for next years devices that will be based on qnx. Getting more memory on the devices, testing battery life, faster processors, etc.

    This will all be necessary with the next round of devices but it is such a large leap that RIM really needs to get some of the architecture worked out and in peoples hands so they'll really know how it does in real world conditions.


    PG
    agreed. but that doesnt mean that the 9900 wont be a great device.

    with all these delays happening, it might be another full year (totaling 2 yrs) before qnx comes out. we know how progressive rim is.
    05-07-11 09:09 PM
  7. phonegeek#AC's Avatar
    I wholeheartedly agree and was not meaning to suggest that this won't be a great device because I believe it will.

    As for the delays I think with Playbook out qnx development will move at much faster pace and hopefully will bring us devices sooner rather than later.


    PG
    05-07-11 09:18 PM
  8. chunt69's Avatar
    I think I'm going to get the 9900 as soon as I'm able and then quit CrackBerry. With all the ******** that's already going on and the damn thing is still months away, the last thing I'm going to need is to see even more of it after I've bought one. Good christ will you people ever lighten up, especially those of you who have absolutely no clue of what different types of memory are or how the BB OS uses them.
    Why not clear the matter up for us then? I for one don't want to ***** but find it very confusing that it is billed as having 8GB of onbaord storage but cannot use this all for apps and o/s.
    My 9700 has 256mb of onboard storage- all of which is available for the o/s and appss.
    Why can only 768 of the 8gb on the 9900 be used in this manner? Very confusing.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-08-11 04:02 AM
  9. Bob G's Avatar
    insufficient memory again?
    Exactly!

    I've had the same problem with the 8830, 8310, and 9700. I end up deleting core apps and rebooting regularly just to keep the BB functioning. With the tiny amount of memory in combination with the terrible memory leaks (especially on 9700/OS6) it is safe to say that a lack of memory is a chronic problem. Worse yet, RIM refuses to learn their lesson.

    200 MB free sounds good now, but if history is any guide, when the next OS update comes out, you'll have to shrink the OS just to fit a few aftermarket apps, and forego apps that you really want for lack of memory. Still, the OS will delete your calendar events and your e-mail to make room for the leaked memory.

    I am very excited about the form factor and the features of the Bold Touch, but this memory shortage may be a deal-breaker.
    mechanic_joe likes this.
    05-08-11 04:06 PM
  10. Phill_UK's Avatar
    Why not clear the matter up for us then? I for one don't want to ***** but find it very confusing that it is billed as having 8GB of onbaord storage but cannot use this all for apps and o/s.
    My 9700 has 256mb of onboard storage- all of which is available for the o/s and appss.
    Why can only 768 of the 8gb on the 9900 be used in this manner? Very confusing.
    Read the rest of the thread, as this has already been explained.

    Your 9700 does NOT have 256mb on-board memory, it has 32mb.
    The OS and apps are stored in the 256mb of Application Memory.

    On-board (or Device Memory) and RAM (or Application Memory) are different and separate.

    The 9900 has 768mb of Application Memory for the OS and apps, which is MORE than enough space.
    The 8gb Device Memory is for on-board media storage, in addition to an external memory card.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-08-11 04:23 PM
  11. mechanic_joe's Avatar
    Read the rest of the thread, as this has already been explained.

    Your 9700 does NOT have 256mb on-board memory, it has 32mb.
    The OS and apps are stored in the 256mb of Application Memory.

    On-board (or Device Memory) and RAM (or Application Memory) are different and separate.

    The 9900 has 768mb of Application Memory for the OS and apps, which is MORE than enough space.
    The 8gb Device Memory is for on-board media storage, in addition to an external memory card.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    My 9700, with OS6 fully loaded (no shrink) and zero third party apps sits at about 60mb of free application space or so? (seems to vary a bit depending on the exact OS6 version I have installed).

    I agree with you Phil about the OS and apps being stored on the 9700's 256mb of application space, but BlackBerry isn't very clear on the RAM of older devices such as the 9700... some leaked documents show 256mb of RAM on top of the 256mb application space? It has never *really* been officially cleared up.

    So my argument is, BlackBerry is now saying the 9900 has 768mb of 'RAM' but they aren't being clear about the available application data space... The leaked photo shows 210mb? of free application space, so that makes OS7 558mb? (with all its sample videos, wallpaper, os related apps like the augmented reality browser, ect)

    So is 210mb of free application space enough in 2011? If I sign a new contract with my carrier and need to keep this device for 2 years will that carry me through? Apps are only going to get larger and better, not smaller... Will my device lag as the application data space fills up? My 9530, 9630, and 9700 have all shown considerable lag and sand clocking if I start to run low on device application memory (as this is probably grouped together somehow with the device's RAM?).

    I agree 8gigs of media memory is fantastic, but if I was worried about media memory (for my music, pictures, videos, ect) I would just buy a bigger memory card.
    05-08-11 05:12 PM
  12. Phill_UK's Avatar
    My 9700, with OS6 fully loaded (no shrink) and zero third party apps sits at about 60mb of free application space or so? (seems to vary a bit depending on the exact OS6 version I have installed).

    I agree with you Phil about the OS and apps being stored on the 9700's 256mb of application space, but BlackBerry isn't very clear on the RAM of older devices such as the 9700... some leaked documents show 256mb of RAM on top of the 256mb application space? It has never *really* been officially cleared up.

    So my argument is, BlackBerry is now saying the 9900 has 768mb of 'RAM' but they aren't being clear about the available application data space... The leaked photo shows 210mb? of free application space, so that makes OS7 558mb? (with all its sample videos, wallpaper, os related apps like the augmented reality browser, ect)

    So is 210mb of free application space enough in 2011? If I sign a new contract with my carrier and need to keep this device for 2 years will that carry me through? Apps are only going to get larger and better, not smaller... Will my device lag as the application data space fills up? My 9530, 9630, and 9700 have all shown considerable lag and sand clocking if I start to run low on device application memory (as this is probably grouped together somehow with the device's RAM?).

    I agree 8gigs of media memory is fantastic, but if I was worried about media memory (for my music, pictures, videos, ect) I would just buy a bigger memory card.
    Trying to compare your 9700 with the 9900 is not really valid. You have half the processing power, a third of the memory, and you're running an OS it was never designed to run.

    I can also guarantee that the 9700 has no more than 256mb RAM. Those 'leaked documents' are rubbish. If it had double the RAM, it would be a 9780... and that it is not

    As for your argument, I honestly don't know, and I really don't care. I've never had memory issues with any of my BlackBerries in the past, and I don't intend to in the future.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-08-11 07:10 PM
  13. Bob G's Avatar
    Trying to compare your 9700 with the 9900 is not really valid. You have half the processing power, a third of the memory, and you're running an OS it was never designed to run...
    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Therein lies the problem: The 9700 was not designed to run OS 6 (like the 8830 and 8310 weren't designed to run OS 4.5). History shows that OS updates take more memory and that third party apps become more numerous and contain more features, yet RIM repeatedly chooses to design devices with inadequate memory for projected growth beyond a few months.

    And they're doing it again with the 9900.

    I consider myself a pretty loyal BB user, but my iPhone and Android friends laugh at the fact that I need an aftermarket app just to automatically reboot my BlackBerry every day so that it won't delete my calendar and messages.
    mechanic_joe likes this.
    05-08-11 08:00 PM
  14. crackcookie's Avatar
    RIM never learns their lesson with memory, something always seems okay but its never future proofed so they can save a few nickels and dimes here. The playbook as the same thing going on,
    05-08-11 08:19 PM
  15. AllanRosen's Avatar
    I've never had memory issues with any of my BlackBerries in the past, and I don't intend to in the future.
    It's great that you haven't had memory problems and you should be congratulated. However, I have the 9700, have about 6 or 7 apps installed and run OS5. After a day or two I start getting the clock, and I have to reboot about twice a week to keep my 9700 running. While you may not have memory problems, many of us do.
    mechanic_joe likes this.
    05-08-11 08:27 PM
  16. Snipperdo17's Avatar
    It's great that you haven't had memory problems and you should be congratulated. However, I have the 9700, have about 6 or 7 apps installed and run OS5. After a day or two I start getting the clock, and I have to reboot about twice a week to keep my 9700 running. While you may not have memory problems, many of us do.
    While there are several people with memory issues, the majority of people do not have that issue. I have never had that problem either.

    As for the above post and your friends laughing at you, who cares. Its a phone. I don't get why its such a problem to go UP in memory. Most of the androids releasing still have 512mb. Sick of all the complaining on an unreleased phone.
    05-08-11 09:34 PM
  17. Bob G's Avatar
    While there are several people with memory issues, the majority of people do not have that issue. I have never had that problem either.

    As for the above post and your friends laughing at you, who cares. Its a phone. I don't get why its such a problem to go UP in memory. Most of the androids releasing still have 512mb. Sick of all the complaining on an unreleased phone.
    I care. Smartphones are expensive. And I consider it constructive feedback from a BB fan, rather than complaining. If RIM wants me to buy their next smartphone, then I need to be convinced that it is a better value than the competition.

    My understanding is that you can run apps from the SD card on Android, so application memory limitations are not an issue.

    I think the Bold Touch is an awesome device in so many ways, but I don't want to repeat the cycle of having to ration memory a few months after purchase, yet be stuck in a two-year contract.
    mechanic_joe likes this.
    05-08-11 09:56 PM
  18. Masahiro's Avatar
    RIM never learns their lesson with memory, something always seems okay but its never future proofed so they can save a few nickels and dimes here. The playbook as the same thing going on,
    It's not about saving a few "nickels and dimes". It's about optimizing battery performance on the phone. More RAM can kill the battery because the capacitors on the chip have to be constantly refreshed to hold information.

    "A capacitor is like a small bucket that is able to store electrons. To store a 1 in the memory cell, the bucket is filled with electrons. To store a 0, it is emptied. The problem with the capacitor's bucket is that it has a leak. In a matter of a few milliseconds a full bucket becomes empty. Therefore, for dynamic memory to work, either the CPU or the memory controller has to come along and recharge all of the capacitors holding a 1 before they discharge. To do this, the memory controller reads the memory and then writes it right back. This refresh operation happens automatically thousands of times per second."

    HowStuffWorks "How RAM Works"

    Therefore, the more RAM the phone has, the more capacitors there are that have to be refreshed.
    Last edited by Masahiro; 05-08-11 at 10:40 PM.
    05-08-11 10:30 PM
  19. AllanRosen's Avatar
    While there are several people with memory issues, the majority of people do not have that issue.
    I find it frustrating when you sweep the problem under the rug by saying that only "several" people have had memory issues. The truth is that lots and lots and lots of blackberry owners experience memory problems, as evidenced by all these threads throughout the years. I personally have had 5 or 6 blackberries throughout the years; everyone of my bb's has had a memory problem. In my family, as of 3 months ago, we had 4 blackberries-- again every single one has memory problems. We now only have 3 blackberries because one of us has defected to a different phone; a second one of us will likely also leave blackberry within a month or so. When you pretend the problem doesn't exist, you provide cover for RIM to not fix the problem, and that simply perpetuates the issue. Like with many issues in life, the first step in fixing the problem is acknowledging that there is a problem.
    mechanic_joe likes this.
    05-08-11 11:08 PM
  20. Masahiro's Avatar
    When you pretend the problem doesn't exist, you provide cover for RIM to not fix the problem, and that simply perpetuates the issue. Like with many issues in life, the first step in fixing the problem is acknowledging that there is a problem.
    I hope you're aware that RIM is developing a whole new QNX OS for their smartphones to help deal with the kind of issues you're having. I'm sure they're a couple steps beyond "acknowledging the problems". If you can wait until then, great. If not, great.
    05-09-11 12:03 AM
  21. mechanic_joe's Avatar
    Trying to compare your 9700 with the 9900 is not really valid. You have half the processing power, a third of the memory, and you're running an OS it was never designed to run.

    I can also guarantee that the 9700 has no more than 256mb RAM. Those 'leaked documents' are rubbish. If it had double the RAM, it would be a 9780... and that it is not

    As for your argument, I honestly don't know, and I really don't care. I've never had memory issues with any of my BlackBerries in the past, and I don't intend to in the future.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Your correct, my 9700 is running an OS it wasn't designed to run. Perhaps I should purchase a 9900 this summer, then 6-9 months later when the QNX OS starts popping up in leaked form I can throw it on and ***** and complain that my device 'wasn't made to run this OS', and thus does it poorly.

    Where was it ever released that the 9780 has 512mb or 'RAM' ??? To the best of my knowledge, the most official information I've ever received has said that the device has '512mb of onboard memory' ... whatever that means.
    05-09-11 12:29 AM
  22. southlander's Avatar
    I know some good Android phones have 512MB of RAM. If the new bold has 768 then that should be plenty.
    05-09-11 12:56 AM
  23. Phill_UK's Avatar
    Your correct, my 9700 is running an OS it wasn't designed to run. Perhaps I should purchase a 9900 this summer, then 6-9 months later when the QNX OS starts popping up in leaked form I can throw it on and ***** and complain that my device 'wasn't made to run this OS', and thus does it poorly.

    Where was it ever released that the 9780 has 512mb or 'RAM' ??? To the best of my knowledge, the most official information I've ever received has said that the device has '512mb of onboard memory' ... whatever that means.
    I doubt we'll see QNX in a handset OS form for at least 2 years, and it will likely require a dual-core processor to run... so don't purchase a 9900 if you want QNX, simple as.

    As for memory on the 9780, RIM have always been vague with their terminology in this field, but we all know the facts... 512mb RAM and 32mb device memory, period.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    05-09-11 08:22 AM
  24. mechanic_joe's Avatar
    I know some good Android phones have 512MB of RAM. If the new bold has 768 then that should be plenty.
    Actually newer Android phones, like the Galaxy S2, have 1gig of RAM. And they don't use a portion of that for app storage.
    05-09-11 09:38 AM
  25. Phill_UK's Avatar
    Actually newer Android phones, like the Galaxy S2, have 1gig of RAM. And they don't use a portion of that for app storage.
    Actually they DO use that space for app storage
    05-09-11 09:50 AM
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