03-06-12 10:49 AM
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  1. encryption's Avatar
    So I have a TMo 9900 (this is my 4th BB that I've owned). On the last 2 (9700 and 8900 before that), after the first year of ownership, I faced random issues on the phone such as not being able to hear the person on the other side on incoming calls/convenience key not working. When I had these issues on my 9700, right off the bat the service tech at the tmo store looked at the water damage indicators and said the phone was water damaged and they couldn't help. Course I was also outside the 1 year period and didn't make a fuss about it.

    Now, my 9900 has the exact same problems, the phone is just 4 months old, there's a slight pinkish hue to the water damage stickers and of course, I have been told that my warranty is voided and now I have to live with a $249 dollar phone that has problems on incoming calls as well as a non-functioning convenience key. My other option is to buy a new device at regular price to help me alleviate my problems.

    I was, naturally, very upset with tmobile and called RIM directly, who graciously rerouted my phone call to tmobile, who gave me the same spiel.

    I know I've never dropped the phone in water, never introduced it to a moisture rich environment other than being in Singapore for 3 weeks for work, where the humidity is insane. I mean if the water damage stickers react to water/moisture, who is to say it doesn't react to moisture that naturally exists in the environment and turn color? Do we now have to be destined to use our expensive devices in temperature controlled environments just so the damn warranty can be honored?

    I wish there was a way to contact / register a complaint with RIM or get some more accurate information on this Water Damage sticker and the extent to which it needs to pass a certain shade of pink beyond which, the phone was definitely taken for a swim.

    If it wasn't for work, I truly would never buy another BB. This is not how I expected to be treated, either by Tmobile or by RIM. Both of who's product / services I have been using since 2005.
    Last edited by encryption; 03-05-12 at 11:15 AM.
    03-05-12 11:12 AM
  2. T
    I would definitely continue to buy BlackBerry, but I agree this water damage issue that comes up whenever someone goes in for service is a crock and needs to be addressed/mitigated.
    03-05-12 11:18 AM
  3. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    the problem is, for every person who honestly DIDNT wet the phone and say so, there are 300 who DID wet the phone and swear up and down they didnt. Water damage is an SOB, it could kill your phone instantly, or your phone could live just fine for a year and suddenly start freakin out.

    Also, youd be surprised at how many people come in actin like the phone is having issues. i cant recreate the issues but i offer to call the warranty in for them anyway. when i inform them theyll be receiving only the phone and will need to swap over their own back and battery they act astonished "you mean im not getting a better/different phone?". i tell them no and they say "ill just live with this one then".

    Unfortunately, due to those people, warranty processors go by what the phone tells them, not what the person tells them.

    Did you get the insurance?
    03-05-12 11:37 AM
  4. encryption's Avatar
    I realize that but it's a pain in the for people legitimately using their devices to get the short end of the stick. Unfortunately no insurance either, so I am hung out to dry.
    Last edited by encryption; 03-05-12 at 12:36 PM.
    03-05-12 12:30 PM
  5. sulcopete's Avatar
    The question is still out there...can high humidity cause the stickers to turn pink? How do you protect against that?
    03-05-12 01:47 PM
  6. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    i cant speak for hot humid environments but on occasion a customer will say the only thing they can think of is having left it in the bathroom as they took a hot shower. again, many have said this and the phone reeks of coffee...

    solution to THAT scenario is dont leave it in the bathroom.

    or maybe a plastic baggie?
    03-05-12 01:51 PM
  7. encryption's Avatar
    See this was another reason thrown at me, a hot shower? I mean as many phones as I've used and had issues with, none have consistently thrown the "Water Damaged because it's pink" nonsense at me.

    I have a second line with ATT and owned a Samsung Galaxy S2, whose screen I completely managed to shatter. How I did it I have still no idea, but ATT was happy enough to take the phone back and swap it out for a brand new one provided I got the monthly insurance on the second unit, which I happily obliged.

    They didn't open the back to look at a pink sticker and tell me I was SOL. Why can't Tmobile support long standing customers like this? Why doesn't RIM create a product that CAN withstand higher grades of moisture.

    Modern day Car Navigation Systems and electronics onboard have just as advanced technology in them as I'm sure RIM is implementing in their phones, but I'd be darned if my BMW or my Lexus Service departments told me they couldn't help me cause I drove my car through a downpour and managed to turn my seats pink. That's just utter nonsense to me.

    And to have the same excuse dished out 2 phones in a row is downright insulting.
    Last edited by encryption; 03-05-12 at 02:32 PM.
    03-05-12 02:29 PM
  8. greggebhardt's Avatar
    Your argument is not with RIM. They use the same technology as 99% of the other phone makers. It is not RIM's fault that your sticker has indicated moisture.

    You can likely tell T-Mo what ever excuse you want and the answer will be the same. You problem is so many "others" have taken advantage of the system and lied that it looks like T-Mo got tired of being screwed.

    In the end you can thank the "less honest" people.
    03-05-12 02:47 PM
  9. encryption's Avatar
    Let's agree to disagree, how many other phone manufacturers use that as an excuse? My wife had her iPhone swapped out because it was misbehaving, there was no pink sticker excuses handed to her. So in my personal experience, that's 2 of the leading competitors to BBs that are not finding ways to cop-out of their obligations.

    What's the sense of the warranty if there are loopholes in it? if they're guaranteeing the performance of a product in a given duration, why not stand by it and stop dicking clients around cause it "rained" too much in your area.

    I realize so many others have ruined it for those of us who are genuine, but that doesn't mean those who ARE genuine have to enjoy being shafted at the expense of the others. Sorry this is a really sore issue for me, especially for having it happen to me twice in a row AND despite being an honest customer.
    03-05-12 03:03 PM
  10. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    Someone broke the rules on your behalf at at&t. I have done it myself for some of my "better" customers. Its wrong.

    The reason they didnt bother to check for water damage on the shattered phone was becuase they didnt need to see if it would be covered under warranty. The shattered screen was the clear indicator that it would NOT be covered under warranty. If they didnt mention the sticker to your wife it would be because there wasnt a problem with her sticker. I dont go around saying "well your sticker doesnt show any signs of moisture damage see?" If it does i show it and compare it to one of my non-wet phones. If they dont believe me i had a few OLD cheap phones lying around, and i moisten the tip of my pinky then lightly dab it on the sticker so they can watch it turn pink. The ones they bring in are usually blood red.

    RIM and SAMSUNG have nothing to do with this. The warranty is provided by AT&T or T-Mobile or Verizon or Sprint etc etc. We take the phone and we turn around and get RIM or whoever to replace it also under warranty. If the phone has an LDI they dont ask us questions, we're just stuck with the phone.
    03-05-12 03:42 PM
  11. mssca's Avatar
    Do what I did (may be work for you as well)? I was told that I dropped the phone and that's why there is a defect on the bottom of my second Bold 9900 by Telus, which is not true because it was a manufacturing defect. I yell, scream use f&@#k you, call RIM and told them to go f&*@k off and eventually they replaced my phone with a brand new one.
    03-05-12 03:51 PM
  12. encryption's Avatar
    RIM and SAMSUNG have nothing to do with this. The warranty is provided by AT&T or T-Mobile or Verizon or Sprint etc etc. We take the phone and we turn around and get RIM or whoever to replace it also under warranty. If the phone has an LDI they dont ask us questions, we're just stuck with the phone.
    How can that have nothing to do with RIM when by your own admission, you will end up stuck with a phone that has an LDI and RIM won't replace it for you? That has EVERYTHING to do with RIM. And regardless of what ATT told me in both the cases of my other exchanges, the fact is there was genuine customer service handed out.

    You're clearly missing the point I'm trying to make, RIM should have a DEFINITIVE way to identify water damage, not some lame indicator that's gradually turning pink over time, as the device stays exposed to the atmosphere and then turn around and NULLIFY the warranty (what a sham).

    From your responses, it appears you are somehow connected with a retail store/service center. Why not keep a device out of the box, displayed on a shelf, and see what happens to the indicator over the course of several weeks or even months.

    Instead of expecting genuine customers to have to live with a product thats poorly warranted, you may well end up doing a great service to them by identifying a massive flaw in the way RIM is honoring their warranties and checking for actual liquid damage.
    03-05-12 04:04 PM
  13. Rootbrian's Avatar
    If you are getting mistreated by that carrier, switch. It's that simple. But there is no reason to blame the device maker since they aren't responsible, the carrier is, the people who made the moisture stickers are also responsible.
    offthahorseceo likes this.
    03-05-12 04:05 PM
  14. mssca's Avatar
    If you are getting mistreated by that carrier, switch. It's that simple. But there is no reason to blame the device maker since they aren't responsible, the carrier is, the people who made the moisture stickers are also responsible.
    But most of us here have 2+ years of contacts and cannot switch without paying fines.
    03-05-12 04:18 PM
  15. Rootbrian's Avatar
    But most of us here have 2+ years of contacts and cannot switch without paying fines.
    Well waiting until the contract/term is up would be a best bet.
    03-05-12 04:25 PM
  16. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    How can that have nothing to do with RIM when by your own admission, you will end up stuck with a phone that has an LDI and RIM won't replace it for you? That has EVERYTHING to do with RIM. And regardless of what ATT told me in both the cases of my other exchanges, the fact is there was genuine customer service handed out.

    You're clearly missing the point I'm trying to make, RIM should have a DEFINITIVE way to identify water damage, not some lame indicator that's gradually turning pink over time, as the device stays exposed to the atmosphere and then turn around and NULLIFY the warranty (what a sham).

    From your responses, it appears you are somehow connected with a retail store/service center. Why not keep a device out of the box, displayed on a shelf, and see what happens to the indicator over the course of several weeks or even months.

    Instead of expecting genuine customers to have to live with a product thats poorly warranted, you may well end up doing a great service to them by identifying a massive flaw in the way RIM is honoring their warranties and checking for actual liquid damage.
    What im saying is WE as a store end up with the bad phones if we take em back wet. Like it or not, your phone was exposed to moisture. it is what it is.

    Again, it has nothing to do with rim, if WE decide to go above and beyond, WE are taking the hit, RIM, SAMSUNG, LG, ETC will never know about it, because as i said, if i did you that favor and then tried to turn the phone in, the claim would be denied and id be stuck with a wet phone. SOMETIMES however, a customer generates enough revenue for you as an agent, that you are able to afford to take a hit on ONE device in order to continue doing business with this customer.

    AGAIN, we take the hit, the MANUFACTURER (in your case rim) never sees or even hears about the device we took back.
    03-05-12 04:42 PM
  17. mssca's Avatar
    What im saying is WE as a store end up with the bad phones if we take em back wet. Like it or not, your phone was exposed to moisture. it is what it is.

    Again, it has nothing to do with rim, if WE decide to go above and beyond, WE are taking the hit, RIM, SAMSUNG, LG, ETC will never know about it, because as i said, if i did you that favor and then tried to turn the phone in, the claim would be denied and id be stuck with a wet phone. SOMETIMES however, a customer generates enough revenue for you as an agent, that you are able to afford to take a hit on ONE device in order to continue doing business with this customer.

    AGAIN, we take the hit, the MANUFACTURER (in your case rim) never sees or even hears about the device we took back.
    Some phones like iPhone has water detection strips on 3 different places including under the circuit board. Unless all three indicate water damage, I think Apple Inc would replace the unit.
    03-05-12 05:49 PM
  18. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    Let's agree to disagree, how many other phone manufacturers use that as an excuse? My wife had her iPhone swapped out because it was misbehaving, there was no pink sticker excuses handed to her. So in my personal experience, that's 2 of the leading competitors to BBs that are not finding ways to cop-out of their obligations.

    What's the sense of the warranty if there are loopholes in it? if they're guaranteeing the performance of a product in a given duration, why not stand by it and stop dicking clients around cause it "rained" too much in your area.

    I realize so many others have ruined it for those of us who are genuine, but that doesn't mean those who ARE genuine have to enjoy being shafted at the expense of the others. Sorry this is a really sore issue for me, especially for having it happen to me twice in a row AND despite being an honest customer.

    03-05-12 05:56 PM
  19. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    Some phones like iPhone has water detection strips on 3 different places including under the circuit board. Unless all three indicate water damage, I think Apple Inc would replace the unit.
    its actually the other way around. they use 3 to protect themselves.

    A customer can easily coat the LDI with a material that would protect the sticker from getting wet (hint)

    however, if the device is sent in this way (fraudulently) the warranty department would be able to check the other two indicators, if ANY of them are red or wet the phone is seen out of warranty.
    03-05-12 06:10 PM
  20. offthahorseceo's Avatar
    so because they wont help you commit fraud they are monkeys?

    BTW, using a wet battery in a phone will cause problems, have you ever used a dead or dying (not discharged, at the end of their lifecycle) battery in a car? youll get all sorts of electrical gremlins
    03-05-12 07:48 PM
  21. edthebudman's Avatar
    I dont know about a 3rd strip under the circuit board but I do know that my daughter dropped her iphone 3G while on a trip to San Diego and had a white screen(not cracked just was solid white) went to apple store and the tech took the phone into the back then came and showed me the 2 strips one by the charging port one in the headphone port both were red. They did offer to sell me a replacement for $200 which I took them up on. Only part I didnt like is tech used a keychain LED light to show me the strips on the phone but only after he went into the back?? He had the keychain light on him to start. My daughter did drop phone previously into damp bathroom sink previously and suffered a day or two of issues( that fully manifested their self when she dropped I guess) so Apple wont just replace phone either!!! ALL CARRIERS use these stickers and void warrenties if showing liquid damage regardless of source and again is not the manufacturers fault or problem. Just my two cents!!!
    03-05-12 08:33 PM
  22. T
    ... Only part I didnt like is tech used a keychain LED light to show me the strips on the phone but only after he went into the back?? He had the keychain light on him to start ...
    Yea, that's shady. But with apple, I'm not surprised.
    03-05-12 08:55 PM
  23. reeneebob's Avatar
    Yea, that's shady. But with apple, I'm not surprised.
    So it's shady, even though he freely admits the phone was exposed to water? They take it to the back because the anti static precautions are in the back. I don't work for apple but we take things apart in the back for dust and anti static. If the damage indicators are there and we know that the issue means replacement, we at that point bring the item out to show the customer.

    Wasn't aware taking the appropriate precautions is shady. And damn, Apple are so shady for pointing out the water damage on the water damaged phone.


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    03-05-12 09:05 PM
  24. T
    He got lucky. The indicators were already red. I'm sure if they weren't, the bespectacled "genius" would have made them red.
    03-05-12 09:09 PM
  25. reeneebob's Avatar
    He got lucky. The indicators were already red. I'm sure if they weren't, the bespectacled "genius" would have made them red.
    That's the dumbest thing I've read in a while.

    So now Apple turn people's moisture indicators? Let me guess, they supplied weapons of mass destruction to the terrorists, caused cancer, killed Kennedy, blew up the Challenger and Columbia, and set up Rush Limbaugh to look bad?

    You're so hard on for hating Apple you'll accuse them of anything. Good lord.

    Apple has one of the best reputations for support around. You're really reaching. I can tell you that our store has had to contact RIM quite a bit on behalf of customers and I WISH they backed up their products like Apple.


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    03-05-12 09:34 PM
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