[nevilleadaniels]

I was worried about that too. That's why I tried it on my Keyone, but the phone appeared to fall back to some android default which still allowed the physical keyboard to type normally, which is good.

As long as you don't use symbols in the password just characters and numbers

[bblinky]

So, is there a reason to only uninstall for user 0? And can I uninstall for all users?

[chetmanley]

So, is there a reason to only uninstall for user 0? And can I uninstall for all users?

Unless you have more than one user profile on the device, this shouldn't be a factor. But I've always wondered if there is a hidden user profile which is running everything regardless.

[bblinky]

Unless you have more than one user profile on the device, this shouldn't be a factor. But I've always wondered if there is a hidden user profile which is running everything regardless.

That was kind of what I where getting at, but I guess there's no real way to make sure... Except only giving it internet through a wifi AP that's running wireshark and monitoring for unexpected traffic...

[chetmanley]

I'm doing some reading right now into how the firmware of the broadband chip itself can make cellular connections directly, without going through the OS.

It appears that Google leverages this on some devices for Assisted GPS to provide SUPL (Secure User Plane Location) support.

This writer theorized that some devices appear to contact Google directly using the firmware of the broadband chip, which means there is no way that I'm aware of to block it.

https://blog.wirelessmoves.com/2014/...to-google.html

I did find an interesting setting in the ARDA app under Location Services which shows this server: supl.google.com

I have no idea if modifying this will actually affect the system or not, but I deleted this server and also turned off the settings for XTRA injection.

Hopefully now the GPS on the device will solely be collecting constellation data from the satellites themselves, and not Google or Qualcomm.

[JHBrandt]

I'm doing some reading right now into how the firmware of the broadband chip itself can make cellular connections directly, without going through the OS.

It appears that Google leverages this on some devices for Assisted GPS to provide SUPL (Secure User Plane Location) support.

This writer theorized that some devices appear to contact Google directly using the firmware of the broadband chip, which means there is no way that I'm aware of to block it.

Looking with App Inspector, the ARDA app on my Priv has an interesting-looking permission which may be related: "com.qualcomm.permission.USE_QCRIL_MSG_TUNNEL"

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I'm doing some reading right now into how the firmware of the broadband chip itself can make cellular connections directly, without going through the OS.

It appears that Google leverages this on some devices for Assisted GPS to provide SUPL (Secure User Plane Location) support.

This writer theorized that some devices appear to contact Google directly using the firmware of the broadband chip, which means there is no way that I'm aware of to block it.

https://blog.wirelessmoves.com/2014/...to-google.html

I did find an interesting setting in the ARDA app under Location Services which shows this server: supl.google.com

I have no idea if modifying this will actually affect the system or not, but I deleted this server and also turned off the settings for XTRA injection.

Hopefully now the GPS on the device will solely be collecting constellation data from the satellites themselves, and not Google or Qualcomm.

Surprised there isn't more interest in this.

[chetmanley]

Looking with App Inspector, the ARDA app on my Priv has an interesting-looking permission which may be related: "com.qualcomm.permission.USE_QCRIL_MSG_TUNNEL"

Qcril_msg_tunnel is actual a continuously running service which sounds necessary for the OS to communicate with the hardware. I'll don't think disabling it will be wise but I'll give it a shot soon and report back just for interests sake.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Interface_Layer

It's this sort of mystery about our devices which makes me really look forward to open source and hardware projects like the Librem. I hope it continues to roll out to market.

[Ginowine]

That sounds great to disable system apps on the Priv.

Posted via CB10

[marioalphabetti]

I have to say, I've been looking for solutions to this Google issue for some time, and it's what pushed me to IOS when BB10 wasn't supported. That said, I've went on a long walk and realize I was so much happier with life when I used a Blackberry (7230, Pearl and Classic, Key1).

I recently picked up a Priv, and am attempting to do what's been described in this and a previous post. https://forums.crackberry.com/blackb...55/index4.html

I've tried to: A. delete all the google junk using the XDA method (I bricked it once). then attempted to install MicroG.
--- Is it possible to pull off all the required system files to be able to install MicroG? - I was not able to pull Phonesky and Velvet from the system/priv-apps/ folder and thats what seems to be blocking the installation of MicroG from what I can tell.

Question 1 - Is it possible to Install MicroG on the Priv (Or Key1/Key2) without having root? If so, how?

I'm not heavy into google at all, but there are a few apps I run for specific communicaitons. 1. Signal 2. Line2 3. Threema. 4. Protonmail
(If I could get those to run on a BB Classic I would, happily). I also don't need location services.

Seems like the missing piece is either installing MicroG, or, Patching the apps.

Question 2: I saw in the previous post (via @chetmanley) about the de-googled Key1, with the nuked google play, with patched apps BB10 style. What method and apps are you using to patch Signal for example? That seems to be the part I'm missing sans BB10 Classic & potentially de-googled Priv/Key1/Etc. (That or MicroG)

[chetmanley]

@marioalphabetti

I'm never tried installing MicroG on a Blackberry device, so unfortunately I can't say what might be preventing the install for you. If the MicroG packages use the same names as the official Google Packages, then there will be a conflict and it can't be resolved, because like you say, without root, the originals cannot be fully removed to make way for MicroG.

Fortunately, non of the applications you listed require Google Play Services - although I can't speak to Line because I don't use it.

Signal, Theema and Proton Mail all work, as do countless others like Microsoft's apps, Adobe, and even Whatsapp (sometimes with message delivery delay until the app is opened because it isn't designed to work without Play Services like Signal and Threema are).

For location services - GPS position works perfectly.

Regarding your second question. When I first wrote that post, some apps needed to be patched to remove their Google Play Services check. I was using Cobalt's patcher app. Another option which can be used to patch apks on the device is Lucky Patcher.

But I have found this is no longer required. I haven't had to patch an app in years. Signal, Threema, Protonmail and all of the Blackberry apps run fine without google play services and no patching is required.

[marioalphabetti]

Interesting....

I have a second Priv I can run tests on, and will build it without the Google from the beginning, and try patching some of these apps with Cobalts patcher (I tried Cobalts system years back when it was in it’s infancy, glad to hear it's still around).

Signal - on install at the phone number entry screen, it said it needed google play services to be updated, which was interesting. Was there a specific version you used that didnt do this or did this go away with the patching process?

Regarding BB10 - Did you have any luck getting Signal or Protonmail running on the Passport or Classic? I believe they required Android 5.xx and the Passport/Classic were capped at Android 4.xx (I've read that MicroG will function on BB10)

[chetmanley]

Interesting....

I have a second Priv I can run tests on, and will build it without the Google from the beginning, and try patching some of these apps with Cobalts patcher (I tried Cobalts system years back when it was in it’s infancy, glad to hear it's still around).

Signal - on install at the phone number entry screen, it said it needed google play services to be updated, which was interesting. Was there a specific version you used that didnt do this or did this go away with the patching process?

Regarding BB10 - Did you have any luck getting Signal or Protonmail running on the Passport or Classic? I believe they required Android 5.xx and the Passport/Classic were capped at Android 4.xx (I've read that MicroG will function on BB10)

You shouldn't need to patch anything. Signal just says that without Google Play Services, it needs to run a background service for message reception. Just click okay and it will continue with the setup. The Signal apk can be downloaded directly from the Signal site but I believe it will have the same behavior.

Threema will do something similar - except instead of running a background service, it gives the option to enable polling at different time intervals.

Protonmail used to work on BB10, but their app no longer supports Android 4. Signal doesn't work anymore either, however Threema still does with limitations (no voice/video calls because it relies on WebRTC which isn't supported in the runtime)

[marioalphabetti]

Update on BB10:
Telegram - Works
Protonmail - No Bueno
Signal - No Bueno
Threema - No Calling, Crashes a lot, but messages work when it's not crashing. (Need to download the Legacy Version from their website, and pay a small fee, but the license is transferable to other devices and versions).
WhatsApp - Works (but with their privacy policy changing, not recommended).

Blackberry World - The new update works.
Email - Gmail works (but that's Google)
Text Messages - Work.
Calls - Work.
Music - Works
Browser - Limited functionality. (haven't found a replacement for this)
Crackberry App - Works like a dream.

In short, the classic makes a great PDA. Calendar is still the best, better than any newer Android Blackberry or iCal version in my opinion. Anything web-based is going to be slow compared to what we're used to with newer/modern devices, but offline functions and apps work as you would expect.

Still the best Operating System so I do hope it is refreshed with the new 2021 Blackberry, with Android App support, even though that seems unlikely.

PRIV UPDATE (Using the ADB Method)
I'm revamping and compiling a list of copy and paste commands for anyone who wishes to easily de-bloat theirs, and will post here when completed. Surprisingly, the phone is still great in 2021, though the battery life is something to be desired (this is the draw to upgrade to a Key1 or Key2).

NOTE 9 (Samsung) EXPERIMENT
I know this is not a BlackBerry but I had an older Note9 and my intent was to install Lineage OS, then the BlackBerry Suite (Keyboard, Hub, Etc) on top, so it would be something like a high powered Motion or Dtek50/60. Turns out I have one of the few Notes that is unable to root, or even unlock the bootloader so I've been experimenting with ADB on that and from my experience your right, the BlackBerry version of Android is definitely the cleanest version of Android in comparison, especially on the Priv.The volume of additional app's on these things is unreal.

With the BlackBerry on top it gives us the ability to use whatever hardware, and keep the sanity enhancing features like the Hub, On Screen Keyboard, etc. I consider the "soul" of Blackberry to be their OS (BB10 and earlier), their hardware (Classic, Passport), the HUB, and the Physical Keyboard. So this method is somewhat like installing a Corvette engine in a minivan - weird-ish, but it works.

Anyways, will post up the Priv ADB list shortly.


Posted via CB10

[dhblackberry]

Updated Dec 26, 2019

This list is more applicable to the Key1 and 2 than the Priv because the Priv has fewer / different packages.


First - What not to disable:

Don't disable Android System - obvious really but I tried it for science. While the phone will continue to work fine, it will be bricked once your restart it. Requires a full wipe autoloader to bring it back to life after that.

org.codeaurora.ims Do not disable this, it is required to acquire IMS (VoLTE, Wifi Calling APN settings. I wouldn't disable the other codeaurora packages either that deal with Bluetooth)

com.blackberry.arda Do not disable this. This package allows for modifying Cellular radio, IMS, and GPS settings by the user. It can be accessed by using the Chairlock app from F-Droid.


Android Webview can't be disabled with this method on the Key 1 or 2. I haven't tried deleting it on the Priv. Really no reason to disable it.

I'll first list the main apps you want to disable if you want to stop Qualcomm and Blackberry Telemetry:

QDMA: com.qualcomm.qti.qdma (Qualcomm Telemetry)
StatManQDMA: com.qualcomm.qti.smq (Qualcomm Telemetry)
TelemetryJService: com.qualcomm.qti.haven.telemetry.service (Qualcomm Telemetry)

LocationServices: com.qualcomm.location (You will loose GPS capability, but it appears to control connections to the IZAT XTRA cloud which sends back telemetry. One way to control this is with a Firewall (block 99% of the time, until your GPS stops working, then allow it to get a constellation update - I would consider clearing it's cache before doing so to limit what is sent back to qualcomm). This one is discussed further below in the Qualcomm section.

I tried deleting com.qualcomm.location.XT on the Priv (this doesn't exist on the Key series), and it causes the Location Settings page to crash when opened under device settings. I had hoped that it would be a good way to stop IZAT communication, but it seems to kill Location services also.

Blackberry Bug Reporter: com.blackberry.ddt.bugreporter
Blackberry Diagnostics: com.blackberry.ddt
com.blackberry.ddt.checkin
com.blackberry.dm
(Killing these will stop Blackberry Hub+ Services from sending back it's collective telemetry to the ccl server)

If you want to kill all connections to TCL, then disable these:

Preview: com.blackberrymobile.aota
Updates: com.tcl.ota.bb
(I can't confirm if these send back telemetry or not. They are called up if you search for new updates, but periodically call up TCL servers in the background). If you never get OTA updates and use Autoloaders, then these apps aren't required and may save some battery due to their continued connection attempts.

-----

Here is the complete list of system apps I've been able to safely disable using the XDA ADB method. (This doesn't include other systems apps I've disabled normally directly on the device like Google Play etc)

Android:

Android Accessibility Suite: com.google.android.marvin.talkback
Android Easter Egg: com.android.egg
Android Setup: com.google.android.setupwizard
Basic Daydreams: com.android.dreams.basic
CaptivePortalLogin: com.android.captiveportallogin (This might affect login at hotels/public hot spots - still testing)
Carrier default app: com.android.carrierdefaultapp
Carrier Services: com.google.android.ims (No affect on IMS - Wifi Calling or VoLTE)
com.android.backupconfirm
com.android.backuptokenagent
com.android.wallpaperbackup
com.android.carrierconfig
com.android.cts.ctsshim
com.android.cts.priv.ctsshim
Companion Device Manager: com.android.companiondevicemanager
Device Configuration: android.autoinstalls.config.blackberry.venice
Device Setup: com.google.android.apps.work.oobconfig
Google Sample Home Screen: com.google.android.gmsintegration
Live Wallpaper Picker: com.android.wallpaper.livepicker
Trusted Face com.android.facelock

MusicFX com.android.musicfx (From what I understand, this is for the sound mixer in Google Music, I've disabled that app so I also disabled MusicFX)

Qualcomm:

com.qualcomm.qti.biometrics.fingerprint.service (Key2 only - despite the name, it actually doesn't affect the fingerprint scanner)
Device info: com.qti.qualcomm.deviceinfo (Reads out info like IEMI, IMSI, CELLID, etc. no affect to disable and doesn't affect About Phone Menu)
QDMA: com.qualcomm.qti.qdma (Qualcomm Telemetry)
SeempJService: com.qualcomm.qti.seemp.service
StatManQDMA: com.qualcomm.qti.smq (Qualcomm Telemetry)
com.qualcomm.qti.autoregistration (Some think this has to do with telemetry also)
TelemetryJService: com.qualcomm.qti.haven.telemetry.service (Qualcomm Telemetry)

com.qualcomm.qti.ims Although this is also related to IMS, it can be disabled without affecting it. It appears to be redundant.
com.qualcomm.qti.ipa
com.qualcomm.qti.uim
com.qualcomm.qti.optinoverlay
com.qti.qualcomm.datastatusnotification
com.qualcomm.qti.uceShimService (RCS Service)
com.qualcomm.embms (LTE Broadcast https://www.qualcomm.com/media/docum...per-by-idc.pdf )


If you want to disable GPS location completely, then disable:

LocationServices: com.qualcomm.location (This one is required for the device to pull GPS constellation data. Without it, the phone wont get a GPS lock). Unfortunately, it also sends back your location and other device telemetry (including WIFI and cell locations) back to Qualcomm. Connections are made via the Android GPS Daemon (Can't be disabled)

Fused Location: com.android.location.fused (From what I understand, this is used for when you lose a GPS signal. It provides your last known position to apps. It likely has a hand in Wifi and Bluetooth location processing also but not sure.
When using ADB`s Dumpsys location command, It appears that if com.android.location.fused is disabled, then com.qualcomm.location takes over for fused location services.


Blackberry:

Power Center Storage: com.blackberry.providers.batterycenter (I also have Power Center disabled - dont use it)
Blackberry Bug Reporter: com.blackberry.ddt.bugreporter (Blackberry Telemetry)
Blackberry Diagnostics: com.blackberry.ddt (BB Telemetry)
com.blackberry.ddt.checkin (BB Telemetry)
com.blackberry.dm (BB Telemetry)

com.blackberry.cellular.ims.provider (These two relating to IMS (Wifi Calling, VoLTE) can be disabled without impacting IMS setup or function.)
com.blackberry.cellular.ims.daemon
com.blackberry.deviceconfig (Once the device is first configured, this should no longer be required. It has a permission related to the TCL Preview app called Preview_Install and a strange permission listed as com.ts.permission.CAMELEONDATA_READ... not sure what that is about.)


com.blackberry.resources (Sole purpose of this app is to provide BB EULA, Warranty and FCC info to the About Phone page under settings. If disabled, those pages will either disappear or simply no longer open. If these are accessed, the app calls up blackberry.com to pull the documents)

As an aside - I was able to disable DTEK on the Keyone and com.blackberry.bide which is supposed to be a package allowing developers to leverage DTEK`s abilities. After a reboot, there were no issues detected. Just interesting that it could be disabled. I haven`t tried deleting it on my Priv.


TCL:

Slide Show (Magic Lock): com.tct.magiclock (Key 2 only - wallpaper picker for lock screen. Once disabled, the setting is removed from the Settings -> Display screen

com.android.tct.autogregister
Telecom Record: com.tcl.TctRFM and com.tcl.TctTelecomRecord
Preview: com.blackberrymobile.aota (This no longer appears to remain disabled on the Key2, but worth a shot. Okay on Key1)
Updates: com.tcl.ota.bb (Removes the System update screen from Device settings)

Dual Services App: com.vapp.aide.intl and com.vapp.aide.intl.arm64 (Doesn't remove the Dual app option from the settings screen, but clicking it will crash back to main settings screen)

Temp Control: com.tct.tempcontrol - I've disabled this one. It isn't present on the KeyOne and appears to be redundant. For an idea of what it does, see here: https://forums.crackberry.com/showth...1#post13474909

If my phone explodes I'll be sure to update the thread.

---------------

My goal was to reduce, if not eliminate unnecessary background connections and telemetry being sent by system apps. Up til now, Netguard firewall was blocking these connections, but now the offending apps are disabled.

Before, Netguard was constantly blocking TCL, Blackberry and Qualcomm connections, but now the only system connections being made are to timing update servers. I'm still tracking down the exact app responsible for that one (I suspect com.qualcomm.timeservice even though it doesn't have it's own internet permission)

Cheers

My marioalphabetti account isn't letting me in, password reset isn't being sent, so here I am on a new account.

Update: I went ahead and purchased a Key2, and this thing is the cat's pyjamas. It's my favourite blackberry to date that doesn't run BBOS or BB10, so very well done TCL for refining it to this degree. Highly recommended and definitely a few steps up from the Priv. I owned a Key1 and the keyboard is exceptionally better, and speed key leaves nothing to be desired. Still getting my muscle memory worked in but being able to slide my fingers across the keys, vs tapping glass, it’s hard to describe but it's wonderful.

Anyways - I've put together a fuller list of the apps to disable on the Key 2 (this should work for Key 1 as well but I'm posting this document so we can complete it and have an easy to use de-googling/debloating guide for the Key series.

See RTF document here:

BLACKBERRY KEY2 ADB DE-BLOAT GUIDE
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8a0odf58wx...GUIDE.rtf?dl=0

I pulled most of your comments @chetmanley into the document, but please make additions/adjustments and re-upload if you wouldn't mind. There are probably more that can be removed, but so far everything works great with what you've mentioned.


(A quick note on the Priv project... after reseting it a couple dozen times, just doesn't seem to have the horsepower to run workarounds when lot of the software is stripped out. Though I may have deleted something specific that caused the issue, I lost patience with it, and the thin keyboard with very little key travel leaves something to be desired. Hence - Key2. The keyboard truly makes a Blackberry, a Blackberry, and the Key2 does it very well.)

[dhblackberry]

A couple glitches with the above setup:

1. This might be unique to my setup, but I still receive non-secure email at a Gmail account, (secure mail goes to Protonmail) and since using the Gmail App would setup the account as an on-device account, ruining this whole degoogling process, is there a relatively clean Gmail/email app that you recommend?

(Currently I have Gmail set up in the BB Hub Inbox, but filing emails isnt syncing - thinking this may have to do wish disabled google framework and services)

2. Audio that should go to the bottom speaker sometimes defaults to the on-ear speaker above the screen. Unsure what is causing this but it is solved by rebooting the device.

Any ideas?

[Ben xfg]

Signal - No Bueno

Posted via CB10

Someone in another thread mentioned they got Signal working. I'll see if I can find the post - I forget the name of the thread...

[chetmanley]

A couple glitches with the above setup:

1. This might be unique to my setup, but I still receive non-secure email at a Gmail account, (secure mail goes to Protonmail) and since using the Gmail App would setup the account as an on-device account, ruining this whole degoogling process, is there a relatively clean Gmail/email app that you recommend?

(Currently I have Gmail set up in the BB Hub Inbox, but filing emails isnt syncing - thinking this may have to do wish disabled google framework and services)

2. Audio that should go to the bottom speaker sometimes defaults to the on-ear speaker above the screen. Unsure what is causing this but it is solved by rebooting the device.

Any ideas?

You could try Faircode's Fairemail app. It's free to try, with a donation to unlock all features.

www.faircode.eu

I'm not sure how well it supports Gmail but it's worth a shot.

Regarding the audio issue, I'm not sure what may have caused that. What device is this on? Is it in a specific application or all applications? Might be worth doing a factory reset and then starting the debloating process again to see which deleted package might cause it.

[marioalphabetti]

I did exactly that and it fixed the issue. So all good on the audio front.

Regarding the Gmail issue, on the reformat, Hub started working proper, including email filing. It does take a few minuites to reflect the changes, so this may have to do with the refresh cycle set in Hub, currently set to 15 mins.

I must have disabled something important because now after the reset a full day brought me 7.5 hours SOT, at 15% battery, so could have pushed 8.5 hours at 5% most likely. (This is on a Key2). I'd love to get 2 days, but with my useage, I suspect 14-16 hours SOT is not really a thing...

I do suspect the Gmail fetching is causing excess battery drain though, so I'll try the full version of Fairemail and see if I can pull Gmail out of the Hub that way.

I've also been using an app called "WebApps" (found on FDroid) to run some of those signed in services like Amazon, Facebook, Twitter, etc. It doesn't incorporate into the Hub or give you notifications, but it does give you the ability to create webapps for one click access on the homescreen (no speed key shortcuts unfortunately) if you are still using services where the apps are not privacy friendly.

Also, for notes and tasks, if you were an Apple user prior to your switch back to Blackberry, the apple app Omnifocus does load a Web version up in Webapps. It's nothing like a native app, but saves me the days of transferring data back and forth if I have to wipe the device. (BlackBerry Notes and Tasks won't sync unless you add a Google account). So I wanted to mention that.

Posted via CB10

[marioalphabetti]

Ben if you do find the thread for this it would still be sweet to have BB10 making encrypted calls outside of apps like SeeCrypt and CellCrypt.

Posted via CB10

[Horakhty]

Hey guys, just curious where everyone is at with their blackberry/privacy/de-googling journey?

I recently switched back to the Key2 (again) and am reminded why we love these phones.

[chetmanley]

Last fall I made the switch from my Key2 to a Pixel 7 so I could try GrapheneOS. While I miss everything about the Key2 (keyboard, headphone jack, and SD card support), I've gotten used to the Pixel and I absolutely love GrapheneOS.

I installed a number of Cobalt's patched BlackBerry apps onto GrapheneOS, including the keyboard, password keeper, notes, tasks and contacts in order to make it "feel" more Blackberryish.

And for an email app I'm using Fairemail. Using its customizable appearance options, I've tried to have it replicate the look and feel of BB10 hub.

Cheers