07-31-07 09:41 AM
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  1. BFEINZIMER's Avatar
    Here is the proof, it is listed at one of the highlight features...so who thinking class action?

    I have the entire thing so if we need anything else scanned...also I'm posting this to BlackBerryForums, PinStack, HowardForums and CrackBerry so cross-ref links follow:

    BlackBerryForums: Proof that VZW advertised the 8830 with GPS - BlackBerryForums.com : Your Number One BlackBerry Community
    PinStack: Proof that VZW advertised the 8830 with GPS - RIM Blackberry Forums - Pinstack.com
    HowardForums: HowardForums: Your Mobile Phone Community & Resource - Proof that VZW advertised the 8830 with GPS



    Last edited by BrianFeinzimer; 07-21-07 at 07:42 AM. Reason: Add LinkBack URLs
    07-21-07 07:33 AM
  2. dillyyo's Avatar
    Well, that maybe interpreted in the legal rhelm as it does come with "built-in GPS", but is just not functional through the Verizon network at this time. I would then proceed to make the argument that it could be deemed as deceitful advertising to an unacceptable level. Whether thats a realistic legal argument, I have no idea.
    07-23-07 09:23 PM
  3. Trevor's Avatar
    Class action baby! I am going to have to snatch up one of these quick so I can get $2.17 back when the lawyers settle their suit and collect their ginormous* legal fee.

    Seriously though, maybe that refers to a future service. It only seems fitting that a "world device" would come with a GPS. Also, it says coming soon. Maybe they are referring to the new gps-enabled version.



    * Just in case their are any English Professors/Teachers among us, ginormous is now a real word. Check for yourself.
    07-23-07 09:53 PM
  4. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    * Just in case their are any English Professors/Teachers among us, ginormous is now a real word. Check for yourself.
    As of 2007 it is...
    Merriam-Webster Online

    Also, RIM should also be brought into this lawsuit for failure to "stand behind it's product as a manufacturer". RIM's failure to deny VZW's request to disable GPS directly underminds the public's trust in their products. If we can't trust a manufacturer to release products with all "documented" capabilities entact how can we trust their licensed resellers. RIM accepted and implemented the request from VZW to disable the autonomours GPS in the phone. Not cool.
    Last edited by Trevor; 10-28-07 at 06:35 PM.
    07-23-07 11:01 PM
  5. dillyyo's Avatar
    another legal angle would be that the phone DOES have the GPS capability, but only for 911 emergency purposes. So, technically the advertisement would be accurate. Proving the deceptive aspect would be a much tougher job.
    07-24-07 02:06 AM
  6. trinston's Avatar
    Hmmm... I just sent out an email to Verizon with a full list of documented examples of their deception and lies with regard to the GPS situation and I included this. It's such a sketchy situation. As you guys have mentioned, it says built-in GPS - functional appears to be a different thing. True, it has a GPS, but there is probably no legal problem with advertising it with future plans to activate it. They better release a patch soon with the enabled GPS for everyone to use. I think the legal aspect depends on who you ask. If there is a clear pattern of this misleading advertising, then there could be a case for class action.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-24-07 09:08 AM
  7. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    another legal angle would be that the phone DOES have the GPS capability, but only for 911 emergency purposes. So, technically the advertisement would be accurate. Proving the deceptive aspect would be a much tougher job.
    Incorrect. They cannot use this to depict E911 GPS because no other phone they sell is listed as "Built in GPS" to depict E911 GPS even though all the phones any carrier sells has E911 GPS capabilities due to FCC mandate. This is different.
    07-24-07 09:48 AM
  8. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    Hmmm... I just sent out an email to Verizon with a full list of documented examples of their deception and lies with regard to the GPS situation and I included this. It's such a sketchy situation. As you guys have mentioned, it says built-in GPS - functional appears to be a different thing. True, it has a GPS, but there is probably no legal problem with advertising it with future plans to activate it. They better release a patch soon with the enabled GPS for everyone to use. I think the legal aspect depends on who you ask. If there is a clear pattern of this misleading advertising, then there could be a case for class action.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    I don't even think it's a matter of advertising anymore. VZW is in the habbit of crippling phone capabilities for financial gain. That alone is where my problem with them is. I could care less if it's false advertising, but this constant stripping of features for their own financial gain is BS! That's the think that we need to stop VZW from getting away with. No other carrier.... I'll say it again, NO OTHER CARRIER does this sort of stuff, what makes VZW think that it can get away with it. They have gotten away with these tactics for far too long.
    07-24-07 09:52 AM
  9. ibmman69's Avatar
    has anyone filed a complaint with the BBB?
    07-24-07 10:12 AM
  10. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    Here's an interesting read. Seems that even the cell phone manufacturers are getting sick and tired of the carriers and their BS strategies. Please read this... it's very interesting.

    Cell Service Providers Get A Wake-Up Call From Business Users - Technology News by TechWeb
    07-24-07 11:15 AM
  11. Trevor's Avatar
    I wish they would just make it like a feature that you could pay exta for. Say like $50 and it would be unlocked. Ideal would be free, but Verizon would never do that.
    07-24-07 02:40 PM
  12. Saukrateaz's Avatar
    From what I have read, I believe Verizon was originally going to offer GPS enabled on the 8830 but then changed the flow of things and wanted to charge for it. Since so many other carriers were not charging for it they decided to not offer it all.
    07-25-07 12:18 PM
  13. JRSCCivic98's Avatar
    I know it's crossposted, but it's important. Hammer this guy's phone!!! They'll get the message soon enough.

    CALL GARY PAUL, FROM VERIZON EXECUTIVE OFFICES OF VERIZON WIRELESS, AT 240-568-2186. TELL HIM ABOUT THE GPS PROBLEM AND THAT WE WANT IT WORKING
    07-25-07 05:23 PM
  14. trinston's Avatar
    Call and threaten a class action lawsuit. I will start a class action lawsuit if they don't fix this issue, no lie. Call this guy and explain the problem and tell him that unless they fix the problem, we will file a class action lawsuit. If we all call, we might get some leverage.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-26-07 09:01 AM
  15. Saukrateaz's Avatar
    You cant sue them for something they never offered you. Wether it is available through other carriers or not, the device was never put out to market with the GPS enabled. Had it been enabled and they just decided to disable it without knowledge, then fine you have a case provided you bought it specifically for the GPS. It is a well known fact that verizon has disabled this feature. If you want it that bad move to another carrier because this is not the first, last, or only device that verizon has disabled these features. Calling them will do nothing except entice them to charge for it because there will be such a high demand.
    07-26-07 09:20 AM
  16. ibmman69's Avatar
    We need a Verizon fanboy avatar.


    You cant sue them for something they never offered you. Wether it is available through other carriers or not, the device was never put out to market with the GPS enabled. Had it been enabled and they just decided to disable it without knowledge, then fine you have a case provided you bought it specifically for the GPS. It is a well known fact that verizon has disabled this feature. If you want it that bad move to another carrier because this is not the first, last, or only device that verizon has disabled these features. Calling them will do nothing except entice them to charge for it because there will be such a high demand.
    07-26-07 11:27 AM
  17. tomtheguitarguy's Avatar
    Calling them will do nothing except entice them to charge for it because there will be such a high demand.
    At least it would be working then.

    tomtheguitarguy
    07-26-07 03:08 PM
  18. Saukrateaz's Avatar
    At least it would be working then.

    tomtheguitarguy
    Thats a rediculous comment. People would then complain that there is a charge for it. For those of you that are willing to pay for GPS on a verizon BB can do this: Cancel your Verizon contract and go with another carrier that offers it. At 200 for a cancellation fee you can break it down monthly and your looking at a little less than 17 a month for GPS on your device. Verizon doesn't offer it, so what. This is only a big deal with people because of that reason. If it was enabled, people would complain about its inaccuracy, or it not being/refreshing as quick as someone elses.
    Like I said, making phone calls and crying about it will do absolutly nothing. Why should they enable it? Noone is going to cancel the contract or go to another carrier merely because they will not enable GPS. What's next? People complaining that their device would not verbalize when it was time to walk the dog?
    Last edited by saukrateaz; 07-26-07 at 03:22 PM.
    07-26-07 03:20 PM
  19. tomtheguitarguy's Avatar
    Thats a rediculous comment. People would then complain that there is a charge for it. For those of you that are willing to pay for GPS on a verizon BB can do this: Cancel your Verizon contract and go with another carrier that offers it. At 200 for a cancellation fee you can break it down monthly and your looking at a little less than 17 a month for GPS on your device. Verizon doesn't offer it, so what. This is only a big deal with people because of that reason. If it was enabled, people would complain about its inaccuracy, or it not being/refreshing as quick as someone elses.
    Like I said, making phone calls and crying about it will do absolutly nothing. Why should they enable it? Noone is going to cancel the contract or go to another carrier merely because they will not enable GPS. What's next? People complaining that their device would not verbalize when it was time to walk the dog?
    Actually, it isn't that ridiculous of a comment. If Verizon charged for it, people who didn't like that, can still do what you're suggesting - cancel their contract and go with another carrier as well. The fact of the matter is that RIM manufactured it with a built-in GPS and Verizon disabled it - for whatever reason.

    Your statement "No one is going to cancel the contract or go to another carrier merely because they will not enable GPS", can also be applied if they were to charge for it - you would have the choice to use it or not / pay for it or not. This is based on the idea that enabling the GPS would require the use of VZNavigator.

    I only replied so succinctly in my first post that "at least it would be working" as a commentary that I don't particularly care if Verizon charged for the service or not - at least the unit would be fully functional. And if I didn't want to pay for it, then I would just use my external GPS puck - like I can now. It would be nice to be able to use it without carrying an exra component.

    Why should they enable it? Because it's the right thing to do. All of those alternatives that you mentioned could be used if it were enabled too - but Verizon would probably have a lot less unhappy (about this feature) customers. And I don't see how the Verizon 8830 GPS would work any less accurately or quickly as any other carriers version (except if were tied to the VZNavigator, which wouldn't work without cell service). And I don't see a lot of posts that complain about how bad the GPS is working in the other carriers' version.

    You're right in the fact that we (the people complaining) have choices. We can choose another carrier. We can choose to complain about it. We can choose to let it go. So, why can't we have a choice to use the GPS as it was meant to be used in the 8830?

    tomtheguitarguy
    07-27-07 07:06 AM
  20. Saukrateaz's Avatar
    You're right in the fact that we (the people complaining) have choices. We can choose another carrier. We can choose to complain about it. We can choose to let it go. So, why can't we have a choice to use the GPS as it was meant to be used in the 8830?

    tomtheguitarguy

    You just made my point. Those are your choices. However, you have no choice in wether or not you can use the GPS on your VERIZON 8830 because it is not offered. Thats all there is to it.
    For instance. If you go look at a Ford Expedition and a Lincoln Navigator (SUV's). 1 model has heated seats and the other doesn't. But because the 1 model does have heated seats does that mean ALL should have heated seats? No. Its your choice as to wether or not you choose to go with the heated seats. They are the same frame and chassis, but have different makers (though Ford owns both). If you really want the heated seats your going to have to go with the Lincoln. BUT!! IF the Expedition offered heated seats (which they do) at additional cost, you can choose that as well. In this case Verizon does not offer the GPS. It may in the future but not now, so people should deal with it. If it bothers someone that much then they should have done their homework before deciding on a carrier/phone package.
    07-27-07 10:02 AM
  21. trinston's Avatar
    That's not true. If you go to the Ford dealer, he or she isn't going to say it has heated seats when it really does not. There is not going to be advertising that says that it has heated seats when it does not. Verizon specifically said that it has GPS capabilities in correspondences with customer support and in their advertising. That's where the problem is.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    07-27-07 07:32 PM
  22. Jarhead's Avatar
    I know it's crossposted, but it's important. Hammer this guy's phone!!! They'll get the message soon enough.

    CALL GARY PAUL, FROM VERIZON EXECUTIVE OFFICES OF VERIZON WIRELESS, AT 240-568-2186. TELL HIM ABOUT THE GPS PROBLEM AND THAT WE WANT IT WORKING
    This wont work, and the verizon reps / sales really do not care , they have there millions and are recovering from loosing customers to the IPhone, out of which they "VZW and others are going to loose MORE, when the IPod Nano comes out this fall.

    I would love to have VERIZON Executive prove everyone wrong, but in the end its not going to happen, when you go into the stores all you here is one rep asking the other how about 5 star or some other phrase meaning I am the MOD "Manager on duty " and have to obtain these goals, so do what I say and do it. But lets lye to customers about functionality of our equipment. And lets take a perfectly good piece of equipment and rewrite the firmware / OS and CRIPPLE the SH__ out of it.
    Last edited by Jarhead; 07-27-07 at 08:42 PM.
    07-27-07 08:34 PM
  23. Firefishe's Avatar
    Guys 'n Gals: Maybe we just need to license the technology from RIM for Consumer Development.

    As it's such a new market for RIM, why don't we just build our own release as a third party phone provider, then sell the 88xx phone for prime retail--or slightly discounted retail--and be done with it?

    We could sell 88xx's for everyone, without any feature restrictions.

    Your Thoughts and Comments?

    Warm regards,
    Firefishe
    07-28-07 06:53 PM
  24. tomtheguitarguy's Avatar
    But because the 1 model does have heated seats does that mean ALL should have heated seats? No.
    However, if the heated seats were in the vehicle, I would certainly expect them to work.
    07-29-07 04:10 PM
  25. dlogan's Avatar
    I am brand new to BB's. Just purchased an 8830 two days ago. GPS was a minor reason for the purchase. I had read somewhere that GPS was disabled, but all you needed to do was get your provider to enable it. I have spoken to the local manager and he said all I needed to do was to download GPS software and then I would have GPS on my phone. After reading this thread I am guessing GPS is not possible on my phone. If that's true, then why are the local folks telling me to simply download software?
    07-29-07 08:29 PM
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