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  1. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    To be honest I havn't paid a lot of attention to the smartphone market dynamics very much at all...
    But 2000 people !?!?! I'm afraid to ask where did you pull that number out of?
    (As a side note doesn't BB still have a case with cartel like practices via the EU of Apple and Google for their storefronts(apps), on the smartphone sphere by excluding BB10 devices, driven by the EU don't they?)

    We're talking about continuing the eco-system, not building a new solar system from assembler pixie dust. We're not talking about re-writing bb10 to something new, maybe a tenth of that number 200 would be closer to the real need, and the QNX people still exist don't they?

    ...Does Microsoft Office costs 10,000 annually for upgrades as well? No?
    Then I guess it's way out of date as well. LOL
    Even Corel Wordperfect Office still exists and gets upgraded (for less than Office) for those who didn't abandon ship at the first site of albeit new more powerful (slick), but maybe rarely used features in Office, and they wrote Apps for Windows 10, but soon abandoned them (for lack of sales in that biosphere) and stayed with their core desktop applications which are still chugging along to this day...yes despite Google docs.

    32bit to 64bit conversions necessary for supporting existing base? Nope.
    And anyways is doable as a future path without mythical billions and a hurculean tasks.

    API libraries are expandable one class at a time (and open source contributions of various means aren't out of the question for API growth)

    Can't imagine why the "QT" can't be updated, and if not why it would need to be. Heck throw it out and/or write/ open-source a script compatible or additional C++ libraries to supplement .

    What "out-of-date" capabilities since 2013 are you referring to? It would be an interesting exercise to see just what you think is missing in some kind of class list.

    Given your over the top "mission impossible" statement, is it safe to say you are sold on Google or Microsoft and can't envision a smaller nimble independent player?

    Ohh maybe i get it, it might break the 2year cycle of must upgrade novel feature cellphones for the Telcos.
    But as someone said the market might be topping out anyways, so the upgrade cycles might start slowing naturally for consumer devices (the kids etc), the annual revenue stream to Blackberry might just help weather that, and yes it is a niche player.
    Drael646464 likes this.
    04-09-17 01:29 AM
  2. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    To be honest I havn't paid a lot of attention to the smartphone market dynamics very much at all...
    But 2000 people !?!?! I'm afraid to ask where did you pull that number out of?
    (As a side note doesn't BB still have a case with cartel like practices via the EU of Apple and Google for their storefronts(apps), on the smartphone sphere by excluding BB10 devices, driven by the EU don't they?)

    We're talking about continuing the eco-system, not building a new solar system from assembler pixie dust. We're not talking about re-writing bb10 to something new, maybe a tenth of that number 200 would be closer to the real need, and the QNX people still exist don't they?

    ...Does Microsoft Office costs 10,000 annually for upgrades as well? No?
    Then I guess it's way out of date as well. LOL
    Even Corel Wordperfect Office still exists and gets upgraded (for less than Office) for those who didn't abandon ship at the first site of albeit new more powerful (slick), but maybe rarely used features in Office, and they wrote Apps for Windows 10, but soon abandoned them (for lack of sales in that biosphere) and stayed with their core desktop applications which are still chugging along to this day...yes despite Google docs.

    32bit to 64bit conversions necessary for supporting existing base? Nope.
    And anyways is doable as a future path without mythical billions and a hurculean tasks.

    API libraries are expandable one class at a time (and open source contributions of various means aren't out of the question for API growth)

    Can't imagine why the "QT" can't be updated, and if not why it would need to be. Heck throw it out and/or write/ open-source a script compatible or additional C++ libraries to supplement .

    What "out-of-date" capabilities since 2013 are you referring to? It would be an interesting exercise to see just what you think is missing in some kind of class list.

    Given your over the top "mission impossible" statement, is it safe to say you are sold on Google or Microsoft and can't envision a smaller nimble independent player?

    Ohh maybe i get it, it might break the 2year cycle of must upgrade novel feature cellphones for the Telcos.
    But as someone said the market might be topping out anyways, so the upgrade cycles might start slowing naturally for consumer devices (the kids etc), the annual revenue stream to Blackberry might just help weather that, and yes it is a niche player.
    Why don't you build this small nimble company you envision? By your estimations, it will make you successful and possibly rich..

    Posted via CB10
    04-09-17 06:37 AM
  3. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Why don't you build this small nimble company you envision? By your estimations, it will make you successful and possibly rich..

    Posted via CB10
    Well okay if everyone that still uses a bb10 or earlier paypals me $20 for the next installment, I'll look into that :-) (or if you can send me back 4-5yrs in a time machine...).

    ..Though I didn't say that it alone would make Blackberry significantly richer, it might compensate for some overhead of the maintenance & infastructure costs ..iff its prevents a possible bleeding of BB10 owners to other device licensors (if they're not all ready to KEYone all at once in May - though I''m sure they will get significant sales with that solid device), and it increases the pool of potential future device/service/royalty upgrades.

    Though I can't peer into their active device pool to see how much is there. It's an alternative hybridized model -two years free os upgrades, annual os maintenance fees after that- all devices, including androids, given they are working hard on hardening the security.
    04-09-17 07:26 AM
  4. anon(9742832)'s Avatar
    An OS subscription costing roughly $250/month?
    Or put together another petition and then to a go fund me page and buy the OS system outright.
    04-09-17 08:05 AM
  5. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Or put together another petition and then to a go fund me page and buy the OS system outright.
    Love to know where someone came up with $250/month figure an OS upgrade?...looking at their gas bill maybe?
    04-09-17 08:23 AM
  6. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Just for comparison, BB employed more than 4,000 people to work on BB10. If it only took 100 or 200, why employ that many people? Apple has more than 7,000 working on iOS, and Google has around 8,000 working on Android. Apple and Google each spend more than $1B per year on maintaining their platforms.

    My estimates are for half of that, even though BB has more work to do, having been out of the game for 2.5 years and having no existing team. In other words, my numbers are very optimistic.

    The reason Apple and Google and Microsoft can sell their software so cheaply is because they each have hundreds of millions of customers. How many BB10 users are willing to pay significant money to update BB10 for their existing devices - especially when it will take at least 2 years before this work would be ready?
    04-09-17 09:26 AM
  7. drobbie's Avatar
    BB10 is dead
    04-09-17 09:32 AM
  8. djsvet's Avatar
    I would pay $1000 only for updated Q10, no bigger than classic.

    Posted via CB10
    04-09-17 09:47 AM
  9. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Just for comparison, BB employed more than 4,000 people to work on BB10. If it only took 100 or 200, why employ that many people? Apple has more than 7,000 working on iOS, and Google has around 8,000 working on Android. Apple and Google each spend more than $1B per year on maintaining their platforms.

    My estimates are for half of that, even though BB has more work to do, having been out of the game for 2.5 years and having no existing team. In other words, my numbers are very optimistic.

    The reason Apple and Google and Microsoft can sell their software so cheaply is because they each have hundreds of millions of customers. How many BB10 users are willing to pay significant money to update BB10 for their existing devices - especially when it will take at least 2 years before this work would be ready?
    Got any references for those numbers? Apple and Google each have a lot of frying pans in the fire. Blackberry has focused on one or two. Can one reliably know with any certainty how those numbers (if accurate) are specifically broken down? I would imagine ABC keep those numbers fuzzy, with grey delineations.

    Though I still wonder about that position ...if i take my cellphone partner (BB10) to the Apple or Google store, can they refuse to sell to me, if i want to buy something, and I'm not even talking about weddings, just a piece of pie, and can the major apps players only supply those two retailers exclusively (given their market dominence), by bypassing the common web/html market altogether? Just an interesting thought exercise in terms of commerce.

    Continuing to support bb10 and pre-bb10 at a reasonable annual fee does several things (its like health insurance)
    ...it relieves the angst of not knowing whether BlackBerry will totally ditch, it won't, but it relieves the worry and the well-poisoning of competitor agents and the media.....you think Trump has problems with the media?....if Trump was a BlackBerry they would all be saying Trump died before the November elections, and they would still be shovelling dirt in the hole today...despite the fact he was sitting in the Whitehouse.
    ... it relieves users, that some major security hole will be uncovered and left unpatched.
    ... it incentivizes BlackBerry to continue to carry the ball on modest enhancements (no it wouldn't add revolutionary smell censors to the next maintenance release, or holographic projections for its video-conferencing software). It will be replacing the shingles when they wear to harden the OS from the elements, and maybe some small really useful upgrades, the entertainment system or some plumbing, and tidying up the house. It will not be rebuilding the house. The house is solid, it not a mansion - but it doesn't have to be.
    ... it incentivizes BB10 and pre- users who might balk (I doubt it) to move on to consider a newer Blackberry device (whether Android or BB10), because it will maintain its stellar reputation of long term OS support (some others in the industry have terrible reputations)
    ...it maintains a third way for cellphone purchasers

    I don't know the real numbers (it depends on exactly what you want to do), I suspect you may not either - we'll take it for what it is, a suggestion (of modest support), because we could endlessly argue without actually knowing all the facts of the situation (because I don't) (like how much work is really needed to keep the biosphere humming, and how big he biosphere is. etc).
    Thank you one and all...
    -Flame out :-)
    04-09-17 05:06 PM
  10. joeldf's Avatar
    Got any references for those numbers? Apple and Google each have a lot of frying pans in the fire. Blackberry has focused on one or two. Can one reliably know with any certainty how those numbers (if accurate) are specifically broken down? I would imagine ABC keep those numbers fuzzy, with grey delineations.
    Troy has known the ins and outs of those BlackBerry numbers for years. I trust his guesses much more than most because he knows where those numbers are.

    Joel
    04-09-17 05:53 PM
  11. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    Got any references for those numbers?
    Just to give you an slight idea, Apple is currently looking for 141 mobile software engineers on Indeed alone. That's a lot of positions to be actively looking to fill.
    04-09-17 06:10 PM
  12. Drael646464's Avatar
    Coding is more about total hours, than individual coders. And it depends on the size of the project.

    Security and bugfixes could very much be a skeleton crew. Probably even updating the runtime would be no more complex than adding new features. Testing on multiple hardware platforms makes things more complex. If you were to say "everything but passport and classic are no longer supported", it would considerably speed things up.

    There's no way an BB11 will happen for sure, that's too big a project.

    Micorostf nt 4, for an example, took 200 man years to develop. That's two men programming for 100 years, or 200 men for 1 year. Programmers don't get paid pennies either. It took 10,000 man years to write internet explorer 3. 90 man years for the original windows program.

    A modern mobile OS, a new edition filled with change UI, new features, changed core software etc. Its too much for a crowdfunded project. It's too much for a charity consumer faith builder.

    They could potentially give it one limited, last tweak of some sort. But if its that skeletal, there's no guarantee it will be 100% compatible with everyones devices. Testing and bugfixing would be limited.

    Best you can really hope for is minor tweaks, and security revisions, maybe some small new feature, or perhaps the 4.4 runtime at best. And I don't think any of that well happen, cash gifts or not.

    Something like blackberry's assistant seems like a considerable waste of past man hours in retrospect. I mean, its not a bad piece of software, but in the assistant wars, and considering speech recognition, machine learning etc...they didn't have a hope of being competitive.They could have easily updated the runtime instead. A 5.0 runtime would have increased BB10's longevity a lot more. But I guess they had an all in attitude at the time. And what company cares about longevity lol.

    I think this argument is really resolved by ignoring the work involved and focusing on this instead : people aren't going to pay for it. No way.

    If BB had some extra cash, and decided to be extra loyal to its customers, it might happen that some minor tweaks and updates occur, in service to the recent customers. But a kickstarter on this would fail. As would a subscription model.

    People are just going to go to other platforms. If they don't like android, there are three other viable platforms, still receiving the support BB10 isn't.

    That's what I recommend to anyone else not knowing where to go. There are a handful of options with different merits. Good thing its not just one choice.

    If BB feels extra kind after a bumper year of keyone and software sales (as if!), maybe they'll throw their old customers a bone. But that's pretty doubtful, I don't think they'll be shedding too many tears considering the lean years they have had.
    Last edited by Drael646464; 04-10-17 at 05:43 AM.
    04-10-17 05:29 AM
  13. Drael646464's Avatar
    Small projects you can do with a small crew. A totally new version number of an OS? No, that's a big project. Twenty people, two years might be pretty darn optimistic even skeleton (40 man years, less than the primitive first incarnation of windows). And even with that low estimate, I doubt you'd have much quality control given the number of different bb10 phones.

    You _could_ community source an idea like that if it were popular enough. But even projects like Ubuntu, and sailfish are built on commercial investments, and bb10 isn't popular enough to get people doing it all for penny's. If it was turned over as open source, to the public, it might have a shot via that means. BUT, bb won't do that because all their past security IP is hidden within.

    Just move on. Don't like BBdroid? Pick iOS, sailfish, or Windows 10 mobile. iOS has keyboard add ons and great software, sailfish has good privacy, runs a commandline and is open sourced, windows has good productivity workflow (like continuum, outlook/Cortana or the mail app) and gets a steady slow of updates. Figure out whats important to you in a phone, and cut your loses.
    04-10-17 05:56 AM
  14. eshropshire's Avatar
    Prem/Fairfax has effective control of the company through BlackBerry debt that he owns which is senior to any common shareholders. How do you think he was able to demand Chen be hired as CEO?

    Posted via CB10
    Because the Board did everything they could ro sell the company and found no buyers. Don't know throw out the specious argument that Lenovo was prevented buying BlackBerry by the Canadian government. Lenovo's history shows they are not afraid of challenging Governments. Lenovo looked at BlackBerry's finacials and did not even try and buy BlackBerry.

    Prem was willing to lend BlackBerry a lot of cash that was required due to almost all of Blackberry's cash at the end of 2013 was committed. BlackBerry needed cash to fund operations until they could become more liquid in 2014. In 2013 and 2014 BlackBerry was burning through tons of cash.

    The Board all agreed to hire Chen and support his plan to turn BlackBerry into an enterprise software company. If Board members did not agree they would have left the Board. Board members have a fiduciary duty to the company. Just because you don't agree do not assume Board members do not support Chen.
    04-10-17 06:54 AM
  15. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Because the Board did everything they could ro sell the company and found no buyers. Don't know throw out the specious argument that Lenovo was prevented buying BlackBerry by the Canadian government. Lenovo's history shows they are not afraid of challenging Governments. Lenovo looked at BlackBerry's finacials and did not even try and buy BlackBerry.

    Prem was willing to lend BlackBerry a lot of cash that was required due to almost all of Blackberry's cash at the end of 2013 was committed. BlackBerry needed cash to fund operations until they could become more liquid in 2014. In 2013 and 2014 BlackBerry was burning through tons of cash.

    The Board all agreed to hire Chen and support his plan to turn BlackBerry into an enterprise software company. If Board members did not agree they would have left the Board. Board members have a fiduciary duty to the company. Just because you don't agree do not assume Board members do not support Chen.
    I do agree. That was my point. Prem's infusion was necessary and he used as leverage to get Chen hired. The BOD supports Chen and Prem as they should.

    Posted via CB10
    eshropshire likes this.
    04-10-17 07:03 AM
  16. eshropshire's Avatar
    Those are all fair comments. Admitedly, none of the failed promises you speak of occurred under the current CEO.

    And often apps don't need changes. There are a number of games that have been directly ported from android or ios with no or little modification. Apps too. Often apps have 'their own look'.

    And the app store is growing. Really fast. I'm sure its more than doubled in size in two years. Probably tripled. Plus for developers its not just some small third mobile platform. Its the thing a quarter of desktops are running, and an increasing number of tablets. At least for big developers, even a decent amount of time spent makes sense.

    I think the main reason windows marketshare of mobile has recently sunk (really only the last year or two mainly), is because they specifically abandoned nokia, the route of being a hardware company, and focused primarily on tablets and desktops for the first two years of windows 10 release.

    They intentionally, and justifiably focused on other things. And its paid off. Fastest growing tablet segment (when android is shrinking - understandable IMO, iOS has the slight edge software wise, and you feel that software quality more on a tablet), and fastest desktop windows adoption ever....

    Now that may be harsh to phone consumers, but I am sure anyone can see it makes business sense. Phones will likely eventually become tablets anyway. And its not on those tiny screens where people crave the sort of power, for gaming or tools Microsoft excels in. On tiny screens low rent software makes more sense.

    The current windows phone market is more geared towards the prosumer. And I am sure they will be pretty happy with the arm win32 emu, seeing as desktop software has a power a) they want b) only windows will be able to provide.

    I get that windows mobile users might be peeved. But commercially win mobile isn't an attempt to win total market hardware dominance anymore. Its a software project that is a small part of the greater windows 10 on any device plan. But they do have plans that very much include mobile, wearables and more. They've demo'd the emu, and plenty of windows insiders have used the creators update. So, we know, for sure, this year huge updates are coming.

    You can't really expect win32 to run well on an old nokia with 1gb of ram. You shouldn't reasonably expect a phone without the right connectivity could do continuum. So of course, those early models are a little underspec for everything that's coming. Old Samsung users won't be getting the update to android 7.0 either.

    Perhaps, when tablet sized screens fold into the pocket, regular folk will start to crave that power and depth. Maybe they'll want to play modern warfare instead of candy crush. Or run a full browser rather than a slim version of one.

    Its all commerce in the end anyway. Not friendship.

    If your a prosumer, and want a conventional slab type device the wait and see shouldn't be long. Creators update is probably this month, Redmond 3 late this year.

    Trial yourself an Idol 4S or HP elite x3 running that, when Redmond 3 comes out, or watch some reviews (techaltar is excellent, thorough, OS agnostic), and you'll have a good idea what the promise delivery is.

    There's UI updates and win32. Both of those will be more than interesting to see in action.
    Show me the statements from Satya Nadella supporting Win 10 Mobile and Microsoft's commitment. He has stated his key mobile strategy is to make Microsoft's applications and services run on iOS and Android. Since he has taken Microsoft's products and services have all been developed not only to support iOS and Android, they have better support on these platforms than on Win 10 Mobile.

    Nadella is very well aware the Microsoft BOD fired Balmer because of the complete failure of the Win mobile. The MS Board has no appetite to lose billions on mobile. Most importantly Microsoft's embrace of iOS and Android is paying off big divideds. Microsoft's decision to sell Samsung Android phones demonstrates Microsoft's embrace of Android.
    04-10-17 07:07 AM
  17. Drael646464's Avatar
    Show me the statements from Satya Nadella supporting Win 10 Mobile and Microsoft's commitment. He has stated his key mobile strategy is to make Microsoft's applications and services run on iOS and Android. Since he has taken Microsoft's products and services have all been developed not only to support iOS and Android, they have better support on these platforms than on Win 10 Mobile.
    Well that's going to be pretty hard to do, given its obviously hush hush on some level. They develop windows 10 rom, to flash on android arm device the xiaomi mi 4, as a partnership with xiaomi - no word as to what the application actually is, literally "no comment", no tangible profits. They announce windows win32 emulation on ARM, demo it, no word on mobile application whatsoever. They patent keyboard case for a mobile phone, no word on matching phone. They continue to roll out really more regular updates than any other platform, and two major updates this year.

    Is there a commitment? No, there's not. CEO has said simply, and dismissively "mobile is not a priority". But there is a serious amount of obvious investment. If I was a win mobile user, I wouldn't be sure if my OS was going to be replaced with a more centralised windows 10 platform or not. I would know however, Microsoft hasn't actually given up on windows 10 on small screen devices. And that much is also obvious by the whole out in the open philosophy of windows 10, one core, the entire vision of a 'hardware independent OS that can power the internet of things"

    Microsoft isn't planning on beating the other competitors in the smartphone slab game IMO. They are hoping to leapfrog them.

    Nadella is very well aware the Microsoft BOD fired Balmer because of the complete failure of the Win mobile. The MS Board has no appetite to lose billions on mobile. Most importantly Microsoft's embrace of iOS and Android is paying off big divideds. Microsoft's decision to sell Samsung Android phones demonstrates Microsoft's embrace of Android.
    Microsoft and Samsung developed the flexible OLED screen together, and jointly own the patent. Samsung make windows products, Microsoft sell Samsung products. Windows developed the only DeX compatible apps for Samsung, despite DeX being kind of a similar product (albiet for a different audience) as continuum.

    Samsung and Microsoft are in bed, because they both hope to get a leg up over google and apple. Its natural business. They both want up, so they work together with other power players as a way to hedge their bets, and plan for the future.

    Nadella's strategy is not just a short term one, as people arm chair analysts tend to think about technology. Microsoft has made many statements suggesting just this, and describing their vision for one core, and the internet of things. Such a vision would be impossible without a small screen UI for the OS, and a no screen UI for the OS, both of which are agknowledged to be holes in the vision (and at least some of which, in the form of win mobile, should be addressed this year, UI updates are a part of creators update for mobile, and likely redstone 3 as well).

    It's not so much that Microsoft has a commitment to windows 10 smartphone users (Microsoft has a pretty fair policy on EOL, they always give fair warning - windows 10 is on the block until they renew - like a TV show, or a lease), its more that they have a new branding vision, the includes wearables, smartphones, tablets, smart home devices and everything inbetween, where their only hardware contributions are essentially demos.

    It's miles away from the nokia fiasco, and a forward thinking philosophy and branding, thats leading a lot of people to call Microsoft "the new apple". I can see fair comparisons between Nadella and Jobs actually. Both are striving for something, beyond simply the marketplace. There is a sense of values behind the ideas.

    If they make some major release on mobile, it can't just be a tweak. If they release a phone, it can't just be a phone.

    It has to be presented with the same sort of excitement the new surface, the studio or the hololense was. Or Microsoft 10 when it was released. It has to be a fresh thing, a move forward.

    I can totally understand their combination of furious software updates for windows mobile users, unusual suggestive investments, and complete radio silence on what is actually around the corner.

    A dull release in this area would be death, and as you say, the stockholders would not like it. Sure, the marketplace and mobile phone users both don't like this much. But there is a long game at play here. Someone trying to take in the board, instead of looking at the individual pieces. It's honestly not really much like Microsoft has ever been in the past. It's not purely enterprise, its as much focused on gaming, and creativity. Taking the core strengths of MS, and turning them, steve jobs style, into values, into branding.

    Myself, I am quite excited about what MS is doing in games.

    Just recently the surface robbed the iPad of the JD power customer satisfaction survey. Creativity and precision design used to be apples space. So much focus on the soon to slow premium phone space, I wonder did they forget about the dwindling mac. I mention this, the fastest growing area of tablets, because its...hip. The early adopters like young tech saavy people and Asian markets are feet first into this hybrid deal. Apple and Samsung are both essentially copying them with the pro, and tab a.

    Which again, is why a dull windows mobile update would be death. Why plaining announcing some kind of next step wouldn't work. Its contradictory to their hype. Whatever happens with the mobile platform. It's gotta be more like a steve jobs unveiling. And he always kept those quiet beforehand.

    Anyway TLDR - MS has no promises of win 10 mobile, but some form of small screen device is clearly part of their one core strategy/vision, they roil like a locomotive with updates, and this year new features, and they have made some quite suspicious investments in related areas (working on the snapdragon windows arm EMU with QUALCOMM, making the ROM for xiaomi, even continuing to deliver major updates at all). It's clearly not dead.

    If it was dead, they'd be burning money, and making promises that will make them look stupid (like being hardware independent as an OS). No company would intentionally do those things. They have stuff up sleeve, they have plans, one might even guess with some accuracy what they are given both the investments and the broad talks of vision, they are just so focused on the long game, it's more important they do it right.

    I guess we'll hear about some more new updates for win 10 mobile soon enough, redstone 3 has started development. There's a few decent changes to the platform already coming this month in creators edition. Whatever Microsoft has up their sleeve it can't be too far off. When it comes, I am sure the rumour mill will churn.

    In the end, slab phones are just a phase of technology, not an end point. People will always want mobile devices, but the form they take, that is guaranteed to change. Probably quite soon, especially given the oled graphene screen prototypes. You want a tech company to be as committed to the future as the are to the present and the past.
    Last edited by Drael646464; 04-10-17 at 08:37 AM.
    04-10-17 07:47 AM
  18. JSmith422's Avatar
    Yes. Might go to $2000 or the cost of building a new PC.


    Posted via CB10
    +1

    But I'm not going to bother to explain why. It'll just get picked apart by the BlackDroid folks. It's not even fun anymore.

    I love Crackberry, but the constant "hate" for BB10 from the same three or four people has really made me lose interest in these forums. We get it, you like Android, you need apps, Google privacy/security issues don't bother you, you think BB10 is dead and cannot be revived. Even if everything you say is true (which I don't believe it is) do you have to rain on our parade, especially when a question is specifically about bb10?

    Did you all see the video of the gentleman being physically dragged from the United Airlines flight last night because United overbooked? If not, then check it out, it's all over the Internet. I can't speak for anyone else here, but that's pretty much how I feel when I come to Crackberry to talk about BB10. "Oh you're the one bb10 user left? You WILL comply and move to Android, or we WILL drag you out of here"

    The android folks will deny it, say they're just offering opinion, conjecture, and conversation, but they often end up monopolizing the thread and alienating the bb10 folks...I'll probably even be banned from the site now for saying it..I jest - sort of.

    Just my opinion, and I've been told I'm entitled to it. =)

    Posted via CB10
    04-10-17 03:53 PM
  19. Elephant_Canyon's Avatar
    Did you all see the video of the gentleman being physically dragged from the United Airlines flight last night because United overbooked? If not, then check it out, it's all over the Internet. I can't speak for anyone else here, but that's pretty much how I feel when I come to Crackberry to talk about BB10. "Oh you're the one bb10 user left? You WILL comply and move to Android, or we WILL drag you out of here"
    Wow, little overdramatic, don't you think? The two situations aren't in any way even remotely analogous.
    04-10-17 04:11 PM
  20. curver2's Avatar
    Would you spend 1000$ for a new BB10 Device to save BB10s future?
    Absolutely. And I'm perfectly happy with the state of BB10. I don't need no stinkin apps. Actually, I've been thinking why not make BB10 devices Porsche Design exclusive. That way OS team can focus on keeping the core features of BB 10 upto date: Hub, Browser, Security. I would definitely pay twice that much for materials, design and the exclusivity of using BB 10 which puts it in the PD price range anyway.
    04-10-17 04:18 PM
  21. tdyhedge's Avatar
    Wow, little overdramatic, don't you think? The two situations aren't in any way even remotely analogous.
    No, they are analogous... The guy on United felt entitled too, I'm sure, even though there were no seats available. People here feel entitled tor something more from BlackBerry just because they bought a phone. Free stuff, never-ending support, you name it....
    04-10-17 04:21 PM
  22. thurask's Avatar
    Mmm, that's good melodrama.
    04-10-17 04:22 PM
  23. JSmith422's Avatar
    Wow, little overdramatic, don't you think? The two situations aren't in any way even remotely analogous.
    Haha, of course it's overly dramatic....that was the point. =)

    Posted via CB10
    04-10-17 04:47 PM
  24. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    No, they are analogous... The guy on United felt entitled too, I'm sure, even though there were no seats available. People here feel entitled tor something more from BlackBerry just because they bought a phone. Free stuff, never-ending support, you name it....
    No one's tried subscription maintenance (not helpdesk support) (like life insurance) before. Don't subscribe, don't get the security upgrade enhancements. Period. Simple enough for microsoft and Blackberry's niche, who aren't paying for enterpise services with BB10 or two year-old+ androids.
    Passenger? Serves him right? Don't know the details (good dilemma for the airline to be in, oversold) , But I do know that there are more than two Airlines serving the flying consumer, and more than two Jet builders (though dominated by two), others are profitable niche players as well. BB10 doesn't really have to be dead in terms of major upgrades. The analogies show otherwise...no visionary with deep pockets stepped up, they were too afraid for some reason, BB10 wasn't dead, it wasn't given a long enough runway to take-off on, and Airports refused to give it landing rights (Netflix etc..).
    04-10-17 04:53 PM
  25. JSmith422's Avatar
    No, they are analogous... The guy on United felt entitled too, I'm sure, even though there were no seats available. People here feel entitled tor something more from BlackBerry just because they bought a phone. Free stuff, never-ending support, you name it....
    Fwiw, the guy on United did have a seat, which he paid for, and was ticketed and assigned by United...and he was then randomly bumped so that United could replace him with their own employee who was flying standby to Louisville, and physically dragged across the floor during his exit.

    But that wasn't the point. The analogy wasn't about Blackberry and United. In fact, the point had nothing to do with blackberry or their offerings or United for that matter. It had to do with Crackberry and the tone of the threads lately. It was simply the mental imagery of a guy (analogous to BB10 user) being dragged out of the group (analogous to being scoffed at in the Crackberry forums) by those in authority (analogous to certain BlackDroid users).

    Crackberry is no longer a place to discuss BB10 without being hounded and "beat up" for your decision to do so.

    Yes, it was a dramatic analogy. Intentionally so, for effect. =)

    I'm merely saying that these forums used to be supportive, but the move to Android has obviously caused a divide within the BlackBerry user base and the tone of these forums has now become combative....

    Even if BB10 is (unofficially) dead, shouldn't Crackberry still be a place where users can still discuss BB10 without the conversation always turning into "you don't know what you're talking about, stop being a fanboy, just accept bb10 is dead and move to Android."

    I'm just sayin'....

    Posted via CB10
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    04-10-17 05:17 PM
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