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  1. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    There is a little thing called communications. Emails, texts, call quality. This is why we all are still using BB10 except for those trolling.

    Posted via CB10
    It can't even do those well anymore. I use app from phone.com to answer my business line and make calls from my business line when not in the office. I started with this company line back in 2009 using my 9000, then my 9700 and finally my 9900 with no problems. The BB10 version on my Q10 was a port that was no longer available for the 7 other BB10 devices I acquired over the last four years.

    Email sucked for like 18 months. I had to enter my own bcc email address manually to myself each time I sent an email to myself. With BBOS7 this was automatic. This feature was finally reintroduced with 10.2 or 10.2.1.

    Texting, sure, but I can't do that with clients since all communication must be archived..

    Not trolling, just reality and why BlackBerry has 0% market share.

    Posted via CB10
    04-04-17 08:56 AM
  2. conite's Avatar
    Why would they dump windows 10, when its on 25% of desktops, 5% of tablets, ~1% of phones and the windows stores is growing like an oak sapling?
    Current sales figures has Android at 88%, and iOS at 12%. Microsoft has become statistically zero in the mobile space.

    As a matter of fact Android has now become the number one operating system in the world. It has surpassed Windows desktop.
    04-04-17 08:59 AM
  3. kvndoom's Avatar
    Current sales figures has Android at 88%, and iOS at 12%. Microsoft has become statistically zero in the mobile space.

    As a matter of fact Android has now become the number one operating system in the world. It has surpassed Windows desktop.
    He doesn't understand the difference between Windows 10 on the desktop and Windows 10 mobile.
    04-04-17 09:23 AM
  4. Drael646464's Avatar
    Current sales figures has Android at 88%, and iOS at 12%. Microsoft has become statistically zero in the mobile space.

    As a matter of fact Android has now become the number one operating system in the world. It has surpassed Windows desktop.
    As someone who works in tech, I am well aware of OS market shares. The free product android is the most common OS. Apple makes the most money. Most android manufacturers struggle to make anything. When the negative growth hits, and the uptake period is over, that whole castle is going to tumble down in terms of the top two as well.

    Googles product isn't android. Its its advertising platform, google search, and all the data they mine.

    And these days, its the assistant wars that will decide the future of search engine dominance, a war that has barely started.

    But that wasn't my point. My point is that

    1) windows 10, as an operating system, from a software company, is growing. Fast. So is the windows store.
    2) windows 10 mobile wasn't at all microsofts priority or interest for the past two years, since windows 10 came out, and mobile market share hasn't even been slightly their interest, in the past two years.
    3) They are only just now getting around to the fermentation of their windows 10 mobile plan. The Redmond 3 update. What has existed until now, is more or less an alpha. When Redmond 3 comes out, win32 desktop software is possible, and users also gain access to chrome stores great extensions.

    There would be zero sense at all, in abandoning something that is underdeveloped
    (windows 10 mobile), and just about to receive the first major update since its creation, something that must have taken serious investment with developing with QUALCOMM.

    And there is zero sense at all, in abandoning windows mobile at all. Unlike the other players they don't need mobile share to develop their app market. Its growing without it, due to tablets and desktops, and their market strategies.

    And most importantly, you can take this as a TLDR; the ENTIRE vision for windows 10, and the whole company of Microsoft regarding windows 10, is an OS that can run on any hardware. It's nowhere near there yet, but this is the whole mission, the whole enchilada. That obviously includes smart devices, smartphones, wearables, smart homes, screenless devices and so on.

    They won't abandon that vision because the new vision is making Microsoft successful again under the new CEO. People do not fire CEO's that make more money.
    04-04-17 09:24 AM
  5. kvndoom's Avatar
    BlackBerry current ownership has deeper pockets than old BlackBerry. Old management took most of there money out when company was a lot more healthy and had a lot more cash.

    If BB10 was really worth anything, Microsoft has the money to buy, then build and support. They would just dump what's left of W10M. Even Microsoft is going the Android route now.

    Posted via CB10
    Microsoft felt Minecraft (2 Billion dollars ) was a better investment than BB10 apparently.
    04-04-17 09:25 AM
  6. Drael646464's Avatar
    He doesn't understand the difference between Windows 10 on the desktop and Windows 10 mobile.
    Or.

    You don't understand windows 10 at all.
    04-04-17 09:25 AM
  7. nabeel-bb-user's Avatar
    Dude Drael don't you have like, a job or something...

    Posted via CB10
    04-04-17 09:29 AM
  8. Drael646464's Avatar
    Dude Drael don't you have like, a job or something...

    Posted via CB10
    Self-employed
    04-04-17 09:31 AM
  9. nabeel-bb-user's Avatar
    Ah, I see. Good deal.

    Posted via CB10
    04-04-17 09:35 AM
  10. stlabrat's Avatar
    win10 or others, unified OS for both handset and table top, tablet do have advantage. the eco system that build up slowly...
    04-04-17 09:38 AM
  11. Drael646464's Avatar
    Microsoft felt Minecraft (2 Billion dollars ) was a better investment than BB10 apparently.
    To be fair, minecraft is a pretty good investment. And bb10 isn't. I love the interface but you'd be hard pressed to make it successful now as a free open sourced operating system
    04-04-17 09:42 AM
  12. conite's Avatar
    windows 10, as an operating system, from a software company, is growing. Fast.
    Hmm.

    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-04-17 09:50 AM
  13. kvndoom's Avatar
    Even better is that they gave it away free for an entire year and it still only has half of Windows 7's desktop share.

    https://www.netmarketshare.com/opera...10&qpcustomd=0
    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-04-17 10:12 AM
  14. kvndoom's Avatar
    Or.

    You don't understand windows 10 at all.
    By all means, enlighten me... tell me something that all the technology websites I read, three Windows 10 computers in my household, and Lumia 640 I keep in my desk haven't opened my eyes to.
    04-04-17 10:14 AM
  15. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    That's an interesting chart. Where does the data come from? PC sales? Internet traffic?

    Obviously, Windows used to enjoy near monopoly status among consumers, and we know that has changed. But I have never felt comfortable recommending Chrome to my business clients. Microsoft's business offerings are just too robust and affordable.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    elfabio80 likes this.
    04-04-17 10:18 AM
  16. Drael646464's Avatar
    Well, its the fastest adopted desktop OS from Microsoft historically. Its the fastest growing segment of the tablet market too.

    The graph you put up, essentially charts the growth of android, leading up to the market saturation, and subsequent negative growth that everyone knew would happen for years. If you take the non-existant android, and chart its growth, and compare everything as a comparison to that, in proportion, well duh, it'll look like a massive drop.

    The desktop market has slumped a bit, but not that much. And smartphones are just about to. All that really happened, and we knew it would, is that smartphones caught up, and got a bit more popular than desktops.

    5 years ago people knew more people would own smartphones than desktops. Right now, I know negative growth will bite apple and samsungs butt soon too, just as saturation hit the desktop market.

    Remember IBM? They don't even make desktops any more. Desktops went through exactly the same growth boom. Everything does.

    This graph is news to me, like the colour of mud is news to me.
    Last edited by Drael646464; 04-04-17 at 10:30 AM.
    04-04-17 10:19 AM
  17. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    That's an interesting chart. Where does the data come from? PC sales? Internet traffic? How does one even compare a PC OS to a mobile one?!

    Obviously, Windows used to enjoy near monopoly status among consumers, and we know that has changed. But I have never felt comfortable recommending Google's OF to my business clients for PCs. Microsoft's business offerings are just too robust and affordable.

    Posted with my trusty Z10


    Posted with my trusty Z10
    04-04-17 10:20 AM
  18. Drael646464's Avatar
    By all means, enlighten me... tell me something that all the technology websites I read, three Windows 10 computers in my household, and Lumia 640 I keep in my desk haven't opened my eyes to.
    Sure, the philosophy of windows 10, is to create an OS that is hardware independent, and can run on any type of machine. Watch, fridge, phone, desktop. The internet of things, incoming. That is the total vision of Microsoft for the OS.

    Smartphones are obviously a small part of that, as is windows mobile, hence the major updates this year. You implied windows 10 was distinct from windows 10 mobile. Both are part of the same thing, a growing product, that is yet incomplete.
    04-04-17 10:24 AM
  19. Drael646464's Avatar
    What would make it compete and more telling, is if you

    a) put in standard market predictions, the consensus amongst analysts of where it will go
    b) put in the historical context of windows doing exactly the same thing, and then slumping.

    You have to get adoption, saturation, the phases of tech markets etc.
    04-04-17 10:28 AM
  20. Drael646464's Avatar
    Reading some people opine, you'd think that tech was this frozen in ice thing, with no development, where at some point you just declare the winners and nothing ever changes.

    Try telling that to nokia, IBM, blackberry OR apple when they were about to go bust, or google or microsoft when they were working from a garage.

    The next big thing will take the throne, and then the thing after that. No winners are declared at any point, and any currently massively grossing company can go down the toilet if they play their cards wrong. Its a strategy game that doesn't end until you run out of chips. And even then, not really. Look at nokia - boom, bust, sold, re-established, starting up again in the budget sector.

    Apple could easily still go bust. I think google could probably survive if someone destroyed their search engine with a vastly superior conversational platform/assistant, given they have other holdings. But they could change radically.

    Windows 10 is in its infancy. I believe their market strategies will pay off even more than they have, just like I believe BB will continue to flop. I like both companies. But I could be wrong. Time only will tell.
    04-04-17 10:38 AM
  21. stlabrat's Avatar
    BlackBerry current ownership has deeper pockets than old BlackBerry. Old management took most of there money out when company was a lot more healthy and had a lot more cash.

    If BB10 was really worth anything, Microsoft has the money to buy, then build and support. They would just dump what's left of W10M. Even Microsoft is going the Android route now.

    Posted via CB10
    not sure about the 1st sentence: BB has no debt until those guys showed up.
    as for microsoft, the bad taste of nokia still long lasting. I don't think they are going to buy BB, unless to find a way to drive down the price, send a ceo over?
    04-04-17 11:26 AM
  22. eshropshire's Avatar
    Hard to know what to believe of rumours.

    The Redmond 3 update should be available to some current windows 10 mobile users, which basically gives them the same new stuff as the win32 emu. You'd have to have a recent phone though to get the update.
    So they say. Show me the Microsoft support for Mobile at their Build conference or the MS World Wide Partner conference. John Chen has been more supportive of BB10 than Satya Nadella has been about Win 10 Mobile. His stated strategy is to sell Microsoft Sevices and applications on iOS and Android. Microsoft just announced they are going to sell the Galaxy S8 Android phone in Microsoft's stores.
    04-04-17 03:34 PM
  23. eshropshire's Avatar
    BlackBerry current ownership has deeper pockets than old BlackBerry. Old management took most of there money out when company was a lot more healthy and had a lot more cash.

    If BB10 was really worth anything, Microsoft has the money to buy, then build and support. They would just dump what's left of W10M. Even Microsoft is going the Android route now.

    Posted via CB10
    Blackberry ownership has not changed. The company is a publicly traded company.
    04-04-17 03:41 PM
  24. Drael646464's Avatar
    So they say. Show me the Microsoft support for Mobile at their Build conference or the MS World Wide Partner conference. John Chen has been more supportive of BB10 than Satya Nadella has been about Win 10 Mobile. His stated strategy is to sell Microsoft Sevices and applications on iOS and Android. Microsoft just announced they are going to sell the Galaxy S8 Android phone in Microsoft's stores.
    That's because it has a Microsoft edition, pre-loaded with wunderlist, office, Cortana and the full Microsoft suite. Samsung and Microsoft are good friends. Samsung has a windows hybrid, and most likely will make a windows phone flagship eventually. They co-developed and co-own the patent to the all important flexible graphene OLED screen, so their partnership runs pretty deep.

    Putting a Microsoft software product by a hardware partner in the window store is pretty standard these days.

    You are right though, Chen jumped into nokia, and when they replaced him the new CEO needed to do things differently (stockholders). One of the obvious changes was how badly they failed at playing phone manufacturer. The new CEO has gained economic ground, and his vision for things like Cortana as an app system, Microsoft as a tool provider and gaming provider, and the porting suites for UWP, even the win 10 mobile on arm, seem pretty business inspired to me.

    So they switched gears back to software company, and downplayed windows mobile. It is however a vital part of the windows 10 vision, to be able to run windows on every type of device. And they put considerable effort with QUALCOMM into the win32 on arm emu, and have listened to UI grips.

    Even the creators edition, which has been previewed has windows 10 mobile UI updates. Fairly minor (like folders in the tablet mode interface), but still. Windows 10 mobile gets its major updates this year. Although, as with any new features some phones may be left behind. I doubt something with 1gb of ram is going to be able to run chrome or desktop applications. Really those need at least 2gb, more like 3gb.

    I'd understand if many windows 10 mobile people felt abandoned though. They have been quite intentionally put aside for two years. Which is a long time in the mobile world, and after the windows 10 update, it must have felt like they were never going to get any attention.

    Politics really.
    Last edited by Drael646464; 04-04-17 at 08:46 PM.
    04-04-17 08:23 PM
  25. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Samsung has said many times it doesn't want to be tied to android. I think that's almost samsungs mantra.
    Of course they'd rather own their own successful platform than to use someone else's. What business wouldn't? But if it was possible, they'd have done it already. As things stand today, it simply isn't possible. The app/ecosystem issues make it insurmountable. Simply, developers have little interest in supporting a third ecosystem - that just creates 50% more work for them for exactly the same return, because every WinPhone or BB10 user who would have bought their app on WinPhone or BB10 will end up buying it on iOS or Android anyway.

    The only way anything has a chance of beating the iOS/Android duopoly is to have a new, different kind of device created that takes people away from smartphones, or to somehow create some feature that the mainstream consumer considers essential that iOS and Android can't do and can't be made to do. It's hard to imagine the latter situation, so, really, until there is some kind of device (cortical implant?) that completely replaces the smartphone, it's going to be an iOS/Android world. Need proof? Simply look at the desktop/laptop market, where the same 2 companies (Apple and Microsoft) have, between them, owned the market since 1980 - almost 40 years!
    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-04-17 09:45 PM
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