[Slash82]

Hi friends,

I don't get why everyone is rushing for BB10.

For me OS7.X is still perfect!
Awesome perfomance and most secure system ever!

And why they "fail" (they don't really do - but the expections for number of sales were higher) is all because of the devices.

I mean the Bold 9900 had everything to dump the Iphone all the way.
The Blackberry OS is most (besides the awesome keyboard) part of the BB experience, we love!

So tell me, what's a Iphone without that overrated and overpriced appstore?!

But the weak points of the 9900 it didn't let the overtake come true!

IMO: The sales kept down because of:
- the too weak battery (almost no BB user needs a that slim phone. Perfomance > Thiness)

- lack of AF (many people I know really wanted to have in a >500 bucks phone - so they switched

- maybe a Java (BB OS) based videochat software (at least from BB to BB).

So if that things had been realised in OS7 devices - I don't know what OS 10 could do better?!

It's not really that the current OS is behind (only in the gaming point) - for me it's more about the hardware!

Don't get me wrong, the new OS7 devices are great - but with a bit of that improvements I wrote above, there wouldn't be that big need of BB10.

What do you say to that?
What are your hopes for BB10?

[Bla1ze]

It's not really that the current OS is behind (only in the gaming point) - for me it's more about the hardware!

And that sir, is where everyone will disagree with you. BlackBerry is essentially running on an OS from 1998. It is and has been.. maxed out for a while now. RIM has never really had an issue with getting people to take on their hardware, their OS however is a totally different story. Many, many people would love to put a BlackBerry in their hands -- the only thing that stops is that tired, old OS.

It's old.
It's crippled.
It's maxed out
It has no life left to give.

Simply put, RIM needs BB10 yesterday in order to survive in today's market. There is very little value left in the current OS and while I can appreciate that many people love it "as is" if anyone thinks RIM should keep on pushing it outside of emerging markets, you might as well just ask them to put a noose around their neck and hang themselves. It would be a less painful death.

[sam_b77]

And that sir, is where everyone will disagree with you. BlackBerry is essentially running on an OS from 1998. It is and has been.. maxed out for a while now. RIM has never really had an issue with getting people to take on their hardware, their OS however is a totally different story. Many, many people would love to put a BlackBerry in their hands -- the only thing that stops is that tired, old OS.

It's old.
It's crippled.
It's maxed out
It has no life left to give.

Simply put, RIM needs BB10 yesterday in order to survive in today's market. There is very little value left in the current OS and while I can appreciate that many people love it "as is" if anyone thinks RIM should keep on pushing it outside of emerging markets, you might as well just ask them to put a noose around their neck and hang themselves. It would be a less painful death.

You really think that BB10 wont be pushed out to "emerging markets"?
I would hazard a bet that the "emerging markets" will drive sales of BB10 too. Taking users from iOS would be a difficult task because a lot of them are invested in the ecosystem . If they switch they will have to leave their books, music etc.
In "emerging markets" very few people are invested in the Apple or Android ecosystem so selling a new product to them is easier .



Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk

[Bla1ze]

You really think that BB10 wont be pushed out to "emerging markets"?
I would hazard a bet that the "emerging markets" will drive sales of BB10 too. Taking users from iOS would be a difficult task because a lot of them are invested in the ecosystem . If they switch they will have to leave their books, music etc.
In "emerging markets" very few people are invested in the Apple or Android ecosystem so selling a new product to them is easier .



Sent from my BlackBerry 9900 using Tapatalk

I never once said they wouldn't, nor gave any indication that was my thinking. Not even sure how you drew that conclusion from what I did say.

Also, you are correct about Apple.. however, not so much about Android.

Android is expected to consume 80% of the Indian, African, and Chinese markets due to the fact they can basically give it away by offering consumers lower-end devices and proliferate the market with them. Google already has these plans laid out, it's just a matter of time before they put it into action. They're not even going after the smartphone market, they want to kill off the feature phone market by matching prices and making it all a low-end smartphone market.

Apple however, can't do that due to the fact they need to maintain profit margins on the devices. Same for RIM, they still money back on their devices in those markets. Google makes money just by their handsets existing and eyeballs looking at them, Google doesn't sell Android, they sell ad space on Android phones.

[hurds]

And that sir, is where everyone will disagree with you. BlackBerry is essentially running on an OS from 1998. It is and has been.. maxed out for a while now. RIM has never really had an issue with getting people to take on their hardware, their OS however is a totally different story. Many, many people would love to put a BlackBerry in their hands -- the only thing that stops is that tired, old OS.

It's old.
It's crippled.
It's maxed out
It has no life left to give.

Simply put, RIM needs BB10 yesterday in order to survive in today's market. There is very little value left in the current OS and while I can appreciate that many people love it "as is" if anyone thinks RIM should keep on pushing it outside of emerging markets, you might as well just ask them to put a noose around their neck and hang themselves. It would be a less painful death.

I disagree with a lot of what you say here. There is still a lot of value left, I really don't know how anyone can't see that. Just wait and see, BB7 is going to be around for a long time and its going to make RIM a lot of money, even in North America. Not every needs a massive screen battery hog, although reading posts here youd think everyone in the world was a mid-20s male tech geek that will only buy the newest highest spec device (which may work out in RIMs favor). I definitely disagree RIM needed BB10 devices out yesterday. Wouldn't matter with the perception in NA, people would whine about something no matter what since BB isn't the media portrayed tech darlings Google or Apple. I'm glad you're not in charge of RIM.

I agree BB OS is old but if people actually want a phone and not an app-launger, BB7 is better than anything out there. For me, I don't even need to wait for BB10 since I already have QNX on the PB. The 7 inch screen, $2 hdmi cable and speakers of the PB are better for media than any phone. And despite what is rammed down our throats, the PB does have apps. Just not as extensive catalogue as android or iOS. I have 168 non-side loaded on mine and theres still plenty I haven't found and more to come.

I'm thinking I'll have my BB7 device for a long time. They should ramp up BB7 advertising and hold off on BB10 for at least a year.

[hurds]

I never once said they wouldn't, nor gave any indication that was my thinking. Not even sure how you drew that conclusion from what I did say.

Hes just trying to make you feel like RIM.

Also, you are correct about Apple.. however, not so much about Android.

Android is expected to consume 80% of the Indian, African, and Chinese markets due to the fact they can basically give it away by offering consumers lower-end devices and proliferate the market with them. Google already has these plans laid out, it's just a matter of time before they put it into action. They're not even going after the smartphone market, they want to kill off the feature phone market by matching prices and making it all a low-end smartphone market.

Apple however, can't do that due to the fact they need to maintain profit margins on the devices. Same for RIM, they still money back on their devices in those markets. Google makes money just by their handsets existing and eyeballs looking at them, Google doesn't sell Android, they sell ad space on Android phones.

I wonder how well their business model works in foreign markets. I dont really think Google has any plans, its kind of up to the OEMs. I'm sure Microsoft is happy if what you say is true.

[Bla1ze]

I disagree with a lot of what you say here. There is still a lot of value left, I really don't know how anyone can't see that. Just wait and see, BB7 is going to be around for a long time and its going to make RIM a lot of money, even in North America. Not every needs a massive screen battery hog, although reading posts here youd think everyone in the world was a mid-20s male tech geek that will only buy the newest highest spec device (which may work out in RIMs favor). I definitely disagree RIM needed BB10 devices out yesterday. Wouldn't matter with the perception in NA, people would whine about something no matter what since BB isn't the media portrayed tech darlings Google or Apple. I'm glad you're not in charge of RIM.

I agree BB OS is old but if people actually want a phone and not an app-launger, BB7 is better than anything out there. For me, I don't even need to wait for BB10 since I already have QNX on the PB. The 7 inch screen, $2 hdmi cable and speakers of the PB are better for media than any phone. And despite what is rammed down our throats, the PB does have apps. Just not as extensive catalogue as android or iOS. I have 168 non-side loaded on mine and theres still plenty I haven't found and more to come.

I'm thinking I'll have my BB7 device for a long time. They should ramp up BB7 advertising and hold off on BB10 for at least a year.

Just because I said they need it out yesterday, doesn't mean I think they should do it. BB10 needs time to bake, RIM has produced enough half baked things in the past. There is a need for it to be out, there is no need for it to be rushed out the door broken to hopefully fulfill the desires of the few. I also never said BB OS would just up and disappear either, you're talking over 10 years worth of the OS out there in the hands of the consumers but you won't see a push for it any more when BB10 arrives unless it's buy 1 get 3 free, lol.

[Bla1ze]

Hes just trying to make you feel like RIM.



I wonder how well their business model works in foreign markets. I dont really think Google has any plans, its kind of up to the OEMs. I'm sure Microsoft is happy if what you say is true.

Google has plans.

http://www.androidcentral.com/eric-s...ote-now-online

And during that keynote Eric Schmidt highlighted the fact they were indeed working with OEM's directly to beat the prices down. The OEM's in those areas are leaders of the pack. Huawei, MicroMax, Motorola, Samsung, Spice, and ZTE have all seen massive growth with Android in those markets and plan on continuing to expand upon every market possible. Google has even gone so far as helping carriers build out their networks in emerging areas with their own funding.

Schmidt said that Google’s OEMs were working on sending Android phones into the $100-150 territory, with the eventual goal of reaching the $70 price point. All these figures are for phones sold independently of carriers, with no contracts and an unlocked connection to mobile networks.

Now stop it, you're making sound like an Android fanboy or something, lol.

[Bla1ze]

PS: Even RIM gave up on their JDE to a certain extent. There was a reason for that, just like there is a reason they are cleaning house in Waterloo of those who worked on what will soon be referred to as legacy systems. Look at the list of people who are no longer there. They mostly all contain people with Java backgrounds. Out with the old, in with the new. For better or worse.

[howarmat]

I disagree with a lot of what you say here. There is still a lot of value left, I really don't know how anyone can't see that. Just wait and see, BB7 is going to be around for a long time and its going to make RIM a lot of money, even in North America. Not every needs a massive screen battery hog, although reading posts here youd think everyone in the world was a mid-20s male tech geek that will only buy the newest highest spec device (which may work out in RIMs favor). I definitely disagree RIM needed BB10 devices out yesterday. Wouldn't matter with the perception in NA, people would whine about something no matter what since BB isn't the media portrayed tech darlings Google or Apple. I'm glad you're not in charge of RIM.

I agree BB OS is old but if people actually want a phone and not an app-launger, BB7 is better than anything out there. For me, I don't even need to wait for BB10 since I already have QNX on the PB. The 7 inch screen, $2 hdmi cable and speakers of the PB are better for media than any phone. And despite what is rammed down our throats, the PB does have apps. Just not as extensive catalogue as android or iOS. I have 168 non-side loaded on mine and theres still plenty I haven't found and more to come.

I'm thinking I'll have my BB7 device for a long time. They should ramp up BB7 advertising and hold off on BB10 for at least a year.

not when devices are getting EOL they wont. Sure if they keep making OS 7 devices but not if they kill off devices.

And with that last line you are either clueless or really in secret wanting RIM out of business cause in a year without OS 10 that is probably where they will be

[Bla1ze]

not when devices are getting EOL they wont. Sure if they keep making OS 7 devices but not if they kill of devices

Torch 9850/60 - EOL
Curve 9380 - EOL
Bold 9790.. Well heck, that didn't even make it to US carriers

And these are the NEW devices.

[howarmat]

^^exactly...BB10 will be RIMs main focus for NA

[belfastdispatcher]

Rim needs BB10 to have a presence in the high end market, me, I'm fine wit BBOS for another 2-3 years or longer. Expecially now that I have a PlayBook.

I'm afraid i will not like BB10 unless it runs a BBOS player, similar to the Android player.

I'm not ready to give up BB app integration and customization.

[Slash82]

Hi friends,
First of all:
Thank you for ALL your replies!

I'm not saying that it isn't time for a bigger change! OS10 surely will be awesome! It's a new basis with a lot of possibilites!

But it's not the fact, that the current, java-based version is that bad everyone (especially the press) says!
It's still an awesome user experience!
Sure there is a lack of apps...

But I don't really see why RIM should be that far behind - if it really is!
It's still the most secure plattform a smartphone has ever seen!

And there is still potential - like I wrote above!
Videochat would be possible.

And I'm absolutely convinced, that the 9900 would have been a greater success with a stronger battery, AF (over slim design) and videochat!
It would have grabbed other plattforms like iOS and droid devices on their nuts!

There is not big need for doublecore with that!

Just compair how great there battery lasts with a 1230mAh battery and how much less data traffic we have!

Sure, it's time for a OS overhaul - but the current system is still not dead.

Even with OS10 in a 9900 there would be the same complains!
There would be no bigger improvements!

Please tell me what great revolutions gives OS10 which OS7 can't offer?

Dual, quadcore etc. Are still for marketing - IMO!

[Joltcola1234]

Torch 9850/60 - EOL
Curve 9380 - EOL
Bold 9790.. Well heck, that didn't even make it to US carriers

And these are the NEW devices.

These phones have been EOL since they were released anyway, nobody even knows RIM has full touch screen phones outside of CrackBerry.

What exactly is so outdated about OS7 vs. Android/iPhone?

I've got many friends with an iPhone or an Android phone, and I don't see the differences other then the available apps. Each phone seems to have certain features another doesn't, but I don't see the major deficiency in any of them.

[BoldPreza]

Actually I disagree about the software being dead. Its failure was because RIM boxed itself in several times during the launch. When they should have been selling the upgraded features they let slip that BB 10 would be just around the corner. They were aiming for 2011 launch I believe at that point.

The OS is quick, fluid, pleasing to the eye and can be customized through the use of themes. Plus it has an excellent browser now.

Then they let slip that OS 7 phones couldn't be upgraded anyway so you would essentially be stuck if you got one.

It was missing key hardware features that people want(FFC being one) and had a features no one in North America uses(NFC). This is just the Bold I am talking about but this was supposed to be their flagship and in terms of its launch they basically didn't pull abreast of the competition(legitimately they were a generation behind) and told consumers buy now but be prepared to buy again cause well we're cutting you off shortly.

I love Blackberry but that would definitely kill confidence in a brand/product.

[BoldPreza]

These phones have been EOL since they were released anyway, nobody even knows RIM has full touch screen phones outside of CrackBerry.

What exactly is so outdated about OS7 vs. Android/iPhone?

I've got many friends with an iPhone or an Android phone, and I don't see the differences other then the available apps. Each phone seems to have certain features another doesn't, but I don't see the major deficiency in any of them.

Realistically if there was a larger adoption of the 9850/60 apps would have become available for it that the Android and iPhone had. This phone was most likely to hold the line against the other platforms but they handicapped it several times.

The name was wrong. No NFC, No FFC, and seriously, when last was it in a Blackberry ad? Had this launched as the Revolutionary new Storm 3/Onyx/Ignite/Illuminate with the above mentioned features and a full advertising campaign Blackberry wouldn't be where it is now. I am almost certain of it cause when people see my phone and hear that its a Blackberry they get a little excited.

[BlackBerry Guy]

IMO, it's the thought that "things are good enough the way it is" that got RIM into the position they're in today.

There are certain things about the old java based OS that no amount of modern hardware can fix. Among them being having to do a reboot when deleting or updating most apps, the spinning clock when trying to do more than 2 things at once (yes, it even happens on the 1.2ghz devices), the memory leaks...you know, all those little quirks we BlackBerry owners love

[llllBULLSEYE]

RIM needs BB10. Its gonna be new and fresh and Rim will do all it can to make sure almost all the major apps will be there. This is gonna be the first full bezel phone and There is no other OS like it. Its gonna be powerhouse phone with a new chip thats gonna have great battery life and LTE. Its gonna run smooth along with Cascade and the best HTML5 support. Probably the first SuperPhone. In
How can we not want this asap from RIM?
I am happy with OS7, but Im sure I'll be much happier with OS10

Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

[lnichols]

The need for BB10 sooner is to stop the loss of existing BB users in NA, and hopefully start creating an upward trend. OS7 simply isn't doing this. For me it is the best platform for my requirements, but unfortunately my requirements don't seem to be what the majority of smartphone buyers requirements are these days. I'd like my BB to do more than it can, and I'm hopeful that BB10 will bring me everything my OS7 device can do now, and be a much better media consumption and app platform, and get more developers behind it, but it fills the need to haves more than the competition at this time for me.

[xandermac]

You think Apples app store is overpriced? Most apps are cheaper on iOS than the BB and you get a much better quality app. (Need for speed shift for example, IM+ as another) IM+ used to be $39.95 on the BB while it was $9.99 on iOS, they recently priced the BB version at $9.99 also but it took a long time. Yeauh, I'll stick to Apple's overpriced store I guess.

The current BB devices just can't compete, that's why they need BB10. The flagship 9900 doesn't even have a front facing camera! Is that because of the limited OS7? We don't really know because none on the devices have a front camera let alone the flagship. The 9900 also demands a premium price for a pretty limited spec device, is there a wonder they're not selling as well as the better spec'd and more powerful android/iOS devices.

The apps are overpriced, which might change with BB10 seeing as better quality android apps will arrive to compete with the limited BB apps. Hopefully BB developers will be forced into a price war that has been a long time coming (5.99 for bebuzz with incremental PAID updates! Unheard of on iOS).

BB10 is desperately needed for RIM to stand a chance of competing, you might be happy with OS7 but for the majority of buyers it just doesn't cut it.

Hi friends,

I don't get why everyone is rushing for BB10.

For me OS7.X is still perfect!
Awesome perfomance and most secure system ever!

And why they "fail" (they don't really do - but the expections for number of sales were higher) is all because of the devices.

I mean the Bold 9900 had everything to dump the Iphone all the way.
The Blackberry OS is most (besides the awesome keyboard) part of the BB experience, we love!

So tell me, what's a Iphone without that overrated and overpriced appstore?!

But the weak points of the 9900 it didn't let the overtake come true!

IMO: The sales kept down because of:
- the too weak battery (almost no BB user needs a that slim phone. Perfomance > Thiness)

- lack of AF (many people I know really wanted to have in a >500 bucks phone - so they switched

- maybe a Java (BB OS) based videochat software (at least from BB to BB).

So if that things had been realised in OS7 devices - I don't know what OS 10 could do better?!

It's not really that the current OS is behind (only in the gaming point) - for me it's more about the hardware!

Don't get me wrong, the new OS7 devices are great - but with a bit of that improvements I wrote above, there wouldn't be that big need of BB10.

What do you say to that?
What are your hopes for BB10?

[brucep1]

I disagree with a lot of what you say here. There is still a lot of value left, I really don't know how anyone can't see that. Just wait and see, BB7 is going to be around for a long time and its going to make RIM a lot of money, even in North America. Not every needs a massive screen battery hog, although reading posts here youd think everyone in the world was a mid-20s male tech geek that will only buy the newest highest spec device (which may work out in RIMs favor). I definitely disagree RIM needed BB10 devices out yesterday. Wouldn't matter with the perception in NA, people would whine about something no matter what since BB isn't the media portrayed tech darlings Google or Apple. I'm glad you're not in charge of RIM.

I agree BB OS is old but if people actually want a phone and not an app-launger, BB7 is better than anything out there. For me, I don't even need to wait for BB10 since I already have QNX on the PB. The 7 inch screen, $2 hdmi cable and speakers of the PB are better for media than any phone. And despite what is rammed down our throats, the PB does have apps. Just not as extensive catalogue as android or iOS. I have 168 non-side loaded on mine and theres still plenty I haven't found and more to come.

I'm thinking I'll have my BB7 device for a long time. They should ramp up BB7 advertising and hold off on BB10 for at least a year.

Try again.
'Be Bold' is a bust: Ad blitz didn't help BlackBerry 7 sales in Feb

[xandermac]

I agree BB OS is old but if people actually want a phone and not an app-launger, BB7 is better than anything out there.

That's the thing, they want both, they want it all and the current BB doesn't come close to delivering what the competition delivers.

[Bla1ze]

What exactly is so outdated about OS7 vs. Android/iPhone?

I've got many friends with an iPhone or an Android phone, and I don't see the differences other then the available apps. Each phone seems to have certain features another doesn't, but I don't see the major deficiency in any of them.

More to it then just apps.

Rebooting after a new app install.. nothing like a clock of doom spinning away, random reboots just for simply answering a call, how about a device that just up and commits suicide in the middle of the night, randomly losing all your BBM contacts, wiping itself out with nothing but system errors. I could go on.

All those and more are core problems of the OS being arcane and done.

Let me tell you a very small, and simple story. It's not to hate on BlackBerry. I love RIM and BlackBerry, I do however want them to do better and create compelling products but here is the straw that broke the camels back so to speak for me and made me realize RIM needed to move on from BB7.

My son doesn't live with me, every night he calls me.. until one night he called, he called, he called and he called.. I never answered. He got worried, left about 5 voicemails asking "Dad, I called... why didn't you answer?" by this time, he was upset and crying. I never answered because for the first few calls, my BB never rang.. never sent my voicemails and eventually, when it did ring and I did answer, it kept rebooting itself over and over. That day, I realized my BlackBerry was no longer a reliable device for me. I still use it daily for email, BBM, Twitter but that's about it. I no longer rely on it for calls, I have other devices for that -- ones that I can say have never left me stranded and never leave my son crying on my voicemails because his dad can't answer his phone because it's not working.

If you've never experienced something like this, then good -- I'm glad. But for anyone to believe that RIM is fine with BlackBerry 7 and they can sit around raking in profits (dwindling profits at that) from that and be fine is akin to sticking your head in the sand and ignoring the problem at hand. RIM did this. They ignored the iPhone, they ignored Android and now, they're struggling to correct their mistakes of resting on their laurels for so long. Even RIM knows it's time to move on from the Blackberry OS as we know it.

[Slash82]

@ Bla1ze:
Sad to read that story, but I have never had such problems. Not with my 8700, not with my 8900 and not with my 9900.
Sure, I had a nuked BB but that happened just 2 times - with Blackberry protect and a saving copy of my BBM contacts it was never that big deal.
Just reloading the OS within a few minutes and restoring my BBM contacts from my memorycard.

I also have got some iPhone friends and Droid friends.

They also had software crashes and whats worse - they sometimes not get Emails.
Also their messengers hangup more often than my BB ones...

I also have no problems to restart my device after upgrades or installations.
I can live with that.

But what really annoyes me is the fact, that RIM put in only a 1230mAh battery - why not 2000mAh?
Or the lack of a decent AF cam.
Sure, the cam is ok - but compaird to my 8900 it's a massive step back.
A thicker device? No problem - that's why I have a 9900, a high end device.
It's not about thickness, it's about performance!

With a frontfacing camera and a videochat software (maybe a BB solutuion within the blackberry system and a PC/Mac version of it) would have been a stunning device!

The email and security are still awesome!

IMO RIM just brought it out to late!
I wish they had such things (like touchscreen and a good HTML5 browser) back in 2009, when the 9700 came out.
They would never had so many people that went to other plattforms.

Sure, BB10 will be an awesome step forward! But with a more stabil version of the current OS side by side it would be the perfect solution.

And no ringtone sounds - sounds like a software issue for me.
Apple had the same problem with the start of iOS5 - with an update they solved it.

And also IMO BB10 will have problems when they launch it at the end of this year.
Like they had with the playbook!
It took a whole year to bring out a working emails solution.
But then it was too late!
Many people still think it's not that good as it is!
If RIM has the same problems with OS10 it would not be good, because it will ever be a "crappy" OS - people often rembemer such things for a looooong time!
Even if they are wrong with that thoughts!

That's why I think it is very important for OS7 to get more love!
It's still awesome!
The 9900 (and other OS7 devices) could offer "more" as they do - people would love it, I'm sure!
That are mostly hardware things.

And a blackberry is all about it's OS.
Not like other plattforms about apps.
Different market...