[aboldcurve]

They did try that early, btw. I work for a top 5 bank. They wanted our app. They offered us money and phones, as did Microsoft.

They (BB and Microsoft) missed the point. We make money when people deposit their money with us and when they use our cards and borrow money from us. That's our focus as a business, not trying to pick up a few extra users on the side by getting some other company to subsidize that support for us. SnapChat, similarly, is singularly focused on growing their network. That's their business. Anything else is a waste of time.

Again, if Chen walked in here and pitched this idea, any of us would point out that our app works perfectly fine on the Priv and the other new phones in Chen's pipeline.

Valid point and I appreciate the explanation, I just figured if we handled the cost of development and support then the user base would ultimately grow.

Posted via CB10

[keliew]

Sometimes it isn't as easy as throwing money at companies to develop software. It's much more than that.

BlackBerry Passport via CB10

[Bluenoser63]

Yeah that makes sense, I would just figure if we put the cash up front, it would make it worth their while to at least allow access, and have developers whether independent or from BlackBerry take it from there. That's what I'd be doing if I were Chen.

Posted via CB10

That would be the smart play by BlackBerry before they released BB10. They didn't do what they needed to roll out the new platform. BlackBerry management has no clue how to support 3rd party development nor the consumer market. And don't believe those who say that there is nothing BlackBerry could offer to get them to support the app. They had to write off a billion dollars of Z10s. If they paid the big 10 a couple of million dollars to write the app and cover the expenses and a million dollars a year to support the app, they would have sold a lot more phones and been in a better position.

[Bluenoser63]

Sometimes it isn't as easy as throwing money at companies to develop software. It's much more than that.

BlackBerry Passport via CB10

Actually is really is that simple, what software company is going to turn down money if the money makes them profit. That would be stupid.

[keliew]

Actually is really is that simple, what software company is going to turn down money if the money makes them profit. That would be stupid.

"If the money makes them profit". What if it doesn't? What if the money that comes in from BlackBerry is only for a year or two "to test the market"? That's a year or two lost of development time in other apps that's more sustainable.

They could also most likely earn more developing on other platforms. A project manager could decide that throwing more developers into a particular app would slow down development and time to market. A developer may also decide why spend time on a platform that doesn't have market reach. S/he could develop more apps, equals more revenue, than focusing on one app which takes up more development time.

It's endless...

BlackBerry Passport via CB10

[app_Developer]

Actually is really is that simple, what software company is going to turn down money if the money makes them profit. That would be stupid.

But most apps people want aren't made by software companies.

They are made by social networking companies and advertising companies and banks and retailers. These companies didn't become successful at this scale by doing every little odd job that makes a million or two. Good companies focus their time and effort on their own customers and what they want.

Microsoft always offers a lot of money for apps. Many people turn them down. I would make no sense for us to spend time maintaining an app for them (even if they paid us)

[keliew]

Point is, they are late. If they have spent these few years ago, they could have made it happen...

Not now.

They need a different strategy.

BlackBerry Passport via CB10

[app_Developer]

Valid point and I appreciate the explanation, I just figured if we handled the cost of development and support then the user base would ultimately grow.

Imagine just the reputation risk alone. What if the BB10 app isn't working properly and someone's mortgage payment doesn't post on time? Covering the cost of development is only the beginning.

We all want to own our user experience and we feel accountable that it should work to the best of our ability. We aren't going to outsource that responsibility to BlackBerry.

I get what you're saying, and Apple had the same problem in 2008. They also had no users. But they didn't pay people to make apps, instead they allowed us to make completely cool apps that our own customers really enjoyed. They then applied their distribution, marketing, and advertising skill to help. That's a much better strategy.

[psskid]

I think he meant Buick

Ya. That's it...

Posted via CB10

[kvndoom]

Actually is really is that simple, what software company is going to turn down money if the money makes them profit. That would be stupid.

Plenty of companies will turn down profit if it's not enough relative to where those resources could be going. Apple was still making a crapton off the ipod Classic but scrapped it because it was their lowest performer.

And when it comes down to it, what will benefit Netflix/instagram/whoever the most? Having 10 guys on a BlackBerry 10 team, or putting those same 10 guys on the IOS/Droid/Roku teams? Sure the BlackBerry App would make them profit, but improving and maintaining the real cash cows is a better allocation of personnel. Nobody's going to chase thousands when there's billions to be made.

Passport SE, "The BlockBerry" - Cricket Wireless

[Bluenoser63]

"If the money makes them profit". What if it doesn't? What if the money that comes in from BlackBerry is only for a year or two "to test the market"? That's a year or two lost of development time in other apps that's more sustainable.

They could also most likely earn more developing on other platforms. A project manager could decide that throwing more developers into a particular app would slow down development and time to market. A developer may also decide why spend time on a platform that doesn't have market reach. S/he could develop more apps, equals more revenue, than focusing on one app which takes up more development time.

It's endless...

BlackBerry Passport via CB10

No. BlackBerry would be the one developing the app for the other company. No lost development time for the other company and no delay in the company developers trying to learn something new. If there are a couple of good programmers on CrackBerry who can develop apps all by themselves, then BlackBerry could have farmed out the developers for a lot less and quicker than the other company could.

Take the third party developers out of the process and they would just get the money. It would have been lot cheaper than righting off a billion dollars in hardware.

[Bluenoser63]

But most apps people want aren't made by software companies.

They are made by social networking companies and advertising companies and banks and retailers. These companies didn't become successful at this scale by doing every little odd job that makes a million or two. Good companies focus their time and effort on their own customers and what they want.

Microsoft always offers a lot of money for apps. Many people turn them down. I would make no sense for us to spend time maintaining an app for them (even if they paid us)

Yeah. Lots of companies turn down a million dollars or two in profit. LOL. How much money did MS offer? Got the facts? If MS offered them a million or two, can you list the names of the companies that turned them down? I will wait for your facts.

[Bluenoser63]

Plenty of companies will turn down profit if it's not enough relative to where those resources could be going. Apple was still making a crapton off the ipod Classic but scrapped it because it was their lowest performer.

And when it comes down to it, what will benefit Netflix/instagram/whoever the most? Having 10 guys on a BlackBerry 10 team, or putting those same 10 guys on the IOS/Droid/Roku teams? Sure the BlackBerry App would make them profit, but improving and maintaining the real cash cows is a better allocation of personnel. Nobody's going to chase thousands when there's billions to be made.

Passport SE, "The BlockBerry" - Cricket Wireless

If I was running BB when BB10 was getting ready to be released, I would have spent the money and offered the resources to the app owners so they would not use any resources of their own, other than to provide the documentation for the APIs which is common. And the 10 guys (it would only be a couple of guys at most anyway) would be BlackBerry developers who already know the programming language and the best way to program the app. It would get to market faster and have inside resources and get the results faster and the app out quicker. So anything that BlackBerry offered would be pure profit and no one would turn that down.

[Laura Knotek]

Yeah that makes sense, I would just figure if we put the cash up front, it would make it worth their while to at least allow access, and have developers whether independent or from BlackBerry take it from there. That's what I'd be doing if I were Chen.

Posted via CB10

Microsoft tried that, and it didn't help Windows Mobile market share.

[Bluenoser63]

Microsoft tried that, and it didn't help Windows Mobile market share.

Who did they ask and how much did they offer?

[Laura Knotek]

Who did they ask and how much did they offer?

Microsoft paid Instagram to develop an app. It remained in beta for over a year and never got updated.

Windows Mobile global market share is now at 0.7%.

[app_Developer]

Yeah. Lots of companies turn down a million dollars or two in profit. LOL. How much money did MS offer? Got the facts? If MS offered them a million or two, can you list the names of the companies that turned them down? I will wait for your facts.

Just look at some of the companies that BB and Microsoft wanted apps from:

Netflix
FB
Citi
Amex
BofA
Uber

Do you really think a million in cost offsets means anything to any of these companies? These are not little ISV's. These are all multi-billion dollar companies. More importantly, these are all companies who don't see their app development shops as profit centers. They are not software companies in that respect.

These are all companies who also live and die by the strength of their brands. If BB made a Citi app, it would be Citi's brand on the line. When BB10 dies, it would be Citi who have to tell its customers the app would be pulled. If there was a bug in the app, it would be Citi whom the customer would call. If a user was confused trying to use the app, it would be a Citi branch that he/she would walk into for help.

The long term costs, risks and rewards of maintaining apps are the factors any of us base these decisions on. Weighed against that is the number of users. That's really all there is to it.

[app_Developer]

Microsoft paid Instagram to develop an app. It remained in beta for over a year and never got updated.

Windows Mobile global market share is now at 0.7%.

They also paid at least two large banks that i know of, and same results. The apps never got out of beta because marketshare collapsed in Europe and the US.

[cbvinh]

Yeah. Lots of companies turn down a million dollars or two in profit. LOL. How much money did MS offer? Got the facts? If MS offered them a million or two, can you list the names of the companies that turned them down? I will wait for your facts.

Of course people turn down things if they think they can make /more/ money elsewhere. SnapChat turned down $3 billion for their company when they thought they could make more by not selling out. Just the same, BlackBerry could offer $1-2 million and a company would decline and put those resources into chasing $10-20 million with another platform.

[early2bed]

Uber just raised a few billion from the Saudis at a $62.5B valuation. I wonder how many millions it takes to get their attention enough to develop BB10 apps. And, given that John Chen can't make a profit on smartphones, how many smartphones do you have to sell to pay for it. Then multiply times 20 to get a list of apps that most people would expect but still be missing most of the apps that the user wants.

Forbes Welcome

[Russkii33]

It's not just features or throwing money in adds. It's public perception. Image is everything.

Look at what GM is trying to do with the Oldsmobile brand. You see the commercial with two young girls outside a club. A Olds drives up with a young well dressed man gets out. One girl says. That's an Oldsmobile, the other replies, my grandfather drives and Olds, with the quick reply back. That's not your grandfather. Both girls look at the guy and the car.

Samsung did this a few years ago vs apple. They showed all the older parents trying to be "cool" with their iPhone. All the kids had a galaxy phone. Saying I phones are yesterday news.

Image... they need to yes have the product ready to sell. They need to have front line sales reps know the product with sales incentives. They need an image consultant to make people look at BlackBerry as somehow everyone wants not just wall Street bankers...

Posted via CB10

Buick?

[crackberry_geek]

But what's stopping BlackBerry to going to a company like SnapChat and saying 'we'll pay you this much per month or lump sum for access to your apps' and the BlackBerry development could take it from there. That would seem like a good move to me?

Posted via CB10

What is stopping BlackBerry?

Answer -> The ***** in Chief

[Plazmic Flame]

In the beginning of BlackBerry 10 ,they tried already it didn't work

This thread was over after this post. Pretty much the "short and bittersweet" answer. BlackBerry tried, totted WhatsApp to the fullest before and after it came, now a short time later, they are all jumping off ship which casts doubts in the platforms future. BB10 is being set off to pasture.

[Spykedjadedragon]

I wish that worked when BB10 first came on the scene. I much prefer using BB10 devices to the Priv.... maybe if Blackberry focused on building security apps, end to end encrypted chat and email apps, we would have something...

[Bluenoser63]

Of course people turn down things if they think they can make /more/ money elsewhere. SnapChat turned down $3 billion for their company when they thought they could make more by not selling out. Just the same, BlackBerry could offer $1-2 million and a company would decline and put those resources into chasing $10-20 million with another platform.

A sales of a company does not equate making profit from outside sources.