05-19-18 10:37 PM
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  1. conite's Avatar
    Before McDonald's can sell a hamburger, potential customers must know it exists. If they don't know it exists, McDonald's cannot possibly make a sale.

    McDonald's has the benefit of thousands of physical real estate with big signs. It also advertises.

    Blackberry has no physical presence and no advertising. The only thing itt gets is minor media attention.

    Unless customers know about it, we can't know whether or not they would buy it and if not why not.

    Posted via CB10
    In technology, compelling products create their own momentum. You need that momentum for marketing and advertising to work. Bb10 never enjoyed any kind of momentum whatsoever. Pouring money into this type of product is like throwing money into a fire.
    08-10-16 01:47 PM
  2. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Unless customers know about it, we can't know whether or not they would buy it and if not why not.
    I am pretty sure the light goes off in my fridge and I am just about as confident that BB10 would not have done well without apps even with big marketing.
    They would have initially sold some more and they would have gotten more returns.
    But go ahead and believe whatever you want.
    I doubt anyone can change you mind.
    Plus its entertaining for the rest of us.
    Last edited by DrBoomBotz; 08-12-16 at 06:56 AM. Reason: fixed a missing not
    JeepBB likes this.
    08-10-16 02:26 PM
  3. markmall's Avatar
    I am pretty sure the light goes off in my fridge and I am just about as confident that BB10 would have done well without apps even with big marketing.
    They would have initially sold some more and they would have gotten more returns.
    But go ahead and believe whatever you want.
    I doubt anyone can change you mind.
    Plus its entertaining for the rest of us.
    You must be much smarter than BlackBerry management. They spent 3 years or so trying to sell BB10 devices when you knew it would fail as sure as your refrigerator light turning off. Did all your comments on the site suggest this since 2012?

    Posted via CB10
    08-10-16 03:15 PM
  4. markmall's Avatar
    In technology, compelling products create their own momentum. You need that momentum for marketing and advertising to work. Bb10 never enjoyed any kind of momentum whatsoever. Pouring money into this type of product is like throwing money into a fire.
    Thank you, professor. All those years of business education were wasted I guess.

    I thought that maybe some product lines improve over time as the manufacturer refines it. How wrong I was. It's better if management gives up just as the product reaches maturity and flushes billions down the toilet. (Heins' building too many Z10s is not an indicator of BB10's cost. It was a one-time management error.)

    Posted via CB10
    08-10-16 03:21 PM
  5. conite's Avatar
    Thank you, professor. All those years of business education were wasted I guess.

    I thought that maybe some product lines improve over time as the manufacturer refines it. How wrong I was. It's better if management gives up just as the product reaches maturity and flushes billions down the toilet. (Heins' building too many Z10s is not an indicator of BB10's cost. It was a one-time management error.)

    Posted via CB10
    The situation was unrecoverable only a few months after launch. BlackBerry knew it, Prem knew it, and every other technology company knew it when they refused to make an offer to buy BlackBerry.


    Priv STV100-1 AAF960 / Q5SQR100-1/10.3.3.746
    JeepBB likes this.
    08-10-16 03:26 PM
  6. Paraliotis3's Avatar
    I dont really care one day it will or even if not nothing happens android is out there Priv , Dtek others to come
    08-10-16 03:33 PM
  7. anon(3983727)'s Avatar
    The situation was unrecoverable only a few months after launch. BlackBerry knew it, Prem knew it, and every other technology company knew it when they refused to make an offer to buy BlackBerry.


    Priv STV100-1 AAF960 / Q5SQR100-1/10.3.3.746
    That is no more fact than any other post made in this thread. I strongly disagree and feel that Blackberry was in a very good position to retain their position in the market but mismanagement and poor product release timing along with complete lack of advertisement killed them. Z10 launch was successful given the fact it was an all new platform. iPhone took 74 days to sell 1 million devices and only just over 6 million total before the 3GS. The z10 easily matched the sales success of the iPhone but with no followup from blackberry it fizzled and died. In fact today still no followup from Blackberry.
    markmall and elfabio80 like this.
    08-10-16 03:48 PM
  8. conite's Avatar
    That is no more fact than any other post made in this thread. I strongly disagree and feel that Blackberry was in a very good position
    We agree to strongly disagree.

    I'll side with BlackBerry, its board, its benefactor, and its non-existent buyers (when they put out the for sale sign).
    Last edited by conite; 08-10-16 at 05:03 PM.
    08-10-16 03:52 PM
  9. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    You must be much smarter than BlackBerry management. They spent 3 years or so trying to sell BB10 devices when you knew it would fail as sure as your refrigerator light turning off. Did all your comments on the site suggest this since 2012?

    Posted via CB10
    I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

    I was pretty sure they were hosed when they hedged their bets with the android runtime(before the launch of BB10).
    I knew when the apps failed to materialise(summer/fall 2013) that BB10 was hosed.
    I started posting that they were hosed a month or two after I noticed the SDK roadmap disappeared.
    StephanieMaks and JeepBB like this.
    08-10-16 04:52 PM
  10. markmall's Avatar
    The situation was unrecoverable only a few months after launch. BlackBerry knew it, Prem knew it, and every other technology company knew it when they refused to make an offer to buy BlackBerry.


    Priv STV100-1 AAF960 / Q5SQR100-1/10.3.3.746
    If Chen knew it coming in and releasing the Classic, the Leap and Passport he sure was a really good actor.

    We've gone over all this already. Getting tiresome. You can't accept that Chen tried with BB10 for years after taking over.
    08-10-16 06:13 PM
  11. conite's Avatar
    If Chen knew it coming in and releasing the Classic, the Leap and Passport he sure was a really good actor.

    We've gone over all this already. Getting tiresome. You can't accept that Chen tried with BB10 for years after taking over.
    He had to drag things along long enough for software to take shape.

    There is no way that Chen and company thought those niche devices would save BlackBerry and completely turn their fortunes around. No one is that dumb.
    JeepBB likes this.
    08-10-16 06:22 PM
  12. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    No one is that dumb.
    That's almost true.
    08-10-16 06:24 PM
  13. anon(3983727)'s Avatar
    He had to drag things along long enough for software to take shape.

    There is no way that Chen and company thought those niche devices would save BlackBerry and completely turn their fortunes around. No one is that dumb.
    Same company released an android device with slide out keyboard at nearly $1000. I think they have no clue. If they wanted to be successful we would have had a z10 successor.
    BEEBEEBEEBEE and elfabio80 like this.
    08-10-16 06:28 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    Same company released an android device with slide out keyboard at nearly $1000. I think they have no clue. If they wanted to be successful we would have had a z10 successor.
    Hardware, ANY hardware is NOT going to save BlackBerry. The software will. Devices are secondary. Android is much cheaper to bring to market - hence why we are still getting devices AT ALL!
    08-10-16 06:38 PM
  15. Kryngle's Avatar
    Hardware, ANY hardware is NOT going to save BlackBerry. The software will. Devices are secondary. Android is much cheaper to bring to market - hence why we are still getting devices AT ALL!
    I swear you either work for Chen, Android, Google or "BlackGoogleBerry, Droid Berry" or whatever.

    Posted via CB10
    BEEBEEBEEBEE and elfabio80 like this.
    08-10-16 07:11 PM
  16. markmall's Avatar
    He had to drag things along long enough for software to take shape.

    There is no way that Chen and company thought those niche devices would save BlackBerry and completely turn their fortunes around. No one is that dumb.
    I am not going to rehash a discussion we already had. Your theory that Chen knew that the company would fail to sell any BB10 devices but released them anyway so that he could churn capital to create cash flow in order to pay for the development of their blockbuster Android app suite is mind-blowingly absurd and shows a complete lack of understanding of corporate finance.

    They had no idea the BB10 devices would flop (notwithstanding not having any marketing support). Do you think that Chen knew the Priv would flop, too? The Priv flopped much worse than the Passport, that's for sure. Did Chen release the Priv in order to lose money while raising short-term revenue?

    Prediction: DTEK will flop magnificently. It will flop, in part, because no one knows that it exists. Do you think Chen knew that DTEK will be flopping two weeks ago but released it anyway trying to raise more capital? To pay for the development of more Android apps?
    08-10-16 07:12 PM
  17. markmall's Avatar
    I swear you either work for Chen, Android, Google or "BlackGoogleBerry, Droid Berry" or whatever.

    Posted via CB10
    I once expressed the exactly same sentiment. Maybe Chen is further along in his IOT push than any of us knew and the first subject for infestation is Mr. conite's melon.
    08-10-16 07:15 PM
  18. markmall's Avatar
    He had to drag things along long enough for software to take shape.

    There is no way that Chen and company thought those niche devices would save BlackBerry and completely turn their fortunes around. No one is that dumb.
    Niche devices? Leap was supposed to be the affordable fleet device. The Classic was supposed to attract millions of former BIS users. Niche because they didn't sell well?

    If niche just means did not sell well, then Priv and DTEK are the ultimate niche devices and will not help Blackberry in the least.
    08-10-16 07:19 PM
  19. conite's Avatar
    I swear you either work for Chen, Android, Google or "BlackGoogleBerry, Droid Berry" or whatever.

    Posted via CB10
    Because I don't agree with you?
    08-10-16 07:30 PM
  20. thurask's Avatar
    I swear you either work for Chen, Android, Google or "BlackGoogleBerry, Droid Berry" or whatever.

    Posted via CB10
    You mean I can get paid for reminding people reality is a harsh mistress? Sign me up!
    StephanieMaks and JeepBB like this.
    08-10-16 07:41 PM
  21. Kryngle's Avatar
    Because I don't agree with you?
    I could care less who agrees with me or not. I'm only speaking for one individual and that is me. I think I'm entitled to that. It just seems to me that you work for Android or Chen the way your always shooting down anybody that makes a BB10 Statement. I could be wrong but it just seems that way. Not starting beef or drama. Just making a statement.

    Posted via CB10
    markmall and BEEBEEBEEBEE like this.
    08-10-16 08:18 PM
  22. Kryngle's Avatar
    You mean I can get paid for reminding people reality is a harsh mistress? Sign me up!
    When you find "their" HR department YOU let me know so I can apply and remind all those folks blinded by an Android device that reads BlackBerry on the front or with just a BlackBerry logo on the back ain't got nothing over other far more superior Android devices besides their "security" protection even though there is a flaw in the OS alongside the other 899 million Android devices. With that being said. I got just one question that only requires a yes or no answer. Nothing more or less. Have you ever seen any BB10 devices... Bump that... Have you ever seen ANY BlackBerry device with a flaw in the OS that would and will allow hackers to hack into them that is a given fact? Only a yes or no answer.

    Posted via CB10
    08-10-16 08:25 PM
  23. conite's Avatar
    I could care less who agrees with me or not. I'm only speaking for one individual and that is me. I think I'm entitled to that. It just seems to me that you work for Android or Chen the way your always shooting down anybody that makes a BB10 Statement. I could be wrong but it just seems that way. Not starting beef or drama. Just making a statement.

    Posted via CB10
    I like BB10 quite a lot, as I continue to use several BB10 devices.

    I'm speaking here only to the BUSINESS decision to move on after staggering losses, with absolutely no hope of recovery.
    08-10-16 08:25 PM
  24. Invictus0's Avatar
    Because its got a pretty awful user experience and Windows is already the "Android of PCs" . Its got a pretty bad track record but its for most people the only option.
    User experience is subjective but user satisfaction on Windows PC (even with 8) is high so I'm not sure I understand the link between the two?

    Microsoft software satisfaction slumps | Computerworld
    08-10-16 08:27 PM
  25. conite's Avatar
    even though there is a flaw in the OS alongside the other 899 million Android devices. With that being said. I got just one question that only requires a yes or no answer. Nothing more or less. Have you ever seen any BB10 devices... Bump that... Have you ever seen ANY BlackBerry device with a flaw in the OS that would and will allow hackers to hack into them that is a given fact? Only a yes or no answer.

    Posted via CB10
    The "flaw" cannot infect a current Android device, because Google Play Services on the device scans for this particular vulnerability.

    On top of that, BlackBerry Hardware Root of Trust will not allow a persistent root.

    On top of that, BlackBerry Integrity Detection would warn if the OS is compromised.

    And even after all of that, the quadrooter malware won't even see your device unless you disable a major security feature of the device.

    As far as BB10 is concerned, no one has ever bothered to spend the resources trying to find holes in drivers, so we wouldn't know of such things. BB10 has resiliency built in too, of course.
    08-10-16 08:32 PM
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