08-16-14 09:13 AM
36 12
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  1. STV0726's Avatar
    -----------------
    OVERVIEW:
    -----------------

    Welcome to the Universal Landscape Support (ULS) Waiting Room!

    What is ULS? The notion that the current state of "Flow" on BlackBerry 10 is impaired by the lack of landscape (orientation rotation) support across the home screen, all default apps, and third party apps.

    This is being created due to "improved landscape" only making the 22nd spot on the CrackBerry Top 25 Improvements wishlist. (Honestly, this is MUCH more important than 22/25, especially considering that SOME of the stuff that CB placed higher on the list is quite likely either out of BlackBerry's full control and/or not related to improving something that is a currently existing but lacking component of BB10 -- in other words, let's fix what we have before we start adding a bunch of stuff!)

    --------------------------------
    OUR S.M.A.R.T. GOALs:
    --------------------------------

    1. Every application (both 1st and 3rd party) as well as every element of the BlackBerry 10 OS GUI (such as the home and active frame screens), with the exception of widescreen-specific apps/games and the phone app, will allow for orientation rotation (can be utilized in either portrait or landscape mode) by December 1st, 2014.

    2. Every 1st party, BlackBerry-made application will support rotation, with the exceptions of Story Maker and Phone, by the release of OS 10.3.

    -----------------
    UPDATES:
    -----------------

    1. Call for landscape improvement only makes spot 22 on CrackBerry's Top 25 list when it is beyond a feature-- it is an aspect of the device and affects how everything we do on the devices operates or "flows".

    2. The first leaked 10.3 does not feature any landscape support improvements. BlackBerry is still changing things that no one is asking for and ignoring the things people are specifically calling for. (Think Priority Hub-- I'd gladly trade the effort that went into that towards ULS, and then they could have prioritized {no pun intended} and added features like Priority Hub which are less crucial to the overall/gestalt experience later on.)

    3. Michael Clewley acknowledged this thread on Twitter, stating that "he gets it." This may be the first acknowledgment of this orientation functionality discrepancy from an official BlackBerry staff member. Unfortunately, it is plausible from his remarks that making the homescreen landscape-supported may be beyond the scope of what BlackBerry is willing to/can reasonably do. Additionally, third party developers need to do their part in making their apps rotation-supported too.

    4. It has been announced that the BBM app will be getting landscape support for 10.3. A small victory--let's keep these improvements coming. Goal updated.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    Last edited by STV0726; 05-09-14 at 06:35 PM.
    03-25-14 04:44 PM
  2. Thalestr's Avatar
    Agreed. This needs to be a bigger priority.

    Posted via Z10
    JTon and STV0726 like this.
    03-25-14 05:04 PM
  3. glamrlama's Avatar
    Waiting. But not holding my breath. PB had "solved" this issue and much of the OS worked well in Landscape. I think we will not see full landscape until a new BB10 tablet arrives
    03-25-14 08:24 PM
  4. RyanGermann's Avatar
    It's a huge deal for "mobile computing". What the heck is the point of having a device with a built-in HDMI and bluetooth keyboard / mouse support if it can't operate in landscape mode? Oh, just let me go rotate my 55" plasma TV <CRASH> oops.

    If there was excellent landscape mode, and a decent HDMI + USB dock, how many of us would just pop our BB10 devices into the dock, switch the HDMI port and be happy to plunk ourselves down in front of our TVs and work away right on the BB10, and rock a movie or two from BlackBerry World? I sure would. I'd pair a bluetooth headset while I'm at it so if a phone call came in, I could just answer the phone without missing a beat.

    Lack of landscape support (when PBOS seemed to lack PORTRAIT support for a while) shows some kind of "cognitive disability" in the BB10 UI design team. The side bezels on the Z30 are too narrow, making swiping "from the bottom" in landscape mode too finicky... and when used with a Mouse, when the device is in landscape mode it doesn't interpret a mouse near the long edge of the screen as being at "the bottom" so... it's just unfinished. So the hardware needs to have side bezels that are, say, 1 mm wider on each side... but as I've said in previous discussions of landscape support, Google tried to go "Portrait Only" on the first Nexus 7 and boy did they hear about it and boy did they fix it fast.

    I get that people want Android apps more easily accessible on BB10... but adding better Android support to BB10 (when there are perfectly good Android tablets available) when BB10 has this native glaring in / dis ability is a textbook case of having your priorities messed up.

    To those who are BlackBerry fans that want Android support FOR THEIR OWN USE above and beyond native BB10 capabilities? Go buy yourself an Android device, too.

    For those of you who want Android support to be improved so that more people will buy BlackBerry devices? I think by the time the mass market starts choosing BlackBerry devices BECAUSE of improved Android Support, Android will have improved a lot that there will be risk of actually losing CURRENT BB10 users to Android: so, let's fix BB10 first.
    03-25-14 08:31 PM
  5. eldricho's Avatar
    Been a while since I've seen any kind of waiting room on CrackBerry

    Posted via CB10
    03-25-14 08:58 PM
  6. svelt's Avatar
    In on this as well. Universal landscape mode is crucial to have a niche as a "mobile computing" OS, i.e. when I have it docked somewhere or when I am connecting it to a larger display via HDMI
    03-25-14 11:23 PM
  7. Brandon Orr's Avatar
    unfortunately, one of my sources from within Blackberry was unsure if landscape would ever come because of some key UI/UX concerns. Most notably, the fact that you can't do the standard swipe up and right to access the hub. Swiping up from landscape is considerably more difficult than portrait. Also, the CPU strain that the hub switching orientations every time the phone did is also a concern. For example, when you go into the hub it's in portrait, turn it landscape and exit the hub, go portrait again and you'll see the hub remained in landscape and has to switch after you've entered. He agreed they should have it and he'd like to see it, but that originally the portrait only homescreen was done on purpose for UI/UX reasons. I personally think that, yes it will be more than a little work to get a landscape UI working well with the same flow and fluidity we get in the portrait version, but I think it's really something that users have been asking for.

    I'd be interested to see if they maintain the OS in portrait and change it to a landscape friendly UI when docked, miracast, or hdmi for a more desktopish experience.
    Uzi likes this.
    03-25-14 11:34 PM
  8. STV0726's Avatar
    It's a huge deal for "mobile computing". What the heck is the point of having a device with a built-in HDMI and bluetooth keyboard / mouse support if it can't operate in landscape mode? Oh, just let me go rotate my 55" plasma TV oops.

    If there was excellent landscape mode, and a decent HDMI + USB dock, how many of us would just pop our BB10 devices into the dock, switch the HDMI port and be happy to plunk ourselves down in front of our TVs and work away right on the BB10, and rock a movie or two from BlackBerry World? I sure would. I'd pair a bluetooth headset while I'm at it so if a phone call came in, I could just answer the phone without missing a beat.

    Lack of landscape support (when PBOS seemed to lack PORTRAIT support for a while) shows some kind of "cognitive disability" in the BB10 UI design team. The side bezels on the Z30 are too narrow, making swiping "from the bottom" in landscape mode too finicky... and when used with a Mouse, when the device is in landscape mode it doesn't interpret a mouse near the long edge of the screen as being at "the bottom" so... it's just unfinished. So the hardware needs to have side bezels that are, say, 1 mm wider on each side... but as I've said in previous discussions of landscape support, Google tried to go "Portrait Only" on the first Nexus 7 and boy did they hear about it and boy did they fix it fast.

    I get that people want Android apps more easily accessible on BB10... but adding better Android support to BB10 (when there are perfectly good Android tablets available) when BB10 has this native glaring in / dis ability is a textbook case of having your priorities messed up.

    To those who are BlackBerry fans that want Android support FOR THEIR OWN USE above and beyond native BB10 capabilities? Go buy yourself an Android device, too.

    For those of you who want Android support to be improved so that more people will buy BlackBerry devices? I think by the time the mass market starts choosing BlackBerry devices BECAUSE of improved Android Support, Android will have improved a lot that there will be risk of actually losing CURRENT BB10 users to Android: so, let's fix BB10 first.
    +100...

    ...but not cognitive disability...

    ...it's actually Head-Up-Their-@55 Syndrome.

    Actually, I think it's a combination of meeting deadlines and improperly prioritizing which led to designing a UI that now won't be so easy to implement landscape since it wasn't designed with universal rotation in mind.

    Again, from what I'm hearing, BlackBerry is willing to improve. I'm guessing all or almost all 1st party, default apps will be rotation supported. But asking for home and active frame screen to support rotation currently seems like wishful thinking, unfortunately.

    Also, third party apps like Spotcast, for example, need to implement rotation. BlackBerry can't force them.

    If we can get it to where almost all apps are rotation supported except homescreen, it won't be horrible. Still not ideal but whatever.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    03-26-14 12:44 AM
  9. STV0726's Avatar
    One more point--

    There are plenty of apps very much like CB10, except they are forced-vertical. CB developers could have made a usage assumption and thought, "Well, for swiping through headlines and viewing posts, who needs landscape?"...

    ...but they didn't. Why can't ALL devs go the extra half a mile and just make their app rotation-supported unless there is a very, very specific reason why not to?!

    To sum the optimal developer rotation philosophy up in one sentence: It shouldn't be why should I allow for rotation; rather, it ought to be why shouldn't I allow it.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    kbz1960 likes this.
    03-26-14 12:52 AM
  10. Brandon Orr's Avatar
    One more point--

    There are plenty of apps very much like CB10, except they are forced-vertical. CB developers could have made a usage assumption and thought, "Well, for swiping through headlines and viewing posts, who needs landscape?"...

    ...but they didn't. Why can't ALL devs go the extra half a mile and just make their app rotation-supported unless there is a very, very specific reason why not to?!

    To sum the optimal developer rotation philosophy up in one sentence: It shouldn't be why should I allow for rotation; rather, it ought to be why shouldn't I allow it.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    Often comes down to the fact that supporting two UI orientations with one code is a bit more work. My app, for instance, is vertical only and it's just a pain going and adding landscape support, especially since it's the type of app people are using while on the go and not really one where people stay in for very long to consume content. Not to mention I haven't received one single request for landscape support. For media apps, games and other content consuming apps it makes much more sense. IMO of course. If the UI did support landscape home screen I may be enticed to add it just to keep my app consistent with the flow of the UI/UX.

    - Developer of PinGuin
    03-26-14 05:31 AM
  11. STV0726's Avatar
    Update check...

    Anything new with 10.3 latest info/software leaks?

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    04-30-14 04:44 PM
  12. VR6's Avatar
    Hey great, I just finished virtually yelling about this. You have my support

    Posted via CB10
    04-30-14 07:01 PM
  13. STV0726's Avatar
    Hey great, I just finished virtually yelling about this. You have my support

    Posted via CB10
    Oh really? To who, may I ask?

    (and thanks for doing that!x

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    04-30-14 11:57 PM
  14. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    +1,000,000,000,000

    I've tweeted, talked, begged, advocated and cajoled devs over supporting landscape, but results have been mixed. One success story is LinkShrink by Jared MacDonald. He updated his once portrait-only app to be universal orientation capable, so some devs will go that extra mile!

    Even better is that devs are baking landscape in as its popularity becomes more widely spread. Devs, it's really important to us!

    Every app that requires typing should support landscape, because landscape makes it easier to type and to watch video.

    Sent from my BB Z10 running OS 10.3.0.140.
    STV0726 likes this.
    05-01-14 02:43 AM
  15. STV0726's Avatar
    Maybe it will take making a list of the "offenders" before we see change.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    05-01-14 10:46 AM
  16. STV0726's Avatar
    And part of it is on BlackBerry dev tools because all apps seemed to "just support" landscape on legacy touch devices (e.g. Torch 9860) automagically.

    Why in the heck we've gone backwards in universality and consistency in design is beyond me.

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    05-01-14 10:52 AM
  17. kbz1960's Avatar
    I'm in. If BBOS can do it so can BB10.
    05-01-14 10:55 AM
  18. VR6's Avatar
    Oh really? To who, may I ask?

    (and thanks for doing that!x

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    Here http://forums.crackberry.com/showthread.php?t=927993

    Posted via CB10
    05-01-14 01:33 PM
  19. STV0726's Avatar
    This thread needs a few servings of humor that, at the same time, further reinforce our point...

    (All original creations)


    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-landscape-bb10-took-blue-pill.jpg

    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-one-does-not-simply-use-landscape-bb10.jpg

    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-particular-skills-but-not-landscape.jpg

    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-i-dont-always-rotate-my-phone.jpg

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    eyesopen1111 likes this.
    05-01-14 02:44 PM
  20. STV0726's Avatar
    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-i-dare-you-release-one-more-update-without-landscape.jpg

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    eyesopen1111 likes this.
    05-01-14 02:46 PM
  21. Bdot-1's Avatar
    God Damn, is this reddit or crackberry. Anyways, both are pretty boring these days. Carry on..

    Posted via a mess called CB10
    05-01-14 10:17 PM
  22. STV0726's Avatar
    Universal Landscape Support Waiting Room-mockit_09052014182821.jpg

    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    eyesopen1111 likes this.
    05-09-14 06:29 PM
  23. STV0726's Avatar
    It's a huge deal for "mobile computing". What the heck is the point of having a device with a built-in HDMI and bluetooth keyboard / mouse support if it can't operate in landscape mode? Oh, just let me go rotate my 55" plasma TV <CRASH> oops.

    Google tried to go "Portrait Only" on the first Nexus 7 and boy did they hear about it and boy did they fix it fast.

    I get that people want Android apps more easily accessible on BB10... but adding better Android support to BB10 (when there are perfectly good Android tablets available) when BB10 has this native glaring in / dis ability is a textbook case of having your priorities messed up.

    To those who are BlackBerry fans that want Android support FOR THEIR OWN USE above and beyond native BB10 capabilities? Go buy yourself an Android device, too.
    I simply must quote your excellent points here and ask people to reread them.

    Don't let the request for full landscape support die out!


    -STV on Z10STL100-3/10.2.1.2228 TMO US
    05-09-14 06:39 PM
  24. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    The lack of landscape support in BlackBerry OS 10 is unacceptable. Are the software developers incompetent? Rhetorical question.

    Posted via CB10 on BlackBerry Q5
    05-11-14 04:18 AM
  25. trsbbs's Avatar
    I agree. BlackBerry once again doesn't get it.

    Great phone, but not in landscape.

    Using a BlackBerry Z10! OS: 10.2.1.3175
    05-11-14 07:27 AM
36 12

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