01-16-20 08:18 PM
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  1. int3h's Avatar
    Is it possible to develop BlackBerry 10 apps for personal use now? I have obtained a debug token, but it is valid only for a year. Is there any way to sign an app that can run without expiry?

    Also, I am thinking of other ways, like using userland gcc and compile apps on the phone. Or if nothing works, just write some web apps.

    Is there any way to a signing key? I have a signing key, but I forgot its password.

    Any ideas on how to get the development going? Also, it sucks that the dev tools do not work on Catalina due to 32-bit Java requirement.
    12-28-19 03:58 AM
  2. conite's Avatar
    Is it possible to develop BlackBerry 10 apps for personal use now? I have obtained a debug token, but it is valid only for a year. Is there any way to sign an app that can run without expiry?

    Also, I am thinking of other ways, like using userland gcc and compile apps on the phone. Or if nothing works, just write some web apps.

    Is there any way to a signing key? I have a signing key, but I forgot its password.

    Any ideas on how to get the development going? Also, it sucks that the dev tools do not work on Catalina due to 32-bit Java requirement.
    Since they will no longer publish new apps, I doubt any new signing keys will be made available.
    12-28-19 10:54 AM
  3. app_Developer's Avatar
    On the Catalina issue, maybe run Linux in a VM? (Last time I had the BB10 SDK running i think I had it on Linux)

    I’ll see if I can dig up my signing key which I’m not using. I think we had 2 or 3 actually. Maybe someone else has one they aren’t using?
    int3h likes this.
    12-28-19 01:34 PM
  4. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    Is it possible to develop BlackBerry 10 apps for personal use now? I have obtained a debug token, but it is valid only for a year. Is there any way to sign an app that can run without expiry?

    Also, I am thinking of other ways, like using userland gcc and compile apps on the phone. Or if nothing works, just write some web apps.

    Is there any way to a signing key? I have a signing key, but I forgot its password.

    Any ideas on how to get the development going? Also, it sucks that the dev tools do not work on Catalina due to 32-bit Java requirement.
    Yes there is! The debug token is the main thing but I believe one can use one's own apps without signing. However, if you're going to develop, why not share with the BB10 community?

    Posted via CB10
    int3h likes this.
    12-28-19 01:36 PM
  5. int3h's Avatar
    On the Catalina issue, maybe run Linux in a VM? (Last time I had the BB10 SDK running i think I had it on Linux)

    I’ll see if I can dig up my signing key which I’m not using. I think we had 2 or 3 actually. Maybe someone else has one they aren’t using?
    Thanks. I am now in the process of setting up Windows via Bootcamp. I came across the post recover code signing key. I will give it a try.

    ... However, if you're going to develop, why not share with the BB10 community?
    Sure. I will share if I get it somewhere
    Last edited by int3h; 12-28-19 at 02:53 PM.
    12-28-19 02:07 PM
  6. Emaderton3's Avatar
    Time machine?
    12-28-19 04:17 PM
  7. HabsFan9860's Avatar
    It would be nice if there were some people who could build some key apps (I wish that I had the time and skills to) because despite the age of the hardware and OS (I currently run a Passport and a Z30 for daily drivers with very heavy use) they perform exceptionally well with what they do. They just don't 'feel old'...my Keyone (thought that I would cash in a 'free' upgrade for one a year or so ago) just doesn't out pace either BlackBerry in tasks I need to do to get through the day...I do use the K1 for Facebook and some YouTube.

    For example, if I had a better Facebook, Linkedin and YouTube apps that were native and not ports or Web versions I would be 100% Z30 and Passport. I do use a few older Android apps (from Cobalts Play Store setup) that work as if they were native on my Z30...a time sheet app and a handful of machine access apps (I'm a millwright). Both phones STILL push through the whole day easily (Z30 gets about 11 hours normally and my Passport will pull down 20-30 hours depending on use on their original batteries.

    I'm hoping that there are still enough clever hardcore users that may start up something...and just as original BlackBerry native apps...I don't mind (as I'm sure others as well) paying for them either.

    Here's to hoping as my phones albeit OLD (in technology years) still just work better than other stuff out there...

    Posted on my Powerful Passport
    bbfanfan likes this.
    12-28-19 07:51 PM
  8. conite's Avatar
    For example, if I had a better Facebook, Linkedin and YouTube apps that were native and not ports or Web versions I would be 100% Z30 and Passport.
    Problem is that most apps, like the ones you mentioned, no longer use public APIs. This means that one cannot make a native app without breaking the law.
    12-28-19 08:36 PM
  9. app_Developer's Avatar
    Yeah, APIs are the issue. Maybe the industrial machines have public (standardized) access?

    For those who don’t know what APIs are, an example: if my app allows a user to reply to a message on FB, then I have to take the reply from my user and I have to actually send that reply to FB on her behalf with her credentials. I need to use a FB API to do that, and those APIs are much more closed now than they used to be years ago. Same with LinkedIn. And remember there are dozens of different things that a user would like to do in a session and the APIs have to support all of them for the app to be useful.
    12-28-19 09:27 PM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Yeah, APIs are the issue. Maybe the industrial machines have public (standardized) access?

    For those who don’t know what APIs are, an example: if my app allows a user to reply to a message on FB, then I have to take the reply from my user and I have to actually send that reply to FB on her behalf with her credentials. I need to use a FB API to do that, and those APIs are much more closed now than they used to be years ago. Same with LinkedIn. And remember there are dozens of different things that a user would like to do in a session and the APIs have to support all of them for the app to be useful.
    Factual accurate information ruins so many BB10 dreams around here.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt and john_v like this.
    12-28-19 09:29 PM
  11. int3h's Avatar
    Ah! Came across this: BlackBerry links Code Signing Keys to BlackBerry ID for developers. So that solves the code signing issue.

    Time machine?
    12-29-19 10:14 AM
  12. Emaderton3's Avatar
    Yeah, APIs are the issue. Maybe the industrial machines have public (standardized) access?

    For those who don’t know what APIs are, an example: if my app allows a user to reply to a message on FB, then I have to take the reply from my user and I have to actually send that reply to FB on her behalf with her credentials. I need to use a FB API to do that, and those APIs are much more closed now than they used to be years ago. Same with LinkedIn. And remember there are dozens of different things that a user would like to do in a session and the APIs have to support all of them for the app to be useful.
    And how secure is this one "someone else" is doing it?
    John Albert likes this.
    12-29-19 11:57 AM
  13. app_Developer's Avatar
    And how secure is this one "someone else" is doing it?
    Yes! That is definitely something people should consider. Especially with some of these “apps” we’ve seen in BBWorld that are nothing more than wrappers around a website. You have to trust the website AND the developer of the app which can now see every single thing you put in, including your password to that site.

    If the app is using official APIs and modern then at least the password will be safe. But I’ve seen banking apps in Chinese app stores that definitely saw people’s banking passwords.
    Last edited by app_Developer; 12-29-19 at 03:01 PM.
    John Albert and Laura Knotek like this.
    12-29-19 02:17 PM
  14. DonHB's Avatar
    Yes there is! The debug token is the main thing but I believe one can use one's own apps without signing. However, if you're going to develop, why not share with the BB10 community?
    Is getting a debug token no longer possible? If so when did it end?
    12-30-19 08:29 PM
  15. DonHB's Avatar
    And how secure is this one "someone else" is doing it?
    FaceBook's leaks, I would guess, is because the access restrictions are implemented in the user interface and not enabled on the servers. Because of this, the API has no restrictions.

    I never looked at the company's SDK/API or delved into its backends, but it makes things much easier if you don't build granular (per user) security in at the foundational level and only have to pretend in the browser.
    12-30-19 08:40 PM
  16. Emaderton3's Avatar
    FaceBook's leaks, I would guess, is because the access restrictions are implemented in the user interface and not enabled on the servers. Because of this, the API has no restrictions.

    I never looked at the company's SDK/API or delved into it backends, but it makes things much easier if you don't build granular (per user) security in at the foundational level and only have to pretend in the browser.
    But at least it is a major company with published guidelines and protocols. QA big difference compared to some guy in his basement writing code.
    12-30-19 08:43 PM
  17. app_Developer's Avatar
    FaceBook's leaks, I would guess, is because the access restrictions are implemented in the user interface and not enabled on the servers. Because of this, the API has no restrictions.

    I never looked at the company's SDK/API or delved into its backends, but it makes things much easier if you don't build granular (per user) security in at the foundational level and only have to pretend in the browser.
    That’s not true. FB creds go all the way back to their service mesh. It’s not that different from the service to service auth on Borg
    12-30-19 09:27 PM
  18. app_Developer's Avatar
    But at least it is a major company with published guidelines and protocols. QA big difference compared to some guy in his basement writing code.
    And the risk is additive. You have to trust FB and the random developer. Both
    12-30-19 09:28 PM
  19. DonHB's Avatar
    That’s not true. FB creds go all the way back to their service mesh. It’s not that different from the service to service auth on Borg
    You lost me. Service mesh and service auth? Also, when did creation of debug tokens end?
    12-31-19 01:04 AM
  20. app_Developer's Avatar
    You lost me. Service mesh and service auth? Also, when did creation of debug tokens end?
    I was addressing the earlier claim that FB's infrastructure doesn't do AAA. It definitely does.

    I don't know when debug tokens ended (of even if they did). I haven't used the SDK in years.
    12-31-19 01:24 AM
  21. DonHB's Avatar
    So, FB built an SDK that bypasses it? Requiring AAA for direct access to backend systems is not the same as having user AAA below the app (including the browser) level. As, I don't care to invest time to investigate further, I'll assume you're correct.
    12-31-19 09:44 AM
  22. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    Is getting a debug token no longer possible? If so when did it end?
    Hey Don,

    I'm pretty sure you can actually still get debug tokens, but I haven't confirmed that. If you're interested I'll see if I can check for you.
    12-31-19 11:20 PM
  23. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    Hey Don,

    I'm pretty sure you can actually still get debug tokens, but I haven't confirmed that. If you're interested I'll see if I can check for you.
    @DonHB

    Just confirmed you can still get debug tokens for BB10 Don. Waiting on confirmation for Playbook and OS 7.

    Just another example of how Blackberry Limited still supports BB10.
    12-31-19 11:31 PM
  24. DonHB's Avatar
    @DonHB

    Just confirmed you can still get debug tokens for BB10 Don. Waiting on confirmation for Playbook and OS 7.

    Just another example of how Blackberry Limited still supports BB10.
    Doesn't work for me. Get "Error creating debug token." Did you use the IDE to get it?
    12-31-19 11:42 PM
  25. DonHB's Avatar
    I tried using USB and Wi-Fi.
    12-31-19 11:47 PM
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