03-01-15 01:13 PM
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  1. birdman_38's Avatar
    I believe its samsung who wants BlackBerry's patents which are ALL software and NOT hardware.

    Thats the main value BlackBerry has. Its in its security algorithms and cryptography and its all, software.
    Yup, software and patents they could use to advance Tizen.

    And keep in mind that BlackBerry established the most extensive carrier relationship network of any smartphone manufacturer in the world, well before Samsung and Apple.
    01-25-15 06:26 AM
  2. The Big Picture's Avatar
    Yup, software and patents they could use to advance Tizen.

    And keep in mind that BlackBerry established the most extensive carrier relationship network of any smartphone manufacturer, well before the Samsungs and Apples of the world.
    Like their carrier support in the US for example?

    Posted via CB10
    gfondeur likes this.
    01-25-15 06:28 AM
  3. birdman_38's Avatar
    Like their carrier support in the US for example?
    As a good example. Many of BlackBerry's carrier relationships are hanging on a thread because of the lacklustre performance of BB10. Carriers are waiting on BlackBerry to strengthen their offering. Not saying Tizen is their answer, but the size and scope of BlackBerry's existing carrier relationships is an asset to any potential suitor or partner.
    01-25-15 06:36 AM
  4. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    It didn't prevent this guy to do a great job bringing them to BB10 - http://forums.crackberry.com/android...g-page-965257/ - so that "deep OS integration" doesn't seem to be such an impossible obstacle to climb.
    The "deep integration" required to distriubte with Google services isn't a technical hurdle but a leagle one. The requirements are for prominent placement of Google applications on the home screen, "Powered by Android" branding, etc. Even Cyanogen had what amounted to Google integration in the first itterations. It wasn't until the mods started to become very popular that Google responded with leagle challenges.
    01-25-15 08:51 AM
  5. tinochiko's Avatar
    It didn't prevent this guy to do a great job bringing them to BB10 - http://forums.crackberry.com/android...g-page-965257/ - so that "deep OS integration" doesn't seem to be such an impossible obstacle to climb.

    An individual taking time out to create a hack job solution (as good as it is) isn't the same as Google giving BlackBerry permission to have play services.. If it was a case of coding then BlackBerry would have done it a long time ago, but the issue is politics, I suspect that Google are well within their rights to sue the individual , but won't because it's not worth the time or effort ..


    It's not that you need (in coding terms) android OS to have play services, but Google will only officially allow you to impliment play services having met certain requirements, one of which is running android OS rather than just the runtime, and I further suspect that this is what allows tizen cynagen etc to have play services because they worked with the android OS whereas BlackBerry just wants the runtime..

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    01-25-15 08:52 AM
  6. menshawy's Avatar
    No I wouldn't buy one but I have no quarrels with them partnering.

    Posted via CB10
    You would not buy.. but millions of Samsung's customers will.. that matters more to BlackBerry 10 marketshare

    Posted via CB10
    01-25-15 08:54 AM
  7. serbanescu's Avatar
    The "deep integration" required to distriubte with Google services isn't a technical hurdle but a leagle one. The requirements are for prominent placement of Google applications on the home screen, "Powered by Android" branding, etc. Even Cyanogen had what amounted to Google integration in the first itterations. It wasn't until the mods started to become very popular that Google responded with leagle challenges.
    Exactly that was my argument, we are on the same side on this
    01-25-15 09:00 AM
  8. serbanescu's Avatar
    An individual taking time out to create a hack job solution (as good as it is) isn't the same as Google giving BlackBerry permission to have play services.. If it was a case of coding then BlackBerry would have done it a long time ago, but the issue is politics, I suspect that Google are well within their rights to sue the individual , but won't because it's not worth the time or effort ..


    It's not that you need (in coding terms) android OS to have play services, but Google will only officially allow you to impliment play services having met certain requirements, one of which is running android OS rather than just the runtime, and I further suspect that this is what allows tizen cynagen etc to have play services because they worked with the android OS whereas BlackBerry just wants the runtime..

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    Exactly that was my argument, we are on the same side on this
    01-25-15 09:01 AM
  9. tinochiko's Avatar
    Exactly that was my argument, we are on the same side on this
    Ah maybe not, because my argument is that BlackBerry doesn't have what classifies as a 'forked' version of android, as other phones that do have a 'forked version' don't have any issues with apps etc., they have a tweaked android OS, which is different from runtime, although legally I can see how those could come into conflict..

    I guess the real question is whether it would count as Samsung manufacturing 'forked' android devices if they sold BlackBerry OS on their own hardware (whether they will or not is another question), Google might try to argue that it does, and it might be complicated since we're talking about software here not hardware.. would be interesting to see but like others I doubt this is the form that the partnership is taking, a more suitable partner in this respect would be OnePlusOne who have great hardware, but encountering issues with their OS, or HTC, but personally I like BlackBerry's OS and Hardware, as long as they continue to get closer to keeping up specwise, or better optimisation..

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    gfondeur likes this.
    01-25-15 09:13 AM
  10. newfie1974's Avatar
    I'm all 'bout that BB, 'bout that BB, no Samsung
    gfondeur likes this.
    01-25-15 09:40 AM
  11. gariac's Avatar
    Nope. Look at how Nokia shunned Symbian for Windows Phone after Microsoft ponied up $1 billion over 5 years. Symbian actually had a bigger market share at that time than BB10 does today.

    If Samsung puts up the money, I could see BlackBerry scrapping BB10 for Tizen.
    And lose stability and time to market for new phones?

    There is a reason the auto companies are choosing QNX over MS or Android: it works. Sync was killing Ford with the crashes.

    BlackBerry has to maintain QNX even if somebody paid them a billion dollars to use Tizen since QNX is in the braking system, engine controls, etc.


    Posted via CB10
    LyoobaBerry likes this.
    01-25-15 10:11 AM
  12. birdman_38's Avatar
    There is a reason the auto companies are choosing QNX over MS or Android: it works. Sync was killing Ford with the crashes.

    BlackBerry has to maintain QNX even if somebody paid them a billion dollars to use Tizen since QNX is in the braking system, engine controls, etc.
    It definitely wouldn't necessitate the dismantling of QNX.
    01-25-15 10:16 AM
  13. joeragan's Avatar
    Posted via CB10 on Z30/10.3.1.1949
    01-25-15 10:24 AM
  14. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    Exactly that was my argument, we are on the same side on this
    Really? Your post sounded like you thought BlackBerry could provide access to Google Services the way Cobalt did. If BlackBerry did implement Cobalt's work in an official OS they would face immediated littigation from Google. Just as would Microsoft if they put Google Services into Windows 10, which I am sure they could do, technically, if they wanted to.
    gfondeur likes this.
    01-25-15 10:24 AM
  15. Ment's Avatar
    Ah maybe not, because my argument is that BlackBerry doesn't have what classifies as a 'forked' version of android, as other phones that do have a 'forked version' don't have any issues with apps etc., they have a tweaked android OS, which is different from runtime, although legally I can see how those could come into conflict..

    I guess the real question is whether it would count as Samsung manufacturing 'forked' android devices if they sold BlackBerry OS on their own hardware (whether they will or not is another question), Google might try to argue that it does, and it might be complicated since we're talking about software here not hardware.. would be interesting to see but like others I doubt this is the form that the partnership is taking, a more suitable partner in this respect would be OnePlusOne who have great hardware, but encountering issues with their OS, or HTC, but personally I like BlackBerry's OS and Hardware, as long as they continue to get closer to keeping up specwise, or better optimisation..

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    The saga of Acer producing Aliyun phone in 2012 which contained Android runtime but was shot down by Google already prevents this. Google has made android runtime = incompatible fork in terms of OHA compliance.

    Andy Rubin who was a co-founder of Google speaks to OS fragmentation as the reason they aren't going to allow forks in OHA members.

    We agree that the Aliyun OS is not part of the Android ecosystem and you're under no requirement to be compatible.
    However, the fact is, Aliyun uses the Android runtime , framework and tools. And your app store contains Android apps (including pirated Google apps). So there's really no disputing that Aliyun is based on the Android platform and takes advantage of all the hard work that's gone into that platform by the OHA.
    So if you want to benefit from the Android ecosystem, then make the choice to be compatible. [It's] easy, free, and we'll even help you out. But if you don't want to be compatible, then don't expect help from OHA members that are all working to support and build a unified Android ecosystem.
    01-25-15 10:29 AM
  16. serbanescu's Avatar
    Really? Your post sounded like you thought BlackBerry could provide access to Google Services the way Cobalt did. If BlackBerry did implement Cobalt's work in an official OS they would face immediated littigation from Google. Just as would Microsoft if they put Google Services into Windows 10, which I am sure they could do, technically, if they wanted to.
    My post was the follow-up of a longer discussion within this thread, which you obviously didn't read in its entirety.
    01-25-15 10:44 AM
  17. Supa_Fly1's Avatar
    If anything, Samsung would licence its software to BlackBerry.
    Duh they already have: it's called KNOW and it's part of BES12; this was officially announced almost a month ago.

    Posted via CB10
    01-25-15 10:48 AM
  18. birdman_38's Avatar
    Duh they already have: it's called KNOW and it's part of BES12; this was officially announced almost a month ago.
    Corrections:
    - It's called KNOX.
    - It was announced over two months ago.
    - It's a partnership where BlackBerry will enhance the security of that product. Samsung is not licencing anything to BlackBerry in that arrangement.
    gfondeur likes this.
    01-25-15 11:13 AM
  19. dbmalloy's Avatar
    As far as the forked OS issue... people are arguing over the wrong issue... has not to do with forked OS.. not the runtime.. they are two different issues... forked OS is the loader and OS portion while the runtime is what runs the apps.... what is clear is that you will never get Google Play on BB10 simply because Google will not allow it.... as Android is open source and BB has a partnership with Amazon it is a moot point.... as for Samsung selling or folding divisions... will never happen... Canadian government will have a list a mile long as to stipulation for the sale... one will basically be that BB will have to run in its current incarnation... just look at the terms of the Tim Hortons deal with Burger King.... many terms to agree to to approve the deal.... same will happen with BB.... If Samsung's idea is they can buy BB, cherry pick what they want and leave... never will happen.. at best for this to work would need a partial buy in .. which the way the execs are talking sounds more feasable.....
    01-25-15 11:31 AM
  20. tinochiko's Avatar
    The saga of Acer producing Aliyun phone in 2012 which contained Android runtime but was shot down by Google already prevents this. Google has made android runtime = incompatible fork in terms of OHA compliance.

    Andy Rubin who was a co-founder of Google speaks to OS fragmentation as the reason they aren't going to allow forks in OHA members.
    'legally I see how these could come into conflict'

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    01-25-15 11:34 AM
  21. 123nat's Avatar
    Why can't samsung as part of the deal adopt bb10 with perhaps a samsung app store - they have the clout to convince developers to upload apps to the store etc convince developers it's not all about Google play etc.



    Posted via CB10
    01-25-15 12:24 PM
  22. midnightdoom's Avatar
    Windows doesn't have an Android Runtime.
    What about after windows does allow android ad it'd been rumored they are going to do with windows 10

    *Z30 STA100-5 10.2.1.2977/3247*
    01-25-15 12:32 PM
  23. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    My post was the follow-up of a longer discussion within this thread, which you obviously didn't read in its entirety.
    I have read the whole thread, but you quoted my post, and some one else's with the same reply. Pardon me if I misunderstood your intention.

    Z10STL100-3/10.3.1.1154
    01-25-15 03:21 PM
  24. gfondeur's Avatar
    Tizen
    Lol
    01-26-15 07:36 AM
  25. birdman_38's Avatar
    Lol
    You heard it here first!
    01-26-15 10:05 AM
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