[anon(8679041)]

For those who don't know what Progressive Web Apps (PWA) are, take a look at these videos:
short video ( )
longer video ( )

I know this is smth relatively new, not much information on the web yet, but maybe there are someone who could answer some questions here for us, for those who really won't let BB10 go away.

The questions I have would be:
1) Does BlackBerry OS meet all the criteria needed to implement PWA and to have them fully functional? If not, what's it missing?
2) Have you read/seen anywhere mr. Chen expressing his opinion on this? I could not find anything, but still, maybe someone knows smth.
3) Any long-term risks that you see if BB10 would start focusing on PWA?
4) Would implementing PWA be enough for BB10 to revive? If not, what else should be addressed?

p.s. I know kind of similar thread was created, but I decided to recreate it with proper keywords, so that people could find it easier.
The link to the old one: (https://forums.crackberry.com/genera.../#post12851749)

Thanks

[Ment]

Webkit upon which BB10 browser is based would have to adopt it. Apple who is the primary contributor to the Webkit project since its used in Safari, isn't big on it so far since Google is pushing it the most for Android and there is some possibility it could threaten their walled garden app store on the margins. Firefox, Chrome, Opera and Microsoft Edge are or are planning to support progressive apps so eventually Webkit will as well but who knows about the timing.

[cgk]

The questions I have would be:

3) Any long-term risks that you see if BB10 would start focusing on PWA?

Well it would just be a strange thing for a software company to do - spend time developing software for an OS that is not being sold on current devices and nobody is making devices for.


4) Would implementing PWA be enough for BB10 to revive? If not, what else should be addressed?

Nothing will bring BB10 back to life - it will stagger on in its zombie state for a bit but over time it will die as hardware dies off.


Thanks

[anon(8679041)]

Webkit upon which BB10 browser is based would have to adopt it. Apple who is the primary contributor to the Webkit project since its used in Safari, isn't big on it so far since Google is pushing it the most for Android and there is some possibility it could threaten their walled garden app store on the margins. Firefox, Chrome, Opera and Microsoft Edge are or are planning to support progressive apps so eventually Webkit will as well but who knows about the timing.

Well, but they can adapt or change the browser's engine to a different one right? This will cost some money, but at least they'll keep pace with the modern mobile world. So we a talking here just about a cost.

[kvndoom]

Well, but they can adapt or change the browser's engine to a different one right? This will cost some money, but at least they'll keep pace with the modern mobile world. So we a talking here just about a cost.

What is in it for BlackBerry? They would spend money to update and maintain the browser and get no money out of the deal.

[Ment]

Well, but they can adapt or change the browser's engine to a different one right? This will cost some money, but at least they'll keep pace with the modern mobile world. So we a talking here just about a cost.

Yes it would be easier to change it to Blink which was forked off from Webkit by Google is used for Chrome, Opera and some other browsers but Blackberry would have to put resources on adapting it to BB10 which does not seem likely given that doing so cost resources and puts no revenue back into the company.

Plus the horizon for ubiquity for progressive web apps is a few years and by that time what will BB10 be like, probably officially EOL.

[Trouveur]

Well, but they can adapt or change the browser's engine to a different one right? This will cost some money, but at least they'll keep pace with the modern mobile world. So we a talking here just about a cost.

BlackBerry is done with smartphone and hardware.

They no longer care about BB10, there is no further development.

Expecting anything about BB10 is just dreaming.


Posted via CB10

[dpgo]

They could pay mozilla fundation for this work. I dunno how much can be porting an app, but I am sure that for BlackBerry it is just cash.

Even they can try to obtain money from users through bbworld

IMHO a platform with an updated web browser is still an alive platform. BlackBerry browser is too outdated

Posted via CB10

[Trouveur]

They could pay mozilla fundation for this work. I dunno how much can be porting an app, but I am sure that for BlackBerry it is just cash.

Even they can try to obtain money from users through bbworld

IMHO a platform with an updated web browser is still an alive platform. BlackBerry browser is too outdated

Posted via CB10

"They" ? BlackBerry no longer cares about BB10.


Posted via CB10

[anon(8679041)]

Blackberry would have to put resources on adapting it to BB10 which does not seem likely given that doing so cost resources and puts no revenue back into the company.

by selling smartphones perhaps?

[Ment]

by selling smartphones perhaps?

missing /s tag I see.

New BB10 smartphone model needs hundreds of millions to launch because no one is going to buy a new BB10 with 10.3.3 as its lacking features of a modern smartphone OS like an full-featured Assistant, native cloud service integration and lack of up-to-date native apps; neither is a partner like TCL willing to take that risk on the hardware. Plus you'd have to subsidize devs to come back to update or write apps. When does BB get money back in this scenario: it doesn't. Chen would be sacked by the board if he proposed this.

[The_Passporter]

missing /s tag I see.

New BB10 smartphone model needs hundreds of millions to launch because no one is going to buy a new BB10 with 10.3.3 as its lacking features of a modern smartphone OS like an full-featured Assistant, native cloud service integration and lack of up-to-date native apps; neither is a partner like TCL willing to take that risk on the hardware. Plus you'd have to subsidize devs to come back to update or write apps. When does BB get money back in this scenario: it doesn't. Chen would be sacked by the board if he proposed this.

Yes but he would be adored and get lots of "Likes!"

[eshropshire]

by selling smartphones perhaps?

Who? Blackberry Limited? They are an enterprise software company. Last September BlackBerry Limited announced they were leaving the hardware business. TCL formed BlackBerry Mobile to sell BlackBerry Android phones.

If BlackBerry Limited has a few extra million to invest, they will spend the money on enterprise software.

[Jazuyo]

I honestly believe this is the only way that BB10 has a shot at staying alive as far as apps go. But will BB invest into that?

[Elephant_Canyon]

I honestly believe this is the only way that BB10 has a shot at staying alive as far as apps go. But will BB invest into that?

No. Blackberry is not making any more significant investment in BB10.

[anon(8679041)]

No. Blackberry is not making any more significant investment in BB10.

How feasible would be to start a crowdfunding campaign? For the sake of saving BB10 and getting some updates. The way I'd imagine this happening is by adjusting bb10 OS for the Keyone and pushing some updates, at least once every 6 mo. I think TCL doesn't care which OS they put on. It's just BB Ltd which will have some costs while adjusting BB10 OS for the Keyone and maybe a few updates.

If this would happen, I'd buy a minimum of 4 phones myself! Gosh... : )))

[thurask]

How feasible would be to start a crowdfunding campaign? (for the sake of saving bb10)

Not very?

[Elephant_Canyon]

How feasible would be to start a crowdfunding campaign? For the sake of saving BB10 and getting some updates. The way I'd imagine this happening is by adjusting bb10 OS on keyone and pushing some updates, at least once every 6 mo.

How many tens of millions of dollars do you think you can raise? And do you plan on getting permission from Blackberry beforehand? Because if you don't, it's an even bigger waste of time.

I think TCL doesn't care which OS they put on.

You'd be incorrect in thinking that.

[anon(8679041)]

How many tens of millions of dollars do you think you can raise?

Why millions?
Say two developers only would work 8hr/day only on developing BB OS. That's around $200k a year. Aren't two developers enough to launch 2 updates within a year?

And then they could outsource that work in other countries with lower wages. In some countries a senior developer gets even $4k a month (not kidding, this is why a lot of companies do outsourcing)!

You'd be incorrect in thinking that.

Why?

[kvndoom]

Why millions?
Say two developers only would work 8hr/day only on developing BB OS. That's around $200k a year. Aren't two developers enough to launch 2 updates within a year?

And then they could outsource that work in other countries with lower wages. In some countries a senior developer gets even $4k a month (not kidding, this is why a lot of companies do outsourcing)!


Why?

Yes, outsource BB10 development to 3rd world countries and then try to sell it to the public as the world's most secure OS! That's a great idea! Why didn't Blackberry think of this sooner?!?

[Elephant_Canyon]

Why millions?
Say two developers only would work 8hr/day only on developing BB OS. That's around $200k a year. Aren't two developers enough to launch 2 updates within a year?

No, 2 developers aren't enough to launch 2 updates to a piece of software as complex as an operating system within a year. Plus, you'd also need to train the developers you hired to get them up to speed on BB10. You'd also need a project manager and support staff, which includes everything from testers and QA people all the way down to administrative assistants. There's also benefits to pay all those full-time employees on to of base salary.

Why?

Because it wouldn't help them push more device sales. BB10 has already proven itself to be a massive market failure.

[anon(8679041)]

Yes, outsource BB10 development to 3rd world countries and then try to sell it to the public as the world's most secure OS! That's a great idea! Why didn't Blackberry think of this sooner?!?

One senior developer from blackberry = $100k which would manage two outsourced programmers = 2 x $45k

Or if that doesn't work, just two BB developers = $200k

[sid89]

Yes, outsource BB10 development to 3rd world countries and then try to sell it to the public as the world's most secure OS! That's a great idea! Why didn't Blackberry think of this sooner?!?

I absolutely agree with this idea!!

Posted via CB10

[Trouveur]

How feasible would be to start a crowdfunding campaign? For the sake of saving BB10 and getting some updates. The way I'd imagine this happening is by adjusting bb10 OS for the Keyone and pushing some updates, at least once every 6 mo. I think TCL doesn't care which OS they put on. It's just BB Ltd which will have some costs while adjusting BB10 OS for the Keyone and maybe a few updates.

If this would happen, I'd buy a minimum of 4 phones myself! Gosh... : )))

Nobody is interested in trying to sell BB10 devices, and the cost to be able to put BB10 on new hardware would be far too huge.


Posted via CB10

[anon(8679041)]

the cost to be able to put BB10 on new hardware would be far too huge.

You mean drivers installation cost? Aside from programmer's work