03-30-18 02:48 PM
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  1. CBuser3215's Avatar
    It has been calculated that the fee would be between $3000 and $5000 per user, per year. IF you can find 50,000 people willing to pay it.
    Sauce? Source?

    Posted via CB10
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    11-09-17 04:21 AM
  2. bbrotestant's Avatar
    Cost is a valid angle to the problem. If the community is able to come together and work out what are the neccessary minimum features to keep the system live and usable - then I am sure there's a way to have a word with BB.
    The security cerfitication might be hurdle, but what do I know. For now, it's down to the business contracts...
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    11-09-17 05:34 AM
  3. kvndoom's Avatar
    How about making the end users (US) pay for the licensing of the continued development of BB10, kind of like users of MS office pay for the licensing on a monthly or yearly basis??? Also, paying a premium for the phones as well, as they ARE premium devices. This way, they may be able to generate several hundred million dollars a year, and keep it going, or at least self sustaining.

    Make most apps in the app store pay apps, a lot of them are already, i know. This is the only way BB10 can survive. I would be willing to pay a licensing subscription to use BB10 and pay a premium for the phones, as long as they were willing to keep it going, and we had our most important apps, say fb, whatsapp, telegram, signal, etc.... Then I am all in!!!

    What do you guys think?
    I wouldn't go back for FREE. Sure as hell not going to pay money to go back.
    11-09-17 05:36 AM
  4. kvndoom's Avatar
    Sauce? Source?

    Posted via CB10
    Oh I don't know... all the numerous times its been stated how many people Apple and Google employ to keep their OS up to date. Even The number of people BlackBerry had on the BB10 team. Their salary, the office space, benefits, management, equipment, all the costs associated with assembling and maintaining that team.

    Then divide it by the few people still even using BB10.

    Makes perfect sense, unless you're in the "2 guys in their garage on weekends" camp.
    11-09-17 05:40 AM
  5. Fernando Martin's Avatar
    God bleeping bleep it I swear to bleep some people cannot accept reality. BlackBerry doesn't bleeping give a flying bleep!!!!!! It's not us just automatically shooting down every idea you have for the bleeping sake of being bleepholes! You have to bleeping get BlackBerry to give a rats bleep and they don't!!!!! You're just posting to irritate and now I'm putting you on my God bleep ignore list. Enjoy the bleeping VIP section.
    @butterbean1983 (PAL)

    let me show you a quote directly from the blackberry website.

    "BlackBerry 10 version 10.3.3 has passed the NIAP security test to deliver the strictest government-grade security to further support government, enterprise and regulated customers who require the highest levels of protection for critical data."

    There are still left a few million users world wide of BB10, including government users. A lot of the users are clients of BB Software services. John Chen has announced that they will continue to support BB10.

    It is true that there probably will not be any major development, support continues, updates will come, and we probably will get 10.4. I see at least 3-5 more years of contiuned to support.

    So frankly, I really don't know where you come up with all this garbage to be honest. Furthermore, I think your intended langauage is inapropriate for this forum.
    Qorax likes this.
    11-09-17 05:52 AM
  6. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Oh I don't know... all the numerous times its been stated how many people Apple and Google employ to keep their OS up to date. Even The number of people BlackBerry had on the BB10 team. Their salary, the office space, benefits, management, equipment, all the costs associated with assembling and maintaining that team.

    Then divide it by the few people still even using BB10.

    Makes perfect sense, unless you're in the "2 guys in their garage on weekends" camp.
    (((So you're saying there's a couple of possibilities. High cost version or low cost version....

    Will someone make a KEYone running on BB10 and call it the Passport 2? If we take the Motion and SIMPLY add BB10 then we have the long sought after Z50.....

    kvndoom, you're a genius......... )))


    Ok all you $&@&$$&@, you realize this would be utterly moronic......kvndoom and I don't really believe this......
    11-09-17 06:01 AM
  7. Elephant_Canyon's Avatar
    There are still left a few million users world wide of BB10, including government users. A lot of the users are clients of BB Software services. John Chen has announced that they will continue to support BB10.

    It is true that there probably will not be any major development, support continues, updates will come, and we probably will get 10.4. I see at least 3-5 more years of contiuned to support.
    You can believe whatever silly things you want, but prepare yourself for some pretty heavy disappointment, and much sooner than you expect.
    11-09-17 06:08 AM
  8. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    @butterbean1983 (PAL)

    let me show you a quote directly from the blackberry website.

    "BlackBerry 10 version 10.3.3 has passed the NIAP security test to deliver the strictest government-grade security to further support government, enterprise and regulated customers who require the highest levels of protection for critical data."

    There are still left a few million users world wide of BB10, including government users. A lot of the users are clients of BB Software services. John Chen has announced that they will continue to support BB10.

    It is true that there probably will not be any major development, support continues, updates will come, and we probably will get 10.4. I see at least 3-5 more years of contiuned to support.

    So frankly, I really don't know where you come up with all this garbage to be honest. Furthermore, I think your intended langauage is inapropriate for this forum.
    Are you kidding me? They left the device business and only "promise" was 10.3.3 and 10.3.4 which has been acknowledged fairly well on CB to have all been rolled into 10.3.3 with delays back then. A 10.4 would be a device gag that wipes your device clean of any OS and tells you to leave already Ferris Bueller style....
    11-09-17 06:21 AM
  9. stlabrat's Avatar
    "Look at Senior *software* engineer and *software* engineer averages at Google and BB. Remember, payroll taxes in ON are very, very high (much higher than CA), so you have to add those employer paid taxes on top of these numbers:"
    there are few bones canadian gov throw to the company: R&D tax credit. (1) cost of developer - may not be as high as you quote - many still in waterloo region, live on 50-70K. (2) interns - around similar salary for U waterloo. BB started with interns. - remember Mike L was a student when he start the whole thing. (3) OS although it is not easy, but check Palm, still a few chaps lead, not near as billions (not mention 100 billions) cost. you do need close nit few beer fellow to live in basement (can't live in garages at -11 C, tomorrow for example). (4) the salary of R&D can be write off almost 70%... (5) Gov got incentive to hire new grad. If you are PhD, it will provide 50/50 match for 2 years project on salary to let you set foot into the industry. - but salary must be >50K I believe (that means you pay 25K for a PhD)... (6) all talk about funding is a bit scary... showed lack of passion to the BB10... if you really, really love it, you do it for free... take a day job (hopefully, no conflic interest)... like Jobs, the home made self drive car guy, etc.etc. if you really, really want BB10, find someone and convince him/her to do it if you lack of brain power to do so... (needle in a hay stack). if you find one, you possibly pull a string of few crazy chaps of his/her drinking buddy go along for a fun ride. (boom or bust you never know...). IMHO. (above mentioned items possibly why google set up office in waterloo/kitchener.... it hired many prior to BB massive downsize... so the caliber are mixed, not cream... few exBB still refuse to work for eye balls... the bad thing try to track freebee worker is: they are very choosy.. only work for chaps they feel like it...BB may paid them too much at exit door... ).
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    11-09-17 06:35 AM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    "Look at Senior *software* engineer and *software* engineer averages at Google and BB. Remember, payroll taxes in ON are very, very high (much higher than CA), so you have to add those employer paid taxes on top of these numbers:"
    there are few bones canadian gov throw to the company: R&D tax credit. (1) cost of developer - may not be as high as you quote - many still in waterloo region, live on 50-70K. (2) interns - around similar salary for U waterloo. BB started with interns. - remember Mike L was a student when he start the whole thing. (3) OS although it is not easy, but check Palm, still a few chaps lead, not near as billions (not mention 100 billions) cost. you do need close nit few beer fellow to live in basement (can't live in garages at -11 C, tomorrow for example). (4) the salary of R&D can be write off almost 70%... (5) Gov got incentive to hire new grad. If you are PhD, it will provide 50/50 match for 2 years project on salary to let you set foot into the industry. - but salary must be >50K I believe (that means you pay 25K for a PhD)... (6) all talk about funding is a bit scary... showed lack of passion to the BB10... if you really, really love it, you do it for free... take a day job (hopefully, no conflic interest)... like Jobs, the home made self drive car guy, etc.etc. if you really, really want BB10, find someone and convince him/her to do it if you lack of brain power to do so... (needle in a hay stack). if you find one, you possibly pull a string of few crazy chaps of his/her drinking buddy go along for a fun ride. (boom or bust you never know...). IMHO. (above mentioned items possibly why google set up office in waterloo/kitchener.... it hired many prior to BB massive downsize... so the caliber are mixed, not cream... few exBB still refuse to work for eye balls... the bad thing try to track freebee worker is: they are very choosy.. only work for chaps they feel like it...BB may paid them too much at exit door... ).
    Not enough people care to buy it, let alone build it....
    11-09-17 06:43 AM
  11. stlabrat's Avatar
    just try to correct the budget estimate... just in case you want to do a start up in waterloo/kitchener (which few creamer are cooking now), it is definitely not 100 billion... besides, BB still maintain BB10 for corp client (the supporting cost is definitely not billions - at least I can't find it on 2Q report as entry that high under operation cost... if I missed, please let me know which page I need to look... getting old, eyes not that great... the eye balls not worth a penny for sale now).
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    11-09-17 06:59 AM
  12. bobshine's Avatar
    just try to correct the budget estimate... just in case you want to do a start up in waterloo/kitchener (which few creamer are cooking now), it is definitely not 100 billion... besides, BB still maintain BB10 for corp client (the supporting cost is definitely not billions - at least I can't find it on 2Q report as entry that high under operation cost... if I missed, please let me know which page I need to look... getting old, eyes not that great... the eye balls not worth a penny for sale now).
    Maintain? They are pushing their corp client out of BB10... encouraging them to go Android
    11-09-17 07:28 AM
  13. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Maintain? They are pushing their corp client out of BB10... encouraging them to go Android
    Actually discouraging BB10 with Enterprise clients since EMM solutions encourage use of Android/IOS..
    11-09-17 07:38 AM
  14. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    I actually had a conversation with a business man, and office manager talking about the distraction of byod (apple and android) phones to the workplace (is a serious productivity problem)....one of the things they liked about bb10 was that there wasn't a lot a of distraction (especially during work hours) on these phones to keep employees unproductive....maybe bb10 could capitalize and formalize this feature....in that parallel universe we are working on....just got to get a babe ruth investor to step up....or a whole team.
    The security risks of those devices is even worse that the productivity costs. Large companies put reasonable controls in place, but many smaller companies expose a lot of their assets to significant risk in the way they manage BYOD.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    11-09-17 08:29 AM
  15. mf1982's Avatar
    Come on.... BlackBerry is the ex who left, got married, has had a few kids(Priv, DTEK, KeyOne, Motion) with the guy (in this case a green robot) and is living a happy life... they are not coming back to you sitting in a dingy, moldy, leaky basement for you to bankrupt them again and make life a stuggle.

    BB10 is over. Enjoy it while you can, but it's not coming back.

    Posted via CB10
    11-09-17 09:46 AM
  16. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Come on.... BlackBerry is the ex who left, got married, has had a few kids(Priv, DTEK, KeyOne, Motion) with the guy (in this case a green robot) and is living a happy life... they are not coming back to you sitting in a dingy, moldy, leaky basement for you to bankrupt them again and make life a stuggle.

    BB10 is over. Enjoy it while you can, but it's not coming back.

    Posted via CB10
    Correct, with one key addition: in this case, there's nothing wierd about starting a new relationship with one of the kids. Just don't expect the kid to be the parent, even if it seems a bit familiar at times!

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    11-09-17 09:54 AM
  17. Fernando Martin's Avatar
    Are you kidding me? They left the device business and only "promise" was 10.3.3 and 10.3.4 which has been acknowledged fairly well on CB to have all been rolled into 10.3.3 with delays back then. A 10.4 would be a device gag that wipes your device clean of any OS and tells you to leave already Ferris Bueller style....
    If nothing else, you are comical, and laugh I did, i tell you.

    Having said that, I have been on this board for years now, and i see the same people saying the same thing they have been saying from way back then. That is, that BB10 won't be around another year, and it's going out sooner than you think, and yac, yac, yac..... It's the same people that said, BB is getting out o the handset business, and on and on and on....

    Fast forward 3 years, and BB10 is still alive, they are releasing updates, we have NIAP security, and BB also has expanded its handset business. SO PLEASE, SPARE US.

    We don't want to hear it anymore, that the handset business is going away, and that BB10 is going away. It's getting old, and as time goes buys, you are just looking like fools.
    i_plod_an_dr_void and Qorax like this.
    11-09-17 09:58 AM
  18. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    If nothing else, you are comical, and laugh I did, i tell you.

    Having said that, I have been on this board for years now, and i see the same people saying the same thing they have been saying from way back then. That is, that BB10 won't be around another year, and it's going out sooner than you think, and yac, yac, yac..... It's the same people that said, BB is getting out o the handset business, and on and on and on....

    Fast forward 3 years, and BB10 is still alive, they are releasing updates, we have NIAP security, and BB also has expanded its handset business. SO PLEASE, SPARE US.

    We don't want to hear it anymore, that the handset business is going away, and that BB10 is going away. It's getting old, and as time goes buys, you are just looking like fools.
    BlackBerry did get out from the handset business, so there you go.

    BB started with Android two years ago then I left BB10 part time shortly thereafter dual carrying two devices. Year ago, BB announced they were getting out from the handset business and final BB10 update finally rolled out. I went from PRIV to DTEK. Face it, there's no more development just some very basic weak support for the customers migrating off the platform....
    11-09-17 10:19 AM
  19. Fernando Martin's Avatar
    BlackBerry did get out from the handset business, so there you go.

    BB started with Android two years ago then I left BB10 part time shortly thereafter dual carrying two devices. Year ago, BB announced they were getting out from the handset business and final BB10 update finally rolled out. I went from PRIV to DTEK. Face it, there's no more development just some very basic weak support for the customers migrating off the platform....
    Yes, they got out from producing handsets themselves, sure, but they are not out of the handset business completely. They have someone else build them now... Others on here have said, that after the PRIV there would be nothing, and that was simply not the case. Some are saying now, that after this year, no handsets. Please stop, there will be handsets in 2018..

    Furthermore, there are several hundred thousand Government phones that require NIAP certification, which android phones don't have, and may never have. BB10 is here to stay, even in its very limited capability.
    i_plod_an_dr_void and Qorax like this.
    11-09-17 10:27 AM
  20. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Yes, they got out from producing handsets themselves, sure, but they are not out of the handset business completely. They have someone else build them now... Others on here have said, that after the PRIV there would be nothing, and that was simply not the case. Some are saying now, that after this year, no handsets. Please stop, there will be handsets in 2018..

    Furthermore, there are several hundred thousand Government phones that require NIAP certification, which android phones don't have, and may never have. BB10 is here to stay, even in its very limited capability.
    BB has completely exited the handset business and only licenses their brand to completely unrelated manufacturers....

    What governments? I can tell you that US government is migrating away. The only very limited few ultra government secure type uses are private builds that will only be seen by the parties that pay for those builds. With Knox and other EMM solutions, BB10 is just unnecessary for those private contracts. The legions of hundreds of thousands of government users don't exist like you think. It's maybe tens of thousands and depleting rapidly.
    11-09-17 10:32 AM
  21. Invictus0's Avatar
    Furthermore, there are several hundred thousand Government phones that require NIAP certification, which android phones don't have, and may never have. BB10 is here to stay, even in its very limited capability.
    Many Android phones have NIAP,

    https://www.niap-ccevs.org/Product/
    app_Developer likes this.
    11-09-17 10:34 AM
  22. Fernando Martin's Avatar
    Many Android phones have NIAP,

    https://www.niap-ccevs.org/Product/
    I only saw one android phone on the list. the LG, and besides, who is going to pay for the migration??
    11-09-17 10:41 AM
  23. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I only saw one android phone on the list. the LG, and besides, who is going to pay for the migration??
    Not BlackBerry.....
    11-09-17 10:48 AM
  24. mf1982's Avatar
    The migration is covered under service contracts. As devices are replaced, they will be replaced with in-market devices.

    Considering a 2-3 year timeline, and assuming new BB10 devices were only sold in numbers into early 2016, most devices will be phased out by early 2019 at the latest.

    BB10 is gone. You can't buy any more devices, other than the overstock ones still out there. A new one hasn't been built in likely over a year already. OS development is pretty much done, the last update was essentially a carrier specific (contractual obligation) update.

    I guess the hope for more BB10 stems from lack of knowledge about BlackBerry's business. They are out of the hardware business (except for Radar), full stop.

    They license their name and patents to TCL, and TCL makes the decisions, spends the money, pays for marketing and flips BlackBerry a couple of bucks per device sold (I don't know how much it is).

    Posted via CB10

    Edit: Just looked on the NIAP site, 10.3.3's Assurance Date is January 2019. After that, BB10 will EOL. I'm guessing they can't EOL it until then.

    Also, there's this small company out of Cupertino, California that sells NIAP certified devices too, so it's not BlackBerry or bust for government.
    11-09-17 10:54 AM
  25. BriannaJL's Avatar
    I only saw one android phone on the list. the LG, and besides, who is going to pay for the migration??
    Did you see the list with the heading "Products by Vendor"? You have to scroll down the list to see all the names of the companies. Samsung phones, for example, have NIAP certification.
    11-09-17 10:58 AM
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