03-30-18 02:48 PM
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  1. eshropshire's Avatar
    Agreed the inventory definitely didn't help things, I think what we (myself included) also overlook is that they also made use of SOC's that likely required new purchases (the Snapdragon 400, 801, and probably some 800's for the Z50/Ontario prototypes) and struck various BB10 specific partnerships in 2014.

    Devices were no longer the main priority for BlackBerry but if BB10 could still work as a smaller, more focused OS I don't see why they wouldn't have kept it around.
    The problem was the ASP of BB10 devices. BB10 users were not willing to pay for the phones. Apple has an ASP over $600 for iPhones, plus they have revenue from the iTunes store. I remember when the passport was released everyone here gripped about the price and kept saying they would wait for a sale.

    If you want a device with a proprietary OS you have to be willing to pay for the hardware and the OS. BB10 users were not willing to pay for either one.
    Qorax and TGR1 like this.
    10-31-17 06:44 PM
  2. Invictus0's Avatar
    The problem was the ASP of BB10 devices. BB10 users were not willing to pay for the phones. Apple has an ASP over $600 for iPhones, plus they have revenue from the iTunes store. I remember when the passport was released everyone here gripped about the price and kept saying they would wait for a sale.

    If you want a device with a proprietary OS you have to be willing to pay for the hardware and the OS. BB10 users were not willing to pay for either one.
    Yeah and BlackBerry certainly wasn't hiding the fact that they couldn't compete on price before BB10 launched. I guess BIS and subsidized/used devices made all the difference in the BBOS days, consumers may not have realized the true cost of BlackBerry devices and BlackBerry would have made revenue regardless from subscribers.
    10-31-17 07:47 PM
  3. bhoqeem's Avatar
    Fuhgetaboutit, boyo. It's DEAD.
    Even the company doesn't care.
    If they do, they should at least releases it as an open source. But no, they wanna keep and hog at it till it rots.
    I hate them.
    10-31-17 08:53 PM
  4. conite's Avatar
    Fuhgetaboutit, boyo. It's DEAD.
    Even the company doesn't care.
    If they do, they should at least releases it as an open source. But no, they wanna keep and hog at it till it rots.
    I hate them.
    For the last time, they will never open source BB10. The hardware requires all software to be signed by BlackBerry - nothing else would install.
    10-31-17 09:55 PM
  5. johnny_bravo72's Avatar
    For the last time, they will never open source BB10. The hardware requires all software to be signed by BlackBerry - nothing else would install.
    "For the last time..."
    Ugh. Now you jinxed it.
    Expect to see dozens more in the future asking why BlackBerry doesn't open source BB10.
    app_Developer and BigBadWulf like this.
    10-31-17 10:19 PM
  6. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    For the last time....you said that the last time.... and then pop goes the balloon, BB has a modest bug/fix release...or is that gum on your face instead? Who else in lollipop land is even doing this?

    50k USD *100 developers (developers that expensive/affordable in BlackBerry HomeTown, govt healthcare, lower cost of living etc.). This aint Kansas Dorothy (uhh I mean Seatle or NewYork or even Toronto or Vancouver ...hey move to London or Kingston Ontario, might even get a cheaper labour pool, decent city, lower overhead costs) = 5million (okay double that for overhead) 10million a year.....works out to $10 per device, if only 1million devices active (or more)..$20 annual os-upgrade /security patch fees . 50% margin Perfectly doable, minus executive salaries of course ...but you can take them off of the larger business.
    200 developers 10million double that 20million (assume 1 million devices active or more) costs, want to recoup $40million, that's $40 per year os /security update costs (spread over 1million devices)...still reasonable. Sell a few more new devices there you go, maintain a base for future years. A modest bare-bones plan, that gets apps back and some enhancements.

    BB10 Dead? Only if BB ,Governments and BigCorps want BB to deliberately kill it off, and BB doesn't have the guts to slug it out with the Google Gansta Android-monopoly Racket, or the Apple Boys Gang.
    Qorax, rayporsche and PwrSurge like this.
    11-01-17 02:44 AM
  7. valer466's Avatar
    Even if every daily active crackberry+indonesian bbm users+utb etc made $100 CDN contribution which translates to around 77.5 degraded $ USD greenbacks, BB-chen-waterloo-canadeh still wouldn't have the $5 Billion USD to restart something abandoned in 2013 and neither would they have the fallback $5 Billion USD, which makes them grand $10 Billion a nary possibility.
    Last edited by valer466; 11-01-17 at 03:27 AM.
    rayporsche likes this.
    11-01-17 03:04 AM
  8. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    ...as they said in some of my favourite old-time 70's style cop shows.....they're serving a lot of baloney sandwiches here . 5 billiion!!! OMG!.
    PwrSurge likes this.
    11-01-17 03:58 AM
  9. Qorax's Avatar
    The point is dedicated forums like Crackberry should keep the hope alive. Lovers of Blackberry should populate the social media with such requests and discussions. It might just be possible that the manufacturer/owner of the OS listens, work it out backwards, and decide favorably.

    IMO, it still is feasible to keep BBOS alive. Despite the telltale signs a workaround is plausible if Blackberry is coerced enough - and it's top brass has the motivation to get things right. This is a lovely OS and it'd be a shame to let it go.

    We at maemo.org seriously tried when Nokia was wrapping up its Meego Harmattan (another lovely mobile platform) but failed. Finland didn't push it enough. However, this time we Canadians should and could see it thru, else it'd be our national embarrassment. Failures at RIM wasn't - but this would.
    11-01-17 04:10 AM
  10. stlabrat's Avatar
    Fuhgetaboutit, boyo. It's DEAD.
    Even the company doesn't care.
    If they do, they should at least releases it as an open source. But no, they wanna keep and hog at it till it rots.
    I hate them.
    (1) open source is a death trap. read this https://www.theverge.com/2012/6/5/30...pre-postmortem
    (2) BB run similar path as Pre, including carrier deal used as counter balance to the google/apple negociation chip. BB fall for the VZ (not blame VZ to revenge the storm). check above link "blowfish and the deal"... excess inventory is not hardware issue, it is that one key personnel negociated the carrier deal, who lack the skill of scream at carrier like Jobs - for all the fans of "Lost Signal" book, little info there (possibly, who ever they interviewed didn't want to admit their own fault... blame everything else except themselves distored history, IMHO... but it is entertaining never the less).
    (3) BB should learned from Palm.. the path is so similar, if Ruby take over BB10 with the handset, it might see a second life - it would be his redemption of both Palm and BB... (he got his hedge fund to back him up.... if he still want to jump into the fry pan... however, chen may not let him.. just in case he succed, it showcased how bad Chen managed left over of BB... chances are near zero chen will let him do it).
    11-01-17 05:39 AM
  11. conite's Avatar
    For the last time....you said that the last time.... and then pop goes the balloon, BB has a modest bug/fix release...or is that gum on your face instead? Who else in lollipop land is even doing this?

    50k USD *100 developers (developers that expensive/affordable in BlackBerry HomeTown, govt healthcare, lower cost of living etc.). This aint Kansas Dorothy (uhh I mean Seatle or NewYork or even Toronto or Vancouver ...hey move to London or Kingston Ontario, might even get a cheaper labour pool, decent city, lower overhead costs) = 5million (okay double that for overhead) 10million a year.....works out to $10 per device, if only 1million devices active (or more)..$20 annual os-upgrade /security patch fees . 50% margin Perfectly doable, minus executive salaries of course ...but you can take them off of the larger business.
    200 developers 10million double that 20million (assume 1 million devices active or more) costs, want to recoup $40million, that's $40 per year os /security update costs (spread over 1million devices)...still reasonable. Sell a few more new devices there you go, maintain a base for future years. A modest bare-bones plan, that gets apps back and some enhancements.

    BB10 Dead? Only if BB ,Governments and BigCorps want BB to deliberately kill it off, and BB doesn't have the guts to slug it out with the Google Gansta Android-monopoly Racket, or the Apple Boys Gang.
    The point is dedicated forums like Crackberry should keep the hope alive. Lovers of Blackberry should populate the social media with such requests and discussions. It might just be possible that the manufacturer/owner of the OS listens, work it out backwards, and decide favorably.

    IMO, it still is feasible to keep BBOS alive. Despite the telltale signs a workaround is plausible if Blackberry is coerced enough - and it's top brass has the motivation to get things right. This is a lovely OS and it'd be a shame to let it go.

    We at maemo.org seriously tried when Nokia was wrapping up its Meego Harmattan (another lovely mobile platform) but failed. Finland didn't push it enough. However, this time we Canadians should and could see it thru, else it'd be our national embarrassment. Failures at RIM wasn't - but this would.
    You do understand that the BB10 developers are all gone, buildings have been sold, development tools are deprecated, hardware design teams no longer exist, and the entire devices infrastructure is dismantled?

    We've moved from "hope" to utter delusion.

    BlackBerry has spoken. They've moved on from hardware. Bye bye BB10.
    Last edited by conite; 11-01-17 at 06:16 AM.
    11-01-17 06:02 AM
  12. Qorax's Avatar
    ^ Bye bye sir?

    1) There is TCL. Full infrastructure and the jingbang.
    2) Software updates need just a couple of guys. And a basement room.
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    11-01-17 06:09 AM
  13. conite's Avatar
    ^ Bye bye sir?

    1) There is TCL. Full infrastructure and the jingbang.
    2) Software updates need just a couple of guys. And a basement room.
    TCL, or any other company on planet Earth, has no interest in licencing BB10.

    You'd need a billion dollars to rebuild the whole infrastructure and re-train, then another $100-500 million a year for even basic development.
    11-01-17 06:19 AM
  14. kvndoom's Avatar
    ^ Bye bye sir?

    2) Software updates need just a couple of guys. And a basement room.
    It saddens me that you probably believe this to be true. But hey, find two programming buddies and have a go at it! Let us know how it works out, okay?
    TGR1 and StephanieMaks like this.
    11-01-17 06:32 AM
  15. bhoqeem's Avatar
    TCL, or any other company on planet Earth, has no interest in licencing BB10.

    You'd need a billion dollars to rebuild the whole infrastructure and re-train, then another $100-500 million a year for even basic development.
    Sad but true. BB10 is CRAZY expensive to develop and maintain. Especially when it comes to connecting it with the hardware--chip and all that jazz. Which is why it's so good an OS.

    But at least with open source, even with bleak possibilities as discussed above, the community still have a chance to lead it somewhere, or at least see for themselves how futile that effort is.
    11-01-17 06:40 AM
  16. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    ^ Bye bye sir?

    1) There is TCL. Full infrastructure and the jingbang.
    2) Software updates need just a couple of guys. And a basement room.
    Since you believe this as fact, how soon can you provide four guys, you know for sleep and sickness purposes? If you'll put together business plan and let us know when it's ready to go.....
    11-01-17 06:46 AM
  17. Emaderton3's Avatar
    A bug fix is a far cry from a true update that would modernize the OS. It's one thing if they had the people, infrastructure, and dollars to do it, but they don't. And TLC has not licensed BB10 and is moving forward with more BlackBerry Android phones. So what's the problem? Cheerleading was a noble endeavor a few years ago, but sometimes you need to be realistic.

    Posted via CB10
    Qorax likes this.
    11-01-17 07:14 AM
  18. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Sad but true. BB10 is CRAZY expensive to develop and maintain. Especially when it comes to connecting it with the hardware--chip and all that jazz. Which is why it's so good an OS.

    But at least with open source, even with bleak possibilities as discussed above, the community still have a chance to lead it somewhere, or at least see for themselves how futile that effort is.
    BB10 is a dead end for BlackBerry.

    QNX is now a big part of their bread and butter, they can't open source BB10 without doing the same to QNX. And why? Even if BB10 were open source, who has both the skill and desire to work on fixing and maintaining it? CrackBerry tried to opensource their one BB10 app and couldn't get enough of the "community" interested in fixing it.
    BigBadWulf and PantherBlitz like this.
    11-01-17 07:42 AM
  19. Emaderton3's Avatar
    BB10 is a dead end for BlackBerry.

    QNX is now a big part of their bread and butter, they can't open source BB10 without doing the same to QNX. And why? Even if BB10 were open source, who has both the skill and desire to work on fixing and maintaining it? CrackBerry tried to opensource their one BB10 app and couldn't get enough of the "community" interested in fixing it.
    When the unofficial mouthpiece of all things BlackBerry doesn't/can't update their BB10 app, that should definitely tell people something.

    Posted via CB10
    11-01-17 07:45 AM
  20. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    When the unofficial mouthpiece of all things BlackBerry doesn't/can't update their BB10 app, that should definitely tell people something.

    Posted via CB10
    I'm assuming everybody was too busy just downloading the Android version using the various go around tools and patching etc.... ;-) LOL
    11-01-17 07:48 AM
  21. bhoqeem's Avatar
    BB10 is a dead end for BlackBerry.

    QNX is now a big part of their bread and butter, they can't open source BB10 without doing the same to QNX. And why? Even if BB10 were open source, who has both the skill and desire to work on fixing and maintaining it? CrackBerry tried to opensource their one BB10 app and couldn't get enough of the "community" interested in fixing it.
    Aah, yeah, I forgot they still use QNX for their IOT and car software framework. Open sourcing BB10 would indeed pose serious security threat to the system.
    11-01-17 07:51 AM
  22. Emaderton3's Avatar
    I'm assuming everybody was too busy just downloading the Android version using the various go around tools and patching etc.... ;-) LOL
    That's what one expects from a superior OS!

    Posted via CB10
    11-01-17 08:02 AM
  23. texn884's Avatar
    Really, let it go it will be ok i have a number to a shrink and he will help you let go of BB10 and transition into android or Apple and you will make it but you need lots of electro shock seeing pictures of BB10 being shredded and done away with and in time your mind will not have any memory of BB10 and all will be fine, take a deep breath and fondle your device and put it between your legs and rock back and forth.
    ppeters914 likes this.
    11-01-17 08:33 AM
  24. glwerry's Avatar
    It seems like the more that people are told BB10 is EOL, the more threads like this pop up. It really doesn't matter if BlackBerry has made an official announcement. They haven't made any BB10 devices since 2014 and the OS itself is rapidly decaying with most developers abandoning the platform and stock apps deteriorating, the end is nigh.
    It's rather understandable in many ways.
    Like with vehicles, many people long for the "good old days" where you could fix your car with a screwdriver, a pair of pliers and a crescent wrench. I literally once helped a guy with a 1957 Chevy disassemble his carburetor at the side of the highway with a slotted screwdriver and a couple of wrenches. He had a MOSQUITO stuck in the venturi.

    Could I do that on my modern vehicle? Not a chance.

    However, my fuel-injected computerized modern vehicle gets much better gas mileage that the 1957 equivalent, with much more power, incredibly more safety and I just never have to adjust anything. Carburated vehicles I always had to figure out how many times to pump the gas pedal depending on how cold it was. The fuel injection just starts.

    BUT, there's that lingering romantic pull of "the old way", especially if you have to fork out hundreds or thousands to get the modern vehicle fixed.

    I think this is the kind of thing that may be happening to a degree.
    11-01-17 08:39 AM
  25. Mattster723's Avatar
    And when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor. . did we give up?
    app_Developer and Qorax like this.
    11-01-17 09:15 AM
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