03-30-18 02:48 PM
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  1. conite's Avatar
    Adopter , I rewatched the UTB Blogcast several times and that's what Thurber said . He also said that the NIAP certification was the issue and that the update was in a strategy phase. That's undoubtedly why there's been no news yet.
    So, again, that means it ain't coming. "Strategy phase" , "considering options" , "evaluating market conditions" , ALL mean NO.

    With 10.3.3, it was a FULL YEAR between its first appearance on the BlackBerry servers and its release. And in the 11 months since then, we've seen only two tiny patches (2163/2205 and 3057).

    We haven't seen anything yet for 10.3.4.
    Last edited by conite; 11-13-17 at 12:30 AM.
    11-13-17 12:16 AM
  2. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    ChuckFinley06 , my current device is the Nokia Lumia 830 running Windows Phone 📱 10 , and, to put it mildly, WP10 , not to mention Microsoft Edge, isn't exactly stable . Plus the unfortunate fact that the 830 is dying exacerbates the issue. Sometimes I can quote, sometimes not . Nor do I have a computer. So I'm afraid that for the time being if you want to follow what I'm saying, you'll have to do that old fashioned scrolling thing.
    11-13-17 12:30 AM
  3. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    DrBoom, I'm not aware of any other current OS , excluding Android, that can run Android apps so yes BB10's ability to do so is a Unique Selling Point
    11-13-17 12:38 AM
  4. conite's Avatar
    DrBoom, I'm not aware of any other current OS , excluding Android, that can run Android apps so yes BB10's ability to do so is a Unique Selling Point
    Jolla Sailfish.
    Tizen.
    11-13-17 12:48 AM
  5. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Not necessarily conite . It may be that it's not , as you opine , coming. But Thurber said that they were working on it and that BlackBerry was continuing to support BB10 and their BB customers, which interestingly seems to include the legacy OS. So it could also be that 10.3.4 is coming but not anytime soon. Or it could be, since BlackBerry can't update the ART , that the update will be rather different than the current version, like BB11 maybe.
    11-13-17 12:54 AM
  6. conite's Avatar
    Not necessarily conite . It may be that it's not , as you opine , coming. But Thurber said that they were working on it and that BlackBerry was continuing to support BB10 and their BB customers, which interestingly seems to include the legacy OS. So it could also be that 10.3.4 is coming but not anytime soon. Or it could be, since BlackBerry can't update the ART , that the update will be rather different than the current version, like BB11 maybe.
    The fact that they haven't rushed out a Krack fix for its tiny user base doesn't indicate anything to you?

    Why would they bother doing something even bigger for whatever handful of users are left a year from now?
    StephanieMaks likes this.
    11-13-17 01:00 AM
  7. joeldf's Avatar
    DrBoom, I'm not aware of any other current OS , excluding Android, that can run Android apps so yes BB10's ability to do so is a Unique Selling Point
    BB10 running Android was originally only for developers to test their apps in BBW (by virtue of a bar wrapper), and if BB10 takes off, then maybe they will code a native version.

    That never happened.

    If you'll remember, you had to side-load apks converted to bar files - the most common method being the BB10/Playbook Chrome extension installer. Not really user friendly. And certainly not something BlackBerry actively advertised at first.

    It was only later that BlackBerry opened up the apk installer in the OS itself.

    And, as already noted, there are other OSs that can run android.

    So, it wasn't considered a selling point at the beginning (and, it didn't help when it was advertised - if you call a press release advertising - about a year later), and it's not the only non-android OS that can run android apps.

    So much for running Android apps being unique. In fact, there were lots of BlackBerry fans (not all, of course) who hated the idea of the android runtime, and you can find many requests on the forums over the past few years asking how to remove the runtime.
    StephanieMaks likes this.
    11-13-17 01:29 AM
  8. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Conite neither Sailfish nor Tizen officially support Android apps. You can download an app in each case to induce compatibility, but that's not the same as supporting Android apps out of the box.
    As to the KRACK fix , like Thurber said , the new BB10 version is still in the strategy phase. As I said , there's no future for BB10 in it's current state because the ART can't be updated. There's no point to issuing a KRACK fix just now .
    Regarding users , Thurber didn't say how many BB10 users there were , but he did say that they were" incredibly loyal". Immediately after saying that, Thurber volunteered that there were still millions of BBOS users. With millions of users still on their proprietary OSes , BlackBerry would be wise to leverage that support .
    11-13-17 01:41 AM
  9. bronzedragon18's Avatar
    Sorry joelef , but you're wrong . See mh post above.
    11-13-17 01:44 AM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Conite neither Sailfish nor Tizen officially support Android apps. You can download an app in each case to induce compatibility, but that's not the same as supporting Android apps out of the box.
    As to the KRACK fix , like Thurber said , the new BB10 version is still in the strategy phase. As I said , there's no future for BB10 in it's current state because the ART can't be updated. There's no point to issuing a KRACK fix just now .
    Regarding users , Thurber didn't say how many BB10 users there were , but he did say that they were" incredibly loyal". Immediately after saying that, Thurber volunteered that there were still millions of BBOS users. With millions of users still on their proprietary OSes , BlackBerry would be wise to leverage that support .
    Very interesting that you're not seeing the doublespeak for what it really is. You're also ignoring the fact that BB10 is stuck. BB can't update the ART because of Android devices. BB won't update a KRACK fix. Without either of those, BB10 can't move forward.

    Even if BB then wanted to do something, nobody is around to do anything with BB10. The BB10 people were let go already.

    Think about it for just a minute. They're now cash flow positive after exiting hardware and their proprietary OS. Why is the company going to spend any money on something that lost them billions of dollars and will never generate a penny of profit? The BOD that represents shareholders interests, especially large shareholders want the BB10 chapter kept closed forever....

    BB would support BBOS first since at least that generates revenue... Enjoy the old BB10 hardware as long as you can and enjoy buying more of it cheap because sellers are dumping it now before its completely worthless. Even some of the biggest die hard fans here on CB have moved on to other devices because BB10 was/is breaking down on them and they explain in various BB10 threads in detail.

    WP has a better chance of coming back and they've made their announcement haven't they?
    11-13-17 07:05 AM
  11. conite's Avatar
    Conite neither Sailfish nor Tizen officially support Android apps. You can download an app in each case to induce compatibility, but that's not the same as supporting Android apps out of the box.
    As to the KRACK fix , like Thurber said , the new BB10 version is still in the strategy phase. As I said , there's no future for BB10 in it's current state because the ART can't be updated. There's no point to issuing a KRACK fix just now .
    Regarding users , Thurber didn't say how many BB10 users there were , but he did say that they were" incredibly loyal". Immediately after saying that, Thurber volunteered that there were still millions of BBOS users. With millions of users still on their proprietary OSes , BlackBerry would be wise to leverage that support .
    You are using semantics. Every prospective buyer knows full well that both Tizen and Sailfish can support Android apps with a quick download. And compatibility is much better than that of the BB10 VM.

    "There's no point to issuing a KRACK fix just now." Really??! It's a tiny code fix to the radio file - no different than the July update for Vodafone's 4G issue. It's a mission critical flaw that makes using a BB10 device in a secure environment immediately impossible.
    11-13-17 07:14 AM
  12. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Conite neither Sailfish nor Tizen officially support Android apps. You can download an app in each case to induce compatibility, but that's not the same as supporting Android apps out of the box.
    As to the KRACK fix , like Thurber said , the new BB10 version is still in the strategy phase. As I said , there's no future for BB10 in it's current state because the ART can't be updated. There's no point to issuing a KRACK fix just now .
    Regarding users , Thurber didn't say how many BB10 users there were , but he did say that they were" incredibly loyal". Immediately after saying that, Thurber volunteered that there were still millions of BBOS users. With millions of users still on their proprietary OSes , BlackBerry would be wise to leverage that support .
    I suspect with BlackBerry's unwillingness to address KRACK on BB10 in their announcement.... most enterprise customers have added BB10 devices to the list of hardware needing to be replaced soon, due to security concerns. If there is no guidance in the next two months, BB10's phase out will be on the top of most IT Departments budget list for next year. But for many that was the case even before KRACK came along, as it is an old and uncompatiable OS for today's business world.
    11-13-17 07:35 AM
  13. DallinCrump's Avatar
    I wonder how many of the former deeply skilled BB employees would love the chance to jump back to BB NorthEast if there was an opportunity. Maybe BB should keep in touch through an alumni org......I am aware of some who have migrated off to Calif, and Wash and aren't enjoying it as much as they thought they would - the opportunity yes - the life not as much. I'd give that a little while longer to brew for others though.
    The same BlackBerry that laid them off during one of the many rounds of cutbacks?

    BB10 is dead. BlackBerry Ltd doesn’t make phones anymore. They’ve clearly moved on. I don’t understand how or why anyone won’t accept this.
    11-13-17 07:37 AM
  14. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    ... CrackBerry tried to opensource their one BB10 app and couldn't get enough of the "community" interested in fixing it.
    I considered it, but from my point of view there were two major problems:
    1. It wasn't so much an attempt to open source the application as a call for unpaid labor to maintain a product; and
    2. Based on the synchronicity of issue occurring with the BB10 application and changes to the website I assume there are too many dependencies between the front and back ends.


    Not opening the source is perhaps understandable since it it a branded application. On the other hand there are a number of reasons CrackBerry should try to stand out from other BB10 application providers who find it becoming less and less feasible to maintain an app in the ecosystem.

    The second issues is really why I didn't come forward. There is too much of Web 2.0 and Agile Manifesto in the design. The outward signs are unmistakable. For example I could not find your post in the BB10 application anywhere. The only reason I knew your post existed was because someone else quoted it in a reply. I had to come to the the web version to find your post and reply to it. I would have to look at the code of both front and back ends to be sure, but this kind of bug is usually a symptom of issues at the core design level and would probably need a clean sheet restart to fix properly. In any case the CB BB10 app and the CB website are products I wouldn't take on for money, because all I see is frustration, so I'm not going to do it as a hobby.

    On the other hand I have been involved in diagnosing and fixing issues in BB10 and pre-installed applications pro bono and would happy continue.
    Dunt Dunt Dunt and elfabio80 like this.
    11-13-17 08:12 AM
  15. joeldf's Avatar
    Sorry joelef , but you're wrong . See mh post above.
    I am not wrong. When BB10 was introduced, being able to run android apps was a feature of the OS only to ease developers into BB10.

    It was never intended to be an end user feature.

    It only turned into one when developers ignored BB10.

    See the history of BB10 behind you.
    11-13-17 08:44 AM
  16. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Adopter , I rewatched the UTB Blogcast several times and that's what Thurber said . He also said that the NIAP certification was the issue and that the update was in a strategy phase. That's undoubtedly why there's been no news yet.
    Okay. I Re watched it too, and heard the same thing, but to me, "strategy phase" just meant, "we're considering it," which I interpreted as "not working on it." So, we agree on what was said, but not what it means.

    I think that, if they don't announce a plan to patch KRACK or release 10.3.4 before Dec. 31, the chance of any future patches becomes vanishingly small.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    11-13-17 08:49 AM
  17. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I am not wrong. When BB10 was introduced, being able to run android apps was a feature of the OS only to ease developers into BB10.

    It was never intended to be an end user feature.

    It only turned into one when developers ignored BB10.

    See the history of BB10 behind you.
    For a while they were even locking the runtime, you had to have a developer key to "test" apps and it was only good for 30 Days. BlackBerry's plan was to profit from sales off apps in BlackBerry World, native or ported. But Chen figured out, if you can't beat them, join them..... had the runtime opened and even tried to "partner" with Amazon. But that wasn't the original intent.
    11-13-17 10:27 AM
  18. Invictus0's Avatar
    most enterprise customers have added BB10 devices to the list of hardware needing to be replaced soon, due to security concerns.
    Source? Customers that made their transitions public have cited the lack of availability for new/replacement BB10 devices, not security.
    11-13-17 11:23 AM
  19. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    I don't know a single corporate IT manager who doesn't want all unpatched KRACK-vulnerable endpoints permanently off of their WiFi networks.

    I can no longer use WiFi on my BB10 phones at client sites without violating my contracts.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    11-13-17 11:29 AM
  20. stlabrat's Avatar
    BB product is radar for the moment... radar frequency is 5G... three key challenges currently already resolved by IBM
    https://www.ibm.com/blogs/research/2...ve-5g-wireless
    Let's wait and see if BB can take advantage of its radar and head back to glory. (big IF or else)... it is pointless to BB10 with droid as chocker point on run time... IMHO.
    11-13-17 11:33 AM
  21. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    DrBoom, I'm not aware of any other current OS , excluding Android, that can run Android apps so yes BB10's ability to do so is a Unique Selling Point
    Now you exclude Android.
    Others have mentioned Tizen and Sailfish can also run Android apps.
    Then you attempted to move the goalposts again.

    If you keep adding caveats after the fact at some point you will probably have an USP.
    Of course that USP is already fairly silly and heading toward ridiculous.
    11-13-17 12:13 PM
  22. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Given the frequent reaction to "hey get bb10 off the sidelines during the game" is ....nuts, crazy, you're not only vulnerable to KRACK quite possibly(along with everybody else)...but you are on CRACK...and besides who will pay for the new stadium?....(Rather than poster's coming up with unique breakthrough idea's capitalizing on the QNX foundation, and getting the business and the markets to float the idea....which was possibly the intent of the OP and this thread).

    Then I propose in parallel with the "way out" of his league PM of Canada legalizing and taxing Marijuanna, which is clearly a way more crazy idea.....That the only thing to do...is take some of those Millions or Billions in puffing pipe-dream greenbacks (going to the tax mad man - not to be confused with Google's Madison Av. Mad men) and take bb10 to the gym to bulk up a bit (cause basically he's in okay shape) . Otherwise he (BB) will end up in a hazy confused stupor from his neighbour's 2nd hand-smoke...Just until the market is sufficiently stable competitive-wise. THIS SUGGESTION IS GOVERNMENT CERTIFIED POT-FREE.
    11-13-17 01:57 PM
  23. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Given the frequent reaction to "hey get bb10 off the sidelines during the game" is ....nuts, crazy, you're not only vulnerable to KRACK quite possibly(along with everybody else)...but you are on CRACK...and besides who will pay for the new stadium?....(Rather than poster's coming up with unique breakthrough idea's capitalizing on the QNX foundation, and getting the business and the markets to float the idea....which was possibly the intent of the OP and this thread).

    Then I propose in parallel with the "way out" of his league PM of Canada legalizing and taxing Marijuanna, which is clearly a way more crazy idea.....That the only thing to do...is take some of those Millions or Billions in puffing pipe-dream greenbacks (going to the tax mad man - not to be confused with Google's Madison Av. Mad men) and take bb10 to the gym to bulk up a bit (cause basically he's in okay shape) . Otherwise he (BB) will end up in a hazy confused stupor from his neighbour's 2nd hand-smoke...Just until the market is sufficiently stable competitive-wise. THIS SUGGESTION IS GOVERNMENT CERTIFIED POT-FREE.
    Now things are becoming clear in the haze as everything goes Up In Smoke. Glad to see you're ok Dave....
    11-13-17 02:14 PM
  24. bobshine's Avatar
    DrBoom, I'm not aware of any other current OS , excluding Android, that can run Android apps so yes BB10's ability to do so is a Unique Selling Point
    Ok it’s a “USP”... but a very small handful of client are interested in it. Not corporations (most disable the runtime), not governments.... maybe a few hardcore BB10 loyalist. Most BB loyalist moved to Android
    11-13-17 05:27 PM
  25. bobshine's Avatar
    BB product is radar for the moment... radar frequency is 5G... three key challenges currently already resolved by IBM
    https://www.ibm.com/blogs/research/2...ve-5g-wireless
    Let's wait and see if BB can take advantage of its radar and head back to glory. (big IF or else)... it is pointless to BB10 with droid as chocker point on run time... IMHO.
    BB haven’t innovated in years in hardware. I would prefer seeing them seeing some inroad in software. The hardware battle is between Goliath and Goliath now (Apple and Samsung)... don’t think there’s room for a third player
    11-13-17 05:49 PM
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