07-11-17 01:11 PM
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  1. kunz1925shooter's Avatar
    So you are saying, accept Google's terms or don't use the phone? Because that's the problem. In order to use their OS you have to allow they to collect.

    15 years ago we called it spyware, today we call them apps.
    I think you hit the bullseye.



    Via a very battered white BlackBerry z30 , running on the fumes of love...LoLz!!!
    04-09-17 06:02 PM
  2. conite's Avatar
    So you are saying, accept Google's terms or don't use the phone?
    Same as any other device. Apple has a ToS you have to accept, as does BB10.

    All include the right to collect information from you. Google is just better at it, and have more useful services to make it worth our while.
    04-09-17 06:28 PM
  3. vimagreg's Avatar
    Same as any other device. Apple has a ToS you have to accept, as does BB10.

    All include the right to collect information from you. Google is just better at it, and have more useful services to make it worth our while.
    Yes, it's exactly it. If you don't want Google accessing your data so keep Google away of you. Simple like that.

    About Google offering services that worth our while... That's can be discussed. For me it doesn't, for example. In the end, yes, all is choice. But use Android without share your life with Google: impossible. That's the way it makes money after all.
    elfabio80 likes this.
    04-09-17 06:42 PM
  4. ominaxe's Avatar
    When choosing a phone, what it comes down to is whatever phone gives me the best end user experience. This is why I don't think about spyware or selling information to advertisers as long as it doesn't get in my way, I don't think about the cultural implications of using a certain OS, the technology used in the phone, the community that uses the phone, or the company's business.

    What I do think about is how my phone works for me in the quickest, simplest, most efficient way. My previous BlackBerry Storm 2 couldn't do a lot of things I wanted, iOS was simple and reliable, but was inefficient for me (app centricity bothers me as well as reliance on iTunes). On the other end, Android seemed unreliable, battery hogging, and cluttered. This is one reason I loved WP7 as everything was right on the start screen and many things were unified with FB. For me it was simple and reliable, just what I needed. WP8 changed that when it started trying to catch up and copy Android. It became a glitchy, cluttered, disjointed mess. I have no allegiances so I changed back to BlackBerry with BB10.

    The Q10 showed me how simple and efficient a phone with a keyboard and unified inbox could be. But as apps are becoming scarce on BB10 and the OS has gotten glitchy with the 10.3 update, I'm willing to give up my BB10 'allegiance' and try Android with Nougat on the only phone that has the proposed efficiency of a unified inbox and keyboard, the KEYone. Not sure if Android will be for me, but I'm willing to try it to see if BlackBerry can bring the things I loved from their OS to Android. Will WP10 become better in the future and bring back more unification? Perhaps. But as of right now, when I need a phone it's nowhere in sight. I'll cross that bridge when the time comes.

    It seems that many people get so hung up on security, brand allegiance, phone culture, specs, and business that they forget how to just use and enjoy their phones.
    howarmat and BigBadWulf like this.
    04-09-17 07:06 PM
  5. howarmat's Avatar
    When choosing a phone, what it comes down to is whatever phone gives me the best end user experience. This is why I don't think about spyware or selling information to advertisers as long as it doesn't get in my way, I don't think about the cultural implications of using a certain OS, the technology used in the phone, the community that uses the phone, or the company's business.

    What I do think about is how my phone works for me in the quickest, simplest, most efficient way. My previous BlackBerry Storm 2 couldn't do a lot of things I wanted, iOS was simple and reliable, but was inefficient for me (app centricity bothers me as well as reliance on iTunes). On the other end, Android seemed unreliable, battery hogging, and cluttered. This is one reason I loved WP7 as everything was right on the start screen and many things were unified with FB. For me it was simple and reliable, just what I needed. WP8 changed that when it started trying to catch up and copy Android. It became a glitchy, cluttered, disjointed mess. I have no allegiances so I changed back to BlackBerry with BB10.

    The Q10 showed me how simple and efficient a phone with a keyboard and unified inbox could be. But as apps are becoming scarce on BB10 and the OS has gotten glitchy with the 10.3 update, I'm willing to give up my BB10 'allegiance' and try Android with Nougat on the only phone that has the proposed efficiency of a unified inbox and keyboard, the KEYone. Not sure if Android will be for me, but I'm willing to try it to see if BlackBerry can bring the things I loved from their OS to Android. Will WP10 become better in the future and bring back more unification? Perhaps. But as of right now, when I need a phone it's nowhere in sight. I'll cross that bridge when the time comes.

    It seems that many people get so hung up on security, brand allegiance, phone culture, specs, and business that they forget how to just use and enjoy their phones.
    Awesome post and spot on. It really comes down to what works for you. BB10 didnt have a prayer to work for me, android has always been great to me though. I went Iphone this time around and iOS has been a great experience as well. Win8/10 never won me over but its a solid 3rd choice with really no other option.

    But in the end everyone is different and going forward you will have to choose from the big 3 probably and find what works best for you
    BigBadWulf and anon(9803228) like this.
    04-09-17 07:25 PM
  6. Powdah's Avatar
    Agreed - made the difficult move to Android by buying a Mate 9. For me, width of screen is important. The OS while infuriating, is smooth, apps run well. I hate to say it, but a smoother app experience than on BB10, especially after the last update.

    I do not like having to enable Google Play Services for many of the apps I use often, but that is life. Advertisements are a pain in the ***.

    Now if they would give me a Passport width with a 2:3 ratio screen, all would be well.
    04-10-17 10:26 AM
  7. Trouveur's Avatar
    Well that was interesting to google. Somehow runs most android apps, and of all things ported Symbian apps.

    What's the appeal for you? Security? Multi-tasking? The open-sourceness?
    Main things :
    - the UI and the gestures to navigate, like BB10
    - true multi-tasking like BB10
    - an OS not developed by a US firm
    - privacy respect

    Posted via CB10
    04-10-17 10:37 AM
  8. Drael646464's Avatar
    Main things :
    - the UI and the gestures to navigate, like BB10
    - true multi-tasking like BB10
    - an OS not developed by a US firm
    - privacy respect

    Posted via CB10

    I though true multitasking meant apps continued to run in background. I know that's sort of emulated in android, but apps get frozen. Does that happen in bb10? Suppose it does?
    04-10-17 11:11 AM
  9. conite's Avatar
    I though true multitasking meant apps continued to run in background. I know that's sort of emulated in android, but apps get frozen. Does that happen in bb10? Suppose it does?
    BB10 is a RTOS. But this is not important on a mobile OS. As a matter of fact, it can be detrimental to battery life.
    04-10-17 11:20 AM
  10. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    So you are saying, accept Google's terms or don't use the phone? Because that's the problem. In order to use their OS you have to allow they to collect.
    Right. Exactly like every other mobile OS ever released as a commercial product. Including BBOS, BB10, WinPhone, Sailfish, Tizen, WebOS, Symbian, and even Palm OS.
    04-10-17 03:04 PM
  11. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Right. Exactly like every other mobile OS ever released as a commercial product. Including BBOS, BB10, WinPhone, Sailfish, Tizen, WebOS, Symbian, and even Palm OS.
    I generally agree with this, of course. A contract is being offered, and it is up to the user to accept or reject the terms of the agreement.

    But, saying or implying that there are not very substantial differences between the Android, iOS, and BlackBerry terms is disingenuous.

    Unlike BlackBerry, Google's entire business model revolves around exploiting (I use the word in an economic context sense, not in a negative, judgemental way) user information. Blackberry does not. While both company's TOS cover similar ground, what actually HAPPENS to users' individual and aggregated data is very different.

    Saying that signing BB's TOS is the same as signing Google's is like saying that signing a rental car agreement is the same as signing a multi-year lease. In principal that's 100% correct, but in practice they results are very different.

    By design, BlackBerry does not even offer for you to tie your personal email/calendar/contacts/etc. To your Blackberry account. You may use any Blackberry ID you choose, and you can list an email address that you never configure on your phone for anything else. This means that, at a fundamental level, Blackberry does not demonstrate any desire to aggregate personal information to use for any purpose other than providing the service you have paid for. They explicitly do not provide personal data to help advertisers target users.

    You can certainly create a Google ID and use it the same way on Android, but Google does not want this, since they are in the business of monetizing user data, which BlackBerry is not.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    i_plod_an_dr_void likes this.
    04-10-17 03:39 PM
  12. Ment's Avatar
    Main things :
    - the UI and the gestures to navigate, like BB10
    - true multi-tasking like BB10
    - an OS not developed by a US firm
    - privacy respect

    Posted via CB10
    Plan on staying away from Android apps then. Jolla doesn't have robust permissions system yet although they were planning on making a hardened version of Sailfish OS last year. Don't know how far they've gotten since they have funding issues.
    04-10-17 04:40 PM
  13. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    It's okay, Jolla's app count is up around 400 already, and it's only been around what, 3-4 years?
    04-10-17 08:55 PM
  14. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    BB10 is a RTOS. But this is not important on a mobile OS. As a matter of fact, it can be detrimental to battery life.
    RTOS was the reason to go BB10,still is, part of it's robustness. Non-Real Time Operating Systems don't cut it, and not just for multi-tasking.you just haven't discovered RTOS's benefit yet. For some crucial applications (not apps per say) its a must. If you are just a single-tasking person (tetris, bubble apps) you might not notice the benefits. If you are doing twice as much with your phone at the same time a raised power consumption isn't a concern (Though has anyone quantified whether there are any significant or even slight power consumption increases? Other things can consume far more power on their own )
    04-10-17 11:31 PM
  15. conite's Avatar
    RTOS was the reason to go BB10,still is, part of it's robustness. Non-Real Time Operating Systems don't cut it
    Troy has a good post on this issue:

    /blackberry-10-os-f269/any-chance-apple-google-will-release-qnx-type-real-time-os-1087224/#post12606576
    04-10-17 11:54 PM
  16. Drael646464's Avatar
    RTOS was the reason to go BB10,still is, part of it's robustness. Non-Real Time Operating Systems don't cut it, and not just for multi-tasking.you just haven't discovered RTOS's benefit yet. For some crucial applications (not apps per say) its a must. If you are just a single-tasking person (tetris, bubble apps) you might not notice the benefits. If you are doing twice as much with your phone at the same time a raised power consumption isn't a concern (Though has anyone quantified whether there are any significant or even slight power consumption increases? Other things can consume far more power on their own )
    Fair point if your very actively using your device it can be of benefit to have several processes running at once (ie timed saved not waiting for processes to complete). And if you are very actively using your device, battery is going to drain anyway. I doubt there would be significant difference battery wise, at that level. I can see applications where this is preferable.

    Most people of course don't use their phones that intensively. But I agree, its not accurate to suggest this is never useful, or never what one wants.

    Worth mentioning this doesn't entirely NOT happen on android. Some apps run real time, like music playing apps for example.
    04-11-17 12:21 AM
  17. aullak's Avatar
    Get the samsung Note series!

    Posted via CB10
    04-11-17 03:30 AM
  18. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    RTOS was the reason to go BB10,still is, part of it's robustness. Non-Real Time Operating Systems don't cut it, and not just for multi-tasking.you just haven't discovered RTOS's benefit yet. For some crucial applications (not apps per say) its a must. If you are just a single-tasking person (tetris, bubble apps) you might not notice the benefits. If you are doing twice as much with your phone at the same time a raised power consumption isn't a concern (Though has anyone quantified whether there are any significant or even slight power consumption increases? Other things can consume far more power on their own )
    Could you provide some specifics? I'm not sure I know what you're talking about.
    04-11-17 06:17 AM
  19. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Could you provide some specifics? I'm not sure I know what you're talking about.
    BB10 RTOS is like...

    Not going to the new blackdroid phones? Where to next?-brawndo_social_head.gif
    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-11-17 07:13 AM
  20. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    BB10 RTOS is like...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Idiocracy?
    04-11-17 07:23 AM
  21. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Idiocracy?
    Yes.
    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-11-17 07:23 AM
  22. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    The lack of true multitasking is one of my biggest complaints with mobile devices. It's like we're living back in the early 90s with Windows 3.1!

    A few examples:

    1) Not being able to quickly watch a work-related training video while on a conference call (switching the audio to the video witho.ut dropping the call). I'm often on hour-long calls as a host where my participation is not needed for a few minutes, and I could use that time to review information in the training videos we're discussing on the call.

    2) While riding in a car as the navigator, map programs fail to update location continuously if the map program isn't active, causing me to miss turns when multitasking.

    3) If I need to load a bunch of web pages, only the active page will load, so that I have to wait for each page to load when it's active. I want to be able to let 4 or 5 others preload while I'm reading the first one.

    4) When running small simulations or other computational processes that take time, I can't complete other tasks and let the calculations run in the background.

    All of these tasks are trivially simple on Windows, Linux and MacOS. Just another way in which the current crop of mobile OSes are not ready for prime time.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Last edited by bb10adopter111; 04-11-17 at 08:11 AM.
    i_plod_an_dr_void and jope28 like this.
    04-11-17 07:24 AM
  23. Drael646464's Avatar
    This is total side topic, but seeing as it was already raised as a topic in this thread, I thought I would just mention that windows creators update for windows 10 pro/home (desktop/tablet) features --

    Go into apps, under apps find "Phone". Under the action centre, find "Mobile Hotspot" (or network settings). Under settings>privacy find "Call history". Under privacy messaging find "Let apps read or send SMS/MMS"

    Suggesting, to me, (not so much suggesting as totally spelling out) when adding last years windows 10 on ARM announcement, a merger with windows mobile.

    Ie replacing windows 10 mobile with just plain old windows 10

    Told ya so. Should be this year! Ya. As I expect the surface phone will be too. That's going to be SO dope next to boring old smartphones, having a full powered desktop OS. SO dope.

    So I won't have to even think twice about my next phone purchase. It'll just be a matter of finding a phone with the drivers and hardware for the upgrade. 4s will probably do nicely with its 4gb of ram. My tablet goes well with 4gb. Even some desktop games.

    And the mail app can manage multiple inboxes. Sadly the messaging app is separate, but that doesn't stop any third party from writing something like the HUB. Maybe BlackBerry will chip in when the sales fly (as they will, there is zero doubt win32 apps will attract people, especially enterprise, creatives and gamers).

    Happy!
    Last edited by Drael646464; 04-13-17 at 01:54 AM.
    04-11-17 06:08 PM
  24. grimlok's Avatar
    I will probably go with a non-proprietary OS like Replicant. It is a Free Software version of Android that has had Google's Spyware removed (AKA Google Play Services).

    I was hoping that Ubuntu Phone would have broken out into the mainstream a bit more because it had a similar communications center like the Hub, but Ubuntu has just announced they are quitting development of it.

    Posted via CB10
    04-12-17 10:27 PM
  25. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    This is total side topic, but seeing as it was already raised as a topic in this thread, I thought I would just mention that windows creators update for windows 10 pro/home (desktop/tablet) features --

    Go into apps, under apps find "Phone". Under the action centre, find "Mobile Hotspot" (or network settings). Under settings>privacy find "Call history". Under privacy messaging find "Let apps read or send SMS/MMS"

    Suggesting, to me, (not so much suggesting as totally spelling out) when adding last years windows 10 on ARM announcement, a merger with windows mobile.

    Ie replacing windows 10 mobile with just plain old windows 10

    Told ya so. Should be this year! Ya. As I expect the surface phone will be too. That's going to be SO dope next to boring old smartphones, having a full powered desktop OS. SO dope.

    So I won't have to even think twice about my next phone purchase. It'll just be a matter of finding a phone with the drivers and hardware for the upgrade. 4s will probably do nicely with its 4gb of ram. My tablet goes well with 4gb. Even some desktop games.

    And the mail app can manage multiple inboxes. Sadly the messaging app is separate, but that doesn't stop any third party from writing something like the HUB. Maybe BlackBerry will chip in when the sales fly (as they will, there is zero doubt win32 apps will attract people, especially enterprise, creatives and gamers).

    Happy!
    I'm amazed that so few people around here appreciate the potential of a truly converged Windows 10 running on phones, tablets and PCs.

    One of the under-reported events has been the way that Microsoft bought and has invested in Xamarin Studios, a major Android / Windows Universal development platform, and how they are integrating x-plaform mobile development into Visual Studio. They are making it very easy for win32 developers to port their code to Windows Universal, Android, and iOS.

    There are still many, many more useful software applications on Win32 than on Android and iOS combined.

    The only reason I can't use a Surface Pro as a mobile phone is lack of integrated GPS, always on/connected functionality, voice command or a wearable for hands-free phone use, and a phone SIM. None of those are particularly difficult.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    04-13-17 07:59 AM
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