04-25-17 01:14 AM
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  1. Yoox_II's Avatar
    We kept BlackBerry's head above water these past 3 years by buying into their brand new OS10 phones. But now that they realize they'll never be profitable, we're left in quite the lurch. I know these phones won't "stop working" because of ended support aside from security updates, but man it upsets me, how we receive no official message from BlackBerry that BB10 will not be developed and improved anymore. It leaves some people wondering and hoping for a cool new update with new features and a new look, because some people are less informed about what's going on. Anyone who isn't a member of a site like CB pretty much won't know that their phone is now on its way to being outdated even if they just bought it yesterday!

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by pkcable; 01-06-16 at 08:36 AM. Reason: filter evsasion
    01-05-16 11:07 AM
  2. lift's Avatar
    We kept BlackBerry's head above water these past 3 years by buying into their brand new OS10 phones. But now that they realize they'll never be profitable, we're left in quite the lurch. I know these phones won't "stop working" because of ended support aside from security updates, but man it upsets me off how we receive no official message from BlackBerry that BB10 will not be developed and improved anymore. It leaves some people wondering and hoping for a cool new update with new features and a new look, because some people are less informed about what's going on. Anyone who isn't a member of a site like CB pretty much won't know that their phone is now on its way to being outdated even if they just bought it yesterday!

    Posted via CB10
    I feel the same way. I had more than 14 BB10 devices over the last couple of years. I like all touch devices more but I bought some PKB devices too just to see if I could get myself to like them better. Never happened. But overall I really loved using BB10. Now I feel like BlackBerry just threw all the Loyal BlackBerry followers under the bus with their move to android. In my opinion the move did 2 things.
    1) It killed their BB10 device sales because nobody wants to buy a phone that they feel will no longer be supported or become obsolete in the very near future.
    2) Killed app development for BB10 even more now because of what I stated in number 1. What developer is going to keep developing apps on a dying platform. So the app gap gets worse.
    The Priv is never going to sell enough devices to make up for the falling sales of BB10 devices so in the end, BlackBerry killed themselves by moving to android.
    That's the only "Thanks" that us BB10 loyal users are going to get. We kept the company afloat as you said, and now it's "don't let the door hit you on the way out".
    Last edited by pkcable; 01-06-16 at 08:37 AM.
    01-05-16 11:18 AM
  3. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    How would you like to be an IT guy that got your company to move to BES12 and BB10 devices last year.....


    I would take them at their word, two minor updates is all they have planned.
    01-05-16 11:33 AM
  4. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I feel the same way. I had more than 14 BB10 devices over the last couple of years. I like all touch devices more but I bought some PKB devices too just to see if I could get myself to like them better. Never happened. But overall I really loved using BB10. Now I feel like BlackBerry just threw all the Loyal BlackBerry followers under the bus with their move to android. In my opinion the move did 2 things.
    1) It killed their BB10 device sales because nobody wants to buy a phone that they feel will no longer be supported or become obsolete in the very near future.
    2) Killed app development for BB10 even more now because of what I stated in number 1. What developer is going to keep developing apps on a dying platform. So the app gap gets worse.
    The Priv is never going to sell enough devices to make up for the falling sales of BB10 devices so in the end, BlackBerry killed themselves by moving to android.
    That's the only "Thanks" that us BB10 loyal users are going to get. We kept the company afloat as you said, and now it's "don't let the door hit you on the way out".
    Sorry but sales and development died long before BlackBerry officially announced any move to Android or cut backs to BB10. BB10's days were already numbered, other than one quarter.... I think hardware sales have slipped every quarter that Chen has been at BlackBerry.

    I agree that the move to Android was never going to save BlackBerry hardware business... but then I'm not sure Chen ever taught it would.
    01-05-16 11:39 AM
  5. conite's Avatar
    So OP, what is the alternative? You want BlackBerry to keep making BB10 phones and developing the BB10 OS, at staggering losses, for a small group of people?

    They've already agreed to provide support and security patches.
    01-05-16 11:45 AM
  6. lift's Avatar
    The move to android is going to destroy what small amount of BB10 device sales BlackBerry had. Development of BB10 apps is done and never going to get better. It is going to keep getting worse day by day. Sad but true, and that is what upsets the many BB10 loyal users and supporters.
    moyah8 and Killjoyhere like this.
    01-05-16 11:46 AM
  7. Yoox_II's Avatar
    So OP, what is the alternative? You want BlackBerry to keep making BB10 phones and developing the BB10 OS, at staggering losses, for a small group of people?
    No. Did I say I had a better idea? No. Was I merely sharing my thoughts on the situation? Yes


    Posted via CB10
    vanrickman and Killjoyhere like this.
    01-05-16 11:46 AM
  8. anon(2313227)'s Avatar
    Yeah what's wrong with BB. I remember HP apologizing profusely when they termed WebOS. Also Sega and the Genesis. Sony and Beta.

    WTF is wrong with BB?
    Last edited by deremi; 01-05-16 at 05:41 PM.
    01-05-16 12:11 PM
  9. early2bed's Avatar
    Well, since the Priv is only on one carrier in the US, right now, announcing the end of BB10 would be like saying "If you aren't on AT&T then don't buy a BlackBerry." I don't think anyone would expect them to do that. To be fair, John Chen has heavily implied that his future hardware strategy is based on Android. There should be some insiders that can give us a BB10 platform development head count which would be revealing. The only people who don't realize what is happening are people who choose not to do so.
    Killjoyhere likes this.
    01-05-16 12:22 PM
  10. Valker's Avatar
    So OP, what is the alternative? You want BlackBerry to keep making BB10 phones and developing the BB10 OS, at staggering losses, for a small group of people?

    They've already agreed to provide support and security patches.
    Well - actually yes. Why all the fuss about market share? Couldn't BB decide to be a niche player and downsize enough to retain a core staff which would keep working on BB10 upgrades - and still be profitable?. I test drove the S6 and the Priv and have to say that BB10 is far superior. Using Cobalt's excellent files I have loaded all the Google Play apps I need (and some I don't), but maybe BB could now arrange with Google to make more apps available to BB10 now that they are in a joint venture with the Priv. BB10 is such a great OS now, and could be enhanced to make it even better. Hell, before I'd pay $700 for a Priv I'd pay for BB10 enhancements.
    01-05-16 12:33 PM
  11. GadgetTravel's Avatar
    It's not all about you.

    Or as Michael Corleone would say, "it's business, not personal".
    01-05-16 12:48 PM
  12. GadgetTravel's Avatar
    Well - actually yes. Why all the fuss about market share? Couldn't BB decide to be a niche player and downsize enough to retain a core staff which would keep working on BB10 upgrades - and still be profitable?. I test drove the S6 and the Priv and have to say that BB10 is far superior. Using Cobalt's excellent files I have loaded all the Google Play apps I need (and some I don't), but maybe BB could now arrange with Google to make more apps available to BB10 now that they are in a joint venture with the Priv. BB10 is such a great OS now, and could be enhanced to make it even better. Hell, before I'd pay $700 for a Priv I'd pay for BB10 enhancements.
    No.
    01-05-16 12:48 PM
  13. early2bed's Avatar
    Well - actually yes. Why all the fuss about market share? Couldn't BB decide to be a niche player and downsize enough to retain a core staff which would keep working on BB10 upgrades - and still be profitable?.
    It's hard to be an niche player when your CEO is the highest paid CEO in Canada at almost $90 million last year. Isn't that something like $20 for every single phone that BlackBerry sold in 2014? LOL.
    Killjoyhere likes this.
    01-05-16 12:50 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    Well - actually yes. Why all the fuss about market share? Couldn't BB decide to be a niche player and downsize enough to retain a core staff which would keep working on BB10 upgrades - and still be profitable?. I test drove the S6 and the Priv and have to say that BB10 is far superior. Using Cobalt's excellent files I have loaded all the Google Play apps I need (and some I don't), but maybe BB could now arrange with Google to make more apps available to BB10 now that they are in a joint venture with the Priv. BB10 is such a great OS now, and could be enhanced to make it even better. Hell, before I'd pay $700 for a Priv I'd pay for BB10 enhancements.
    1) Google Services can't have anything to do with BB10 because of OHA regulations.

    2) The Android Runtime can't be further developed because of OHA regulations.

    3) Cobalt's work (although awesome), isn't exactly on the level.

    4) An Android Runtime stuck forever on Jellybean would destroy what's left of the ecosystem within a year

    5) Without full-blown OS development, BB10 would fall so quickly behind, that it would be laughable in no time.

    6) Cost of designing, developing, and coding drivers for new BB10 hardware for super-small production runs would be insanely expensive.
    01-05-16 12:50 PM
  15. iHadLastBB's Avatar
    I just leave this here I just got from Blackberry Team via https://twitter.com/BlackBerryHelp , so all of you just at least for a moment stopped killing all innocent horses:

    "Hello, We're very sorry for the inconvenience about the Facebook application. To be honest, we are currently working on updating all applications that is needed to be updated. Not just Facebook but all the application. I don't know the exact date when would the update will be released but rest assured that we will notify everyone about it. ^KO"

    I hope this is not just a speculations for me to calm down and we see really huge improvement with next BB10OS update! Update with Virtual keyboard layout letters / OS translations too, so everyone worldwide finally could buy and start using BB10OS devices!
    Zeratul57 likes this.
    01-05-16 01:00 PM
  16. Valker's Avatar
    I don't know..... Take a million (or whatever) BB users there are out there and offer an upgrade package for $500 and you'd have $0.5 billion to play with - maybe develop key BB10 apps in house, and make other improvements (e.g., camera software)?

    When BB10 came out there were so many people on this site trashing it (which probably didn't help sales !), and now I think a lot are coming to the realization that BB10 is actually very, very good. I mean, have you seen the calendar app on an Android?!!? Can you really multi-task without that silly split screen, pull files and attach them out of a file manager, use a real Hub, use RFA, and Blend? Sure - there are probably work arounds and apps galore at Google Play, but at the cost of battery draining and who knows what else - and it still isn't a smooth and coordinated. as BB10...... Take the BB users, do a survey on what apps they "have to have", prioritize them and develop them in house, then turn around and sell a package - maybe so much an app? ...... The BB customers who know the value of BB10, and are secure in not having access to thousands of meaningless apps might go for this.
    01-05-16 01:05 PM
  17. iHadLastBB's Avatar
    I don't know..... Take a million (or whatever) BB users there are out there and offer an upgrade package for $500 and you'd have $0.5 billion to play with - maybe develop key BB10 apps in house, and make other improvements (e.g., camera software)?

    When BB10 came out there were so many people on this site trashing it (which probably didn't help sales !), and now I think a lot are coming to the realization that BB10 is actually very, very good. I mean, have you seen the calendar app on an Android?!!? Can you really multi-task without that silly split screen, pull files and attach them out of a file manager, use a real Hub, use RFA, and Blend? Sure - there are probably work arounds and apps galore at Google Play, but at the cost of battery draining and who knows what else - and it still isn't a smooth and coordinated. as BB10...... Take the BB users, do a survey on what apps they "have to have", prioritize them and develop them in house, then turn around and sell a package - maybe so much an app? ...... The BB customers who know the value of BB10, and are secure in not having access to thousands of meaningless apps might go for this.
    and do not forget that for BB10OS "don't need app for that" what apps Blackberry exactly creating for android OS right now, they'r just build in inside BB10OS!
    01-05-16 01:20 PM
  18. conite's Avatar
    I don't know..... Take a million (or whatever) BB users there are out there and offer an upgrade package for $500 and you'd have $0.5 billion to play with - maybe develop key BB10 apps in house, and make other improvements (e.g., camera software)?

    When BB10 came out there were so many people on this site trashing it (which probably didn't help sales !), and now I think a lot are coming to the realization that BB10 is actually very, very good. I mean, have you seen the calendar app on an Android?!!? Can you really multi-task without that silly split screen, pull files and attach them out of a file manager, use a real Hub, use RFA, and Blend? Sure - there are probably work arounds and apps galore at Google Play, but at the cost of battery draining and who knows what else - and it still isn't a smooth and coordinated. as BB10...... Take the BB users, do a survey on what apps they "have to have", prioritize them and develop them in house, then turn around and sell a package - maybe so much an app? ...... The BB customers who know the value of BB10, and are secure in not having access to thousands of meaningless apps might go for this.
    Not to derail the thread, but I am a long time super-fan of BB10 (and still use it), but I think the Priv is even better. But I digress, there are other threads to discuss that.

    I think full blown OS and device development costs closer to one or two billion dollars a year. BlackBerry stated that they needed to sell 10 million BB10 devices just to break even. This is based on a unit profit of maybe $100-$200. If you have a million users, upgrading every two years, you would need a profit of $2000-$4000 per phone (PLUS the cost of a limited run device too!!). I can't see that happening. Keep in mind - no further development on Android Runtime is possible, regardless of resources.

    Anything less (some minor app development, with a Runtime stuck at Jellybean) would be DOA.
    Last edited by conite; 01-05-16 at 01:37 PM.
    Morty2264 likes this.
    01-05-16 01:22 PM
  19. Valker's Avatar
    Continuing.... OK - so let's say BB has provided all the phones that they ever will that run on BB10. Now just focus on software - BB10 enhancements - for those who understand and appreciate BB10. (BB can sell Android phones like the Priv if they want to stay in the hardware business.). Depending on what could be made available I would rather buy that from BB World, or buy an BB10 upgrade, than go get a Priv or an S6 and then look back and think "what the s*** did I just blow $700 on when I was better off with my Z30 with all the apps that I need?".... And then put the Priv in the drawer and go back to my Z30..... And I am not so sure that BB couldn't do an end run on the Android developers by developing really advanced apps for those in diifferent professions - like medicine/health care, transportation, business, legal, engineering, etc. - become the truly professional leader in smart phone technology. I mean - Candy Crush?? - believe it or not, not everyone gives a damn about it. I think that there are a lot of BB users that are more mature than playing silly games and spending hours on Facebook.
    01-05-16 01:43 PM
  20. conite's Avatar
    And I am not so sure that BB couldn't do an end run on the Android developers by developing really advanced apps for those in diifferent professions - like medicine/health care, transportation, business, legal, engineering, etc. - become the truly professional leader in smart phone technology. I mean - Candy Crush?? - believe it or not, not everyone gives a damn about it. I think that there are a lot of BB users that are more mature than playing silly games and spending hours on Facebook.
    So rebuild a business ecosystem from the ground up? OK. But most businesses are already entrenched and invested in the real apps.

    What about the proprietary business tools like Airwatch, Good, Citrix, vpn, Office 365, and countless others? I would also add that Facebook and Instagram have become huge business tools.

    I have about 100 apps on my phone right now, and only 4 are games.

    All of the FIPS and other security certifications cost a lot of money to maintain and develop for. I presume you would want to keep those?

    I'm not saying you and many others would not appreciate a solid messaging-based OS like BB10, but can you find a million of them willing to plunk down thousands of dollars a year for it?
    Elephant_Canyon and diegonei like this.
    01-05-16 01:52 PM
  21. PantherBlitz's Avatar
    How would you like to be an IT guy that got your company to move to BES12 and BB10 devices last year..
    No biggie. BES12 will work with Android devices and you guys can just migrate to Android through attrition as the BB10 devices wear out. The Venice and perhaps even a Classic formfactor Android phone will be available.
    01-05-16 02:01 PM
  22. glwerry's Avatar
    At the risk of being an ***, my first thought when I read the heading on this thread was about the article I saw recently where a 27 year old got laid off recently. Whereupon his MOMMY called the boss and demanded to know why her boy had been laid off.

    Seriously? A FORMAL APOLOGY? Maybe if we had been horribly wronged or somesuch, but because WE (with our own free wills!) purchased a device that unfortunately did not survive the competitive environment?

    How about a formal apology for all those poor folk who bought Yugos back in the day?

    I realize I'm been a bit of an *** here, but I really have difficulty with the attitude espoused in the OP.
    01-05-16 02:05 PM
  23. mrsean2k's Avatar
    Indeed. Nobody bought their BlackBerry from a sense of duty.
    01-05-16 02:26 PM
  24. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    So OP, what is the alternative? You want BlackBerry to keep making BB10 phones and developing the BB10 OS, at staggering losses, for a small group of people?

    They've already agreed to provide support and security patches.
    Massive losses were because of over production of Z10s. They should have produced the correct amount and spent money on getting large apps to the platform. For the money they lost, they could have given large apps 5 million a piece for the rights to develop the app themselves and paid a small group of developers to make the apps and still not have the losses they did. What large company is going to give up 5 million for development rights? They didn't have a vision on how to roll out a new platform.
    laketrout73 likes this.
    01-05-16 02:28 PM
  25. Valker's Avatar
    I don't know about the "proprietary business tools" you listed. But I did see a comment on here from a medical provider (I think a nurse) that she could not rely on BB to be reliable enough for ER work and she therefore went to an iPhone. Really? BB can't do better than iOS?

    If that is the case, I withdraw my suggestions.
    01-05-16 02:30 PM
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