10-14-18 09:22 PM
28 12
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  1. lolo9269's Avatar
    Jio phone Will take the market abandoned by Blackberry. Too bad that Blackberry does not attempt a return with bb10 and small keyboard smartphones. https://www.jio.com/en-in/jiophone2

    https://www.kaiostech.com/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/KaiOS

    Htlm5 score on html5test is good 461
    https://html5test.com/results/relate...118af229b.html

    With Whatapps, facebook, Google (maps etc..) support support

    Perhaps nokia made a small phone also with ful keyboard

    So if blackberry just update the core browser of bb10 for supporting webapp (progressive web app. PWA)
    And Jio make what Chen suggest of a market for bold 9900 like phone
    Love Peace and Share
    Last edited by lolo9269; 10-12-18 at 05:08 PM.
    10-12-18 04:32 PM
  2. conite's Avatar
    Jio phone Will take the market abandoned by Blackberry. Too bad that Blackberry does not attempt a return with bb10 and small keyboard smartphones. https://www.jio.com/en-in/jiophone2

    https://www.kaiostech.com/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/KaiOS

    Htlm5 score on html5test is good 461
    https://html5test.com/results/relate...118af229b.html

    With Whatapps, facebook, Google (maps etc..) support support

    Perhaps nokia made a small phone also with ful keyboard

    So if blackberry just update the core browser of bb10 for supporting webapp (progressive web app. PWA)
    And Jio make what Chen suggest of a market for bold 9900 like phone
    Love Peace and Share
    Lol. At 2,999 BlackBerry couldn't tie their own shoe.

    That's $40 usd.
    10-12-18 05:11 PM
  3. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    1. The Jio phone is strictly for the Indian market. BB isn't an expert in the Indian market.

    2. BB has ZERO interest in consumer products, especially hardware which barely has single-digit margins when done WELL. BB is a company that develops software for enterprise - not hardware for consumers.

    3. FirefoxOS is Linux-based (like Android and Sailfish), so others do much of the work necessary to get hardware working. BB10 is QNX-based, which means custom drivers have to be written for the hardware - which BB has to pay for. WinPhone had the same problem. Either OS (BB10 and WinPhone) is significantly more expensive to build and maintain than anything based on Linux, because the vast majority of mobile development is done on Linux-based OSs.

    Even the cheapest BB phone has always been considerably more expensive than phones with similar hardware, and that's especially true with BB10, which had to spread its massive development and maintenance costs across a relatively small number of sold devices (a huge number of which were sold at cost). BB lost around $100 on every single phone sold. The phones you're talking about won't even sell for $100. BB could only lose huge amounts of money on them, and lose WAY more money selling them with BB10.

    BB10 is over, and it isn't coming back. Ever. Period. Enjoy it while you can.
    10-12-18 05:15 PM
  4. lolo9269's Avatar
    Yes I knows but there is a market for small feature enhanced phone with keyboard. Chen talk about why not a 150 dollars bold 9900 like phone on bbos or bb10. Hope nokia made a full keyboard phone with kaios like a nokia e71

    Love Peace and Share
    10-12-18 05:26 PM
  5. lolo9269's Avatar
    Lol. At 2,999 BlackBerry couldn't tie their own shoe.

    That's $40 usd.
    But around 150 dollars why not

    Love Peace and Share
    10-12-18 05:27 PM
  6. conite's Avatar
    But around 150 dollars why not

    Love Peace and Share
    The BlackBerry-secured Punkt MP02 feature phone is $349.
    10-12-18 05:44 PM
  7. thurask's Avatar
    Chen talk about why not a 150 dollars bold 9900 like phone on bbos or bb10.
    I don't think BB's hubris is small enough to ship anything that cheap, and definitely not the $40 of a Jio phone.
    10-12-18 06:37 PM
  8. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Yes I knows but there is a market for small feature enhanced phone with keyboard. Chen talk about why not a 150 dollars bold 9900 like phone on bbos or bb10. Hope nokia made a full keyboard phone with kaios like a nokia e71
    Chen said "someone should make..." - he wasn't suggesting that BB had any interest in doing so. There is absolutely NO business case for BB to many ANY phone, much less a phone where - if they did absolutely everything just right, they *might* earn a couple of dollars per phone (but would be far more likely to lose money).
    10-13-18 10:57 PM
  9. stlabrat's Avatar
    OP, you might want join this group of user instead of BB. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...tter-and-worse
    10-14-18 06:24 AM
  10. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    Jio phone Will take the market abandoned by Blackberry. Too bad that Blackberry does not attempt a return with bb10 and small keyboard smartphones. https://www.jio.com/en-in/jiophone2

    https://www.kaiostech.com/

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/KaiOS

    Htlm5 score on html5test is good 461
    https://html5test.com/results/relate...118af229b.html

    With Whatapps, facebook, Google (maps etc..) support support

    Perhaps nokia made a small phone also with ful keyboard

    So if blackberry just update the core browser of bb10 for supporting webapp (progressive web app. PWA)
    And Jio make what Chen suggest of a market for bold 9900 like phone
    Love Peace and Share
    Lolo my friend, you are sadly not going to get anywhere on CB forums with this kind of talk. There are lots of people who enjoy attacking the entire concept of BBL doing anything other than what they are doing now.

    With that said, conite, props for just letting these threads roll other than pointing out the price absurdity. We may be making progress!

    Posted via CB10
    10-14-18 07:40 AM
  11. lolo9269's Avatar
    I know is to late for blackberry to return to the market of small enhanced phone. But the is a market for this. I hope hmd nokia will made a good enhanced phone whith fool keyboard like the nokia 71 with kaios.
    If a manufacturer will be interesting to licence bb10 it would be nice to.


    Love Peace and Share
    10-14-18 03:15 PM
  12. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    I know is to late for blackberry to return to the market of small enhanced phone. But the is a market for this. I hope hmd nokia will made a good enhanced phone whith fool keyboard like the nokia 71 with kaios.
    If a manufacturer will be interesting to licence bb10 it would be nice to.


    Love Peace and Share
    Oh I agree. But the naysayers (who should be posting anytime now) will argue that BBL tried that, it would never work, there's only a market for two OSes, etc. etc. etc.

    It's fun to engage with them sometimes but it's unlikely that this kind of thread will escape such comments.

    Posted via CB10
    10-14-18 03:44 PM
  13. johnb_xp's Avatar
    BB10 devices are still comparable to the Jio, and even around $40 used on Ebay.
    10-14-18 04:30 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    BB10 devices are still comparable to the Jio, and even around $40 used on Ebay.
    But they won't work on the network.

    To actively develop a working, present-day solution, would require at least a $40 software licencing fee per phone - let alone the hardware.

    Without a security play, BlackBerry would not be interested in the slightest.
    10-14-18 04:55 PM
  15. conite's Avatar
    I know is to late for blackberry to return to the market of small enhanced phone. But the is a market for this. I hope hmd nokia will made a good enhanced phone whith fool keyboard like the nokia 71 with kaios.
    If a manufacturer will be interesting to licence bb10 it would be nice to.


    Love Peace and Share
    https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp02-4g-mobile-phone/

    Best feature phone with BlackBerry involvement you'll ever see. $349 usd.
    10-14-18 04:56 PM
  16. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    This is essentially a stripped-down version of TCL's Blackberry-branded devices, as it runs Android as a base OS. It will not serve for people who are looking for an alternative to Android and iOS (as is likely the case for anyone interested enough in this topic to consider feature phones with KaiOS in the first place).

    Posted via CB10
    10-14-18 04:59 PM
  17. conite's Avatar
    This is essentially a stripped-down version of TCL's Blackberry-branded devices, as it runs Android as a base OS. It will not serve for people who are looking for an alternative to Android and iOS (as is likely the case for anyone interested enough in this topic to consider feature phones with KaiOS in the first place).

    Posted via CB10
    It's a very closed, narrow, walled version of Android with limited app support.

    This is also the only area where BlackBerry is interested and/or capable of actively developing.
    10-14-18 05:02 PM
  18. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Oh I agree. But the naysayers (who should be posting anytime now) will argue that BBL tried that, it would never work, there's only a market for two OSes, etc. etc. etc.

    It's fun to engage with them sometimes but it's unlikely that this kind of thread will escape such comments.

    Posted via CB10
    The ability to license BB10 for OEMs apart from BB has been available since 2012-2013. Microsoft and Nokia could both develop BB10 if they wish to pay BB through licensing. Obviously, BB will license everything possible for revenue at various levels. If OEMs think viable, don't you think one would have stepped up by now?
    10-14-18 05:05 PM
  19. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    It's a very closed, narrow, walled version of Android with limited app support.

    This is also the only area where BlackBerry is interested and/or capable of actively developing.
    Blackberry is not developing anything here, to my knowledge--they are simply licensing existing technology as they have done to TCL.

    BBL's capability to develop or not has been discussed in many other threads, so I'll not repeat the arguments here.

    Walled or not, it's still Android, which has inherent privacy and security differences and implications for those who are concerned enough with the two major platforms to consider an alternative.

    Posted via CB10
    10-14-18 05:06 PM
  20. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    The ability to license BB10 for OEMs apart from BB has been available since 2012-2013. Microsoft and Nokia could both develop BB10 if they wish to pay BB through licensing. Obviously, BB will license everything possible for revenue at various levels. If OEMs think viable, don't you think one would have stepped up by now?
    And here's such a post now!

    I think that many things are possible/viable, but I would agree that most OEMs probably do not believe it is viable to license BB10. However, I think that's a two-way street--IF OEMs had any interest, but BBL itself shows no interest in that platform, licensing, marketing it as an option, etc., then the OEMs (or other interested parties) are unlikely to follow up on any interest they might have and will go to other options such as KaiOS, Sailfish, etc.
    10-14-18 05:17 PM
  21. conite's Avatar
    Blackberry is not developing anything here, to my knowledge--they are simply licensing existing technology as they have done to TCL.

    BBL's capability to develop or not has been discussed in many other threads, so I'll not repeat the arguments here.

    Walled or not, it's still Android, which has inherent privacy and security differences and implications for those who are concerned enough with the two major platforms to consider an alternative.

    Posted via CB10
    Doesn't matter that it's "still" Android. Good luck getting ANY software on the device - hence secure boot, root of trust, and Integrity Detection.

    It's as bullet-proof as it can get.
    10-14-18 05:32 PM
  22. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    Doesn't matter that it's "still" Android. Good luck getting ANY software on the device - hence secure boot, root of trust, and Integrity Detection.

    It's as bullet-proof as it can get.
    Unless of course you're using BB10, which was, you know, made by Blackberry Limited, designed by its people and has a QNX-based process-based permissions limitation system.

    But you know, it might be okay for it being Android, an OS developed and maintained by a company which has shown a complete disregard for privacy and security in its own internal tools, to say nothing of third-party applications.

    In any case, again, if people are concerned enough about using Android or iOS to be investigating KaiOS or other third-party OSes (the original point of this thread), they are unlikely to want to have anything to do with anything related to Android, variants which are theoretically secured notwithstanding.
    10-14-18 05:37 PM
  23. conite's Avatar
    Unless of course you're using BB10, which was, you know, made by Blackberry Limited, designed by its people and has a QNX-based process-based permissions limitation system.

    But you know, it might be okay for it being Android, an OS developed and maintained by a company which has shown a complete disregard for privacy and security in its own internal tools, to say nothing of third-party applications.

    In any case, again, if people are concerned enough about using Android or iOS to be investigating KaiOS or other third-party OSes (the original point of this thread), they are unlikely to want to have anything to do with anything related to Android, variants which are theoretically secured notwithstanding.
    In its day, BB10 was secure. But it simply isn't anymore. Not admitting that is disingenuous.

    Only some BB10 users have the Krack patch, and none have all of the available Spectre mitigations - at either the OS level, or browser level.

    BB10 would have to be rebuilt from the ground up anyway for new hardware, so this is really a moot discussion.
    10-14-18 06:51 PM
  24. TrumpetTiger's Avatar
    In its day, BB10 was secure. But it simply isn't anymore. Not admitting that is disingenuous.

    Only some BB10 users have the Krack patch, and none have all of the available Spectre mitigations - at either the OS level, or browser level.

    BB10 would have to be rebuilt from the ground up anyway for new hardware, so this is really a moot discussion.
    Android has malware popping up for it every other day, including both third-party apps and native code vulnerabilities. It also is maintained and updated by an entity notorious for not caring about users' privacy. Trying to argue that it is secure, regardless of one's position on BB10, is disingenuous.

    KRACK is exploited via a man-in-the-middle attack and can be mitigated if not eliminated through additional encryption, which BB10 supports.

    Spectre can only be executed by local access to the device, as the JavaScript code vulnerabilities do not apply to the BB10 browser.

    It is indeed moot, and I tried to avoid it...but you brought it up.
    10-14-18 07:10 PM
  25. conite's Avatar

    KRACK is exploited via a man-in-the-middle attack and can be mitigated if not eliminated through additional encryption, which BB10 supports.

    Spectre can only be executed by local access to the device, as the JavaScript code vulnerabilities do not apply to the BB10 browser.
    So you're advocating always-on VPN for active BB10 users. Ok.
    10-14-18 07:15 PM
28 12

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