04-22-18 08:24 PM
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  1. dastillero1975's Avatar
    Ive had faceid for 2 years now (windows phone and surface) its very fast on the phone and im stil using it BUT only 1 out of 10 times, cause its easier typing my pin cause 9 out of 10 times i dont lift my phone up to have it eye to screen at that degree. You can se its the same with the iphone x you really have to have it as you were taking a selfie and thats the problem and why faceid wount be big on phones. Unless they can change that so that the cameria and infrared can change angles.

    Posted via CB10
    Probably Apple somewhat enhanced the cameras to allow some angles when unlocking the phone, but what Apple is really good at is convincing their customers they must put their phone in front of them when unlocking
    I remember some people at work handling their iPhone 4 in such a weird way when the "antennagate" happened just because Jobs said they should get their phone that way to avoid signal issues
    09-18-17 02:14 PM
  2. Ralf Sigfridsson's Avatar
    No its the same angle, you can se it in the video were they show the faceid.

    Posted via CB10
    09-18-17 02:23 PM
  3. psskid's Avatar
    Well what you are referring to as “iSheeps” is what made Apple the biggest corporation in the world. They were clever enough to tap into the market of “simple” and “just works” and “integrated”... something that not BB or Android were clever enough to tap into.

    They realized that there’s more money to be made with Ms or Mr Everyone, than to come out with flashy techs and RAM and CPU clock speed and DLNA.

    What’s funny is how everyone laughs at iSheeps, mock them, but I bet that BB, Windows, Android (Google) would love, love to be in the same position as Apple!
    They are not actually the "biggest" corporation in the world. I believe since last summer they dropped to 2nd place as the most valuable company in the world.

    I always have the "isheep" use the apple evaluation as their defense of actual quality and lack of functions. Unless you own a few f thousands shares, the size or value of the company really does not matter.. but.. since you brought it up,

    Samsung ships higher volumes of phones worldwide then apple. Android is by far the largest OS worldwide.. but Apple makes way more money. Why.. like I said in my earlier post. They have great marketing. People don't know what is out there to compare thus just fall into the belief that Apple is the best device. Then they hear news about the stock price.. well. That just makes them feel like they bought into something special.. the reality is that the hardware price is jacked up so much that their margins are massive thus driving their stock price high. Let's face it. All tech has a shelf life. When BlackBerry was over a $120 a share, no one would ever say they sucked...

    As for Apple being "integrated". Well. I find it very frustrating to use. I have 6 email accounts for personal and two different business. I tried IOS as an email driver and business tool. Way too labor intensive to switch between email accounts. I tossed it. Went to the Z30. Added Google play. Best phone I ever had for productivity and leisure use.

    Posted via CB10
    blackbp and Jff007 like this.
    09-18-17 03:19 PM
  4. bobshine's Avatar
    They are not actually the "biggest" corporation in the world. I believe since last summer they dropped to 2nd place as the most valuable company in the world.

    I always have the "isheep" use the apple evaluation as their defense of actual quality and lack of functions. Unless you own a few f thousands shares, the size or value of the company really does not matter.. but.. since you brought it up,

    Samsung ships higher volumes of phones worldwide then apple. Android is by far the largest OS worldwide.. but Apple makes way more money. Why.. like I said in my earlier post. They have great marketing. People don't know what is out there to compare thus just fall into the belief that Apple is the best device. Then they hear news about the stock price.. well. That just makes them feel like they bought into something special.. the reality is that the hardware price is jacked up so much that their margins are massive thus driving their stock price high. Let's face it. All tech has a shelf life. When BlackBerry was over a $120 a share, no one would ever say they sucked...

    As for Apple being "integrated". Well. I find it very frustrating to use. I have 6 email accounts for personal and two different business. I tried IOS as an email driver and business tool. Way too labor intensive to switch between email accounts. I tossed it. Went to the Z30. Added Google play. Best phone I ever had for productivity and leisure use.

    Posted via CB10
    To my knowledge Apple has a market cap of over 800B today, which is 200B above the second largest. But that’s not the point.

    The point is that Apple makes integrated devices and OS that works “magically” with their own ecosystem. No fancy setups necessary to pair Apple earpods. Wanna send a file to your iPad or one of your friend? Just be close to each other and it will work.

    They saw an opportunity to sell to this very very lucrative market that doesn’t need the best specs or the best features or devices. They don’t need a perfect email app like you do. They don’t want to change their background to a widget... they just need a phone that works.

    And they make a fortune out of that market and these customers are amongst the most loyal.

    Cause let’s face it, when you sell specs, you don’t get the most loyal customers. You get shoppers.

    When you sell and experience, you get loyalty. Call it marketing if you want to. Or iSheeps. But their strategy make a boatload of money more than anyone else, combined!
    Parker_Lewis likes this.
    09-18-17 04:09 PM
  5. stlabrat's Avatar
    did BB spend a lot on marketing - true. on alicia key, superball ad, VP on the airplane, etc. did BB hand held user to get familiar with new UI? Not really, besides internet, youtube, (new media)... no boots on the ground, chaps in the carrier store... like samsung and apple did (before apple store time). how many times we heard chaps standing infront of the demo Z10 didn't know how to turn it on because there is no home botton the the front? Apple, the announcement including training will be provided in the apple store when user in contact with the device... That is the difference. it is playbook amazon fire all over again... love to see comparison of z30 vs iphone X. at least industry is widely agree BB was ahead of its time ...(IMHO, Chen followed analysts and boss, didn't see value of BB10... persue low cost high margin software road... hopefully, see fruit before AI kick in and revolutionize the software...)... de ja vu all over again... https://www.phonearena.com/news/Appl...s-time_id98025
    09-18-17 04:51 PM
  6. app_Developer's Avatar
    They are not actually the "biggest" corporation in the world. I believe since last summer they dropped to 2nd place as the most valuable company in the world.

    I always have the "isheep" use the apple evaluation as their defense of actual quality and lack of functions. Unless you own a few f thousands shares, the size or value of the company really does not matter.. but.. since you brought it up,

    Samsung ships higher volumes of phones worldwide then apple. Android is by far the largest OS worldwide.. but Apple makes way more money. Why.. like I said in my earlier post. They have great marketing. People don't know what is out there to compare thus just fall into the belief that Apple is the best device. Then they hear news about the stock price.. well. That just makes them feel like they bought into something special.. the reality is that the hardware price is jacked up so much that their margins are massive thus driving their stock price high. Let's face it. All tech has a shelf life. When BlackBerry was over a $120 a share, no one would ever say they sucked...
    So how do you explain how there are people in the industry who use iPhone as our primary phone (I do)

    Is it because we don't know any better? I know people who work at Google who carry iPhones.
    09-18-17 06:03 PM
  7. DreadPirateRegan's Avatar
    Yes, of course Apple is a lot smarter than BlackBerry....that's for sure!

    Posted via CB10
    If they were people apple would have the higher EQ and BlackBerry the higher IQ. Smash them together and you get, you get... Obama.

    Seriously though, Obama carried a BlackBerry his entire 8 years in office. Exclusive. It's on Youtube..

    That doesn't make anybody wonder even a tad.

     Passport SE  -Working wiDe!...
    Jff007 and Parker_Lewis like this.
    09-18-17 07:15 PM
  8. psskid's Avatar
    To my knowledge Apple has a market cap of over 800B today, which is 200B above the second largest. But that’s not the point.

    The point is that Apple makes integrated devices and OS that works “magically” with their own ecosystem. No fancy setups necessary to pair Apple earpods. Wanna send a file to your iPad or one of your friend? Just be close to each other and it will work.

    They saw an opportunity to sell to this very very lucrative market that doesn’t need the best specs or the best features or devices. They don’t need a perfect email app like you do. They don’t want to change their background to a widget... they just need a phone that works.

    And they make a fortune out of that market and these customers are amongst the most loyal.

    Cause let’s face it, when you sell specs, you don’t get the most loyal customers. You get shoppers.

    When you sell and experience, you get loyalty. Call it marketing if you want to. Or iSheeps. But their strategy make a boatload of money more than anyone else, combined!

    People confuse market cap for actual value of a company. It's funny when people talk to me about Apple and its "value " because it's the most "valuble" company in the world.

    Market cap is calculated as outstanding shares times stock price. .. not going to get into investing Level one but the point I was making in my original post is that Apple is only as valuable as the popularity of its iPhone. The marketing engine of apple is feeding investors to invest in it. It's making non savvy consumers to buy it thinking it's the only phone available.

    Fact is that many companies have gone through this during the last x years.. their product name becomes synonymous with the product type.

    Xerox with photocopiers
    Kleenex with tissues
    Walkman with portable tape players
    Kodak with Cameras and film.
    Palm with personal organizers
    Nokia with flip phones
    BlackBerry with business communication

    So on..

    All these companies eventually declined and everyone else caught up. People realized there are options and some better...cheaper.. it's the natural cycle of business ..

    Apple does have a large market cap. But the value of the company is directly tied to the continued success of ONE product they make. IPhone.

    One day it too will be a Nokia, BlackBerry..

    Apple is a North American success story. Yes they sell worldwide but last I saw their global smartphone reach is 30%. Most of that in North America..

    Isheep think it's worldwide.

    Anyway. I'm signing off for the night. Can't wait to here the replies. Lol. Should be fun..



    Posted via CB10
    Jff007 likes this.
    09-18-17 10:20 PM
  9. bobshine's Avatar
    People confuse market cap for actual value of a company. It's funny when people talk to me about Apple and its "value " because it's the most "valuble" company in the world.

    Market cap is calculated as outstanding shares times stock price. .. not going to get into investing Level one but the point I was making in my original post is that Apple is only as valuable as the popularity of its iPhone. The marketing engine of apple is feeding investors to invest in it. It's making non savvy consumers to buy it thinking it's the only phone available.

    Fact is that many companies have gone through this during the last x years.. their product name becomes synonymous with the product type.

    Xerox with photocopiers
    Kleenex with tissues
    Walkman with portable tape players
    Kodak with Cameras and film.
    Palm with personal organizers
    Nokia with flip phones
    BlackBerry with business communication

    So on..

    All these companies eventually declined and everyone else caught up. People realized there are options and some better...cheaper.. it's the natural cycle of business ..

    Apple does have a large market cap. But the value of the company is directly tied to the continued success of ONE product they make. IPhone.

    One day it too will be a Nokia, BlackBerry..

    Apple is a North American success story. Yes they sell worldwide but last I saw their global smartphone reach is 30%. Most of that in North America..

    Isheep think it's worldwide.

    Anyway. I'm signing off for the night. Can't wait to here the replies. Lol. Should be fun..



    Posted via CB10
    You’re confusing Brands with company: Kleenex wasn’t a company but a brand. Walkman too was a brand...

    And the value of a company IS the number of shares outstanding multiplied by the value of their share plus the debts.

    So what’s the point? Yes the value of Apple is tied strongly to the iPhone, that’s why the value of its shares fluctuate so much with any positive or negative news on it.

    And the reason why Apple is so valuable is because they built a loyal customer base around the iPhone, they targeted customers that wanted something simple that would work.

    That’s it? What’s you’re point? There is no other smartphone manufacturer out there today that can say they have built a customer base as loyal as Apple’s.
    09-19-17 06:30 AM
  10. blackbp's Avatar
    It never came into the attention of people because when it launched it was a buggy mess and BlackBerry’s name was synonymous with trash.
    Really sure of that? Are you saying that BlackBerry devices were garbage? It seems you are speaking for air mouth...or may be you can explain why "trash"...?


    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by blackbp; 09-19-17 at 07:31 AM.
    09-19-17 07:14 AM
  11. stlabrat's Avatar
    Apple do have advantage over others, that resulted high profit margin:
    (1) A10 - A11 chipset - control its own destiny rather than depend upon others for roadmap. Especially, those want to over charge you, such as qualcomm case with BB (1Billion come too late for hardware dept).
    (2) swift language - hardware/software integration use LUT instead of subroutine to improve performance, make app easier to develop and fast - less bload ware and less possible software hang, etc. - make it more easy for teen in all over the world to develop software for them. SDK of BB10 was horrible to the start, not sure if it gets better... droid app in far away got more bloaded up... large memory required if you want to use - high spec... 12 Gb RAM?
    (3) eco system - its own store and total control... hard for user to get out from icloud and its connectivity - new watch will hold you even closer. (iTV, in house production of movie? may be). it still evolve and see what is next - fresh "new" stuff keep the user on edge of their pocket string, if not kidney.
    (4) icloud - Jobs used to envy BB server farm, BIS network. I guess icloud sort of resolved that - Google fiber and amazon has not fruitful yet in terms of connectivity. getting close (amazon)... but google fiber might be shut down if the new CFO get iffy. sammy is fragmented, only rooted in parts... with Korean worker in their FAB got sicker more and more, their might be a game change soon, unless robot take over fast.
    (5) university/school is a strong hold for teach swift - ensure the Mac usage for development.
    (6) heavily funded R&D and Ivy still call shot - no rush to market... design for simple to use - for the majority of the chaps - you can call the lowest denominator or what ever, but charge more for less and provide "value" and resale "value" - by jack up price - phycology brain game showed you charge more, the cake is taste "better"... not everybody can copy that... (9983, 9982 are successful, but not some Jewel phone).
    Try to duplicate all the above is tricky... you better have some other route to win the battle...IMHO.
    09-19-17 07:21 AM
  12. stlabrat's Avatar
    "heavily funded R&D and Ivy still call shot". correction: Ive - Jonny, not Ivy...stupid auto correct.
    09-19-17 07:27 AM
  13. glwerry's Avatar
    Now Mr. Chen take a seat and learn how to do a real marketing campaign to sell millions of devices using an idea you developed.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't BB10 developed a long time before Mr. Chen was hired?
    I believe that BB10 had badly flopped well before this.
    09-19-17 11:14 AM
  14. thurask's Avatar
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't BB10 developed a long time before Mr. Chen was hired?
    I believe that BB10 had badly flopped well before this.
    Linear time is a conspiracy by Apple and Google, BB10, the PlayBook, the Storm, World War 2, those were all Chen's fault, duh.
    09-19-17 11:56 AM
  15. glwerry's Avatar
    Linear time is a conspiracy by Apple and Google, BB10, the PlayBook, the Storm, World War 2, those were all Chen's fault, duh.
    Right ... forgot.

    You missed 9/11, because that was clearly NOT the folks that actually piloted the planes ...
    09-19-17 12:57 PM
  16. DreadPirateRegan's Avatar
    Linear time is a conspiracy by Apple and Google, BB10, the PlayBook, the Storm, World War 2, those were all Chen's fault, duh.
    I know you were being facetious but I saw a video with Chen himself saying he never even touched a playbook whilst going through all the blackberry devices on thee wall.. as for the others. I couldn't say. Thinking now, could of been a green screen.

     Passport SE  -Working wiDe!...
    09-19-17 02:41 PM
  17. psskid's Avatar
    You’re confusing Brands with company: Kleenex wasn’t a company but a brand. Walkman too was a brand...

    And the value of a company IS the number of shares outstanding multiplied by the value of their share plus the debts.

    So what’s the point? Yes the value of Apple is tied strongly to the iPhone, that’s why the value of its shares fluctuate so much with any positive or negative news on it.

    And the reason why Apple is so valuable is because they built a loyal customer base around the iPhone, they targeted customers that wanted something simple that would work.

    That’s it? What’s you’re point? There is no other smartphone manufacturer out there today that can say they have built a customer base as loyal as Apple’s.
    Read my post..

    Thank you for proving my point...

    Walkman. -People would buy portable tape players from other manufacturers and call them walkmans

    Kleenex - my nose is running, pass me a Kleenex.. instead of tissue..

    Xerox- did you Xerox that paper? Instead of copy...

    What I was getting at was that many people don't do research on what they are buying. Apple is a marketing company selling mobile phones. People hear the buzz, see their amazing commercials and just blindly buy it.

    Their sales numbers have the largest penetration in the North American Market not worldwide. People are paying a premium just to say they have an apple device. It has become a status symbol as was BlackBerry less then a decade ago. (when their share prices where above $120 per share).

    They are the most popular manufacturer in North America and THIRD largest worldwide. (behind Samsung and Huawei.). Huawei just passed apple last month but will fall again to third once apple launches the new devices.

    https://www.idc.com/promo/smartphone...t-share/vendor

    PeriodSamsung AppleHuawei
    2016Q123.8%15.4%8.4%
    2016Q222.7%11.7%9.3%
    2016Q320.9%12.5%9.3%
    2016Q418.0%18.2%10.5%
    2017Q123.3%14.7%10.0%


    Everything has a lifespan. Yes apple has a loyal following but I question for how long. North Americans tend to jump ship after a while to the next status symbol device.

    So, my other point is. When apple users talk about valuable companies, BlackBerry users where there a few years ago as where Nokia prior to them... One day in our lifetime, their products will be replaced by other manufacturers and the value of apple will lower..

    Irony is that Apple is putting all their apples into one basket. Iphones..

    Apple is an ok device with great marketing is what I'm saying... Unless you buy into their complete line of products, it's not really that efficient..
    But that's another conversation...

    Posted via CB10
    09-20-17 08:29 AM
  18. Elephant_Canyon's Avatar
    Irony is that Apple is putting all their apples into one basket. Iphones..
    Sure. Meanwhile, Apple’s revenue from Mac computers in a single quarter is higher than Blackberry’s entire market cap.
    09-20-17 10:40 AM
  19. psskid's Avatar
    Sure. Meanwhile, Apple’s revenue from Mac computers in a single quarter is higher than Blackberry’s entire market cap.
    And apple Mac computer is a drop in the bucket compared to anything Microsoft , Dell, Asus,......sells. Apple to Apple comparisons please. . No pun.. lol

    Posted via CB10
    09-20-17 11:03 AM
  20. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    As companies, it makes absolutely no sense to compare Apple and BlackBerry.

    The only thing you can compare is one of Apple's products, iOS, with one of Blackberry's products, their implementation of Android.



    Posted with my trusty Z10
    09-20-17 11:04 AM
  21. DreadPirateRegan's Avatar
    Read my post..

    Thank you for proving my point...

    Walkman. -People would buy portable tape players from other manufacturers and call them walkmans

    Kleenex - my nose is running, pass me a Kleenex.. instead of tissue..

    Xerox- did you Xerox that paper? Instead of copy...

    What I was getting at was that many people don't do research on what they are buying. Apple is a marketing company selling mobile phones. People hear the buzz, see their amazing commercials and just blindly buy it.

    Their sales numbers have the largest penetration in the North American Market not worldwide. People are paying a premium just to say they have an apple device. It has become a status symbol as was BlackBerry less then a decade ago. (when their share prices where above $120 per share).

    They are the most popular manufacturer in North America and THIRD largest worldwide. (behind Samsung and Huawei.). Huawei just passed apple last month but will fall again to third once apple launches the new devices.

    https://www.idc.com/promo/smartphone...t-share/vendor

    PeriodSamsung AppleHuawei
    2016Q123.8%15.4%8.4%
    2016Q222.7%11.7%9.3%
    2016Q320.9%12.5%9.3%
    2016Q418.0%18.2%10.5%
    2017Q123.3%14.7%10.0%


    Everything has a lifespan. Yes apple has a loyal following but I question for how long. North Americans tend to jump ship after a while to the next status symbol device.

    So, my other point is. When apple users talk about valuable companies, BlackBerry users where there a few years ago as where Nokia prior to them... One day in our lifetime, their products will be replaced by other manufacturers and the value of apple will lower..

    Irony is that Apple is putting all their apples into one basket. Iphones..

    Apple is an ok device with great marketing is what I'm saying... Unless you buy into their complete line of products, it's not really that efficient..
    But that's another conversation...

    Posted via CB10
    The real question is, how Huawei do it?.. how did they manage in such a flooded market to rise above.

     Passport SE  -Working wiDe!...
    09-20-17 02:32 PM
  22. psskid's Avatar
    As companies, it makes absolutely no sense to compare Apple and BlackBerry.

    The only thing you can compare is one of Apple's products, iOS, with one of Blackberry's products, their implementation of Android.



    Posted with my trusty Z10
    Thank you. No where in my post was I comparing BlackBerry to anyone.. you are the first to pick this up.

    Posted via CB10
    09-20-17 02:34 PM
  23. brookie229's Avatar
    The real question is, how Huawei do it?..
    I don't know the answer really, but I just purchased a brand new Honor 8 from Newegg this afternoon. I know it's last years version but the price was good and it is brand new. I recently bought my wife a P10 and it has been great so far.
    09-20-17 02:39 PM
  24. psskid's Avatar
    The real question is, how Huawei do it?.. how did they manage in such a flooded market to rise above.

     Passport SE  -Working wiDe!...
    Good question. To the best of my knowledge, they are popular in Asia, they are just starting to gain recognition in North America.

    I believe their hardware is at par with most higher quality phones with a fraction of the price.

    I honestly think price and quality of phones that are at par will be Apples Achilles heal. Why pay over $1000 for a phone that has an apple Symbol when I can get an at par product for a third of the cost.

    As a father of 3 boys. I bought 3 Samsung s outright at Costco in the summer for less then one apple phone

    Posted via CB10
    09-20-17 02:51 PM
  25. dastillero1975's Avatar
    The real question is, how Huawei do it?.. how did they manage in such a flooded market to rise above.

     Passport SE  -Working wiDe!...
    Quality phones at a reasonable price and improved support over the last years. A while ago they used to sell their devices and give little or no updates at all. They managed to improve that together customer support and now people are more confident when purchasing one of their phones.
    09-20-17 02:53 PM
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