08-14-18 09:18 AM
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  1. 1ilic's Avatar
    Are there any community projects or incentives to keep BB10 alive after shutdown? Do you have any opinions or ideas on what could be done? What are we sure that will happen to our devices after shutdown and what can be done to save it?

    Posted via CB10
    08-08-18 06:10 PM
  2. Bla1ze's Avatar
    Are there any community projects or incentives to keep BB10 alive after shutdown?
    What exactly are you expecting people can do? It's not open like webOS was and never will be.

    Do you have any opinions or ideas on what could be done?
    Nothing. It's well beyond time to let it go.

    What are we sure that will happen to our devices after shutdown and what can be done to save it?
    No one knows for certain. Presumably basic stuff will still work such as calls, sms, emails, web browser (though it's already junk) but some background services will be shut down as they have already started that.
    08-08-18 06:42 PM
  3. 1ilic's Avatar
    I read somewhere that GPS will stop working too. I can't beleave that they will completely let it go, there are still over the million of users and there are still selling old stocks of BB10 devices. Maybe solution would be in separate community driven appstore, maybe native apps could replace services not working and sustain the OS working properly.

    Posted via CB10
    crberryy likes this.
    08-08-18 06:53 PM
  4. Leyra B10's Avatar
    What exactly are you expecting people can do? It's not open like webOS was and never will be.



    Nothing. It's well beyond time to let it go.



    No one knows for certain. Presumably basic stuff will still work such as calls, sms, emails, web browser (though it's already junk) but some background services will be shut down as they have already started that.
    I don't think it's that bad...

    Posted via CB10
    08-08-18 07:08 PM
  5. thurask's Avatar
    Maybe solution would be in separate community driven appstore, maybe native apps could replace services not working and sustain the OS working properly.
    They couldn't get that at the OS's peak, let alone now when it's in hospice care.
    john_v likes this.
    08-08-18 07:16 PM
  6. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Are there any community projects or incentives to keep BB10 alive after shutdown? Do you have any opinions or ideas on what could be done? What are we sure that will happen to our devices after shutdown and what can be done to save it?

    Posted via CB10
    There's nothing that can be done by anyone without BlackBerry Limited's involvement. The code is proprietary. If a community wanted to do something to keep the spirit of BB10 alive, their best course of action would be to fork Android (or some other open source mobile OS) and re-engineer whatever parts of the BB10 experience not patented by BlackBerry that they could, using existing drivers for modern hardware.

    That's a huge and unlikely endeavor with almost no potential to succeed, but it would be much cheaper than licensing BB10 from BlackBerry, paying for custom drivers for modern hardware, and then paying for continued support and development of even the most basic BB10 apps, such as the browser.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    mushroom_daddy likes this.
    08-08-18 07:17 PM
  7. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Bla1ze and bb10adopter111 have given fair answers. Proceed with caution if buying any BB10 devices now and have a good Android/IOS backup plan.
    john_v, melhiore and Charles Broam like this.
    08-08-18 07:22 PM
  8. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Just to be clear, even though I can't do anything to keep BB10 alive, I will likely be using it until it no longer syncs properly with MS Exchange!

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    mushroom_daddy likes this.
    08-08-18 07:49 PM
  9. Leyra B10's Avatar
    AWS might help shed some use into BB10 for awhile , but as BB10adopter pointed out regarding custom drivers it is unlikely that a secure solution can surface.

    I don't think hardware or software is holding any incentive back. It would be a lot of error handling and personal support for workarounds which isn't something a couple of people typically burden themselves with.
    Posted via CB10
    08-09-18 12:58 AM
  10. mikael11's Avatar
    I would be quite happy if basic functions continued to work. It would also be nice if the remaining free apps in BBW could be moved to an alternate place. When Symbian closed the door and the shop, free apps (through an agreement between Nokia and Opera), were hosted by Opera software shop. A similar arrangement should be possible (Amazon?). Some diehards also arranged "curated" stores, where now and then new apps and updates appear. However they are of course bound to die over time, but nevertheless can prolong the death.

    Posted via CB10
    Charles Broam and crberryy like this.
    08-09-18 07:44 AM
  11. curves2000's Avatar
    In some brief email conversations with Alex Thurber at BlackBerry, it's my understanding that the basic functions of BlackBerry 10 should continue to work past the previously announced EOL date. He did stipulate that it's also app dependent on developers plans etc.

    For things such as calls, sms, email and such there should be some sufficient runway for at least a couple of years.

    Where things might get tricky is when your talking about batteries, screens, keyboards and other basic parts on devices that were built in 2013, 2014, 2015 and it's 2021.

    Of course nobody really knows what the future holds until it happens?

    Posted via CB10
    08-09-18 08:27 AM
  12. deltact's Avatar
    I will keep using my Passport until my organization pulls support. As less than 5% of the user base is left on BB10, I think that will come before any EOL from BlackBerry.

    Posted via BlackBerry Passport.
    08-09-18 09:02 AM
  13. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    In some brief email conversations with Alex Thurber at BlackBerry, it's my understanding that the basic functions of BlackBerry 10 should continue to work past the previously announced EOL date. He did stipulate that it's also app dependent on developers plans etc.

    For things such as calls, sms, email and such there should be some sufficient runway for at least a couple of years.

    Where things might get tricky is when your talking about batteries, screens, keyboards and other basic parts on devices that were built in 2013, 2014, 2015 and it's 2021.

    Of course nobody really knows what the future holds until it happens?

    Posted via CB10
    I doubt even BlackBerry knows for sure what they will do.... It will depend on where BlackBerry is financially in 18 months. If they have plenty of revenues coming in, Chen might not mind spending a few hundred thousand to keep BB10 operational (Server(s), Bandwidth, Maintenance Staff). But if operational cost and revenues are tight, he might not spend a dime.... in which case it will be over. Proable will also depend on how many BB10 phones are actively being used each day.

    Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.... I would assume that as the deadline draws closer that BlackBerry will be more forthcoming on what their plans are and how it will affect BBOS and BB10 users. Would not be surprised if they moved the deadline for some services....



    But in the end, not much blow back on BlackBerry if they just shut it all down. It will have been five years since the last phone was launched - and it was just a recycled Z10 from two years earlier. Four years since the announced an end to BB10 and, three years after they ended the hardware business, and two years since they announced an end of support for BB10. There will be little sympathy for BB10 users if they wanted to complain on social media... and BlackBerry isn't a consumer facing company anymore (most people think they are gone already).
    08-09-18 09:16 AM
  14. 1ilic's Avatar
    I think that BB10 is to good to be left for dead. I know people whose passports are running fluently still after 4 years, can't find that anywhere else in the mobile world now. Still, I have no programing background and I can't know exactly what endevor is needed to keep it alive and beating. But I would like to see atleast some ideas go in that direction. Developing an OS is expensive sure, but basic maintainance of the one (not speaking about amendables like BB Travel), sure can't be that expensive for type of company like BB. I would sure like to have option to pay to BB just for supporting the main services, or to support similar third party project that does so, wouldn't you to?

    Posted via CB10
    08-09-18 09:19 AM
  15. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    I think that BB10 is to good to be left for dead. I know people whose passports are running fluently still after 4 years, can't find that anywhere else in the mobile world now. Still, I have no programing background and I can't know exactly what endevor is needed to keep it alive and beating. But I would like to see atleast some ideas go in that direction. Developing an OS is expensive sure, but basic maintainance of the one (not speaking about amendables like BB Travel), sure can't be that expensive for type of company like BB. I would sure like to have option to pay to BB just for supporting the main services, or to support similar third party project that does so, wouldn't you to?

    Posted via CB10
    Welcome to CrackBerry....

    We have had a number of threads that have tried to cover the "cost" of doing this. It's much, much more than you probable think. What is clear is that BlackBerry has issued an EOL notification for BB10 - whatever the cost really are, they aren't willing to pay it.

    It's not surprising that a five year old phone running a five year old OS will run like it did five years ago. But Apple and Google build with current or even future hardware in mind and at times push the boundaries.... that's why Google had to release Android Go, as they don't want more basic hardware to limit their software development progress. (sub $200 phone is a big part of their userbase)
    08-09-18 10:59 AM
  16. glwerry's Avatar
    I think that BB10 is to good to be left for dead. I know people whose passports are running fluently still after 4 years, can't find that anywhere else in the mobile world now. Still, I have no programing background and I can't know exactly what endevor is needed to keep it alive and beating. But I would like to see atleast some ideas go in that direction. Developing an OS is expensive sure, but basic maintainance of the one (not speaking about amendables like BB Travel), sure can't be that expensive for type of company like BB. I would sure like to have option to pay to BB just for supporting the main services, or to support similar third party project that does so, wouldn't you to?

    Posted via CB10
    If a person was to just update the browser then you may be able to do that without too much cost.
    However, at some point keeping BB10 alive would require moving to new hardware. THAT is expensive. It's extremely unlikely to happen since the BB10 programming staff has been laid off YEARS ago.

    That's the short answer. I come from almost 40 years of programming and design background.
    08-09-18 12:09 PM
  17. Leyra B10's Avatar
    Get your own assets, use a script loader. Far more efficient to layout and template with HTML 5 standards and have hundreds of libraries ready to :load than to have to adapt to new software requiring better hardware. Just a suggestion...

    Posted via CB10
    08-09-18 01:00 PM
  18. 1ilic's Avatar
    I'm aware that its insane to keep supporting the OS that you don't market anymore. And I'm sure it's few millions down the drain yearly and not counting the workforce neded. But for yearly user payment plan it isn't, and you still keep the good OS alive for better days. Microsoft is strugling with their phones too. It's bleeding them dry, but they keep it for data collection needs.

    Without BB10 wi will end up with one of the three data reapers. That's why I'm asking what can be done and how? I would be glad to read something positive for a change.

    Posted via CB10
    08-09-18 01:02 PM
  19. glwerry's Avatar
    Get your own assets, use a script loader. Far more efficient to layout and template with HTML 5 standards and have hundreds of libraries ready to :load than to have to adapt to new software requiring better hardware. Just a suggestion...

    Posted via CB10
    Ok, like I said in this thread, I have nearly 40 years in software and I didn't really understand what you said.

    The OP clearly stated that he doesn't have programming knowledge - if you want to benefit him you'll have to simplify your answer and maybe give some solid examples of what you're speaking about.
    08-09-18 01:11 PM
  20. joeldf's Avatar
    I think that BB10 is to good to be left for dead. I know people whose passports are running fluently still after 4 years, can't find that anywhere else in the mobile world now.
    You might "think" that. Most here would even agree with that idea. Heck, my Z10, pushing 5 years this month since I got it, still works.

    But reality is different. BlackBerry is done with BB10. It was a money pit that nearly bankrupted a once formidable company out of existence.

    That Z10 of mine is now sidelined. I keep it charged only for my 9 year old to play with from time to time.

    Also, there are plenty of iPhones out there 4 years old and older running just fine for many people. So, it's actually common in the mobile world.
    Mecca EL likes this.
    08-09-18 01:14 PM
  21. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    Welcome to CrackBerry....

    We have had a number of threads that have tried to cover the "cost" of doing this. It's much, much more than you probable think. What is clear is that BlackBerry has issued an EOL notification for BB10 - whatever the cost really are, they aren't willing to pay it.

    It's not surprising that a five year old phone running a five year old OS will run like it did five years ago. But Apple and Google build with current or even future hardware in mind and at times push the boundaries.... that's why Google had to release Android Go, as they don't want more basic hardware to limit their software development progress. (sub $200 phone is a big part of their userbase)
    Let's say it costs a bare bones $10 M a year to simply keep the servers running with appropriate support with zero money spent to maintain integration with data sources for BlackBerry apps like Maps, Weather, the Web browser, etc.

    That means no new hardware, no BlackBerry World for apps, etc. Basically a phone that simply allows for continued use of email, calendar, voice and data until the evolution of standards makes them all fail eventually.

    How much would users pay per year for such a service? $20? $100? $200?

    Let's say the service was prices at $100 per year. You would need 100K users to break even, and, given that the number could never increase, BlackBerry would probably want to earn 2x their annual investment in the first year. So, at $100 per year for a very, very barebones experience that will only get worse, BlackBerry would need 200k paying subscribers with zero fall off.

    It's just not a viable business model at any level. Our best hope is that our BlackBerry 10 phones last a long time even after BlackBerry stops support. I, for one, will re image all my phones with the final OS build and not install any APKS or other complicating factors prior to the EOL date.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    glwerry likes this.
    08-09-18 01:20 PM
  22. twiggyrj's Avatar
    Get your own assets, use a script loader. Far more efficient to layout and template with HTML 5 standards and have hundreds of libraries ready to :load than to have to adapt to new software requiring better hardware. Just a suggestion...

    Posted via CB10
    I wouldn’t use HTML and JavaScript for an OS UI and you would still need a base OS to run everything on so it’s rather a moot point though?
    08-09-18 01:23 PM
  23. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    I just want to mention that OS/2 was also too good to die, compared to MS Windows, but business is not a technical meritocracy. Better products are defeated by inferior ones regularly in the rough and tumble world of business.

    Posted with my trusty Z10
    08-09-18 01:35 PM
  24. Leyra B10's Avatar
    Ok, like I said in this thread, I have nearly 40 years in software and I didn't really understand what you said.

    The OP clearly stated that he doesn't have programming knowledge - if you want to benefit him you'll have to simplify your answer and maybe give some solid examples of what you're speaking about.
    Sorry bad habit, I really was just expressing my opinion. However, I still stand by that.

    BB10 needs a lot of help for some functionality in regards to CSS,JavaScript and JSON, at least when it comes to the stock browser.

    You would have to want to apply fixes or workarounds, which isn't for everybody. So if its not worth your time I wouldn't bother, as there aren't many that could help.

    In more than a few cases I have found just a bookmarklet to apply some code to change a webpages layout can help.

    From changing colors and fonts to removing adds, using a search engine, replacing text, inspecting the page or even just changing it all together. On your side.

    BB10 still has web rtc so you can probably download music and videos from most media sites with a bookmarklet also.

    Support for GPU rendering is there too though to what extend I havent tried.

    There is a risk of using scripts which are hoisted from someone elses server so your own discretion is your only security.

    You can use Term48 or BGshellPlus to run python simple server with 'python3.2 -m http.server'
    Youll need an index.html and some dependencies.

    This console is a good one, plays to strengths of localStorage on BB10 which is like browser cache but far larger in comparison. It uses jquery, which to date has taken the team resposible for it several years. It has many cross browser supported methods that are safe on memory and handle issues such as propagation.

    http://openexchangerates.github.io/j...ndbox-console/

    You do not need a server for that. It can load any scripts you call relative to your location using
    ':load path/to/script.js' , or over http/https. Iframe must be turned to false.

    Inject that over any webpage with a bookmarklet or just run it locally on your device.(which may need a viewport tweak)Ive posted a light one in apps section.

    Load just about any JS library or snippets that you think may help.

    Dev Tools Pro on BBWorld uses the same console but has some more useful tools aswell. I have another console in mind to complement this one I might leave a link to it but it is a little old and can cause some trouble with your network footprint so idk.

    Best thing to keep in mind is that there is usually a mirror, and you can almost always zoom out.




    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Leyra B10; 08-09-18 at 05:09 PM.
    08-09-18 02:30 PM
  25. Leyra B10's Avatar
    I wouldn’t use HTML and JavaScript for an OS UI and you would still need a base OS to run everything on so it’s rather a moot point though?
    I can see where you are coming from, It's probably not the best choice but an available one. Cloud 9, Jupyter, and Evernote desktop use similar dependencies as that console and I liked their UI.

    The web browser on this OS has built in Protocols for things like calendar, contacts and settings. View adapts to cards such as PDF's Doc's Sheets's and better rendering than you might think. The Camera, contacts, music and videos app can open as a card also.

    Nested objects, template element, canvas , vast selection of scalable icons from base64 to svg.When I refer to HTML im really just talking about the elements that have replaced flash like what ive already listed as well as audio, and video. With contenteditable, and designmode that is all the components you could need if you ask me.

    Except Application storage, and backup.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by Leyra B10; 08-09-18 at 03:38 PM.
    08-09-18 03:25 PM
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