1. hapishyguy's Avatar
    I am a Blackberry user. I have heard many times that Blackberry is secure that other platforms. I wouldlike to get some clarification that what is secure. I am on TMOBILE so does it mean that my phone line secure. Means tbat when I make.or receive a call the conversation is secure means that noone can tap or hack into the line. Does it mean the data is secure. Means that when I send an email from my BlackBerry noone can tap or hack into the email while going or receiving. When I open some.app the data transferred is secure.
    I would.like.to get some clarification on this.
    Anything would be appreciated. Thanks
    05-12-15 01:01 AM
  2. baarn's Avatar
    There is no simple answer to a question like this.

    What does secure mean to you? Who or what threats do you want to be secure from? From where do these threats originate? How long do you need this security? ...

    I am on TMOBILE so does it mean that my phone line secure.
    No. Government agencies, your network provider, anyone with enough cash/time can all listen to your conversation. Even if your line was secure, your device, your person, your room can all be bugged.

    Means tbat when I make.or receive a call the conversation is secure means that noone can tap or hack into the line.
    The voice data is encrypted for the OTA transmission but, at least in the case of GSM 2G, this encryption is no longer effective.
    Irrespective, people can set up fake cell towers which your device can connect to. These can intercept your calls etc.
    Everything also applies to the the other parties on the line. By the way, do you trust them?

    Does it mean the data is secure.
    What data is important to you? Secure from whom? For how long?

    In general:
    Safe from you losing access to it? - with regular backups, reasonably.
    Secure from your 5 yo child, your belligerent coworker, your wife? - reasonably.
    Secure from BlackBerry, the police, the CIA/NSA/GCHQ/insert your favourite spook here, the man with the rubber hose? - no.
    ...

    Means that when I send an email from my BlackBerry noone can tap or hack into the email while going or receiving.
    Email is not a secure transmission medium. You can encrypt email, but unless you and the recipient understand what you are doing it may not be effective. The issue of trust is also raised here...

    When I open some.app the data transferred is secure.
    Depends on the app and your expectations, but probably not.

    BlackBerry focuses on security which might equate to a slightly more "secure" device than some, but mostly BlackBerry security refers to business users and business features like BlackBerry Balance and BES, which are effectively protection for the business from its employees.

    To summarise :

    Your security begins and ends with you.
    Treat your device like you rented it from a drug dealer.
    Last edited by baarn; 05-12-15 at 06:51 AM.
    05-12-15 06:20 AM
  3. idhbar's Avatar
    What about the transaction related security through banking apps of BBW?
    05-12-15 07:40 AM
  4. baarn's Avatar
    What about the transaction related security through banking apps of BBW?
    Again, no simple answer.

    Some of the issues are:

    - Are you sure that banking app is the one from your bank and not from a malicious third party?
    - Can you rely on BlackBerry (or other vendors) to remove imposter banking apps promptly from BBW? (Just recently there was a malicious app on Android that purported to be Dubsmash2, but was actually just accessing porn sites in the background.)
    - The bank will claim that their app is safe and your data is secured with "triple encryption" or other such vagaries, but do you trust them (or are they just trying to save money at your expense) ? Would you be right to trust them? Chances are, it wasn't that friendly cashier that you met last week in your local branch that wrote the app; it will be an international team of strangers, anyone of whom could potentially add a security vulnerability that could later be exploited.
    - Are you savvy enough now that you have your legitimate app installed to ignore the emails/texts/phone calls/PIN messages telling you that the bank have lost your login details and can you please verify them on this website?
    - If you have a device that is rooted (on which you've still been able to install the app) can you trust the rooted OS? What if installing the rooted OS has also allowed you to install a malicious app with key logger etc.?
    - Have you secured your device against someone you know picking it up and using it to reset your password (using information that they know about you), commit identity fraud at the bank, or simply installing malicious software to spy on you?
    - Often banks will claim to indemnify customers against online fraud, but have you read the small print to understand the caveats? (And getting the money refunded could be the least of your worries if the financial industry still classifies you as fraudulent, or at least a bad risk.)

    Again, law enforcement will be able to get access to your financial information anyway without needing to worry about any app. With an appropriate warrant, they can just ask at the financial institution.

    As with everything, there is risk. You need to decide how much risk is acceptable to you and then weigh up the pros and cons of using or not using the app and, if you do, be vigilant.

    Personally, I would say that it is probably safer to access the bank from the average smart phone than the average home PC.
    idhbar likes this.
    05-12-15 08:44 AM
  5. hapishyguy's Avatar
    So, to me BB is not secure then. It might be a step ahead from other platforms but not what I was thinking or expecting.
    Madhuchandran likes this.
    05-12-15 10:26 AM
  6. baarn's Avatar
    So, to me BB is not secure then. It might be a step ahead from other platforms but not what I was thinking or expecting.
    No more or less secure than anything else in life and yes it is all about expectations, but I'm starting to sound like a miserable git now.
    I'm sure someone else will be along shortly with a more positive and contradictory opinion.

    Anyway I'd wager 99.9% of the population are happy to be patted on the head and told, "it'll be alright dear."
    05-12-15 11:46 AM
  7. John Vieira's Avatar
    Meh. Here is how it is "more secure"

    I agree with the previous posters, they're correct.

    When it comes to communications, the only way they are more secure is over BES.

    So unless you're on enterprise, you have roughly the same amout of security as anything else.

    What Blackberry is designed to do however, is keep the information on your device safe.

    The police has tools whereby they can plug in a phone and download all its data. As far as I'm aware, BB10 is still immune to this.

    Similarly, when installing apps, they do not have access to each other's info, so you won't be able to build an app to harvest data from the others. Which is why integration for apps kinda Sucks sometimes.

    Keep in mind however, that Android apps are different. They run on their own layer, so they run exactly as an android devices, and can steal and read each other's info.

    The security wipe that Blackberry does is a better wipe, rewriting all the info.

    Hope it helps.

    Work Wide and Prosper
    05-12-15 12:57 PM
  8. gg bb's Avatar
    Good answer above, all I can add is-


    There are some handy apps for android phones like this:


    http://www.yodot.com/android-data-re...ory-reset.html

    Not sure how good this one is took me all of 10 seconds to find, anyway after a security wipe android data is likely still recoverable, a bonus in some situations, a serious liability if you loose your phone.

    On BlackBerry 10 data recovery by third parties from a stolen phone is orders of magnitude more complex and it just isn't worth any criminal looking beyond the SD card which incidentally does not store app data like android.

    Posted via CB10
    05-12-15 02:01 PM
  9. hapishyguy's Avatar
    So, that being said I am not going to be a BlackBerry lover unless I have BES from.work. Time to move on I believe.
    05-13-15 01:11 AM
  10. HrR07's Avatar
    So, that being said I am not going to be a BlackBerry lover unless I have BES from.work. Time to move on I believe.
    Move to what?

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9790 using Tapatalk
    anon(5984179) and pvphooman like this.
    05-13-15 01:31 AM
  11. southlander's Avatar
    Easiest thing to say is unless the threat vector for your situation involves others trying to gain root access to your phone, then no it is not secure in any special way.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    05-13-15 01:50 AM
  12. sakius's Avatar
    I'm sure most of the usual ios users, wouldn't even know how to unlock the blackberry? :-D


    Posted via CB10
    05-13-15 04:21 AM
  13. Old_Mil's Avatar
    Cellular voice calls, MMS, and SMS are not secure and cannot be secured.

    Any BlackBerry that has had android apps installed on it is not secure.

    If you are looking for security, it may be possible to obtain some degree of security from your cell phone if you use an app like Red Phone, Text Secure, or Chat Secure through a VPN over a wifi connection with your mobile connection turned off.

    Theoretically the silent circle apps should accomplish the same thing, but as an American Company based a stones throw from surveillance central I wonder how safe that strategy is.

    BBM Protected should work in a similar way if they could actually get it working.

    Ultimately if you really want to be secure you can adopted a segregated device strategy where you have a dumb phone for unsecure voice/sms/text, a computer for internet access, an android phone with Redphone and Textsecure for secure voice and text and an android tablet for any apps you must have.

    Posted via CB10
    redcubicle likes this.
    05-13-15 08:35 AM
  14. pvphooman's Avatar
    I've read news reports that the camera/ microphone of iOS, Android, and desktops have been hacked. I believe this is another area where BlackBerry is more secure.
    However, I'm pretty sure that high level government can have access to this too, although it is probably a bit more challenging for BlackBerrys. True or not??

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.2726 CB10
    05-13-15 10:45 AM
  15. redcubicle's Avatar
    Cellular voice calls, MMS, and SMS are not secure and cannot be secured.

    Any BlackBerry that has had android apps installed on it is not secure.

    Posted via CB10

    I have to disagree with you about cellular voice calls. These CAN be secured. However, the solution is not readily available to consumers. MMS and SMS are monitored. There is not such thing as secure MMS or SMS.

    You are a wise individual.

    Posted via CB10
    05-13-15 11:30 AM
  16. mpinco's Avatar
    While Blackberry without BES does not bring all of the security features to the table, there is another aspect that needs to be considered. That is the agenda of each of the market participants.

    From the ITProPortal article "Blackberry leaps ahead of Apple and Google in one vital area"

    "......The research division of Thomson Reuters has been looking at patent trends and just released a report and both Google and Apple are on the bottom of one list and Google is big on another you should be aware of.......

    .....That is the patents being taken out for call monitoring (spying on you) and the patents being taken out for securing calls and communications so you can maintain your privacy.

    On the monitoring side companies like Ericsson, Samsung, Google, and LG are very prevalent but you don’t see Blackberry at all, on the cellular privacy side what is really interesting is that Google again shows up as a small player ....... but you don’t see Apple at all (which is kind of weird given how private Steve Jobs was and Tim Cook is) but you see Blackberry towards the top of the chart massively ahead of everyone but ZTE (out of China)......

    ......Wrapping Up: What does this say about us?

    I think our preference for what is pretty and fun over what is productive and safe is telling. It tells us our priorities are often really screwed up particularly when it comes to our kids.

    In any case, where Blackberry leads and Apple clearly lags is in security and safety and Google’s actually doing an impressive amount of work on technologies that observe and monitor us which likely should concern us even more (at least Apple isn’t going in that direction).

    In the end only Blackberry – and ZTE apparently, according to this Thomas Reuters report – are doing what we should prefer and investing heavily in our privacy and safety yet we prefer Apple, who isn’t doing anything is this regard, and Google who apparently is actually investing against us. Something to think about over the weekend."



    There is more than one side to the security question. One is the capability of the technology. Another is the agenda of the platform providers and the applications hosted on same. Google is actively mining your data. Blackberry is not. Apple's silence is deafening.
    Last edited by mpinco; 05-13-15 at 12:53 PM.
    05-13-15 11:39 AM
  17. ATFC's Avatar
    The new question I raised in another thread is the Assistant.
    Though we never had a clear idea if the app is indeed made in-house, a user all but denied it and confirmed it has at least some connections with Maluuba. Now here's the catch, we don't if BB runs its own server or if commands are processed through Maluuba, and what implications does it have.

    Let's say I casually search for email from John Smith of company Y, there is the possibility that my command now goes through a third-party and any of its associates or sub contracted staffs, revealing that John Smith and I have some form of communication. Adding Calendar appointments, sending messages etc would essentially reveal the content entirely to potential third parties. This is certainly not ideal because I am likely tobtrust a small third company even less than Google, Apple or Microsoft.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    05-13-15 11:44 AM
  18. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    The new question I raised in another thread is the Assistant.
    Though we never had a clear idea if the app is indeed made in-house, a user all but denied it and confirmed it has at least some connections with Maluuba. Now here's the catch, we don't if BB runs its own server or if commands are processed through Maluuba, and what implications does it have.

    Let's say I casually search for email from John Smith of company Y, there is the possibility that my command now goes through a third-party and any of its associates or sub contracted staffs, revealing that John Smith and I have some form of communication. Adding Calendar appointments, sending messages etc would essentially reveal the content entirely to potential third parties. This is certainly not ideal because I am likely tobtrust a small third company even less than Google, Apple or Microsoft.

    Posted via the CrackBerry App for Android
    You can run assistant in local only mode, but it is much less capable.

    Basing your level of trust on the size or fame of a company is terribly naive. But then so is asking for security advice from a forum where most people don't even use their own names.

    Z10STL100-3/10.3.1.2708 SR 10.3.1.1865
    05-13-15 05:11 PM
  19. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    So, that being said I am not going to be a BlackBerry lover unless I have BES from.work. Time to move on I believe.
    So please tell us which OS you are moving to that cannot be rooted? BlackBerry 10 cannot be rooted. Malicious apps can also not modify the OS. Malicious apps can't even communicate to other apps and grab data. BlackBerry 10 is the most secure mobile OS out there.
    BigAl_BB9900 likes this.
    05-13-15 05:52 PM
  20. BCITMike's Avatar
    Two years ago, I recall seeing a document written by BlackBerry that discussed the security built from ground up throughout the architecture of the phone. Layers of security, memory protection, signed files, etc.

    I just can't bloody find it and I know I've seen it on CB or linked to it from CB.

    As Richard essentially said, if you're asking on this forum, you're doing it wrong.

    Posted via CB10
    05-13-15 10:37 PM
  21. baarn's Avatar
    Two years ago, I recall seeing a document written by BlackBerry that discussed the security built from ground up throughout the architecture of the phone. Layers of security, memory protection, signed files, etc.

    I just can't bloody find it and I know I've seen it on CB or linked to it from CB.
    How about this one:
    http://help.blackberry.com/detectLan...-overview-pdf/
    BCITMike likes this.
    05-14-15 04:38 AM
  22. deadcowboy's Avatar
    BB10 is more secure in the way that BBWorld Apps require user-defined permissions to access user information. And you don't need to give the app access to anything for it to work in its own little world.

    At least that's the way I understand it, though I know there was than Nemory ad tracking scare wherein his apps were harvesting user info to make money.

    I believe the encryption is slightly better than other phones. The phone wiping procedure appears to be more thorough, securely wiping the device completely. Password options are more robust. The startup procedure is apparently more secure. The QNX base is much simpler and secure than the sprawling Linux base of Android. Probably fewer exploits.

    I'd imagine there are fewer viruses directed toward BB10. Security through obscurity.

    This is me trying to logically suss out what I'd imagine would be the benefits of BB10 over other mobile operating systems. I'm not certain about any of this, and I'd love to hear people's more researched understandings of my claims. I'd love to hear refutations, especially.

    Posted via CB10
    05-14-15 10:53 AM
  23. hapishyguy's Avatar
    Move to what?

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9790 using Tapatalk
    It's not about what is more secure than BB to me. As I said earlier also that BB is ahead in other platforms security wise. I really dont have anything to hide anyway but was just curious to know how is BB more secure as I hear it all the time. I was wondering (which I knew is not) if the calls or SMS or other data transferred via BB is safe but now I know it is not safe but definitely a step ahead than other platforms. Like I said I dont have anything to hide anyway and I dont even have a password on my phone. I dont keep any files or other information on my phone anyway. I dont even put music on my phone, no Facebook, no twitter etc. Just use google voice and navigation and read news. I absolutely love the form factor of BB 9900 but it wont have GPS and Google Voice so I cant use it. I can live without the GPS but not google voice. So 9900 is not for me. I am thinking of getting Classic but its a little bigger also.
    So talking of which OS I will move to then it has to be what phone I like. Since I use Google Voice most of the time I might get Samsung S6 Edge or Note Edge. It's a good looking phone. OS wise I like WP also but WP dont have any good phones. It will still take me months to move. So far happy with my Z10. I wish 9900 has BB10 on it OR Classic was a little smaller.
    05-14-15 12:55 PM
  24. BCITMike's Avatar
    That was recently updated, but yes, that was what I was talking about. Thanks!!!
    pvphooman likes this.
    05-14-15 03:00 PM

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