04-15-16 05:16 PM
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  1. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    If testing effort is small, then why do we spot new internal builds every day using Sachesi? Why produce so many builds if they're not gonna test 'em?

    Posted via CB10 using BlackBerry Passport (OG Red)
    Just to see they build and hopefully run some automated regression tests.
    Some places build every night even if there are no changes.
    02-27-16 12:54 AM
  2. Bogdan Tudor Dan's Avatar
    Where can I find information on how to program apps for BlackBerry 10?



    Check out GTR Lifestyle at C001247FA
    http://developer.blackberry.com/nati...tro/index.html

    Posted via CB10
    02-27-16 02:01 AM
  3. Deckard79's Avatar
    And so, my Passport SE is being refunded, having developed an issue with double-typing on the bottom row of keys.

    End of an era. Feel a bit sad really - it felt good swimming against the current with BB10 all this time.

    Posted via CB10
    02-27-16 05:22 AM
  4. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    That is kind of a facile thing to say.
    The reality of these "security patches" is mostly just pulling an updated package from the upstream maintainer.
    Then building, testing and deploying.
    The amount of change is relatively small but the testing effort will also be small.
    The bug fixes and not the security patches will likely be the source of most of the new bugs.
    The BlackBerry devs are the upstream maintainers.
    02-27-16 06:12 AM
  5. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    The BlackBerry devs are the upstream maintainers.
    I am suggesting that the bulk of the security fixes they make will be for things that have a CVE.
    Is BlackBerry the upstream maintainer because upstream refuses their changes?
    Could be I am just missing something here.
    Why is BlackBerry the upstream maintainer for these packages?
    Last edited by DrBoomBotz; 02-27-16 at 09:01 AM.
    02-27-16 08:41 AM
  6. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    I am suggesting that the bulk of the security fixes they make will be for things that have a CVE.
    Is BlackBerry the upstream maintainer because upstream refuses their changes?
    Could be I am just missing something here.
    Why is BlackBerry the upstream maintainer for these packages?
    Everybody keeps changing "security enhancements" to "security fixes". One of the security enhancements coming in 10.3.3 is a new certification, for example. We have known this for quite a while now.

    Maybe you don't care about this certification, but if you want to understand what is really going on you need to use the actual information not someone's spin based on a lack of understanding. Making decisions on insufficient or incorrect information is one of the biggest sources of software bugs. When an issue doesn't make sense, one of the main reasons is often a lack of understanding. But for some reason we humans seem to assume we are already experts and the people working in an area aren't.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    02-27-16 09:19 AM
  7. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Everybody keeps changing "security enhancements" to "security fixes". One of the security enhancements coming in 10.3.3 is a new certification, for example. We have known this for quite a while now.

    Maybe you don't care about this certification, but if you want to understand what is really going on you need to use the actual information not someone's spin based on a lack of understanding. Making decisions on insufficient or incorrect information is one of the biggest sources of software bugs. When an issue doesn't make sense, one of the main reasons is often a lack of understanding. But for some reason we humans seem to assume we are already experts and the people working in an area aren't.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    Whoa sparky I am aware of the NIAP certification.
    That is just not what I am talking about.
    I believe that they will include some security fixes as well.
    If you don't, that's fine.
    02-27-16 09:23 AM
  8. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    Whoa sparky I am aware of the NIAP certification.
    That is just not what I am talking about.
    I believe that they will include some security fixes as well.
    If you don't, that's fine.
    I do, but as Blunoser said BlackBerry is the upstream developer for almost all the OS. They are the integrator for the rest, open source projects and all, since BB10 is a closed system and BlackBerry is the only organisation that can distribute privileged code. That means more work than you imply. Added to coding to a standard and getting certification the release is not as trivial to do as you make it out to be.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    02-27-16 09:29 AM
  9. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    I do, but as Blunoser said BlackBerry is the upstream developer for almost all the OS. They are the integrator for the rest, open source projects and all, since BB10 is a closed system and BlackBerry is the only organisation that can distribute privileged code. That means more work than you imply. Added to coding to a standard and getting certification the release is not as trivial to do as you make it out to be.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    Ok, if they are the upstream then it is much more work.
    02-27-16 09:44 AM
  10. tipplex's Avatar
    We dont need apps. BlackBerry 10 devices should only receive updates when needed will be enough. For me

    Posted via CB10
    02-27-16 01:18 PM
  11. JeepBB's Avatar
    If testing effort is small, then why do we spot new internal builds every day using Sachesi? Why produce so many builds if they're not gonna test 'em?
    It could just be company procedures. Back in the day, I read that Microsoft used to re-build the WindowsOS every day... and your name would be mud if something you did caused the daily build to fail. None of those internal builds were for release (though anyone of them could have been) it was just Microsoft's way of keeping on top of things and always having a stable build.
    02-27-16 02:59 PM
  12. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    It could just be company procedures. Back in the day, I read that Microsoft used to re-build the WindowsOS every day... and your name would be mud if something you did caused the daily build to fail. None of those internal builds were for release (though anyone of them could have been) it was just Microsoft's way of keeping on top of things and always having a stable build.
    That was Continuous Integration before it became a thing.
    02-27-16 03:34 PM
  13. anon(9821186)'s Avatar
    This post is a lie, the more I research this, the more I think you work for Google, here's what they are really saying in India, http://blogs.blackberry.com/2016/02/...y-10-platform/

    Posted via CB10
    02-28-16 03:18 AM
  14. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    This post is a lie, the more I research this, the more I think you work for Google, here's what they are really saying in India, http://blogs.blackberry.com/2016/02/...y-10-platform/

    Posted via CB10
    You are about to find out that many, if not most, people on CB believe that BlackBerry only says those things so they can sell out the remaining stock of BB10 phones, uncountable broken promises, and so forth.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    JeepBB and Killjoyhere like this.
    02-28-16 04:29 AM
  15. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    This post is a lie, the more I research this, the more I think you work for Google, here's what they are really saying in India, Celebrating PRIV in India ? and Reiterating our Commitment to the BlackBerry 10 Platform | Inside BlackBerry

    Posted via CB10
    You are about to find out that many, if not most, people on CB believe that BlackBerry only says those things so they can sell out the remaining stock of BB10 phones, uncountable broken promises, and so forth.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    But while PRIV on secured Android offers a choice in OS to new and existing customers, we want to also make very clear our ongoing commitment to the BlackBerry 10 platform, which enables industry-leading security and productivity benefits.*As weve said before, consumer and enterprise fans of our workhorse BlackBerry 10 smartphones such as Passport, Classic and others can look forward to multiple security and privacy enhancements in 2016.
    There is nothing in that quote that distorts what I and many others have been saying here. No promise of new features or device. Simply maintenance mode.
    JeepBB likes this.
    02-28-16 07:38 AM
  16. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    There is nothing in that quote that distorts what I and many others have been saying here. No promise of new features or device. Simply maintenance mode.
    Except that we know 10.3.3 is coming with an additional security certification. That may not be a new feature you are specifically looking for, nor the extent of new development you would like to see, but it strains the definition of maintenance in my dictionary.

    I suppose it could be part of Chen's Machiavellian plan. Pour what scant BB10 developer resources he has left into meeting a security certification that no one wants.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    Vistaus likes this.
    02-28-16 09:32 AM
  17. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    Except that we know 10.3.3 is coming with an additional security certification. That may not be a new feature you are specifically looking for, nor the extent of new development you would like to see, but it strains the definition of maintenance in my dictionary.

    I suppose it could be part of Chen's Machiavellian plan. Pour what scant BB10 developer resources he has left into meeting a security certification that no one wants.

    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    Potato, potahto...

    By "no one wants" I presume you mean consumers. They are not the target of large volume BB10 sales for the future.
    02-28-16 09:41 AM
  18. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    I suppose it could be part of Chen's Machiavellian plan. Pour what scant BB10 developer resources he has left into meeting a security certification that no one wants.
    If no one wants it, then why is he doing it?
    02-28-16 09:46 AM
  19. thurask's Avatar
    Potato, potahto...

    By "no one wants" I presume you mean consumers. They are not the target of large volume BB10 sales for the future.
    Yeah, the only people who care about this new certification are IT managers in the Department of Defense.
    BigBadWulf and zephyr613 like this.
    02-28-16 10:08 AM
  20. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    Potato, potahto...

    By "no one wants" I presume you mean consumers. They are not the target of large volume BB10 sales for the future.
    No, mainance, enhancement.

    Perhaps I should have written it like this
    [Sarcasim]I suppose it could be part of Chen's Machiavellian plan. Pour what scant BB10 developer resources he has left into meeting a security certification that no one wants.[/Sarcasim]

    In that context though I think it is clear that by no one, I mean no one. But it is clear from the quote that BlackBerry means "...consumer and enterprise fans of our workhorse BlackBerry 10 smartphones such as Passport, Classic and others..."

    If no one wants it, then why is he doing it?
    Because there are customers who do want it, clearly. Of course if you don't work in the same business as these customers, or for one of them you won't know why and how badly. They aren't know for their love of the public spotlight.

    Yeah, the only people who care about this new certification are IT managers in the Department of Defense.
    See Thurask gets it. All though there are others that he leaves out.

    Have you never criticized a politician or pundit for spining topicts until they are skewed far from the truth? If you read this thread with an unbiased eye there is a lot of that in it. When you engage in the same behaviour you shouldn't be surprised when you get called out for it like a politician. If there is, as BigBadWolf suggests, no difference between saying "...maintenance mode..." and "...two releases with security and privacy enhancements..." then why not use the latter? Most people will recognize that there is a difference and that you are pushing your own view of things. There is nothing wrong with that, why not own it?. But it is your own view of things, not ordained fact. Don't be surprised when someone points that out.
    02-28-16 10:30 AM
  21. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    No, mainance, enhancement.

    Perhaps I should have written it like this
    [Sarcasim]I suppose it could be part of Chen's Machiavellian plan. Pour what scant BB10 developer resources he has left into meeting a security certification that no one wants.[/Sarcasim]

    In that context though I think it is clear that by no one, I mean no one. But it is clear from the quote that BlackBerry means "...consumer and enterprise fans of our workhorse BlackBerry 10 smartphones such as Passport, Classic and others..."



    Because there are customers who do want it, clearly. Of course if you don't work in the same business as these customers, or for one of them you won't know why and how badly. They aren't know for their love of the public spotlight.



    See Thurask gets it. All though there are others that he leaves out.

    Have you never criticized a politician or pundit for spining topicts until they are skewed far from the truth? If you read this thread with an unbiased eye there is a lot of that in it. When you engage in the same behaviour you shouldn't be surprised when you get called out for it like a politician. If there is, as BigBadWolf suggests, no difference between saying "...maintenance mode..." and "...two releases with security and privacy enhancements..." then why not use the latter? Most people will recognize that there is a difference and that you are pushing your own view of things. There is nothing wrong with that, why not own it?. But it is your own view of things, not ordained fact. Don't be surprised when someone points that out.
    It's nuance. While I agree security enhancements go beyond maintenance, this is CrackBerry, and the members here overwhelmingly would not be affected by these changes. Those who are should already be aware of what's coming.

    What's the spin? I've directed my comments to those who feel wronged by BlackBerry. They have read into what has been stated, and set their expectations based on their perspective. BlackBerry for once has under promised.
    02-28-16 12:24 PM
  22. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    It's nuance. While I agree security enhancements go beyond maintenance, this is CrackBerry, and the members here overwhelmingly would not be affected by these changes. Those who are should already be aware of what's coming.

    What's the spin? I've directed my comments to those who feel wronged by BlackBerry. They have read into what has been stated, and set their expectations based on their perspective. BlackBerry for once has under promised.
    Achieving NIAP certification may not require many or possibly any code changes.
    The bulk of the effort is likely to be paper work.
    02-28-16 01:47 PM
  23. thurask's Avatar
    Achieving NIAP certification may not require many or possibly any code changes.
    The bulk of the effort is likely to be paper work.
    All I could find about 10.3.3 so far, besides NIAP, is a few mentions in the BES manual:

    NIAP Common Criteria functionality on BlackBerry 10 devices - BES12 - 12.4

    https://help.blackberry.com/en/bes12...200612274.html

    What's new in BES12 - BES12 - 12.3

    https://help.blackberry.com/en/bes12...094419070.html
    DrBoomBotz likes this.
    02-28-16 02:06 PM
  24. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    Achieving NIAP certification may not require many or possibly any code changes.
    The bulk of the effort is likely to be paper work.
    Presumptions based on...?
    02-28-16 02:14 PM
  25. Richard Buckley's Avatar
    It's nuance. While I agree security enhancements go beyond maintenance, this is CrackBerry, and the members here overwhelmingly would not be affected by these changes. Those who are should already be aware of what's coming.

    What's the spin? I've directed my comments to those who feel wronged by BlackBerry. They have read into what has been stated, and set their expectations based on their perspective. BlackBerry for once has under promised.
    BlackBerry made business decisions. One was to migrate their consumer customers to Android. Many here have applauded this move. Prior to this they announced that they were going to focus their efforts on BB10 at enterprise and security focused customers. This at a time when consumer uptake of BB10 was disappointing and continued focus on BB10 in the consumer space was not going to be profitable. If BlackBerry had simply dropped BB10 and walked away from it one could probably argue that customers have been wronged. But when they not only continue to maintain the product, but continue to expand its usability for the announced customers. The idea that they have somehow wronged customers is spin. Or are you saying that BlackBerry should continue to expend resources to make BB10 a more attractive product in the consumer space for the ever dwindling number of people in that space that buy BB10? If the moves BlackBerry has made have truly wronged their customers it seems that would be something to strive for.


    LeapSTR100-2/10.3.2.2876
    02-28-16 02:35 PM
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