03-31-15 02:32 PM
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  1. membrane chemist's Avatar
    And how do you know this promise wasn't kept? As far as I can tell no one has actually had their Q10 for 90 days. The initial sync may be 30 days but the emails may remain on the device for 90 days.

    I have one email account that when I loaded it I only synced for 7 days. Doesn't mean it only keeps the emails for 7 days.

    Posted via CB10
    1. Because, if I bought a Q10 today expecting 90 days IMAP, it would be rather silly for me have to have wait 60 more days for this feature to be fully realized. Not to mention the fact that some people actually only want 30 days of email on their phone. If 30 days was really a super-secret 90 day setting, Blackberry would have a whole new constellation of irate users to deal with. Perhaps even a flood of justifiable returns after a month as these 30 dayers watched their phone behave in an undocumented way.

    I suppose there is a slim possibility though. A ridiculous choice, but not impossible.

    2. Except Omnitech's desperate flights around the internetz looking for support crashed into some people who got their hands on unreleased 10.1 betas for the Z10.

    EG: in the thread titled "Leaked Full OS 10.1.0.1627 for *z10* stl100-1,2,3"
    "Just done the advanced IMAP set up for GMail *with 90 days set*, but this only appears to apply to email."

    Now of course you and I (not Omnitech though) know beta features cannot be counted on to make the final release for all sorts of reasons. However, the fact that

    -present released 10.1 settings still show 30 days IMAP which would be a very strange way to show 90 days indeed.
    -combined with evidence from a 10.1 beta release showing an explicit 90 day setting

    strongly indicate that your attempt to excuse Blackberry is without basis in fact.

    Don't worry though. 90 days IMAP is coming... Soon.
    JeepBB likes this.
    05-05-13 11:35 AM
  2. membrane chemist's Avatar
    Yes, it certainly is entertaining, but not for the reasons you may believe.

    The tweet said the 30-day limit would be removed in OS10.1. OS10.1 came with the Q10. The Q10, it seems, still has that 30-day limit.

    Is your "OS10.1 doesn't mean Q10" bluster meant to be taken seriously?

    If Clewley had meant "it'll be fixed as one of the updates to 10.1", then he should have been clearer.

    Beautifully stated. Brevity and clarity.

    I've got a lot to learn wrt editing.
    05-05-13 11:38 AM
  3. Vorkosigan's Avatar
    1. Because, if I bought a Q10 today expecting 90 days IMAP, it would be rather silly for me have to have wait 60 more days for this feature to be fully realized. Not to mention the fact that some people actually only want 30 days of email on their phone. If 30 days was really a super-secret 90 day setting, Blackberry would have a whole new constellation of irate users to deal with. Perhaps even a flood of justifiable returns after a month as these 30 dayers watched their phone behave in an undocumented way.

    I suppose there is a slim possibility though. A ridiculous choice, but not impossible.

    2. Except Omnitech's desperate flights around the internetz looking for support crashed into some people who got their hands on unreleased 10.1 betas for the Z10.

    EG: in the thread titled "Leaked Full OS 10.1.0.1627 for *z10* stl100-1,2,3"
    "Just done the advanced IMAP set up for GMail *with 90 days set*, but this only appears to apply to email."

    Now of course you and I (not Omnitech though) know beta features cannot be counted on to make the final release for all sorts of reasons. However, the fact that

    -present released 10.1 settings still show 30 days IMAP which would be a very strange way to show 90 days indeed.
    -combined with evidence from a 10.1 beta release showing an explicit 90 day setting

    strongly indicate that your attempt to excuse Blackberry is without basis in fact.

    Don't worry though. 90 days IMAP is coming... Soon.
    The current set up on 10.0.10.85 (OS of Z10 on Rogers) doesn't allow you to pick how long the email remains on your device. You choose the INITIAL sync period. It isn't out of the realm of imagination that with only a 90 day total they still only allow a choice of initial sync time.

    I'm not saying this is the way it is on the Q10. I'm saying that without knowing anyone who has had one for over 90 days there is no way of knowing, unless it's in a knowledge based article somewhere.

    Posted via CB10
    05-05-13 11:50 AM
  4. membrane chemist's Avatar
    The current set up on 10.0.10.85 (OS of Z10 on Rogers) doesn't allow you to pick how long the email remains on your device. You choose the INITIAL sync period. It isn't out of the realm of imagination that with only a 90 day total they still only allow a choice of initial sync time.

    I'm not saying this is the way it is on the Q10. I'm saying that without knowing anyone who has had one for over 90 days there is no way of knowing, unless it's in a knowledge based article somewhere.

    Posted via CB10
    So, you are saying if you booked a flight on May 5 with email confirmation and attempted to access this email on your phone at the airport on June 10 you would be able to do so?

    I'm pretty sure I have seen many posts here saying this is not the case. The 30 day limitation deletes emails older than that on a rolling basis. Yes, dozens here:
    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...1/index17.html

    EG:
    -"However, I've since found out that even the Remember app doesn't remember emails beyond the 30 day limit. How ironic."

    -"You don't need to be a lawyer to require past 30 days history. There are a number of times I have to follow up with a client or coworker and want to send the original email along with it. Ie "Jim I sent you this 2 months ago and I don't see that it's been done yet" or other times when a manager has emailed me asking if I've handled something or heard from someone about something so I need to forward him a copy of the email."

    "The realm of imagination" is a wonderful place. I am sure there are entire websites devoted to it. This ain't one of them.
    JeepBB likes this.
    05-05-13 01:26 PM
  5. JeepBB's Avatar
    Beautifully stated. Brevity and clarity.
    Thanks, it's a gift.

    I've got a lot to learn wrt editing.
    Don't be harsh with yourself. I reckon you already write very well.

    Your posts are spot-on and I'm enjoying seeing you demolish the arguments of the various apologists as they grasp at straws to resist the inevitable conclusion that Clewley "mis-tweeted". "Lied" is such a judgemental word, don't you think?

    Seems my wallet is going to stay in my pocket a bit longer then... roll on OS10.2...
    05-05-13 01:49 PM
  6. Vorkosigan's Avatar
    So, you are saying if you booked a flight on May 5 with email confirmation and attempted to access this email on your phone at the airport on June 10 you would be able to do so?

    I'm pretty sure I have seen many posts here saying this is not the case. The 30 day limitation deletes emails older than that on a rolling basis. Yes, dozens here:
    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...1/index17.html

    EG:
    -"However, I've since found out that even the Remember app doesn't remember emails beyond the 30 day limit. How ironic."

    -"You don't need to be a lawyer to require past 30 days history. There are a number of times I have to follow up with a client or coworker and want to send the original email along with it. Ie "Jim I sent you this 2 months ago and I don't see that it's been done yet" or other times when a manager has emailed me asking if I've handled something or heard from someone about something so I need to forward him a copy of the email."

    "The realm of imagination" is a wonderful place. I am sure there are entire websites devoted to it. This ain't one of them.
    The realm of obtuseness appears to be alive and well however.

    You appreciate clarity. I will try to be more clear.

    Currently OS10 only syncs for 30 days and doesn't give you a choice on sync time length. The choice is only for initial sync time. If you choose 7 days your emails from the past 7 days will come in. They will then remain for 30 days.

    My point was it is possible that OS10.1 does something similar. Your choice is currently limited to the initial sync. It is possible that the length of the sync will be 90 days.

    I'm sure this reasoning won't have the least effect on your opinion. Your style has been abrasive with anyone who dares to attempt to 'defend BlackBerry' or disagree with you so I don't know why I bothered to try to point out an alternative explanation.


    Posted via CB10
    05-05-13 02:14 PM
  7. membrane chemist's Avatar
    The realm of obtuseness appears to be alive and well however.

    You appreciate clarity. I will try to be more clear.

    Currently OS10 only syncs for 30 days and doesn't give you a choice on sync time length. The choice is only for initial sync time. If you choose 7 days your emails from the past 7 days will come in. They will then remain for 30 days.

    My point was it is possible that OS10.1 does something similar. Your choice is currently limited to the initial sync. It is possible that the length of the sync will be 90 days.

    I'm sure this reasoning won't have the least effect on your opinion. Your style has been abrasive with anyone who dares to attempt to 'defend BlackBerry' or disagree with you so I don't know why I bothered to try to point out an alternative explanation.


    Posted via CB10
    A drowning man will catch at straws.
    (More)
    05-05-13 07:03 PM
  8. John Pawling's Avatar
    They've given themselves quite a berth with "Summer". That could mean mid September.

    Posted via CB10
    Summer usually ends at the end of August in Canada. Then it's back to school for the next crop of BlackBerry engineers ;-)

    Posted via CB10 v1.3 on my Zed10 10.0.10.85 on Rogers
    05-05-13 07:21 PM
  9. Jonny-R's Avatar
    Using IMAP, e-mails remain on the device longer than the initial sync period. This is great, it stops my phone getting hammered with thousands of old emails but from now on keeps everything I get.

    Posted via CB10
    05-05-13 07:55 PM
  10. Omnitech's Avatar
    The SMTP bug that doesn't let me email attachments or reply to emails, when was that fixed because somebody forgot to tell my Z10.
    What is your Software release version/OS version?

    I know you can't be bothered to read the evil threads I create around here unless you can complain about something, but all the info is there if you want it:

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...rsions-779341/
    05-05-13 08:31 PM
  11. Omnitech's Avatar
    ...demolish the arguments of the various apologists as they grasp at straws to resist the inevitable conclusion that Clewley "mis-tweeted".
    The "apologists" argument at the present time is a lot more supportable than the Negative Nellies argument, given that people have already demonstrated that A) the tweet referred to "10.1", not "Q10", B) IMAP settings on BB10 do not include a "sync timeframe" setting, only an "initial retrieval" setting, C) people have already informed you in this thread that IMAP accounts on BB10 are capable of retaining emails beyond the "initial retrieval" time, and D) certain people's incessant need to demonize the company often clouds their reasoning.

    Especially entertaining are those who seem to spend time here for the sole purpose of bashing the company and its products in virtually every single post. At least you could understand a pure Blackberry fanboy's reason for being an avid Crackberry user. It's the pure haters who provide most of the "WTF moments" around here.
    05-05-13 08:41 PM
  12. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    What is your Software release version/OS version?

    I know you can't be bothered to read the evil threads I create around here unless you can complain about something, but all the info is there if you want it:

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackbe...rsions-779341/
    My software is 10.0.10.90 please explain how this was fixed, you said I was wrong, do you mean I should update to an unofficial leaked version? Is that the fix?

    I don't see any official fix for this problem yet.
    JeepBB likes this.
    05-06-13 03:45 AM
  13. JeepBB's Avatar
    I take it from A) in your post above that you now accept the version of 10.1 on the Q10 doesn't have this 30-day email limit removed?

    If so, then Clewley's tweet was at best ambiguous, and at worst deliberately misleading. Which was my point.

    I try not to demonise BB, as they're not evil. BB is a company like any other, releasing products that they hope will attract purchasers. If the product works as advertised, customers buy, and the company prospers. It's capitalism at work, and I'm a big fan of that.

    Nothing changes for me. I'll wait until they actually fix this (and the SMTP bug) in a released OS before I consider buying. Maybe it'll be fixed in one of the planned Summer updates.
    Last edited by JeepBB; 05-06-13 at 04:36 AM.
    kevinnugent likes this.
    05-06-13 03:49 AM
  14. Omnitech's Avatar
    My software is 10.0.10.90 please explain how this was fixed, you said I was wrong, do you mean I should update to an unofficial leaked version? Is that the fix?

    I don't see any official fix for this problem yet.

    The issue is with your carrier and which version that they choose to load and support on their devices.

    As the thread I linked earlier points-out, AT&T (and some other smaller non-US carriers I believe) pushed a Z10 firmware release nearly a month ago that fixed the issue. I believe AT&T's Software release version was 10.0.10.116. I don't remember what the OS version was.

    I'm still stuck on an even worse 10.0.9.x version on my Verizon Z10 - I will be dumbfounded if they don't skip 10.0.10 and go right to 10.1, especially since recent 10.1 builds are supposed to have a fix for the random reboot problem too, which the Verizon Z10's suffer quite a bit from.
    05-06-13 01:53 PM
  15. belfastdispatcher's Avatar
    The issue is with your carrier and which version that they choose to load and support on their devices.

    As the thread I linked earlier points-out, AT&T (and some other smaller non-US carriers I believe) pushed a Z10 firmware release nearly a month ago that fixed the issue. I believe AT&T's Software release version was 10.0.10.116. I don't remember what the OS version was.

    I'm still stuck on an even worse 10.0.9.x version on my Verizon Z10 - I will be dumbfounded if they don't skip 10.0.10 and go right to 10.1, especially since recent 10.1 builds are supposed to have a fix for the random reboot problem too, which the Verizon Z10's suffer quite a bit from.
    Right, so they haven't fixed it yet, so I wasn't wrong then was I?
    05-06-13 02:00 PM
  16. Omnitech's Avatar
    I take it from A) in your post above that you now accept the version of 10.1 on the Q10 doesn't have this 30-day email limit removed?

    No I do not. As Vorkosigan pointed-out, it may just be too early for the new device owners to tell.


    If so, then Clewley's tweet was at best ambiguous, and at worst deliberately misleading. Which was my point.
    Actually, even if that tweet was dead wrong about the IMAP sync retention time, at worst it could only be half-wrong, because he was totally correct about the other half of the tweet, the Exchange ActiveSync "forever" option.

    But I'm not yet prepared to say categorically one way or the other. What pushes me in the direction of belief are all the people running 10.1 leaks who have pretty conclusively shown that 10.1 will have longer IMAP sync. So even if it didn't make it into the very first shipping 10.1 build on the Q10, I have little doubt it will arrive shortly for both Q10's and Z10s, making the statement "10.1 will have X" correct. (Subject to the lovely whims of your carrier of course, something which both BelfastDispatcher and I can certainly appreciate at this point.)
    05-06-13 02:02 PM
  17. buu511's Avatar
    I sent my Z10 back a few week ago because of this issue. I don't even mind the 30 day limitation but I would like to be able to search my IMAP server for my email. And I would like it to show at least 10 email of any imap folder I have, even if they are 3000 days old. I will keep following the BB updates and will consider buying a q10 or z10 again once this issue is resolved. But if it takes too long and the new iOS excites me, it might be too late.
    05-07-13 02:15 AM
  18. Omnitech's Avatar
    Just to clarify that, despite the rumbling of the usual critics here, Michael Clewley's tweet as quoted in the OP of this thread was indeed correct and the ability to see email history using synced email protocols under official current versions of Blackberry 10 OS version 10.1 is now available up to:

    • "Forever" for Exchange ActiveSync (EAS) configured accounts
    • 90 days for IMAP configured accounts
    05-25-13 05:23 PM
  19. quik4life's Avatar
    Omnitech,

    Can you explain in laymans terms what this means? Am I able to save/store/search for emails past the 30-day limit?

    I'm still not sure how this initial sync and retrieval system works. Keeping important emails to me on my phone for long periods of time is very important to me. Any clarification would be appreciated.

    Just to clarify that, despite the rumbling of the usual critics here, Michael Clewley's tweet as quoted in the OP of this thread was indeed correct and the ability to see email history using synced email protocols under official current versions of Blackberry 10 OS version 10.1 is now available up to:

    • "Forever" for Exchange ActiveSync (EAS) configured accounts
    • 90 days for IMAP configured accounts
    05-26-13 08:31 AM
  20. Francois Marcoux's Avatar
    It depends of the technology employed by your email provider, if you have a Microsoft Exchange Server providing your email you will have the option to sync all your mail and keep it on the device forever, and subsequently any folder you do sync will be the same. As for IMAP Idle/push is not intended for mobile use, it's support is limited to 90 days, it's the way the technology works, workaround could be put in place but it wouldn't be efficient, most IMAP servers run on UNIX, read Linux, there is software that is open source which allows server admins to emulate EAS (exchange activesync) which is the technology used by Microsoft. If your IT department where to install that software, then all emails could be kept forever with the 10.1 update.

    Posted via CB10
    05-26-13 09:21 AM
  21. Francois Marcoux's Avatar
    So once you upgrade to 10.1 you simply re-add your EAS ( Exchange Activesync ) and set initial sync to forever, and select folders to sync to all, and voil.

    Posted via CB10
    05-26-13 09:24 AM
  22. buu511's Avatar
    All I know is that on my Q10 I still only get 30 days of email and still can't perform a remote search on my imap account which used to work on iOS and android.

    Posted via CB10
    05-26-13 09:42 AM
  23. quik4life's Avatar
    I should mention that I have a gmail and outlook account.

    Thanks.

    Omnitech,

    Can you explain in laymans terms what this means? Am I able to save/store/search for emails past the 30-day limit?

    I'm still not sure how this initial sync and retrieval system works. Keeping important emails to me on my phone for long periods of time is very important to me. Any clarification would be appreciated.
    05-26-13 09:44 AM
  24. Omnitech's Avatar
    Omnitech,

    Can you explain in laymans terms what this means? Am I able to save/store/search for emails past the 30-day limit?

    Well theoretically on your Outlook.com account you will be able to keep emails visible on the device indefinitely, since it uses EAS (Exchange ActiveSync) as a connection method. (Which is Microsoft's own protocol) You can change that setting on previously setup accounts in the advanced email settings, it's called "Sync Timeframe".

    Keep in mind that trying to sync folders with many thousands of messages to a mobile device is not a particularly good idea for various reasons. If you're going to try the "forever" option, I strongly suggest only syncing folders you really need, and keep the message counts in those folders reasonable.

    For Gmail, on a BB10 device using OS version 10.1, you should be able to see up to 90 days of history. However you cannot set that setting on a previously-configured IMAP account (IMAP is the email protocol Gmail uses for its "free" services), you have to set it during account setup. The setting is "Initial Retrieval Amount". (There is a possibility it will "just work" with a previously configured account prior to the 10.1 update, but I don't have 10.1 here so I can't test that.)

    You can always search for messages that are stored/synced locally on the device, ie messages up to the "maximum age". Beyond that, there is a remote search capability. That depends on the email protocol and whether the server side supports it.

    In theory, EAS connections support remote search, but it has to be enabled on the server side. Anecdotally, I have not been able to get this to work on Outlook.com. It may not be enabled by Microsoft.

    Blackberry 10 devices at the current time do not support remote search for IMAP accounts. (Some IMAP servers support remote search, but many do not, and it can be extremely resource-intensive for that feature so some IMAP email administrators have the feature disabled.)
    05-26-13 11:12 AM
  25. Omnitech's Avatar
    As for IMAP Idle/push is not intended for mobile use


    Not technically true. There are in fact certain extensions to IMAP IDLE that are specifically designed for mobile use.



    ...it's support is limited to 90 days...

    That is a Blackberry 10 limitation, not an IMAP limitation.



    ...most IMAP servers run on UNIX, read Linux, there is software that is open source which allows server admins to emulate EAS (exchange activesync) which is the technology used by Microsoft. If your IT department where to install that software, then all emails could be kept forever with the 10.1 update.

    Microsoft Exchange can be accessed via IMAP as well, and while some *nix-based email servers do support EAS (generally via licensing from Microsoft since it is owned by them), being able to see older messages via IMAP is certainly possible as well, it's just that IMAP in general is not nearly as sophisticated a protocol as EAS is, and functions like remote search are not always well-implemented on the server side.


    All I know is that on my Q10 I still only get 30 days of email and still can't perform a remote search on my imap account which used to work on iOS and android.

    See previous replies. At the present time, BB10 does not support remote search for IMAP.
    05-26-13 11:19 AM
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