1. FortressBB10's Avatar
    I know that Chen has been monetizing everything not strapped down so it seems odd that now after I walk into Whole Foods I start getting instant suggestions in my browser to buy "X" product at Whole Foods.

    Bezos? I'm suspicious of the Amazon incursion in BB universe. I've struggled to disable the App Store and Amazon App. (Parental controls, never opening, etc.) But something(s) tracking my every step I think -- no better than Android in some respects. It would be neat to know what BB is selling in terms of our data. (No, I don't want to argue over legalese in consumer authorization forms unless it really is clear one way or the other.)

    Any ideas? I use the Audible app and other Android apps. Maybe they are the culprit. Can they sell my location data and can the BB browser sell adds that quickly? Does Google's add scheme work with our browser?

    Any insight would be welcomed. Thanks!
    12-17-19 03:48 PM
  2. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    I have never downloaded any apps from the Amazon Appstore on my BB10 phones, and have never received any marketing messages. I think it is much more likely that the Amazon apps are calling home with your location data, OR that your carrier is sharing your location with Amazon.

    Also, if you used WiFi in Whole Foods, that's the single easiest way for them to know you were there.

    It's very unlikely the data is going through BlackBerry simply because it would be the most complicated connection among the possibilities.

    From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.
    12-17-19 04:05 PM
  3. joeldf's Avatar
    It's been a while since I've had my Z10 with me regularly, but I've never had such things happen to me. I've had Amazon apps loaded, and Google Play apps, and sideloaded apps.

    Even now, using an S9, this doesn't happen. And I've still got one Amazon app loaded on it that I bought 5 years ago.
    12-17-19 05:32 PM
  4. bb10adopter111's Avatar
    It's been a while since I've had my Z10 with me regularly, but I've never had such things happen to me. I've had Amazon apps loaded, and Google Play apps, and sideloaded apps.

    Even now, using an S9, this doesn't happen. And I've still got one Amazon app loaded on it that I bought 5 years ago.
    There are lots of retailers using WiFi or GPS geo fencing strategies to target customers. WiFi is the most likely for real-time communications. In some big box stores for example, companies use a combination of WiFi and DNS to know when customers are price-matching online so that the sales staff can focus attention on them.

    But it could also easily be a coincidence.

    From the screen of my trusty Z10 using the exceptional BlackBerry VKB.
    12-17-19 06:18 PM
  5. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    I know that Chen has been monetizing everything not strapped down so it seems odd that now after I walk into Whole Foods I start getting instant suggestions in my browser to buy "X" product at Whole Foods.

    Bezos? I'm suspicious of the Amazon incursion in BB universe. I've struggled to disable the App Store and Amazon App. (Parental controls, never opening, etc.) But something(s) tracking my every step I think -- no better than Android in some respects. It would be neat to know what BB is selling in terms of our data. (No, I don't want to argue over legalese in consumer authorization forms unless it really is clear one way or the other.)

    Any ideas? I use the Audible app and other Android apps. Maybe they are the culprit. Can they sell my location data and can the BB browser sell adds that quickly? Does Google's add scheme work with our browser?

    Any insight would be welcomed. Thanks!
    There's always facial recognition, and imei readers/ mac address readers in retail stores....any "security" but not really cameras in those stores? They can and probably do cross reference your smartphone identifier with their digital picture of you, or just your mac/imei id's alone...along with purchasing some data from a third party to identify you...possibly from email service you are using, and you real name being used in those, or app registrations or other possibilities...
    (5 years out of date).
    https://citizenlab.ca/2015/05/the-ma...-and-security/

    this 2nd one is over 7years old...the tracking has gotten only more sophisticated since then
    https://lifehacker.com/how-retail-st...-and-827512308
    Dunt Dunt Dunt likes this.
    12-17-19 07:08 PM
  6. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    It's been a while since I've had my Z10 with me regularly, but I've never had such things happen to me. I've had Amazon apps loaded, and Google Play apps, and sideloaded apps.

    Even now, using an S9, this doesn't happen. And I've still got one Amazon app loaded on it that I bought 5 years ago.
    The thing about data collection and customizing it to a customer (usually by massive corporate monopolies or oligarchies), is also the fact some customers might not like it. Predicted based on on-line commenting or lack thereof, participation in social media and analysis of your side of the conversations and again lack thereof. Resulting sometimes in the conclusion, best not to spook this customer with our vast knowledge about him or her, and not target an ad on "just what I was thinking". Why not? Because it might have the opposite effect on a privacy/security oriented consumer....and they actually would not purchase a product because of the spooking. The point is, you are being tracked as much as they can track you (also depends on where you live and if your environs have already been equipped with the technology, or how soon it will be). Then again you might not be deemed to be the target audience for whatever reason, age, class, wealth, income, sex etc..
    Last edited by i_plod_an_dr_void; 12-17-19 at 08:21 PM.
    12-17-19 07:45 PM
  7. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    If BB did sell the data, isn’t that expected outcome had BB10 come out ahead of Android?
    12-17-19 07:54 PM
  8. chetmanley's Avatar
    I know that Chen has been monetizing everything not strapped down so it seems odd that now after I walk into Whole Foods I start getting instant suggestions in my browser to buy "X" product at Whole Foods.

    Bezos? I'm suspicious of the Amazon incursion in BB universe. I've struggled to disable the App Store and Amazon App. (Parental controls, never opening, etc.) But something(s) tracking my every step I think -- no better than Android in some respects. It would be neat to know what BB is selling in terms of our data. (No, I don't want to argue over legalese in consumer authorization forms unless it really is clear one way or the other.)

    Any ideas? I use the Audible app and other Android apps. Maybe they are the culprit. Can they sell my location data and can the BB browser sell adds that quickly? Does Google's add scheme work with our browser?

    Any insight would be welcomed. Thanks!
    The Audible App has the following trackers:
    -Facebook Analytics, Login, Places and Share
    -Google Analytics, Firebase Analytics, Tag Manager
    -Amazon Analytics, Kinesis Data Analytics,
    -Kochava
    -Adobe
    -Demdex
    All of those can access your location via GPS, or your proximity to known Wifi and/or Bluetooth transmitters.
    If you are using the standard BB10 browser, it has no tracker protections at all.

    There is very little we can do to stop this on a BB10 device when using Android apps.

    Here is the best you can hope to achieve with BB10:

    - Install Tor Browser and Firefox (for when Tor doesn't work, it's hit and miss on BB10). Install Privacy Badger, uBlock Origin and Cookie auto delete addons.
    - Use a VPN
    - Find a spare android phone, and use Lucky Patcher to remove as many of those tracker links and device permissions as possible (the app might eventually break or fail to install entirely)
    - Then move those patched apps onto your BB10 device.
    - Keep Location, Wifi and Bluetooth off unless actively using them
    - If you use Cobalt's apps, I recall there was an option in there which allowed for the denial of location services to the Android run time, but I might be mistaken.
    Bla1ze likes this.
    12-17-19 08:52 PM
  9. FortressBB10's Avatar
    The Audible App has the following trackers:
    -Facebook Analytics, Login, Places and Share
    -Google Analytics, Firebase Analytics, Tag Manager
    -Amazon Analytics, Kinesis Data Analytics,
    -Kochava
    -Adobe
    -Demdex
    All of those can access your location via GPS, or your proximity to known Wifi and/or Bluetooth transmitters.
    If you are using the standard BB10 browser, it has no tracker protections at all.

    There is very little we can do to stop this on a BB10 device when using Android apps.

    Here is the best you can hope to achieve with BB10:

    - Install Tor Browser and Firefox (for when Tor doesn't work, it's hit and miss on BB10). Install Privacy Badger, uBlock Origin and Cookie auto delete addons.
    - Use a VPN
    - Find a spare android phone, and use Lucky Patcher to remove as many of those tracker links and device permissions as possible (the app might eventually break or fail to install entirely)
    - Then move those patched apps onto your BB10 device.
    - Keep Location, Wifi and Bluetooth off unless actively using them
    - If you use Cobalt's apps, I recall there was an option in there which allowed for the denial of location services to the Android run time, but I might be mistaken.
    Our government really stinks (in the U.S.) I can't believe they have let this go on for so long. We are to blame too, I guess. Younger people don't even realize that Google isn't like some sort of deity that we shouldn't trust knowing everything we do.
    12-18-19 03:44 AM
  10. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Our government really stinks (in the U.S.) I can't believe they have let this go on for so long. We are to blame too, I guess. Younger people don't even realize that Google isn't like some sort of deity that we shouldn't trust knowing everything we do.
    The masses allowed it for all demographics from boomer all the way down....
    12-18-19 03:56 AM
  11. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    If BB did sell the data, isn’t that expected outcome had BB10 come out ahead of Android?
    Need to read a few terms and conditions.... analytical data is part of BB10 and most their apps. But selling that data was never the plan nor goal.

    The OPs issue is once you use a 3rd Party App (even if BlackBerry installed it) or a browser (even the BlackBerry Browser) you fall under the terms and conditions of others.

    What did sales people of old do... get to know you a little and then tailor their approach and the product to what you might be most interested in. That's really all the technology today is trying to do. Yes it might be bad if your insurance company finds out that you buy five boxes of BonBon a week, but so far we haven't gotten to that point. And when we do it will probable be by choice for those that want to share their date to get the best rates... like people do with fitness trackers already. The idea of a George Orwell's society is scary.... But then so was the idea of riding on a steam train.
    iled and Mecca EL like this.
    12-18-19 12:18 PM
  12. FortressBB10's Avatar
    But how would third-parties pay for ads on my Blackberry browser? Google adsense or some other like service? Those can hop onto the Blackberry browser? Excuse my lack of technical knowledge.
    12-18-19 04:10 PM
  13. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    But how would third-parties pay for ads on my Blackberry browser? Google adsense or some other like service? Those can hop onto the Blackberry browser? Excuse my lack of technical knowledge.
    AdSense is available in ANY browser if the website you're visiting uses it, and most do.
    12-18-19 06:10 PM
  14. FortressBB10's Avatar
    AdSense is available in ANY browser if the website you're visiting uses it, and most do.
    You mean that the BB10 browser will run Adsense (if that is the right term)? And our phones share some identifying code with the Adsense server? I'm curious how this works and how an old, non-Google browser could be serving me up ads based on where I just shopped.
    12-19-19 01:34 AM
  15. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    AdSense runs on Google's servers, but the banner ads are served to hundreds of millions of websites, and the BB10 browser will run those ads and create the cookies. As for how AdSense knew you were in the store, there are a dozen different ways, as have been mentioned in other replies.

    BB10 never made anyone immune from targeted ad networks, despite the overblown reputation it has among some in this respect. Like any phone, it really comes down to the user and the settings - but if you lock down the phone to the point where you break things like targeted ads, you'll break lots of other stuff that you probably use and like in the process. Plus, your carrier has tons of your data and is happy to sell that information to all kinds of people.
    12-19-19 03:28 AM
  16. PantherBlitz's Avatar
    Yes it might be bad if your insurance company finds out that you buy five boxes of BonBon a week, but so far we haven't gotten to that point. And when we do it will probable be by choice for those that want to share their date to get the best rates..
    I'm certain that we are on the verge of getting rate increases based on data from auto infotainment systems. Such as during the past month the car traveled over the posted speed limit. Any "choice" in the matter will be illusionary at best, much like grocery stores do with their discounts for loyalty cards. Increase the prices a little - offer a discount back down to the market price.
    12-19-19 11:17 AM
  17. FortressBB10's Avatar
    I'm certain that we are on the verge of getting rate increases based on data from auto infotainment systems. Such as during the past month the car traveled over the posted speed limit. Any "choice" in the matter will be illusionary at best, much like grocery stores do with their discounts for loyalty cards. Increase the prices a little - offer a discount back down to the market price.
    Yes. This is inevitable. Congress needs to lock down what data can be collected so that we are not pushed into a corporate police state. Companies could make it cost prohibitive to have any privacy.
    12-20-19 01:03 AM

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