08-23-14 12:27 PM
765 ... 28293031
tools
  1. wsfahmed's Avatar
    Philyd2 thats what I want to know too

    Posted via CB10
    11-16-13 11:01 AM
  2. phillyd2's Avatar
    While tons of posts should be split off the discussion on 10.2.1 is the answer to the original question. Or at least we hope it is
    11-16-13 11:06 AM
  3. bobauckland's Avatar
    Android doesn't have the BlackBerry Hub. If you have lots of history the hub needs to process and organise that info. Other devices won't have to do that. I keep 3 months of corp mail, 1 month outlook, twitter, LinkedIn, foursquare, BBM, text, etc (everything possible) in my hub and don't experience unacceptably long boot times. Granted I don't boot my device on a regular basis as it's not necessary but for the value of the hub I am more than happy to give it a few minutes to settle down after a boot.

    Posted via CB10 on my Zed10.
    No it doesn't have the hub, and I think it would be a huge mistake if they did.

    I had a universal inbox on legacy and thousands of emails on my razr through the Gmail app, no delay at all on either.

    I can understand the delays when first setting it up.
    10 mins plus boot of your messaging app every single boot? That's just poor programming.
    Not having separate inboxes that can be opened but just one window for texts, emails etc? Just poor planning.

    I hope this is dealt with eventually, by BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    11-16-13 12:13 PM
  4. ssbtech's Avatar
    Not having separate inboxes that can be opened but just one window for texts, emails etc? Just poor planning.

    I hope this is dealt with eventually, by BlackBerry.
    Sorry, what's your concern here? The hub lets you narrow down the display to just texts, just one email account, etc...

    Or am I missing your point?
    11-16-13 02:05 PM
  5. bobauckland's Avatar
    Sorry, what's your concern here? The hub lets you narrow down the display to just texts, just one email account, etc...

    Or am I missing your point?
    Point was on legacy and other oses, there's a centralised notification or universal inbox, on bb10, it's just the hub. You have no other choices. Have 4 email accounts and the hubs taking a while to initialise?
    You can't open just one inbox separately. Or have 2 inboxes concurrently opened and still start a new text. You can only do one thing at a time. Once it's initialised. For most people, the other way of doing things is more productive by far.

    Posted via CB10
    11-16-13 02:13 PM
  6. NoAhB0Dy's Avatar
    No it doesn't have the hub, and I think it would be a huge mistake if they did.

    I had a universal inbox on legacy and thousands of emails on my razr through the Gmail app, no delay at all on either.

    I can understand the delays when first setting it up.
    10 mins plus boot of your messaging app every single boot? That's just poor programming.
    Not having separate inboxes that can be opened but just one window for texts, emails etc? Just poor planning.

    I hope this is dealt with eventually, by BlackBerry.

    Posted via CB10
    I definitely agree with you there. The hub has issues and needs work to be optimized. I'm not sure what they anticipated for the average user but at least in my case, it seems to function fine. Granted I did dump all my text history and I think that has helped immensely. I have a sneaking feeling that grouping text conversations is very process intensive for the hub.
    11-16-13 09:52 PM
  7. bobauckland's Avatar
    I definitely agree with you there. The hub has issues and needs work to be optimized. I'm not sure what they anticipated for the average user but at least in my case, it seems to function fine. Granted I did dump all my text history and I think that has helped immensely. I have a sneaking feeling that grouping text conversations is very process intensive for the hub.
    Possibly they anticipated the average user would not want thousand of emails on their device.
    Which is fair enough but perhaps they should have enforced that, ie not give you the option.
    As it is, I would have thought hub optimisation should be top of the list, instead they're changing the call screen! I just don't understand whoever is making the priority list.

    Posted via CB10
    11-17-13 04:34 AM
  8. johnnyuk's Avatar
    Point was on legacy and other oses, there's a centralised notification or universal inbox, on bb10, it's just the hub. You have no other choices. Have 4 email accounts and the hubs taking a while to initialise?
    You can't open just one inbox separately. Or have 2 inboxes concurrently opened and still start a new text. You can only do one thing at a time. Once it's initialised. For most people, the other way of doing things is more productive by far.

    Posted via CB10
    In early prerelease versions of BB10 the Hub was called Universal Inbox because as with BBOS that's effectively what it is.

    I think what you're getting at is no longer having individual icons on the app grid for each email account as well as seeing them all in one place. Takes a bit of getting used to if you found that useful in BBOS, but I never did it all that useful and used to Hide them from the app grid anyway.

    I find it makes more sense having one place to go for all messaging communications regardless of type, particularly with the Peek gesture available to have a quick look at what just came in.

    The only down side is the Hub takes a while to load after a reboot or boot up. Do you turn your phone off every night? There's really no need to. Put it in Bedside mode and on charge over night and you'll rarely ever have to wait for the Hub again as reboots are so rarley needed.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by johnnyuk; 11-17-13 at 02:17 PM.
    11-17-13 02:03 PM
  9. johnnyuk's Avatar
    If so then why does one offer the Prompt option (as we had previously) while the Hub only offers either or?
    It's just named differently in Settings compared to when you actually use the feature. Possibly different teams of people involved in the implementation with nobody keeping things consistent.

    I hope they tidy it up whichever way they end up naming it so at least it's consistent in the Hub and the Settings.

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by johnnyuk; 11-18-13 at 06:23 AM.
    11-17-13 02:16 PM
  10. ssbtech's Avatar
    In early prerelease versions of BB10 the Hub was called Universal Inbox because as with BBOS that's effectively what it is.

    I think what you're getting at is no longer having individual icons on the app grid for each email account as well as seeing them all in one place. Takes a bit of getting used to if you found that useful in BBOS, but I never did it all that useful and used to Hide them from the app grid anyway.
    I find having an icon for every email account a waste of space. The hub is a much better way to handle this, IMO.
    11-17-13 02:23 PM
  11. bobauckland's Avatar
    In early prerelease versions of BB10 the Hub was called Universal Inbox because as with BBOS that's effectively what it is.

    I think what you're getting at is no longer having individual icons on the app grid for each email account as well as seeing them all in one place. Takes a bit of getting used to if you found that useful in BBOS, but I never did it all that useful and used to Hide them from the app grid anyway.

    I find it makes more sense having one place to go for all messaging communications regardless of type, particularly with the Peek gesture available to have a quick look at what just came in.

    The only down side is the Hub takes a while to load after a reboot or boot up. Do you turn your phone off every night? There's really no need to. Put it in Bedside mode and on charge over night and you'll rarely ever have to wait for the Hub again as reboots are so rarley needed.

    Posted via CB10
    All fine until you have to read read an old email while composing a new one. Or work with two emails from different inboxes and compose one in a third. Options you don't have if you're forced to use just one messaging app without tabs or windows.
    If these sorts of restrictions were imposed on legacy people would go crazy.

    It looks nice. It's absolutely not for 'people who get things done'.
    And I wouldn't voluntarily reboot my device at all. But despite having a q, my phone dies everyday, and I often have to reboot while charged or swap batteries. During a working day, then waiting 10+ mins for messages to reload or before I can send an email, again, not acceptable for the type of people who use BlackBerry.

    Just my opinion, of course. I'd be surprised if it isn't shared by many.

    Posted via CB10
    11-17-13 04:42 PM
  12. ZeroBarrier's Avatar
    I have to disagree. And I'd be the one surprised if it was shared by many. Heck, I'd be surprised if it was shared by more than 2% of all BB10 users. I wouldn't really count all legacy users; more than a few seem to be the type of people that despise change. Isn't it telling that some never moved from BlackBerry phones even when the company failed to keep up with iOS and Android?

    And these aren't "restrictions" as you call them. Legacy BlackBerry phones were designed the way they were designed, BB10 is designed differently. It's not a restriction, it's just a different way of getting things done; and believe you me, in the right hands BB10 can "get things done'' more efficiently than any legacy BlackBerry phone. There's no question about that in many people's minds here on the forum.
    11-17-13 05:01 PM
  13. ssbtech's Avatar
    And these aren't "restrictions" as you call them. Legacy BlackBerry phones were designed the way they were designed, BB10 is designed differently. It's not a restriction, it's just a different way of getting things done; and believe you me, in the right hands BB10 can "get things done'' more efficiently than any legacy BlackBerry phone. There's no question about that in many people's minds here on the forum.
    So how do you have two emails open at the same time then?

    It would be nice if you could break the message out of the Hub and simply minimize it to an active frame so you can jump between them while composing a new one.
    bobauckland likes this.
    11-17-13 05:18 PM
  14. bobauckland's Avatar
    I have to disagree. And I'd be the one surprised if it was shared by many. Heck, I'd be surprised if it was shared by more than 2% of all BB10 users. I wouldn't really count all legacy users; more than a few seem to be the type of people that despise change. Isn't it telling that some never moved from BlackBerry phones even when the company failed to keep up with iOS and Android?

    And these aren't "restrictions" as you call them. Legacy BlackBerry phones were designed the way they were designed, BB10 is designed differently. It's not a restriction, it's just a different way of getting things done; and believe you me, in the right hands BB10 can "get things done'' more efficiently than any legacy BlackBerry phone. There's no question about that in many people's minds here on the forum.
    You must be joking.
    Random comments, marketing speak about efficiency and getting things done, and no specific points at all.
    And no response at all to the issues about having multiple emails open at the same time.
    No explanation of this so called efficiency or better ways of getting things done.

    Posted via CB10
    11-17-13 06:56 PM
  15. johnnyuk's Avatar
    All fine until you have to read read an old email while composing a new one. Or work with two emails from different inboxes and compose one in a third. Options you don't have if you're forced to use just one messaging app without tabs or windows.
    If these sorts of restrictions were imposed on legacy people would go crazy.
    You can save a message you are composing as a draft from the overflow menu and then open the email you need to read or copy from. It's not as quick as switching between different inboxes in BBOS it's true but it's not that taxing.

    Posted via CB10
    11-18-13 06:31 AM
  16. bobauckland's Avatar
    You can save a message you are composing as a draft from the overflow menu and then open the email you need to read or copy from. It's not as quick as switching between different inboxes in BBOS it's true but it's not that taxing.

    Posted via CB10
    It is if you're looking at two different emails and composing a third.
    And if you look through a big inbox for an email, find it, start reading it, then get a new email, what do you have to do?
    Exit, go back to the top, read new emails, then start looking for that old email again.
    Probably the least efficient way of handling heavy emails of any Os I've tried.
    If there's a trick to doing this more productively I'd be happy to hear it.

    Posted via CB10
    11-18-13 06:55 AM
  17. Omnitech's Avatar
    Hope so as when you do a single mail delete the device prompts you to choose if you want to delete on hub or on hub and server.

    When you want to delete a couple of emails at once even the prompt doesn't show.

    Other people have noted this same behaviour. (I haven't tested it yet, will probably do that later today)

    I would guess it's just a flaw in the initial (NOT FOR PUBLIC RELEASE) implementation.
    11-18-13 05:16 PM
  18. Omnitech's Avatar
    Granted I did dump all my text history and I think that has helped immensely. I have a sneaking feeling that grouping text conversations is very process intensive for the hub.

    I would be inclined to agree. Probably pertains to "conversation mode" on email as well.

    I have no idea if the "Priority Hub" and new hub features in 10.2.1 are going to increase or decrease that overhead. I haven't used it enough to tell yet.
    11-18-13 05:19 PM
  19. Omnitech's Avatar
    Regarding working on multiple emails at the same time.

    I think there is a general mindset about modern handheld touch device design that says that most things need to be single-threaded because it's too easy on such small devices that do not have a traditional cursor to "lose" things you have open elsewhere.

    With a mouse and a cursor paradigm, you can more easily shift between various visual layers, in part because you can "hover" over things to reveal data (like the destination of a link on a webpage, or a window "underneath" another window) and you can "right-click" for contextual choices/information. "Long press" is sort-of a substitute for "right click" but not really equivalent IMHO.

    Therefore you have OS's like Windows 8x which actually regress the UI in terms of multitasking, in favor of making them more "finger friendly".

    So this may be what BlackBerry also is thinking with regards to trying to streamline its interface and avoid "layers" such as tabs and so on.

    And of course unlike other "single-threaded UI" handheld OS's like iOS or Android, BlackBerry touts the fact that the gestures allow you to quickly navigate to review contextual or metadata with swipe gestures, rather than page 1 --> page 2 --> page 3 --> [back] --> [back] --> [back] to accomplish the same thing on those other platforms, which improves multitasking.
    johnnyuk likes this.
    11-18-13 05:29 PM
  20. johnnyuk's Avatar
    It is if you're looking at two different emails and composing a third.
    And if you look through a big inbox for an email, find it, start reading it, then get a new email, what do you have to do?
    Exit, go back to the top, read new emails, then start looking for that old email again.
    Probably the least efficient way of handling heavy emails of any Os I've tried.
    If there's a trick to doing this more productively I'd be happy to hear it.

    Posted via CB10
    I don't find any mobile OS email clients to be up to the job of hardcore emailing to be honest, can't beat a full blown desktop client for that. There are still a heck of a lot of sacrifices you have to make when you go smartphone or tablet only for email.

    I've long thought the Hub could do with being mutli-threaded so whatever you're doing in it doesn't tie it up until you 'back' out of what you're doing. This would allow things like peeking back in to the Hub while you're already in it doing something, perhaps creating a new Active Frame each time or a new tab within the Hub or similar. Tabbed message browsing at the very least would help a lot.

    Posted via CB10
    ssbtech likes this.
    11-22-13 10:10 PM
  21. Omnitech's Avatar
    FWIW, my preliminary tests of "selective delete" seem to be working as designed, on OS 10.2.1.1055, on both IMAP and EAS accounts.

    I still think that it should have the enhancements I noted previously for this type of functionality to be properly implemented. The main aspects of which are:

    • An indicator of how many messages are currently hidden from the Hub
    • A mechanism to "unhide" currently hidden messages
    • A way to select scope of deletion (only in Hub or both Hub/server) when multiple messages are selected
    • A warning when locally-tracked message counts become so unwieldy that they will likely affect Hub performance


    And for good measure:

    • A feature to only synchronize email headers, which I think is necessary for anyone using the "forever" retention option in combination with a very large number of messages stored in a server mailbox.
    • A method of locally saving emails that works better than the current Remember flagging method
    11-23-13 12:50 AM
  22. southlander's Avatar
    BIS has nothing to do with it. The message list has always been local to the device, BIS never kept a network database of all your historical emails.






    I don't know where you get this idea that it's so unusual for a smartphone to bog down with tons of locally-stored messages, have you ever tried this on any other platform? That is likely precisely why Blackberry did not initially allow "unlimited" mail visibility on the device. It's a huge overhead if you have an extremely large mail store.

    Which, BTW, is precisely why MANY email adminstrators PREVENT people with smartphones from setting the retention setting to "unlimited". Here are the top 3 reasons:

    1. Excessive server load
    2. Poor performance on the handheld
    3. High bandwidth/storage usage on the handheld



    What BlackBerry should really do is provide a good way to save emails locally on the device, A) without using this limited Remember thing which doesn't save them indefinitely anyway, and B) without using the regular mail store in the Hub. (For performance reasons, and to make it easier to use/export/backup the messages elsewhere. Especially since there is still no granular backup/restore function in BlackBerry Link.)
    Lol. One person on here was complaining of slowness and battery drain while syncing something like 480,000 emails. No surprise there.

    Posted via CB10
    11-23-13 03:08 AM
  23. slickvguy's Avatar
    So how do you have two emails open at the same time then?

    It would be nice if you could break the message out of the Hub and simply minimize it to an active frame so you can jump between them while composing a new one.
    Your original posts weren't as clear as this one in terms of what you want. Now that I understand exactly what you meant, I think you raise a very good point. It was something I noticed after I got my z10. I didn't have a previous BlackBerry handset, so for me it's not that it's missing. Just seems obvious in that I use the phone like a pc. Not a huge deal for me, but I can certainly understand why it would be very important to some users. It would be great to have a multi Window / tab capability for email and text threads. Maybe BBM too.

    Along the same lines, using it like a pc. I greatly miss a delete key. Shift - backspace doesn't do it for me. Also a ctrl key for fast kbd nav and editing.
    Last edited by slickvguy; 11-23-13 at 04:04 AM.
    11-23-13 03:53 AM
  24. Omnitech's Avatar
    Lol. One person on here was complaining of slowness and battery drain while syncing something like 480,000 emails. No surprise there.

    Hilarious. Reminds me of the one that complained the upgrade of the OS locked up and didn't transfer all the SMS messages right. He had 40 thousand of them on the device.
    11-23-13 06:48 AM
  25. Omnitech's Avatar
    Your original posts weren't as clear as this one in terms of what you want. Now that I understand exactly what you meant, I think you raise a very good point. It was something I noticed after I got my z10. I didn't have a previous BlackBerry handset, so for me it's not that it's missing. Just seems obvious in that I use the phone like a pc. Not a huge deal for me, but I can certainly understand why it would be very important to some users. It would be great to have a multi Window / tab capability for email and text threads. Maybe BBM too.

    Along the same lines, using it like a pc. I greatly miss a delete key. Shift - backspace doesn't do it for me. Also a ctrl key for fast kbd nav and editing.

    Hey, how are you doing, haven't seen you posting for a while.

    I agree a lot of things would be nice to have, but personally my stance is if people want to do what a PC does/did, they shouldn't have abandoned them in the first place.

    Because honestly there's only so much you can do on a tiny handheld device, it's not ideal for some things.

    Now when they commercialize a holographic display tech that projects the UI outside of the device like Minority Report, then we can talk.

    Re: deleting text - ever use the left swipe gesture on the virtual keyboard? Handy for deleting words.
    11-23-13 06:53 AM
765 ... 28293031

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-30-09, 04:49 PM
  2. Where did "Delete on handheld and mailbox" go?
    By Jay Pique in forum BlackBerry Curve 83xx
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 01-04-09, 04:06 PM
  3. Delete on handheld only/delete on hh and inbox
    By BLACKBERRYFREAK in forum BlackBerry Storm
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 12-19-08, 05:07 AM
  4. Delete On Handheld and Mailbox
    By TIMELESS in forum BlackBerry Curve 83xx
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-27-08, 12:13 AM
  5. 4.5.093 lost delete on handheld and source.
    By Martinjv71 in forum Legacy Leaked/Beta OS
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-22-08, 11:43 AM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD