08-23-14 11:27 AM
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  1. wsfahmed's Avatar
    C'mon guys can we get back to the original subject of the discussion here please

    The delete on handheald feature is back but bot working as it should, at least for me.

    When I set it up to delete on handheald only all the mails I delete on handheald which I have not yet opened on my desktop are all getting deleted in both places instead of only on the handheald.

    Only mails previously opened on the desktops stay there when deleting from handheald using the delete on handheald option.

    Any idea why this is happening. Technically if you selet the delete on handheald only option then it showul just delete on the handheald.
    11-14-13 08:55 AM
  2. NoAhB0Dy's Avatar
    Maybe it's time to retire this thread. Just a bunch of "old men" whining about how they hate change.

    The facts are simple: There is no such thing as "delete on handheld and not on server" when using a sync environment such as EAS. Like it or not, your only option is to file the content you don't want to deal with on your handheld. *ANY* attempt at implementing this as a feature will require 1 or 2 things, depending on the environment. For non-BES customers, BB will have no choice but to implement some form of marker on the device that will effectively hide emails that are to be deleted on handheld and not on server. If you remove the account, and hence the markers, you will get the deleted mail back when you put the account back. There is absolutely no way possible for this to be any different. In a BES environment, BB may be able to track these marked emails on the BES server rather than the device but to me that would be adding a lot of server overhead and not a good option - doable but not recommended.

    In the end, BlackBerry cannot change the EAS protocol. Anything they do to return this feature will be their own hybrid way of handling mail outside of the EAS server. I personally hope, if they do implement this, that end users will have the option to completely disable the "feature" as this will definitely add additional overhead to the device and hence degrade performance.

    Proponents and opponents of this feature are entitled to have their opinions. This is not me or anyone else saying, "You will do things my way or else!". These are simply the facts of the story. Some (most) prefer true sync. Others, like to hang onto the past.
    11-14-13 09:00 AM
  3. bubbbab's Avatar
    I hate to be offensive, but those that are consuming this thread with bickering, could you please back off and let the grown ups talk?

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my GoogleBerry Cranial Implant
    11-14-13 09:53 AM
  4. mainely_linux's Avatar
    PLEASE CAN WE GET THIS ON THE NEXT OS UPDATE!!!!!

    Its so annoying that this option isn't avlialbe -- i want to keep emails in my actual inbox while deleting it from my phone inbox

    PLEASE
    This feature is currently active and present in 10.2.1.1055
    11-14-13 11:11 AM
  5. johnnyuk's Avatar
    Well let's get back to discussing the feature and stop the silly banter can we.

    The delete on handheld is not working as expected.

    When I go home and receive mails on my yahoo or other accounts which I want to delete on handheld but retain on mailbox it's not happening even when the setting is set to delete on handheld only. The mails are deleting on device and mailbox

    Only those mails that have actually been seen on the PC will allow delete on handheld and will remain on mailbox.

    Please let me know how to delete on handheld only irrespective of what's been seen or not on the PC.

    Posted via CB10
    By 'seen' do you mean downloaded to your PC with a copy left on the server? Or do you mean that the email on the server had been opened and thus marked as read?

    Please remember you're running an unfinished unreleased version of the OS, there will be bugs so you may have just found one.

    Posted via CB10
    11-14-13 12:04 PM
  6. wsfahmed's Avatar
    Yes seen as in opened and read on desktop.

    Finally a to the point answer. Thanks you are much appreciated

    Posted via CB10
    11-14-13 12:48 PM
  7. Omnitech's Avatar
    The delete on handheald feature is back but bot working as it should, at least for me.

    [...]

    Any idea why this is happening. Technically if you selet the delete on handheald only option then it showul just delete on the handheald.

    Since there is not yet a version of that OS that works on any of my devices properly, I haven't tested it yet. But I hope to soon and I will definitely test that feature.

    Do you know precisely what is being used on the server side? Who is your email provider?
    11-14-13 01:58 PM
  8. Omnitech's Avatar
    I don't spend one minute manually filing things on my pc. It's done automatically. I set up a message rule once and it's set forevwr

    I rarely ever need my sent messages on my phone, I only use it to reply to the occasional message and skim I'm coming messages

    Where do you compose and reply to emails from then, if you only use the handheld to "reply to the occasional message"?

    I made the comment about deferral of email tasks based on your past description of your workflow here ITT.



    If you remove the account, and hence the markers, you will get the deleted mail back when you put the account back.

    True, but that would have been the case with a legacy BlackBerry with "delete on device only" too, because of course the server (based on the way the protocol is designed) has no idea what is "deleted on device" because it's a proprietary feature not supported by the mail protocol itself.

    As I have pointed-out various times previously ITT, because of the disconnect created by having a device-specific list of messages that does not reflect the true status of messages held on the email system/server, I think in order to implement this functionality in the least problematic way, they should have some sort of UI mechanism that makes it clear, on a per-account basis, that there are, e.g. "2,447 messages hidden". Furthermore, I think ideally there should also be a UI feature to "show hidden messages".

    Because among various other things, it would be really really easy to unexpectedly exceed your email storage quota when you have "hidden" all messages on the server, but in fact have tens of thousands (or more) still residing there.

    Another example would pertain to system performance. Professional MS Exchange hosting providers will tell you that there are practical limits to number of messages stored per folder when using EAS before the system starts to bog down and have problems. If you have "hidden" all those messages on the handheld, I could see that leading to unexpected issues arising from not having any clear picture of what is actually stored in your account folders. This also impacts data usage and syncing overhead. Syncing a folder of 5,000 messages where 4,999 are hidden still means you are syncing a folder with 5,000 messages. (Which BTW is the maximum number of messages Microsoft recommends for an EAS endpoint without encountering sync issues) Also, I would imagine that HUB would start bogging down as the number of messages it has to separately track as "hidden" rises. My daily driver already takes 2-3 minutes to startup HUB on reboot due to all the email accounts I have configured on it.
    11-14-13 02:47 PM
  9. phillyd2's Avatar
    As I have pointed-out many times
    I have repeatedly pointed-out in this thread..... and have repeatedly pointed-out
    yes Yes YES We got it the first zillion times. If we admit you are the prettiest guy in the thread will you finally stop? Or start a new thread about how it should be but again please stop trolling this thread just to start arguments. Why do you keep doing this here???????
    bobauckland likes this.
    11-14-13 02:49 PM
  10. ThePhlash's Avatar
    I have a Z10 that I use for work and personal reasons, with the work use on BES via a "workspace" that is under a very detailed set of policies for security reasons.

    I get literally hundreds of work-related emails daily, and many of them include data in them or in attachments that I do not need to keep on my mobile device, but DO need to keep on the laptop on which I work.

    The ability to "delete on handset" would help me keep from overloading the storage on my mobile, while still keeping that reference data on Outlook on the laptop - BTW... this data is already subject to a retention policy, but there is a lot of information I may need to access on the laptop but NOT on the mobile - at least after I have seen it and am aware of the information contained in it. For example, I routinely get email with multi-megabyte pdf files attached that I must keep on the laptop, but certainly do not need to keep on the mobile.

    THIS is the reason I would like to be able to "delete on mobile" and NOT have it be deleted on the email server.

    If this is re-enabled in 10.2, that will be another reason I can't wait for VZW to get it out to us !
    ssbtech and LatinoLoco24 like this.
    11-14-13 03:04 PM
  11. phillyd2's Avatar
    Me too!

    I own a mid-sized business and also get tons of emails. This feature allows me to decide what to do with each message.

    Junk – Delete Both
    Information Only – Read and then Delete on Both
    Needs a reply – Do so on the BB and then Delete
    Will Reply Later – Delete on Handset Only
    Need to keep / file in Outlook – Delete on Handset Only

    Been hanging on to my VZ 9930 mainly for this feature. And the keyboard. Apps? Ha, good one. If this new release adds back the feature and also add seamless Android app then the Q10 may be the most perfect phone ever.
    Last edited by phillyd2; 11-14-13 at 03:24 PM.
    11-14-13 03:11 PM
  12. Omnitech's Avatar
    please stop trolling this thread just to start arguments.

    I suggest following your own advice and stop playing the victim.
    11-14-13 03:23 PM
  13. ssbtech's Avatar
    Where do you compose and reply to emails from then, if you only use the handheld to "reply to the occasional message"?

    I made the comment about deferral of email tasks based on your past description of your workflow here ITT.
    I use my desktop PC to write emails.
    In a pinch I'll use my phone, but that's rare.
    11-14-13 05:12 PM
  14. bubbbab's Avatar
    So what is the reality of this legacy feature apparently being returned to BlackBerry? If I'm on imap now would I have to switch back to pop to access the feature? As I understand it, imap is a real time platform so I don't understand how I could have an option not to delete on the server if I delete in the handheld. Currently I'm imap on the phone and pop3 on laps and desktops.

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my GoogleBerry Cranial Implant
    11-14-13 05:41 PM
  15. HotFix's Avatar
    So what is the reality of this legacy feature apparently being returned to BlackBerry? If I'm on imap now would I have to switch back to pop to access the feature? As I understand it, imap is a real time platform so I don't understand how I could have an option not to delete on the server if I delete in the handheld. Currently I'm imap on the phone and pop3 on laps and desktops.

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my GoogleBerry Cranial Implant
    IMAP, like Exchange ActiveSync (EAS), is designed to keep your mailbox in your email client synchronized with your server. IMAP, like EAS, is not designed to maintain different versions of your mailbox.

    Like someone said previously, unless BlackBerry decides to implement some new "hide from the BB10 Hub but keep on the server" message flag, I don't think you will see this returning. I totally get why you all like this so much, I used it with my old BES but that was a different client experience.

    About the best thing I can offer now to you wanting to keep your email on your BB10 device "controlled" is file the messages you don't want to see anymore into a sub-folder that isn't synced to your handheld. No it's not the "delete prior" but it effectively will do the same thing by taking the email off your handheld but still keeping it (in a different folder) on your server.
    NoAhB0Dy likes this.
    11-14-13 06:26 PM
  16. phillyd2's Avatar

    Like someone said previously, unless BlackBerry decides to implement some new "hide from the BB10 Hub but keep on the server" message flag, I don't think you will see this returning. I totally get why you all like this so much, I used it with my old BES but that was a different client experience.
    I don't think so or I hope not anyways. Based on the screen shot recently posted it seems to give the options as was previously offered. Just hiding the email on the device would do nothing to it on the server. In that case may as well file, like you and others have said, but the setting would only offer Delete or Keep on Server.

    See post 610
    11-14-13 06:37 PM
  17. bubbbab's Avatar
    Great dissertation, and thanks. I'm thinking of changing the laptops and desktops to imap but I've been hesitating. Problem is I have is that I save everything forever. I have email dating back to 2002. Yes there is a reason.

    That said, I'm trying to figure out data implications on all of this. I also don't think delete on server will return in its legacy form so I have to get off my but and get this working.

    So if I take the old emails and dump them into a new imap account on computer then I'm gonna have a bunch of downloads to my phone. There may not even be room for all of it.

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my GoogleBerry Cranial Implant
    11-14-13 06:41 PM
  18. Omnitech's Avatar
    Like someone said previously, unless BlackBerry decides to implement some new "hide from the BB10 Hub but keep on the server" message flag, I don't think you will see this returning.

    As I pointed-out ITT on 10/15, someone else pointed-out on 10/26, and we now have proof of via this post of 11/12 among others, BlackBerry is bringing back the feature.

    How well it works is an open-question. The first poster here who has indicated they are testing it is not getting it to work very well apparently.
    southlander likes this.
    11-14-13 06:51 PM
  19. Omnitech's Avatar
    No it's not the "delete prior" but it effectively will do the same thing

    BB10's Hub still has a "delete prior" feature. Some people have gotten in trouble with it by accidentally invoking it (the UI could be a little more obvious), but it's definitely there. Long-press on a date in an email account and touch the trashcan, there it is.
    11-14-13 07:04 PM
  20. Omnitech's Avatar
    I'm thinking of changing the laptops and desktops to imap but I've been hesitating. Problem is I have is that I save everything forever. I have email dating back to 2002. Yes there is a reason.

    That said, I'm trying to figure out data implications on all of this. I also don't think delete on server will return in its legacy form so I have to get off my but and get this working.

    So if I take the old emails and dump them into a new imap account on computer then I'm gonna have a bunch of downloads to my phone. There may not even be room for all of it.

    There are email providers today that will allow you to store tens of gigabytes of data on their system if you wish. In general it's not so much an issue of how old the data is, but how many messages and the size of them that determines whether it is practical to store or not.

    I have customers who have single people who generate literally 100's of emails a day, just for outgoing. Usage patterns vary wildly.

    If you're going to store things "in the cloud", then I suggest using a reliable, professional email provider who offers a backup service. People who rely on freebie email providers to steward all of their critical emails going back 10 years are, to put it lightly, acting irresponsibly.

    Some email clients also have archiving features where you can automatically archive emails from a syncing mail system to a local archive. Outlook (manually or automatically initiated) and Thunderbird (manually initiated) are two examples.
    11-14-13 07:22 PM
  21. bubbbab's Avatar
    I have my own domain and many others. There are no storage limits at all. My concern is that all of that will also be on my phone which could effectively run out.of space.

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my Google iBerry Cranial Implant
    11-14-13 07:53 PM
  22. HotFix's Avatar
    As I pointed-out ITT on 10/15, someone else pointed-out on 10/26, and we now have proof of via this post of 11/12 among others, BlackBerry is bringing back the feature.

    How well it works is an open-question. The first poster here who has indicated they are testing it is not getting it to work very well apparently.
    Sorry I don't have time to go back through every page you wrote...
    bobauckland likes this.
    11-14-13 09:20 PM
  23. HotFix's Avatar
    I have my own domain and many others. There are no storage limits at all. My concern is that all of that will also be on my phone which could effectively run out.of space.

    Posted by Dr. Emmett Brown from my Google iBerry Cranial Implant
    For what it's worth the new "feature" is in the list of features and bugs of 10.2.1.1055 someone is maintaining:
    http://forums.crackberry.com/bb10-le...-fixes-873158/
    "- When deleting an email, you get two options: 1. Delete from Hub or 2. Delete from Hub and server"

    I hope this is what you are looking for and that it works when it actually gets officially released. I don't think it will be as reliable as to the days when the information was maintained on the BIS/BES, because this information will most likely only be tracked on the device which is bound to get out of sync/reset it self once in a blue moon.
    Last edited by HotFix; 11-14-13 at 09:34 PM.
    bobauckland likes this.
    11-14-13 09:23 PM
  24. HotFix's Avatar
    BB10's Hub still has a "delete prior" feature. Some people have gotten in trouble with it by accidentally invoking it (the UI could be a little more obvious), but it's definitely there. Long-press on a date in an email account and touch the trashcan, there it is.
    The "it" I was referring to as not being the delete prior was the process of moving messages into a sub-folder. If you are going to quote me to correct me, then please quote (and read) the whole message.
    11-14-13 09:25 PM
  25. lana75's Avatar
    Tested on 10.2.1.1055 z10 stl-1, and delete on hub only works perfectly, like on my old 9780. That is for pop3 account. Haven't tested on imap.
    11-14-13 09:48 PM
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