02-13-17 11:33 PM
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  1. markmall's Avatar
    You say this in every forum. Forgetting just for a moment there was no ecosystem to market against IOS/Android, with exactly what money did BlackBerry have to use for marketing? The money that came from Prem/Fairfax was never available for marketing.
    I'm done arguing with you guys. Look at their financial statements and what they have spent money on the last several years. Think they could have freed up money to market their products? Buying other companies is a cash flow negative event unless you are just giving them stock.

    Posted via CB10
    01-25-17 02:24 PM
  2. markmall's Avatar
    What apps were the over 35 years old professionals (the meat of BlackBerry's market) clamoring for in 2012? Snapchat? Instagram? Whatsapp? I don't think this was nearly the biggest factor.

    Posted via CB10
    Kot Prada likes this.
    01-25-17 02:29 PM
  3. conite's Avatar
    What apps were the over 35 years old professionals (the meat of BlackBerry's market) clamoring for in 2012? Snapchat? Instagram? Whatsapp? I don't think this was nearly the biggest factor.

    Posted via CB10
    Airwatch, Mobile Iron, Good, Google apps (Sheets, Drive, etc), Pinterest, TriptIt, Chrome, Firefox, Zinio.

    But in 2012, business people became consumers too. Netflix, Instagram, etc.
    01-25-17 02:43 PM
  4. markmall's Avatar
    Airwatch, Mobile Iron, Good, Google apps (Sheets, Drive, etc), Pinterest, TriptIt.

    But in 2012, business people became consumers too. Netflix, Instagram, etc.
    No one knew what any of those were in 2012. (I don't know what half of them are now.) The only one that was an issue was Netflix. Pintererst? Airwatch? Give me a break. You think bankers and lawyers were spending time on Pinterest? Or that they are today?
    Kot Prada likes this.
    01-25-17 02:47 PM
  5. conite's Avatar
    No one knew what any of those were in 2012. (I don't know what half of them are now.) The only one that was an issue was Netflix. Pintererst? Airwatch? Give me a break. You think bankers and lawyers were spending time on Pinterest? Or that they are today?
    Those are the top MDM providers in 2012.

    Pretty much every business collaboration tool from 2012 did not have a BB10 app either.
    01-25-17 02:49 PM
  6. markmall's Avatar
    Those are the top MDM providers in 2012.
    So the problem wasn't consumer apps like Whatsapp and Pinterest but lack of enterprise software?
    01-25-17 02:54 PM
  7. conite's Avatar
    So the problem wasn't consumer apps like Whatsapp and Pinterest but lack of enterprise software?
    Both.

    Android and iOS finally delivered a single device for both business and pleasure - something BB10 could not replicate.
    01-25-17 02:55 PM
  8. markmall's Avatar
    Both.

    Android and iOS finally delivered a single device for both business and pleasure - something BB10 could not replicate.
    I vote neither.
    01-25-17 02:59 PM
  9. Halifax Guy's Avatar
    Let's be honest here... Blackberry 10 was DOA the moment it came out half baked. I bought a z10 from att at launch.. only to have it be striken with the reboot bug that make it reboot like 30 times a day. Returned it and didn't return to BB10 until I bought a passport. The Z10 should have never been a flagship launch device. Even if the OS wasn't full of problems from the get go... the hardware wasn't very impressive....

    Posted via CB10
    Following your lead about being honest, I have never experienced nor heard of this 'reboot bug' of which you speak. Also, the hardware (at least the Q10) was and still is very impressive.

    Posted using a Q10, 10.3.2.2474.
    01-25-17 03:44 PM
  10. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Following your lead about being honest, I have never experienced nor heard of this 'reboot bug' of which you speak. Also, the hardware (at least the Q10) was and still is very impressive.

    Posted using a Q10, 10.3.2.2474.
    BlackBerry 10.1 update confirmed to fix random reboots on affected Z10 devices | CrackBerry.com

    And now you have heard of it.
    01-25-17 03:48 PM
  11. ppeters914's Avatar
    Following your lead about being honest, I have never experienced nor heard of this 'reboot bug' of which you speak. Also, the hardware (at least the Q10) was and still is very impressive.

    Posted using a Q10, 10.3.2.2474.
    You have a Q10.........which enjoyed (still enjoys?) its own unique features.

    Posted via CB10 / AT&T /Z10 STL100-3 /10.3.3.2163
    01-25-17 03:58 PM
  12. Halifax Guy's Avatar
    Thank you for the history lesson.

    Posted using a Q10, 10.3.2.2474.
    01-25-17 05:51 PM
  13. Halifax Guy's Avatar
    You have a Q10.........which enjoyed (still enjoys?) its own unique features.

    Posted via CB10 / AT&T /Z10 STL100-3 /10.3.3.2163
    That I do and it does.

    Posted using a Q10, 10.3.2.2474.
    01-25-17 05:52 PM
  14. Kot Prada's Avatar
    Airwatch, Mobile Iron, Good, Google apps (Sheets, Drive, etc), Pinterest, TriptIt, Chrome, Firefox, Zinio.

    But in 2012, business people became consumers too. Netflix, Instagram, etc.
    I am a business user... and I got all needed apps from the box (except WhatsApp). All office programs, e-mail etc. If I would want some Google sh*t on my device, I would definitely look for Android. But no, I do not use Google services... that's because of security and privacy issues, which BB stands for. That's why I stated BB's death when they began collaboration with Google.
    Last edited by Kot Prada; 01-28-17 at 07:09 AM.
    markmall likes this.
    01-26-17 06:28 AM
  15. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    I am a business user... and I got all needed apps from the box (except WhatsApp). All office programs, e-mail etc. If I Would some Google sh*t on my device, I would definitely look for Android. But no, I do not use Google services... that's because of security and privacy issues, which BB stands for. That's why I stated BB's death when they began collaboration with Google.
    Unfortunately, BBRY needed a good deal more business folks like yourself, who were equally satisfied with BB10 out of the box.

    And for the dwindling number of folks who feel Google/Android is dangerous, there's always iOS.

    I don't think said collaboration with Google was the issue, but that's a discussion for another thread.
    anon(9803228) likes this.
    01-26-17 06:35 AM
  16. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I'm done arguing with you guys. Look at their financial statements and what they have spent money on the last several years. Think they could have freed up money to market their products? Buying other companies is a cash flow negative event unless you are just giving them stock.

    Posted via CB10
    The money that was spent was from Prem/Fairfax and the cash flow generated from those acquisitions.
    01-26-17 06:59 AM
  17. tre10's Avatar
    I'm done arguing with you guys. Look at their financial statements and what they have spent money on the last several years. Think they could have freed up money to market their products? Buying other companies is a cash flow negative event unless you are just giving them stock.

    Posted via CB10
    They probably could have freed up money for marketing. They chose not to. They had no confidence that marketing would have gotten them anywhere (playing it safe with the money has been their thing for a while now).

    In their defense though LG just posted a pretty big loss. They blame the fact that they spent a lot on marketing and G5 didn't sell as expected despite all that marketing. Marketing doesn't solve everything.
    01-26-17 07:13 AM
  18. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    They probably could have freed up money for marketing. They chose not to. They had no confidence that marketing would have gotten them anywhere (playing it safe with the money has been their thing for a while now).

    In their defense though LG just posted a pretty big loss. They blame the fact that they spent a lot on marketing and G5 didn't sell as expected despite all that marketing. Marketing doesn't solve everything.
    Hardware still has negative cash flow. They couldn't spend money on a dead product even if they wanted too... just spending $10/phone would have been $30 million this last year. The board and Fairfax would never allow for mismanagement of shareholder resources, especially with activist stakeholders calling the shots as part the rescue plan.
    01-26-17 07:19 AM
  19. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Marketing doesn't solve everything.
    Very will said!
    01-26-17 07:30 AM
  20. Soulstream's Avatar
    They probably could have freed up money for marketing. They chose not to. They had no confidence that marketing would have gotten them anywhere (playing it safe with the money has been their thing for a while now).

    In their defense though LG just posted a pretty big loss. They blame the fact that they spent a lot on marketing and G5 didn't sell as expected despite all that marketing. Marketing doesn't solve everything.
    Also in their defense, Microsoft pumped a lot of money into Windows phone marketing and that still got them nowhere.
    Tre Lawrence likes this.
    01-26-17 07:36 AM
  21. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Also in their defense, Microsoft pumped a lot of money into Windows phone marketing and that still got them nowhere.
    Agreed.

    A very valid counterpoint to the theory that advertising cash solves all ills.
    anon(9803228) likes this.
    01-26-17 07:39 AM
  22. markmall's Avatar
    Agreed.

    A very valid counterpoint to the theory that advertising cash solves all ills.
    First, Microsoft as treated Windows phone like a red-headed stepchild. I used to listen to Leo Laporte's Windows Weekly, and they would talk about this all the time. I think about as many people know about Windows phone as BB10.

    This is another example of the pro-Android people making up facts to support their point. If you say that does not make it true.

    Second, marketing refers to more than advertising although advertising is a big part. It also refers to branding, pricing, product design and many other things. Chen struck out in just about every respect. The Passport was not his so he doesn't get credit for its design. Its marketing was terrible. The "work wide" campaign -- if you could call it that -- appeared just about no where except banner ads for people doing Google searches for it.
    01-26-17 12:41 PM
  23. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    First, Microsoft as treated Windows phone like a red-headed stepchild. I used to listen to Leo Laporte's Windows Weekly, and they would talk about this all the time. I think about as many people know about Windows phone as BB10.

    This is another example of the pro-Android people making up facts to support their point. If you say that does not make it true.

    Second, marketing refers to more than advertising although advertising is a big part. It also refers to branding, pricing, product design and many other things. Chen struck out in just about every respect. The Passport was not his so he doesn't get credit for its design. Its marketing was terrible. The "work wide" campaign -- if you could call it that -- appeared just about no where except banner ads for people doing Google searches for it.
    Pro Android? The whole faction thing is a bit over done.

    But here's a question: what would you have marketed if BB10 to capture the eye of the burgeoning smartphone market in 2010? What would you have highlighted as advantages over iOS, Android, Windows Phone and Symbian?

    You'll never find me suggesting that BBRY knows how to market well, but I don't see what marketing would have done to prevent the current result.
    DrBoomBotz likes this.
    01-26-17 12:59 PM
  24. markmall's Avatar
    Pro Android? The whole faction thing is a bit over done.

    But here's a question: what would you have marketed if BB10 to capture the eye of the burgeoning smartphone market in 2010? What would you have highlighted as advantages over iOS, Android, Windows Phone and Symbian?

    You'll never find me suggesting that BBRY knows how to market well, but I don't see what marketing would have done to prevent the current result.
    Are you kidding? How about the Hub? How about Blend? How about security? (Remember Sony hacks? The Clinton email hacks?) How about ease of use? How about the premium hardware like superior microphones, speakers and antennas (at least in the Passport)?

    These are the types of features things Madison Ave. has been selling for 75 years. Look at the silly things Samsung bothers to spend big money marketing. Waterproof? Curved sides? If those are worth marketing, so is Blend. Chen did not spend a nickel marketing Blend.

    Posted via CB10
    01-26-17 01:50 PM
  25. Nguyen1's Avatar
    You forgot to mention VR and wearable smartwatches. Both are equally worthless trends in mobile tech.

    The Guide is definitive. Reality is frequently inaccurate.
    01-26-17 02:02 PM
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