02-13-17 11:33 PM
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  1. JSmith422's Avatar

    This reminds me of that great Jeff Goldblum character in Jurassic Park and his Chaos Theory.

    Posted via CB10
    So true.....and look how that turned out. People seem to think cloud data is a proven concept. It's one big experiment, and you're the test subject.

    Posted via CB10
    02-10-17 12:01 AM
  2. Trouveur's Avatar
    Be that as it may, the majority buyers deal with a carrier store . Unlocked phones are increasing in popularity and I hope that "Shop BlackBerry Mobile" can rise to the level of Apple or Google in their client services.
    USA is not the world. In many countries, phones are not bought from a carrier.


    Posted via CB10
    02-10-17 06:28 AM
  3. AlKuqo's Avatar
    We recently had an old AOL account, that was CLOSED way back in 2006, randomly reopen and start leaking data.....the data never dies. It's always there somewhere. Google has money for security features today, but what about in 15 years? AOL was once a behemoth too, and now they aren't. If anything is for certain, it's that Google won't be around forever to protect your personal data.....but the data itself will be, and who knows who will have access to it or how it will be used.

    And to anyone who can't imagine a world without Google and says they'll never go out of business, I say you're incredibly short sighted and in dire need of a history lesson.

    Posted via CB10
    Love this. Absolutely LOVE this.

    Come learn the science that FBI, CIA, Interpol, & Fortune 500 companies are using by visiting our channel. Join The KUQO Group at C002EFE5D and learn all about behavioral sciences.
    02-10-17 08:27 AM
  4. keyboardsrock's Avatar
    There's one point that I've maybe missed reading through all these pages. Yes, all. A sinus infection has left me too wasted to anything more productive. I might be naive, but I doubt most businesses need 25 apps. Perhaps only 2 or 3. HOWEVER, even if you only need ONE, BB10 is of no use if it can't support that ONE app. I find it odd that nobody at BB took a look at the top three or four most widely used/required apps in each 'genre' (for lack of a better word) and make SURE they could be supported by BB10. Did nobody think to ask their major customers what features were most important to them?

    Am I missing something or did BB not know they were killing BB10 by agreeing not to be able to update Runtime beyond 4.x? How could anyone fail to realize that android app compatibility was a major selling point?

    Advertising: Yup, more agreement from me there. There was hardly any at all...ever. Again, nobody at BB knew this was a serious mistake? Or was it that no one actually cared and/or other agendas were at play?

    PKB: BB has licensed or is (supposedly) willing to license out damn near everything EXCEPT the thing for which BB is probably most famous among consumers? I don't know about any of you, but battery life aside, the only thing I've ever heard iPhone users complain about is the keyboard. NOBODY thought that millions of iPhone users around the globe might want a snap-on BB pkb? HELLO?!?!

    Security: It's a hard sell, but not an impossible one. Consumers WOULD understand the concept of individual permissions if it were presented properly. Advert idea:

    Consumer (talking to phone as if it were a person): Hello, you're a keyboard app. No, you DON'T need access to my pics. And YOU, exactly why do you as a flashlight app 'need' to know my location to give me a 'better experience'? YOU ARE A FLASHLIGHT!!!

    Android knew enough to listen and allow at least some individual permissions in its most latest OS versions.
    .
    While I don't question the fact of Google's constant data collection and concerns for the future are valid... How do we actually KNOW that BB will not do the same at some future point?

    It comes down to balancing one's needs vs. convenience, Carrying two phones or one.

    Damn frustrating. The whole thing smacks of Nokia and Norway: Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory!

    Ok, yes I'm dating myself by simply saying "Norway" and assuming readers will know what I'm talking about ;-)
    02-11-17 07:41 PM
  5. Emaderton3's Avatar
    There's one point that I've maybe missed reading through all these pages. Yes, all. A sinus infection has left me too wasted to anything more productive. I might be naive, but I doubt most businesses need 25 apps. Perhaps only 2 or 3. HOWEVER, even if you only need ONE, BB10 is of no use if it can't support that ONE app. I find it odd that nobody at BB took a look at the top three or four most widely used/required apps in each 'genre' (for lack of a better word) and make SURE they could be supported by BB10. Did nobody think to ask their major customers what features were most important to them?

    Am I missing something or did BB not know they were killing BB10 by agreeing not to be able to update Runtime beyond 4.x? How could anyone fail to realize that android app compatibility was a major selling point?

    Advertising: Yup, more agreement from me there. There was hardly any at all...ever. Again, nobody at BB knew this was a serious mistake? Or was it that no one actually cared and/or other agendas were at play?

    PKB: BB has licensed or is (supposedly) willing to license out damn near everything EXCEPT the thing for which BB is probably most famous among consumers? I don't know about any of you, but battery life aside, the only thing I've ever heard iPhone users complain about is the keyboard. NOBODY thought that millions of iPhone users around the globe might want a snap-on BB pkb? HELLO?!?!

    Security: It's a hard sell, but not an impossible one. Consumers WOULD understand the concept of individual permissions if it were presented properly. Advert idea:

    Consumer (talking to phone as if it were a person): Hello, you're a keyboard app. No, you DON'T need access to my pics. And YOU, exactly why do you as a flashlight app 'need' to know my location to give me a 'better experience'? YOU ARE A FLASHLIGHT!!!

    Android knew enough to listen and allow at least some individual permissions in its most latest OS versions.
    .
    While I don't question the fact of Google's constant data collection and concerns for the future are valid... How do we actually KNOW that BB will not do the same at some future point?

    It comes down to balancing one's needs vs. convenience, Carrying two phones or one.

    Damn frustrating. The whole thing smacks of Nokia and Norway: Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory!

    Ok, yes I'm dating myself by simply saying "Norway" and assuming readers will know what I'm talking about ;-)
    It could be a ton of apps based on the number of genres (plumber, electrician, lawyer, doctor, etc.). Probably not feasible.

    The runtime was never designed or provided for mass consumption of Android apps. The original intent was to let Android developers see what their apps looked like on OS10. Once the app gap reared it's ugly head, they panicked and made it an official option paired with Amazon app store.

    I don't understand why everyone inherently trusts BlackBerry and assumes they are not doing anything similar with our data. As many of the experts in these forums have said, read the user agreement and compare to Apple and Android phones and you might be surprised by their similarities.

    Posted via CB10
    02-11-17 08:30 PM
  6. markmall's Avatar
    It could be a ton of apps based on the number of genres (plumber, electrician, lawyer, doctor, etc.). Probably not feasible.

    The runtime was never designed or provided for mass consumption of Android apps. The original intent was to let Android developers see what their apps looked like on OS10. Once the app gap reared it's ugly head, they panicked and made it an official option paired with Amazon app store.

    I don't understand why everyone inherently trusts BlackBerry and assumes they are not doing anything similar with our data. As many of the experts in these forums have said, read the user agreement and compare to Apple and Android phones and you might be surprised by their similarities.

    Posted via CB10
    I still want to know what big apps were missing in 2013 that BlackBerry overlooked and "prosumers" needed so badly. Netflix? What exactly?

    Also, sideloading was a thing immediately I remember.

    You really think BlackBerry is collecting consumer browsing data and selling it? Or just storing it? Not a chance.



    Posted via CB10
    02-11-17 11:30 PM
  7. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    I still want to know what big apps were missing in 2013 that BlackBerry overlooked and "prosumers" needed so badly. Netflix? What exactly?

    Also, sideloading was a thing immediately I remember.

    You really think BlackBerry is collecting consumer browsing data and selling it? Or just storing it? Not a chance.



    Posted via CB10
    Who's selling it though?
    02-11-17 11:37 PM
  8. conite's Avatar
    I still want to know what big apps were missing in 2013 that BlackBerry overlooked and "prosumers" needed so badly. Netflix? What exactly?
    The entire Google suite of apps including GMaps, Hangouts, Chrome, Google Drive, Google+, Google Docs, etc.; Lotus Notes, Digg, Sketchbook, Cal, Touchdown, Square Register, WebEx, Quip, Bloomberg, Pocket, Yelp, Fancy, Square, Uber, Embark, Airwatch, MobileIron, Citrix, Good Technology, Fiberlink, Sap, Flow, Skitch, SalesForce, ....

    ...I'm getting bored. I'll stop there.
    02-12-17 12:03 AM
  9. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    The entire Google suite of apps including GMaps, Hangouts, Chrome, Google Drive, Google+, Google Docs, etc.; Lotus Notes, Digg, Sketchbook, Cal, Touchdown, Square Register, WebEx, Quip, Bloomberg, Pocket, Yelp, Fancy, Square, Uber, Embark, Airwatch, MobileIron, Citrix, Good Technology, Fiberlink, Sap, Flow, Skitch, SalesForce, ....

    ...I'm getting bored. I'll stop there.
    But Conite... can't you just use the websites?
    02-12-17 12:11 AM
  10. anon(6125289)'s Avatar
    The entire Google suite of apps including GMaps, Hangouts, Chrome, Google Drive, Google+, Google Docs, etc.; Lotus Notes, Digg, Sketchbook, Cal, Touchdown, Square Register, WebEx, Quip, Bloomberg, Pocket, Yelp, Fancy, Square, Uber, Embark, Airwatch, MobileIron, Citrix, Good Technology, Fiberlink, Sap, Flow, Skitch, SalesForce, ....

    ...I'm getting bored. I'll stop there.
    ^^

    Posted via CB10
    02-12-17 04:50 AM
  11. Emaderton3's Avatar
    I still want to know what big apps were missing in 2013 that BlackBerry overlooked and "prosumers" needed so badly. Netflix? What exactly?

    Also, sideloading was a thing immediately I remember.

    You really think BlackBerry is collecting consumer browsing data and selling it? Or just storing it? Not a chance.



    Posted via CB10
    Sideloading was discovered by users and not provided as a solution from BlackBerry.

    I know there were many professional apps that weren't available. That is one main reason my wife switched to an Android back then. There are many old forums on here with apps missing for doctors, engineers, researchers, construction, etc.

    I will defer to Conite and Trey regarding BlackBerry data collection.

    Posted via CB10
    02-12-17 07:48 AM
  12. Invictus0's Avatar
    I still want to know what big apps were missing in 2013 that BlackBerry overlooked and "prosumers" needed so badly. Netflix? What exactly?

    Also, sideloading was a thing immediately I remember.
    Good starting point here,

    http://forums.crackberry.com/app-ann...s-bb10-826837/
    02-12-17 10:24 AM
  13. keyboardsrock's Avatar
    Good points, All. I should've at least touched on them while I was ******** ranting.
    - I did follow up with the companies I was most concerned with and asked for a BB10 version. I'll be honest and admit that between illness, the estate I was handling at the time, and my personal resultant housing crisis I was not as diligent as I'd otherwise have been.
    - I've been told by tech geeks that I'm freakishly good at 'following the bouncing ball' regarding h/w and s/w directions. That said, I'm still a non-geek and should the slightest thing go awry I'm usually at a complete loss as to what to do. I'm also very slow at doing anything tech-related as Iusually have to read and re-read before I understand what I need to do. I usually take twice as long as my tech-oriented friends to do anything.
    - I recall BBerry getting into Apple-like clashes with various governments years back for refusing to turn over (user?) data or provide access. I also seem to recall threatening to completely pull out of one country rather than turn over data. I understand that BBerry would have a lot to lose by appearing to capitulate to outside pressure regarding user privacy. At the same time we're on the outside and are dependent on third parties for information. So we have no way of actually knowing for sure what is shared or not. It comes down to trust, no?
    - Mobile web sites don't always offer the same functionality or operate the same way as an app. If two people are talking on the phone and one's using an app to look at something and one's using the mobile site con fusion can result.
    - Then there's the simple fact that end users can get told by their supervisors they must do 'x' task on 'y' app if they want to use their own phone.

    To be fair, this does go both ways. Opera Mini runs beautifully on my Classic but on my tablet the controls and menus are much too small for me to use comfortably. I can adjust how a web page is displayed more ways than I can count through Opera and tablet system settings. However, nothing has touched how the menu itself appears. Result? I don't use Opera Mini on my tablet.

    There's another point not related to BB10, but does fall under the category of "the end user is not the decision maker" regarding hardware. In the last ~5 years the 4 major cell phone carriers (i.e the owners of the four PHYSICAL nation-wide networks) have added/dropped/swapped the frequencies (aka bands, channels, etc.) they use. Has BBerry ever altered the specs of its then in-production models to accommodate the change(s)? Example: IIRC, the 9900 was still in production when T-Mobile added 3G service at 1900 mHz to its extant 1700/2100 3G service. 1900 mHz service appeared first in areas where 1700/2100 service was spotty/non-existent. Did BBerry start equipping its 9900 models produced thereafter to use 1900 mHz as well? As far as I'm aware, it did not. End result? Potential BBerry converts were lost. or those BBerry users who switched to T-Mobile because their job offered a dicsount for T-Mobile had to give up BBerry.

    Have I missed or misunderstood anything?
    02-12-17 01:16 PM
  14. markmall's Avatar
    The entire Google suite of apps including GMaps, Hangouts, Chrome, Google Drive, Google+, Google Docs, etc.; Lotus Notes, Digg, Sketchbook, Cal, Touchdown, Square Register, WebEx, Quip, Bloomberg, Pocket, Yelp, Fancy, Square, Uber, Embark, Airwatch, MobileIron, Citrix, Good Technology, Fiberlink, Sap, Flow, Skitch, SalesForce, ....

    ...I'm getting bored. I'll stop there.
    What a joke. Fiberlink? Square Register? You either didn't understand my question or changed it to suit your argument.

    Posted via CB10
    02-12-17 03:50 PM
  15. markmall's Avatar
    The only app I saw that I recognized in that thread (the part I could stand to read) was Simpsons Tapped Out. I played that on an Android tablet or got it working on my Z30. I don't remember which. It entertained me for 10 minutes tops.

    Some of the other apps look like shopping apps that probably have browser versions by now. Ikea app? Oh, boy!

    People obsessed with apps should never have bought BB10. I have never claimed otherwise.

    My point stands. What mainstream, essential apps were missing apart from Netflix?

    Posted via CB10
    02-12-17 03:57 PM
  16. Soulstream's Avatar
    The only app I saw that I recognized in that thread (the part I could stand to read) was Simpsons Tapped Out. I played that on an Android tablet or got it working on my Z30. I don't remember which. It entertained me for 10 minutes tops.

    Some of the other apps look like shopping apps that probably have browser versions by now. Ikea app? Oh, boy!

    People obsessed with apps should never have bought BB10. I have never claimed otherwise.

    My point stands. What mainstream, essential apps were missing apart from Netflix?

    Posted via CB10
    The problem is that the "app gap" is different for everyone else and that thread proves it (even today you see people ask how to use some random app with Cobalt's method). People have different needs; while some app needs seem trivial to you, to some it may be a key app.

    Also, needs change. While today, I may not need app X, maybe tomorrow I will. Even in 2013, iOS/Android would have been a better long term investment in terms of continued support.
    02-12-17 04:12 PM
  17. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    The problem is that the "app gap" is different for everyone else and that thread proves it (even today you see people ask how to use some random app with Cobalt's method). People have different needs; while some app needs seem trivial to you, to some it may be a key app.

    Also, needs change. While today, I may not need app X, maybe tomorrow I will. Even in 2013, iOS/Android would have been a better long term investment in terms of continued support.
    Exactly.

    Even if Netflix was that only app (it wasn't), it was a gap for some folks.

    I remember the consternation on Android when Netflix was an iOS-exclusive. Plenty of folks left.

    Now, extrapolate for individual gaps, and you have a real problem.
    Last edited by Tre Lawrence; 02-12-17 at 04:45 PM.
    02-12-17 04:23 PM
  18. early2bed's Avatar
    I don't know about you but I have been storing all of my savings in the cloud for decades. It exists no where else. In fact, I'm pretty sure if I asked for all of it they wouldn't be able to give it to me. Even if they did give me all the cash, it would just be Federal reserve notes that are not backed by any hard assets such as gold. Yet I still sleep soundly for some reason.
    02-12-17 04:32 PM
  19. ssbtech's Avatar
    My point stands. What mainstream, essential apps were missing apart from Netflix?
    Posted via CB10
    It's not just the mainstream essential apps, it's all the little ones that people like to use. Like that silly app that lets you control what colour your LED lightbulb is.

    I will say this, with BB10 I'm far less likely to buy peripheral gadgets and "app" controlled devices. It's sure saved me lots of money!
    02-12-17 04:39 PM
  20. conite's Avatar
    What a joke. Fiberlink? Square Register? You either didn't understand my question or changed it to suit your argument.

    Posted via CB10
    Those are make or break apps for many.

    "Square Point of Sale (formerly Register) is the free Android point-of-sale app that gives you everything you need to take payments and run your business."

    "With Fiberlink’s MaaS360 cloud-based offerings, IBM will expand its bring your own device (BYOD) capabilities to deliver a complete mobile management and security solution through IBM MobileFirst that includes trusted transactions and security intelligence capabilities for mobile apps, users, content and data."

    You seem to scoff at apps that don't apply to you personally.
    02-12-17 04:58 PM
  21. wingnut666's Avatar
    netflix worked until recently.

    Posted via CBX
    02-12-17 06:46 PM
  22. markmall's Avatar
    The problem is that the "app gap" is different for everyone else and that thread proves it (even today you see people ask how to use some random app with Cobalt's method). People have different needs; while some app needs seem trivial to you, to some it may be a key app.

    Also, needs change. While today, I may not need app X, maybe tomorrow I will. Even in 2013, iOS/Android would have been a better long term investment in terms of continued support.
    In 2017, yes, I want Uber and Lyft. (Uber has a good mobile version.) In 2017, I want certain dating apps. My point was that it was a different world in 2013.
    02-12-17 07:18 PM
  23. markmall's Avatar
    I don't know about you but I have been storing all of my savings in the cloud for decades. It exists no where else. In fact, I'm pretty sure if I asked for all of it they wouldn't be able to give it to me. Even if they did give me all the cash, it would just be Federal reserve notes that are not backed by any hard assets such as gold. Yet I still sleep soundly for some reason.
    You are delusional then. Of course, they would give you your cash. Only question is if you wanted two tens or a twenty.
    02-12-17 07:20 PM
  24. markmall's Avatar
    Those are make or break apps for many.

    "Square Point of Sale (formerly Register) is the free Android point-of-sale app that gives you everything you need to take payments and run your business."

    "With Fiberlink’s MaaS360 cloud-based offerings, IBM will expand its bring your own device (BYOD) capabilities to deliver a complete mobile management and security solution through IBM MobileFirst that includes trusted transactions and security intelligence capabilities for mobile apps, users, content and data."

    You seem to scoff at apps that don't apply to you personally.
    I'm sure they are great, but these are used by so few that they would not affect BB10. You and your cohort here can't see outside your tech world. Most people only use mainstream apps and don't do commerce through their smartphones -- even today and more so in 2013.
    02-12-17 07:23 PM
  25. conite's Avatar
    I'm sure they are great, but these are used by so few that they would not affect BB10. You and your cohort here can't see outside your tech world. Most people only use mainstream apps and don't do commerce through their smartphones -- even today and more so in 2013.
    Almost everyone out there has several must have apps for them. You want me to give you the name of some mega-app that everyone across the board uses. It doesn't work that way.

    I gave you a list of apps that cover hundreds of millions of users. BB10 had none of them.
    02-12-17 07:47 PM
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