[GadgetTravel]

I feel like I'm just repeating myself at this point, but I suppose nobody is going to read the whole thread when they just want to say their peace. I'm not in denial of BlackBerry's poor sales. Nobody needs google to do anything. Apple sure as hell didn't need google. You want google, that's all that boils down to. BlackBerry needs marketing, they've needed it for years, but they won't spend the money marketing their phones or buying technology websites to bash their competitors and rave about every stupid new feature in their phone like it's the best damn thing in world. Of course I'm referring to apple if you didn't catch that.

BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

Apple has their own ecosystem including a rich app selection. BB doesn't. That ecosystem is needed to sell phones. All the marketing in the world won't change that.

[Tre Lawrence]

Apple has their own ecosystem including a rich app selection. BB doesn't. That ecosystem is needed to sell phones. All the marketing in the world won't change that.

Exactly.

Funnily enough, way back in the day, Android folks used to complain about the lack of marketing too.

When that platform got a better app selection over time, it took care of itself.

[kgbbz10]

Apple has their own ecosystem including a rich app selection. BB doesn't. That ecosystem is needed to sell phones. All the marketing in the world won't change that.

Did ios have a million apps when it first came out?
Does the Xbox one have as many games as the 360?
Did apple and microsoft market the living hell out these products?
Marketing is key to selling a product. If you aren't telling people to buy then why would they?


BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

[Easypants]

Apple has their own ecosystem including a rich app selection. BB doesn't. That ecosystem is needed to sell phones. All the marketing in the world won't change that.

Yep this is the whole problem. You can't overcome this with a TV commercial.

This is why I think BlackBerry us going to try to pay a licensing fee for Google services and the Play store. They'll probably end up selling phones at breakeven as a result. In return BlackBerry is going to have to give something major up to Google in the way of enterprise security.

The long play would be getting bb phones back in the hands of consumers and getting them used to the OS and repairing brand.

Posted via CB10

[GadgetTravel]

Did ios have a million apps when it first came out?
Does the Xbox one have as many games as the 360?
Did apple and microsoft market the living hell out these products?
Marketing is key to selling a product. If you aren't telling people to buy then why would they?


BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

BB isn't competing against Apple of 2007 nor Android of 2009. In the competitive space BB is in not only are those apps available on those other devices but people have been using them for years. People have built workflows over the years using apps on those other devices. BB won't work for them.

[Nikidroid]

Yes, BlackBerry is not Android. So let's choose Android for fully support Google Services and updated apps and simple to switch off dial pad tone.

Posted via CB10

[Tre Lawrence]

No, it's an app issue. Both BlackBerry World and Amazon App Store are missing many of the key Android apps that users want. This is a situation where having 2 app stores still isn't cutting it.

Even the CEO acknowledges it's an app problem, so the positive news is that BBRY gets it.

[clickitykeys]

BlackBerry IS NOT Google

Honestly, these reactions to the slider rumor mill, are not adding much new information and turning Crackberry into an echo chamber.

[acovey]

To be honest I am on the verge of do not to caring. If Chen can make Droid secure and I will not have to give up story of my life to Google, and be able to manage app permission without loosing their core functionality than why not.
Just don't want to pay early adopter price, PlayBook experience was was more than enough for me.

Posted via CB10

I think the word your looking for is QUITTER, a BB with Android OS is NOT a BB.

[GadgetTravel]

I think the word your looking for is QUITTER, a BB with Android OS is NOT a BB.

Is a BB with BB10 not a BB? Or how about BBOS? BB is extremely likely to quit one thing either BB10 or handsets. Unless the September 30 post/thread is correct. Personally I would love to see a BB device with Android and a User interface that made it look like BB10 - Hub etc.

[southlander]

Blackberry gives them less of this data. It is less prone to data overages. It results in fewer phone upgrades at a huge markup, simply because people's phones dont really degrade or degenerate.

Does not exactly jibe with Verizon basically rolling out the red carpet and giving BlackBerry the exclusive "big splash" shot at responding to the first iPhone back in the day. Literally the coming "Storm" was so hyped it was unbelievable. All eyes were on BlackBerry. So why did the carriers push BlackBerry so hard at one time? If anything back then BlackBerry was actually a more private and less data using platform (BIS services) than it is now. BlackBerrys running BBOS were famously efficient on data use. Seems backwards in fitting with your theory.

I think the carriers like to sell what a) is easiest to support. Read... iPhones because Apple has excellent added support, the phones are fairly simple to use, and everyone can get support from others they know with iPhones. And b) what makes them money. Their money largely comes from locking you in to contracts, or has anyway. If you looked at the data I would bet the iPhone has the most loyal repeat subscriber rate with folks repeat-buying new ones each two years around this time, when new models are predictably released. That's why Apple makes it so predictable -- back to school/college/Christmas coming and folks flock in in droves.

Another source of profits for the carriers is ridiculous mark ups on accessories. $50 for a phone case you can get on AMZ for a little more than half that. So anything to reliably drive traffic and contract subs -- pushes up accessory sales as well.

[southlander]

So my fear of what they would have to sacrifice is security, allowing Google to take over every aspect of the phone just like it does with Android.

Security or privacy? Not the same thing. Googles services are secure.

[Jerry A]

Security or privacy? Not the same thing. Googles services are secure.

Exactly.

And it's not even about privacy. It's only about privacy when it comes to Google. I've heard some of the most ridiculous rationalizations on why it's acceptable for everyone else (BlackBerry included) to collect this data, but not Google.

Seriously, it's like if you don't actively hate Google around here, then you're not a "true" BlackBerry fan.

[southlander]

Exactly.

And it's not even about privacy. It's only about privacy when it comes to Google. I've heard some of the most ridiculous rationalizations on why it's acceptable for everyone else (BlackBerry included) to collect this data, but not Google.

Seriously, it's like if you don't actively hate Google around here, then you're not a "true" BlackBerry fan.

I don't claim to be an Android expert, but I can see on my G2 where I can turn off a lot of the Google data collection, location data, etc. Furthermore the Play store has various ad blockers, and I am sure even browsers that block ads. I'd be willing to bet if someone wants to, using Android, they can get by with no main Google apps, opt out of a lot of the data tracking, and even block ads.

Of course the carriers have their tracking agent installed on any phone you buy, even a BlackBerry. So your stuck with that.

[Superfly_FR]

So news flash: BlackBerry needs Google's Dev community to live another day.

I can live with those ...

[Ulferini Schusterotti]

Because they never have allowed anyone else to do so. Samsung isn't making an OS just the hardware. BlackBerry is making an OS like Amazon, and if a powerhorse like Amazon couldn't make a deal with Google I highly doubt BlackBerry can. Unless Google bought BlackBerry, but that would have been leaked already as it would be a huge deal and one that wouldn't remain a secret for this long.

BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

Every manufacturer like Samsung, LG, Motorola and even network providers like Verizon make deeeeeeep changes in the Android system and extend it with own frameworks, hardware specific drivers and their custom UI. This is the main reason why OS updates are delayed. BlackBerry will do exactly the same plus they have an agreement with Google to not use Google servers for some services but their own ones. That doesn't mean that YouTube or anything will be handled by BlackBerry servers but I believe certain sync and initial setup services will be managed by BlackBerry servers.

Posted via CB10

[Ulferini Schusterotti]

I think the word your looking for is QUITTER, a BB with Android OS is NOT a BB.

Is a BlackBerry with BB10 instead of BBOS also not a BlackBerry? Since BBOS is based on Java and BB10 is based on QNX which is based on Linux which Android is also based on? So in fact BlackBerry is no BlackBerry anymore since they released BB10. Right? ^^

Posted via CB10

[Jerry A]

It's your app problem honestly. They don't have the apps you prefer. Doesn't mean there's a lack of apps or a lack of quality apps, they just don't have one or two particular apps that you prefer to use.

Choosing a different OS than everyone else has it drawbacks and it's advantages. Whining and complaining like a 5 year old that the OS you choose doesn't have snapchat is ridiculous. I've heard it all over two years. If only BlackBerry had instagram more ppl would use it. If only BlackBerry had better access to Android apps that didn't have to be sideloaded.
Oh sure we can use instagram now and we can install it ota but if BlackBerry had a native instagram ppl would use it. Blah blah blah. You app hungry ppl will never be completely satisfied and are acting like you're entitled to everything. Which ironically enough was the point of the thread to begin with.

BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

It's not my app problem - it's BlackBerry's. It's directly led to their lack of success and the overall market failure of BB10.

I never said there was a lack of quality apps. All I said is that having 2 app stores, neither of which has all the apps consumers want doesn't solve the real issue.

Even BlackBerry recognizes that fact and it appears they're taking steps to rectify that.

[fschmeck]

..if a powerhorse like Amazon couldn't make a deal with Google I highly doubt BlackBerry can.

One difference though is that Amazon directly competes with Google in areas that Google wishes to dominate. Amazon harvests and holds tons of consumer data, which they can leverage for advertising. They also do cloud storage/server hosting.

BlackBerry isn't a threat to Google, except they do have leverage in one area where Google is not much of a player: corporate security. Google partnering with BlackBerry gives them an in to the corporate/government side IMO.

I'm betting lots of corporate /government clients who would not trust Google might be swayed by something with the BlackBerry name on it.

Posted via CB10

[Jerry A]

The bottom line is that it seems that unless BB somehow manages full Android capabilities it has insufficient apps to generate adequate sales to continue the handset business.

That's pretty much what almost everyone else is saying.

The rest appear to be mad at the world for this slice of reality.

[kgbbz10]

Every manufacturer like Samsung, LG, Motorola and even network providers like Verizon make deeeeeeep changes in the Android system and extend it with own frameworks, hardware specific drivers and their custom UI. This is the main reason why OS updates are delayed. BlackBerry will do exactly the same plus they have an agreement with Google to not use Google servers for some services but their own ones. That doesn't mean that YouTube or anything will be handled by BlackBerry servers but I believe certain sync and initial setup services will be managed by BlackBerry servers.
Posted via CB10

Deeeep changes huh? You do know it's been repeated that Google has deeeeeeeeeep control over their OS and doesn't allow this right? Sure it may have a slightly different face or a different app selection (samsung apps) but it has to meet Google's standards. There's even the articles about Google putting samsung in their place for selling samsung phones in China without Google play services and Google said nope no more.

Is a BlackBerry with BB10 instead of BBOS also not a BlackBerry? Since BBOS is based on Java and BB10 is based on QNX which is based on Linux which Android is also based on? So in fact BlackBerry is no BlackBerry anymore since they released BB10. Right? ^^

Posted via CB10

So you think because the qnx kernel is linux and it isn't 100% based on java that makes it an android? So is my linux OS on my PC an android OS? Must be by your logic. Smh.

BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

[Ecm]

Closed for review. Stand by.

[Ecm]

[WARN]Please discuss the topic in a civil manner! No personal comments are required or acceptable. Keep the language clean.

The off topic and off colour stuff (and where it's been quoted) has been deleted.[/WARN]

[kgbbz10]

I didn't think anyone was out of line, and I'm a big boy I can handle those few attacks that weren't even bad lol. Obviously CB has very high standards, unless you are straight bashing BlackBerry on these forums then it's all good. I wonder if I go on AndroidCentral and straight bash Android if that would be exceptable. In any case I'm tired of my posts being deleted constantly so I'm done with my opinions. I must have annoyed the mods I guess.

BBClassic10.3.2.2639-799Radio

[lift]

Deeeep changes huh? You do know it's been repeated that Google has deeeeeeeeeep control over their OS and doesn't allow this right? Sure it may have a slightly different face or a different app selection (samsung apps) but it has to meet Google's standards. There's even the articles about Google putting samsung in their place for selling samsung phones in China without Google play services and Google said nope no more.

There are a ton of people out there that don't understand just how much control Google has over android. There are a lot of prerequisites that must be met for the device to use android.
Just take a look at this link and make sure you catch your jaw as it drops.
Secret Ties in Google's "Open" Android