04-20-17 11:07 PM
66 123
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  1. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    No matter...if BlackBerry is unwilling (an obvious candidate through bb10) , someone else may very well jump in on this retail platform appstore Monopoly/Duopoly issue. The crack is obviously there in Google's, and by extension Apple's model, dragging both and the dominant/top Apps sellers (like netflix,snap, etc) into a potential fray..or then again maybe nobody picks up on this, and lets sleeping dogs lie for whatever reasons.
    04-18-17 07:25 PM
  2. conite's Avatar
    No matter...if BlackBerry is unwilling (an obvious candidate through bb10) , someone else may very well jump in on this retail platform appstore Monopoly/Duopoly issue. The crack is obviously there in Google's, and by extension Apple's model, dragging both and the dominant/top Apps sellers (like netflix,snap, etc) into a potential fray..or then again maybe nobody picks up on this, and lets sleeping dogs lie for whatever reasons.
    Yup, nothing that a tiny crack and a $100 billion dollars can't solve.
    04-18-17 07:27 PM
  3. Gamesmania Mania's Avatar
    Why everyone still hope BlackBerry 10 going back. Jhon C has indicated no more BlackBerry 10. And all ecosystems application like Whatsapp, LinkedIn etc not support bb10 anymore. BB 10 OS is the one that I like it so much no other OS for me. But logically I must move to other because I have connected to other not only with BBM and get other information not only by browser. So long sad to leave but I am still keep my BB 10 for my good memory
    04-18-17 08:30 PM
  4. app_Developer's Avatar
    No matter...if BlackBerry is unwilling (an obvious candidate through bb10) , someone else may very well jump in on this retail platform appstore Monopoly/Duopoly issue. The crack is obviously there in Google's, and by extension Apple's model, dragging both and the dominant/top Apps sellers (like netflix,snap, etc) into a potential fray..or then again maybe nobody picks up on this, and lets sleeping dogs lie for whatever reasons.
    Netflix doesn't care about BB10. Banks don't care about BB10. Half of Uber have probably never even heard of BB10.

    BB10 fans care about BB10. Netflix really just cares that they can make 2 apps and reach 99% of their smartphone and tablet wielding customers. Same story with the major international banks.

    If Apple and Google fail to support developers well, then other choices will emerge. But it doesn't make sense for us to speculatively invest in every tiny OS on the off-chance that Apple and Google both suddenly decide against supporting developers properly.

    Nokia and BlackBerry had extremely limited platforms when they dominated the market. That was the reason developers flocked to Apple. It wasn't to support little old Apple against big bad Nokia or big bad BlackBerry. It was simply because Apple allowed us to make new apps that we couldn't make on Symbian or BBOS.

    What app can you make on BB10 that you can't already make on iOS or Android?
    BigBadWulf and Blacklatino like this.
    04-18-17 08:31 PM
  5. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar

    What app can you make on BB10 that you can't already make on iOS or Android?
    A healthy competitive marketplace, with more than just two players. Anyone remember the breakup of AT&T or was before most of you were born?
    Jake2826 likes this.
    04-18-17 08:55 PM
  6. conite's Avatar
    A healthy competitive marketplace, with more than just two players. Anyone remember the breakup of AT&T or was before most of you were born?
    App developers don't want more platforms to code for. Spreading resources diminishes the quality of the product.
    04-18-17 09:02 PM
  7. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    App developers don't want more platforms to code for. Spreading resources diminishes the quality of the product.
    Refer to the "Apple 1984 ad" that i posted previously, for a concise response to that assertion. App developers don't dictate markets, they do what the market demands, and free markets demand healthy competition.
    elfabio80 and Jake2826 like this.
    04-18-17 09:15 PM
  8. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Refer to the "Apple 1984 ad" that i posted previously, for a concise response to that assertion. App developers don't dictate markets, they do what the market demands, and free markets demand healthy competition.
    Free markets demand healthy competition and feel satisfied with Android/IOS. Free markets kicked BB10, WP, Symbian and PalmOS to proverbial curb.

    Posted via CB10
    BigBadWulf and Blacklatino like this.
    04-18-17 09:22 PM
  9. conite's Avatar
    Refer to the "Apple 1984 ad" that i posted previously, for a concise response to that assertion. App developers don't dictate markets, they do what the market demands, and free markets demand healthy competition.
    A functioning mobile platform market also abhors fragmentation.

    Users like to be compatible with each other and with all of the gadgets.
    04-18-17 09:25 PM
  10. DrBoomBotz's Avatar
    Free markets demand healthy competition and feel satisfied with Android/IOS. Free markets kicked BB10, WP, Symbian and PalmOS to proverbial curb.

    Posted via CB10
    Free markets tend to end up as duopolies only because monopolies aren't tolerated.
    04-18-17 09:59 PM
  11. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    Free markets tend to end up as duopolies only because monopolies aren't tolerated. How many players is enough for you?
    I'd love more than just two, but, I understand the reasons we end up at these outcomes. Whether it be Linux in desktop or WP in mobile, in OS land, third player is Window (pun??) dressing...

    Posted via CB10
    04-18-17 10:04 PM
  12. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Free markets demand healthy competition and feel satisfied with Android/IOS. Free markets kicked BB10, WP, Symbian and PalmOS to proverbial curb.

    Posted via CB10
    Free markets kicked GM and Chrysler to the curb along with other major financial institutions in the 2008 meltdown, and yet there goes a Dodge Caravan down the road as I write, and some of those institutions seem to have stabilized. The markets dictated that they should have been picked up with the trash long ago....yet another factor in the free market conditions kicks in, anybody know? besides "too big to fail"...yes healthy competition. Kicking to the curb, is not the end-goal of free-market competition. But we go back to the old argument of "os" vs application software, Microsoft indeed should have been busted up way back when, but managed to wiggle out of that correction. We have arrived at nearly the same type of problem again this time on smartphones "os" and "store" vs application software, and access, for a healthy marketplace. Compounded of course by the Google api's issues.
    04-18-17 10:56 PM
  13. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Yup, nothing that a tiny crack and a $100 billion dollars can't solve.
    Don't think, that if there is so much as a wiff of things not naturally occuring that ended up with today's conditions, then the mythical amount needed to correct the duopoly would likely come out of one or both remaining players, possibly some manufacturers and perhaps some of the major app makers, and maybe others.
    04-18-17 11:14 PM
  14. joeldf's Avatar
    Free markets kicked GM and Chrysler to the curb along with other major financial institutions in the 2008 meltdown, and yet there goes a Dodge Caravan down the road as I write, and some of those institutions seem to have stabilized. The markets dictated that they should have been picked up with the trash long ago....yet another factor in the free market conditions kicks in, anybody know? besides "too big to fail"...yes healthy competition. Kicking to the curb, is not the end-goal of free-market competition. But we go back to the old argument of "os" vs application software, Microsoft indeed should have been busted up way back when, but managed to wiggle out of that correction. We have arrived at nearly the same type of problem again this time on smartphones "os" and "store" vs application software, and access, for a healthy marketplace. Compounded of course by the Google api's issues.
    I can't disagree with you on how it should be.

    Reality is very different.

    I'd like more than one cable company to chose from. But, since Dish and DirecTV are technically "available" to me, the system is happy that Cox is the only hard-wire cable company available in my city.
    04-18-17 11:28 PM
  15. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    You actually make my point somewhat....you have three alternatives to choose from....that's a freer market. Surprised your local telephone company doesn't also offer through fibre-optic?(4th)... and you can also throw in digital rabbit ears(5th), and on-line television subscriptions through the internet(several additional), so plenty of ways to serve you television programming and multiple storefronts.
    04-18-17 11:47 PM
  16. joeldf's Avatar
    You actually make my point somewhat....you have three alternatives to choose from....that's a freer market. Surprised your local telephone company doesn't also offer through fibre-optic?(4th)... and you can also throw in digital rabbit ears(5th), and on-line television subscriptions through the internet(several additional), so plenty of ways to serve you television programming and multiple storefronts.
    In my case, the local telephone company is AT&T. Which owns DirecTV. Fiber is only installed in part of town. Not where I am. But we did switch from Cox to DirecTV.

    For internet, we actually kept Cox, because all that is available to my house through AT&T/DirecTV is a paltry 6Mbps DSL connection (because we are at the far limits of the nearest switching station).

    I don't like satellite because in South Louisiana, we get heavy rains a lot that cuts out our signal. We'd love to cord cut altogether, except there are still a few cable networks that we watch that have little to no streaming options. That may change someday but it's not here yet. There is another all fiber cable company in the next parish over. They are local, but Cox has their teeth in Baton Rouge, so our options are severely limited.

    I don't like that BB10 is fading away, but it is what it is.

    Joel
    04-19-17 01:06 AM
  17. anon(10173658)'s Avatar
    I am a BB10 fan so someone who is hanging on with blind hope that they resurrect the OS... but they are not going to do so, not just because they cannot keep up with IOS or Android from an App point of view but just look at the Blackberry specific aspects for BB10:

    BB10 phones:

    1. Beta OS forum now removed.
    2. No longer producing hardware.
    3. OS team I guess made redundant as they are now purely producing apps for Android not BB10.
    4. Blackberry store has phones to purchase, except KeyOne and having flash sales constantly to remove stock.
    5. Official support forums removed with Crackberry now taking over.

    Match that against the new KeyOne and its even clearer that BB is just software and are not going to do anything else:

    1. Hardware subcontracted - TCL not BB.
    2. OS subcontracted - Android not BB10.
    3. Sales subcontracted - Carphone warehouse are linked to the new BB website, so no online store (UK wise anyway).
    4. Support subcontracted - Its not clear who will support Keyone, Hardware might be TCL direct, Android ?, Apps ?

    So you can see that support, hardware, sales and OS all sub-contracted out, they are just a software company, the current Blackberry store website will be next once all BB10 phones have gone, think the Leap and Classic have already sold out anyway, then BB World will disappear and we will be left with the one / new website (blackberrymobile.com) which is pure Android apps and links to suppliers and support.

    The remanence of BB of old will be gone.
    Last edited by edhdurham; 04-19-17 at 07:48 AM.
    Uzi and Dunt Dunt Dunt like this.
    04-19-17 06:08 AM
  18. keyboardweeb's Avatar
    What should stop bb10 from running Google Play apps within an Android sandbox/or Virtual machine within BB10?
    System resources. The same app would perform more poorly simply because of the sandbox/compatibility layer/whatever layer is between the app and the OS.

    Financial resources. Maintaining such a compatibility layer is time-consuming and expensive. Why do you think it hasn't been updated in all this time?
    xandros9 likes this.
    04-19-17 11:27 AM
  19. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    I am a BB10 fan so someone who is hanging on with blind hope that they resurrect the OS... but they are not going to do so, not just because they cannot keep up with IOS or Android from an App point of view but just look at the Blackberry specific aspects for BB10:

    BB10 phones:

    1. Beta OS forum now removed.
    2. No longer producing hardware.
    3. OS team I guess made redundant as they are now purely producing apps for Android not BB10.
    4. Blackberry store has phones to purchase, except KeyOne and having flash sales constantly to remove stock.
    5. Official support forums removed with Crackberry now taking over.

    Match that against the new KeyOne and its even clearer that BB is just software and are not going to do anything else:

    1. Hardware subcontracted - TCL not BB.
    2. OS subcontracted - Android not BB10.
    3. Sales subcontracted - Carphone warehouse are linked to the new BB website, so no online store (UK wise anyway).
    4. Support subcontracted - Its not clear who will support Keyone, Hardware might be TCL direct, Android ?, Apps ?

    So you can see that support, hardware, sales and OS all sub-contracted out, they are just a software company, the current Blackberry store website will be next once all BB10 phones have gone, think the Leap and Classic have already sold out anyway, then BB World will disappear and we will be left with the one / new website (blackberrymobile.com) which is pure Android apps and links to suppliers and support.

    The remanence of BB of old will be gone.
    The audacity of BlackBerry to do this without prior notice is what galls me.

    Um, that's right, BlackBerry did tell everyone this was happening for quite awhile. Yes, they've been saying this for awhile now.

    BlackBerry is just a software company.....


    Posted via CB10
    04-19-17 07:28 PM
  20. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    The audacity of BlackBerry to do this without prior notice is what galls me.
    Um, that's right, BlackBerry did tell everyone this was happening for quite awhile. Yes, they've been saying this for awhile now.
    BlackBerry is just a software company.....
    Posted via CB10
    ...and what's to stop a Software Company from having its own AppStore..BlackBerryWorld...(besides a collossal duopoly...where's that movie poster of Independence Day again) ..seems a natural fit....for all its platforms, including a competitive selection of 'android origin' apps for its advanced bb10 platform...considering we are now in a duopoly situation otherwise.
    04-19-17 07:54 PM
  21. Chuck Finley69's Avatar
    ...and what's to stop a Software Company from having its own AppStore..BlackBerryWorld...(besides a collossal duopoly...where's that movie poster of Independence Day again) ..seems a natural fit....for all its platforms, including a competitive selection of 'android origin' apps for its advanced bb10 platform...considering we are now in a duopoly situation otherwise.
    Why??

    Posted via CB10
    04-19-17 08:00 PM
  22. BigBadWulf's Avatar
    Why??

    Posted via CB10
    Chuck, you're obviously having difficulty connecting dots. Think underpants gnomes.
    04-19-17 09:40 PM
  23. conite's Avatar
    Why??

    Posted via CB10
    Because they must pour money into a failed, redundant, appstore.

    It's our only defence against Google and Apple laying waste to the planet.
    anon(9803228) likes this.
    04-19-17 09:59 PM
  24. app_Developer's Avatar
    A healthy competitive marketplace, with more than just two players. Anyone remember the breakup of AT&T or was before most of you were born?
    Is that an app?

    It's hard to imagine investing millions of dollars for a tiny number of users on the off chance that Apple and Google suddenly lose their minds simultaneously.

    And even if Google tries to abuse their market power v. us, their/our users aren't going to go out and buy BB10 phones anyway. So what leverage have we really bought with our investment in a BB10 for this handful of users?

    Again, this platform might have been interesting if we could have built something new on BB10 that was a step beyond our other apps. That's why many of us supported iPhone when there were only about 2-3MM iPhones. There were few users, but the apps were amazing compared to what we could make with Symbian or BBOS. That was enough to get developers to give iPhone a shot.

    BlackBerry offered us nothing more than port your app over here with zero additional functionality and you can support a tiny number of new users. Yay.

    What harm is this duopoly doing to developers? I understand there is harm done to fans of BB10. But what real measurable cost is there to developers? If someone made a better platform for developers, the duopoly would end, just as Symbian and BBOS fell from their dominance. No one has made that better platform yet.
    BigBadWulf likes this.
    04-19-17 11:48 PM
  25. i_plod_an_dr_void's Avatar
    Because they must pour money into a failed, redundant, appstore.

    It's our only defence against Google and Apple laying waste to the planet.
    Nope. Duopolies are bad. Cartels hate free markets, and Free markets hate cartels, - i think that might sum it up.
    04-19-17 11:50 PM
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