05-22-14 06:37 PM
65 123
tools
  1. LaurentKP's Avatar
    Hello

    I'm a long time BB developer (well actually since 2010). I'm french so please excuse my english...

    My first motivation when I started BB development was making money. And sorry to be honest but it still is. I'm trying to develop quality apps and I've spend so many times to build my apps that I can't stand giving it to the community. Mobile development is most of the time complex. I know I can get satisfaction when I see an app working on my device after several hours of developement but I prefer to enjoy myself when the money is coming in my wallet.

    I know developers who make money on BB10. Even with paid apps.
    It's hard but not impossible...
    qbo, Superfly_FR and FF22 like this.
    01-24-14 06:50 AM
  2. qbo's Avatar
    Reading the comment I left last night, my English is really not good.. lol

    Developer of Corky Notes, Lazy Lists, and MAKE
    01-24-14 07:07 AM
  3. abass's Avatar
    You are right in saying devs need to give before we ask for money and I think it's completely acceptable. Alexs' coffee scenario is great reason why. When someone's buying a cup of coffee, they generally know what they'll get and they know and are comfortable enough to ask for a refund if the quality is terrible. When an app asks for $2 without a trial, I can understand why users might be more hesitant to purchase it than a cup of coffee. Some people venture off and try a new drink at a new cafe once in a while but the reality is, most don't. This is exactly why I believe brand value is extremely important in app market.

    To improve this situation for devs who don't really care about building brands but still have one awesome app, you can again look at the coffee example. Just like you'll try a new drink at a new coffee joint when a friend or many friends recommend it, if you can see your bbm contacts' recommendation (reviews, number of bbm friends downloaded, etc.) on an app when you visit the app description page, people will be more willing to take the risk. Plus, more often than not, they'll find themselves enjoying their purchase.

    Google does this amazingly in google play store but their only problem is, you'll rarely find an app your google+ friend recommended because there's just so many apps..

    Developer of Corky Notes, Lazy Lists, and MAKE
    I like that example a LOT. Thank you for bringing it up, it makes such total sense yet I haven't hear it quite like that before.

    While I completely agree with everything you said, I guess my only complaint really that still stands is HOW much really is a person valuing a potential app?

    Yes, even having no idea on what the outcome will be, having to just go off solely from reviews of an App (yes, many devs completely manipulate this and deny every single 4/3/2/1 star review - which annoys me greatly. You can only REALLY tell if an app is legitimately good if it has hundreds of reviews and if those reviews consist of the occasional 4/3/2/1 star reviews, because not everyone will always be 100% happy with your App and it's their right to. By devs denying every single review that isn't perfect, it hurts the community perception overall.) But I digress (sorry, minor rant in the middle).

    But yes, you know what you are getting when you buy that coffee for $2, I completely agree. But now how much exactly do you value that coffee? Now you're afraid to spend $1 to take a chance on an app with great reviews? At this point, I strongly believe that what solely keeps the person away from taking the chance is the large misconception that developers are making insane amounts of money for their Apps. They think "sure, it's just $1, but the developer probably has 100,000 people giving him a dollar for the App. Therefore they must be rich and because of that I don't feel that I should have to pay for it." because at this point they feel like they are being manipulated and taken advantage of. That mindset is truly something that I believe many people are subject to which is just totally not the case 99.9% of the time.

    While I completely agree with your example and it just makes so much sense, what I'm trying to say here is that people have many misconceptions of the industry and it's getting hurt more and more each day as more Apps go "free". People begin expecting everything to be free when realistically that's perfectly fine for a service like Twitter or words with friends because that's their business model. They are taking such a huge chance trying to scale so large that it will eventually pay off, but that business model is not realistic for the majority of Apps or developers out there. Yet people will continue to just see it as "this app is free and your app should be too." Though can ANY niche apps ever exist with this business model? No, not really. The completely free business model is for the most broad number of people going off of the most common denominator. People are just too quick to compare a niche app with a mass-scale one and that's why they are afraid to pay a couple of dollars.. They are misinformed and the industry has essentially formed this now almost innate feeling to people that all apps SHOULD be free.

    So yes, knowing that you are going to get is HUGE in making a purchade, but I feel it's also skewed in people's minds because the industry makes them think/feel this way. People will take the risk on purchasing a $15-40 game for their system or computer without putting much input into it from friend recommendations or reviews because they are conditioned to believe that if the game is being sold for that kind of money, chances are it's worth it in some way. I am saying this from personal experience and from others. I have gambled $20 on a computer game that simply looks good from the screenshots. Sometimes it fails completely and that was my choice. But most of the time it goes very well and the game is great! No matter the outcome, I don't go run to the dev and try to get a refund. People are just afraid to spend any amount of money on apps because they have been so conditioned to not do so to by the industry. (I'm saying this from personal experience as well, again, 5 years ago I was quite hesitant to spend $1-2 on an app, somehow it's just so easy to feel like it's so much money, but in reality it's such a small amount of money to risk in some cases for something that you want/need).

    Charging for something has been so destroyed over the years in this industry and it has just become so difficult to compete. A large company can push out a free app and make back their money over time. Most apps are just made by one person though not backed behind a large company name, because of thos, that free now and monitize later strategy just isn't possible for most.

    Why should a game for your system be expected to be $60 and a game on your phone gets laughed at if the developer tries to charge $5? Is it simply based on the graphics? Because at times the App dev may have put more into developing than the console dev did. People are just too afraid to charge money for quality apps and that has been detrimental to the industry for it's growth. There'd be so many more devs jumping on board and SOOO many more creative niche apps if it weren't for this.

    (sorry, I totally rambled a lot here) :x

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)
    Last edited by Flip4Bytes; 01-24-14 at 08:25 AM.
    Superfly_FR and nonesuchnick like this.
    01-24-14 08:07 AM
  4. anon(5906760)'s Avatar
    I remember seeing this app. But I saw it didn't have a C++ option and that's what I was working on so I didn't really need it. I'd really like to learn html though, and coming from a java background (which is slowly becoming extinct lol) I'm hoping this app can help me move to something that is even more universal than java (used to be I guess lol).

    I'll give it a try. For 2 bucks, it's cheaper than a "for dummies book" and I don't even have to go out and buy it lol.

    But yea, I think it would get a lot more attention If you included some c++ and cascades as well. Since that is bb10s true "native " code.

    Posted via CB10
    abass likes this.
    01-24-14 08:29 AM
  5. tatail's Avatar
    I don't know anything about programming and I don't think I will use this app. But, I did download and paid to unlock the features and support you for developing for BlackBerry 10.
    On a quick glance your app looks built for BlackBerry nice and clean.

    Good luck

    Posted via CB10
    abass likes this.
    01-24-14 08:40 AM
  6. whofrank's Avatar
    I remember seeing this app. But I saw it didn't have a C++ option and that's what I was working on so I didn't really need it. I'd really like to learn html though, and coming from a java background (which is slowly becoming extinct lol) I'm hoping this app can help me move to something that is even more universal than java (used to be I guess lol).

    I'll give it a try. For 2 bucks, it's cheaper than a "for dummies book" and I don't even have to go out and buy it lol.

    But yea, I think it would get a lot more attention If you included some c++ and cascades as well. Since that is bb10s true "native " code.

    Posted via CB10
    the app centers on web design.
    01-24-14 08:47 AM
  7. abass's Avatar
    I remember seeing this app. But I saw it didn't have a C++ option and that's what I was working on so I didn't really need it. I'd really like to learn html though, and coming from a java background (which is slowly becoming extinct lol) I'm hoping this app can help me move to something that is even more universal than java (used to be I guess lol).

    I'll give it a try. For 2 bucks, it's cheaper than a "for dummies book" and I don't even have to go out and buy it lol.

    But yea, I think it would get a lot more attention If you included some c++ and cascades as well. Since that is bb10s true "native " code.

    Posted via CB10
    Yes, but you have to see where I'm coming from as a developer. My full-time job is web design, it's what I'm passionate about, it's what I'm a expert in. While my app was made in Cascades using QML, I am not even close to being an expert in C++, even QML can get quite complex at times. I would not feel comfortable whatsoever making an app for those languages. HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript though, I know like the back of my hand. I've actually had people email me from the app about general web design question and I am more than happy to answer most of them.

    Just because I am a developer doesn't mean that I am an expert in everything. I made this App because it's on a subject that I am very passionate about. If I were to try and make an app or add C++/QML to it, not only would it no longer feel like a hobby to me, it would entirely just be a business venture and I'd be miserable. A business venture another niche market.

    You guys need to understand that apps like this aren't and won't continue to pop up for all of these different coding languages simply because it's made impossible to be profitable doing so at the moment. And no, I am not going to make one for every language out there either.. The ONLY reason this app exists is because I enjoy these languages SO much that I felt it would be enjoyable sharing my knowledge with people and trying to help them learn.

    I get so many emails "nice app, but why won't you add PHP?" or "I enjoy the app, hut when are you going to make one for Ruby?" people don't realize that above the 700-800 hours it takes to make an App like this, MUCH of it is only possible if you are truly passionate and have a great understanding of the language. So I might as well announce it here, I apologize and hope you can understand where I'm coming from, but I have no plans on making a Ruby or C++ extension of this App. I'm sorry, but that would destroy this hobby of mine and I'd no longer enjoy it. Any amount of money is simply not worth it to me. I did not get into app development solely to make money and I'm not going to start now.

    I appreciate your support for my app though. Thank you for helping me out (:

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)
    01-24-14 08:58 AM
  8. abass's Avatar
    I don't know anything about programming and I don't think I will use this app. But, I did download and paid to unlock the features and support you for developing for BlackBerry 10.
    On a quick glance your app looks built for BlackBerry nice and clean.

    Good luck

    Posted via CB10
    Can't thank you enough. I did not respond to this thread to try and guilt people into buying my app, I'm simply trying to inform people of what this industry is really like for many of us. Not to complain, to simply educate those of you don't know what it's actually like right now for atleast a genuine native BlackBerry developer.

    I really appreciate that you can appreciate the amount of work I put into the app even if you can't really utilize it. I spent WAY too many hours trying to make it as "pretty" and functional as possible. I'm one of those devs that cares WAY too much about things being pixel perfect almost to a fault. I tried very hard to make it as functional as possible and really appreciate when people notice and can appreciate it themselves. (:

    Thank you for your support

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)
    01-24-14 09:05 AM
  9. anon(5906760)'s Avatar
    Yes, but you have to see where I'm coming from as a developer. My full-time job is web design, it's what I'm passionate about, it's what I'm a expert in. While my app was made in Cascades using QML, I am not even close to being an expert in C++, even QML can get quite complex at times. I would not feel comfortable whatsoever making an app for those languages. HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript though, I know like the back of my hand. I've actually had people email me from the app about general web design question and I am more than happy to answer most of them.

    Just because I am a developer doesn't mean that I am an expert in everything. I made this App because it's on a subject that I am very passionate about. If I were to try and make an app or add C++/QML to it, not only would it no longer feel like a hobby to me, it would entirely just be a business venture and I'd be miserable. A business venture another niche market.

    You guys need to understand that apps like this aren't and won't continue to pop up for all of these different coding languages simply because it's made impossible to be profitable doing so at the moment. And no, I am not going to make one for every language out there either.. The ONLY reason this app exists is because I enjoy these languages SO much that I felt it would be enjoyable sharing my knowledge with people and trying to help them learn.

    I get so many emails "nice app, but why won't you add PHP?" or "I enjoy the app, hut when are you going to make one for Ruby?" people don't realize that above the 700-800 hours it takes to make an App like this, MUCH of it is only possible if you are truly passionate and have a great understanding of the language. So I might as well announce it here, I apologize and hope you can understand where I'm coming from, but I have no plans on making a Ruby or C++ extension of this App. I'm sorry, but that would destroy this hobby of mine and I'd no longer enjoy it. Any amount of money is simply not worth it to me. I did not get into app development solely to make money and I'm not going to start now.

    I appreciate your support for my app though. Thank you for helping me out (:

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)
    I understand where you're coming from, I'm just giving you my 5 cents (I had to round up from 2 cents because we don't have pennies in Canada anymore :'( )

    From what I've read so far, it's a good tutorial that gives you a good starting point to start working with html 5.

    All the "�<!*/" in html used to confuse the f*** out of me but this really does make it easier lol.

    Another problem is that I don't think people really notice what the "full version" gives you. I thought the whole app was a cheat sheet when I first DLed it which didn't help me because I had no idea what was going on lol. Maybe include the intro chapter in the free version as well and include that it has an in-depth tutorial in the paid version and you might start getting some interest from normal people who are interested in how stuff actually works.

    Posted via CB10
    01-24-14 09:11 AM
  10. anon(5906760)'s Avatar
    I understand where you're coming from, I'm just giving you my 5 cents (I had to round up from 2 cents because we don't have pennies in Canada anymore :'( )

    From what I've read so far, it's a good tutorial that gives you a good starting point to start working with html 5.

    All the "�<!*/" in html used to confuse the f*** out of me but this really does make it easier lol.

    Another problem is that I don't think people really notice what the "full version" gives you. I thought the whole app was a cheat sheet when I first DLed it which didn't help me because I had no idea what was going on lol. Maybe include the intro chapter in the free version as well and include that it has an in-depth tutorial in the paid version and you might start getting some interest from normal people who are interested in how stuff actually works.

    Posted via CB10
    Oh no... html took over my post...

    Posted via CB10
    01-24-14 09:15 AM
  11. tatail's Avatar
    Can't thank you enough. I did not respond to this thread to try and guilt people into buying my app, I'm simply trying to inform people of what this industry is really like for many of us. Not to complain, to simply educate those of you don't know what it's actually like right now for atleast a genuine native BlackBerry developer.

    I really appreciate that you can appreciate the amount of work I put into the app even if you can't really utilize it. I spent WAY too many hours trying to make it as "pretty" and functional as possible. I'm one of those devs that cares WAY too much about things being pixel perfect almost to a fault. I tried very hard to make it as functional as possible and really appreciate when people notice and can appreciate it themselves. (:

    Thank you for your support

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)
    You are welcome and I am not saying that you did guilt me or anyone else into buying your app. I did it out of genuine respect for somebody who did something for something that I care about and invest in.

    I took a C++ course in my college days because we had to.. I enjoyed it but I didn't learn anything .
    abass likes this.
    01-24-14 10:56 AM
  12. SCrid2000's Avatar
    You were like some of those annoying kids nowadays who attend lectures only to have their eyes glued to Facebook and Instagram? ;p

    In my country, we used to get spanked with rulers (the ones made for spanking!) in the good old days if we misbehaved in class ;p

    Posted via CB10
    Huh? Lol, I'm just joking with Alex. Obviously, there weren't any human rights violations in the making of his app (unless I can prove it was made in a Chinese sweat shop!).
    And no, I didn't use Facebook and Instagram in class, but I did spend several class periods at law school developing some of my apps
    abass and Superfly_FR like this.
    01-24-14 11:07 AM
  13. nhanken's Avatar
    Was law school that boring? J/K lol. Yeah I know you were just joking because I don't think Alex can afford to hire a lawyer like you with his current app revenues. Maybe in a few years unless you want to work in his sweat shop for free

    Huh? Lol, I'm just joking with Alex. Obviously, there weren't any human rights violations in the making of his app (unless I can prove it was made in a Chinese sweat shop!).
    And no, I didn't use Facebook and Instagram in class, but I did spend several class periods at law school developing some of my apps
    It's very hard to do what we love as a full time job and I really like your niche-ness (if that is even a word ;p. Don't give up your passion even though you have a full time job as a Web developer =)
    Yes, but you have to see where I'm coming from as a developer. My full-time job is web design, it's what I'm passionate about, it's what I'm a expert in. While my app was made in Cascades using QML, I am not even close to being an expert in C++, even QML can get quite complex at times. I would not feel comfortable whatsoever making an app for those languages. HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript though, I know like the back of my hand. I've actually had people email me from the app about general web design question and I am more than happy to answer most of them.

    Just because I am a developer doesn't mean that I am an expert in everything. I made this App because it's on a subject that I am very passionate about. If I were to try and make an app or add C++/QML to it, not only would it no longer feel like a hobby to me, it would entirely just be a business venture and I'd be miserable. A business venture another niche market.

    You guys need to understand that apps like this aren't and won't continue to pop up for all of these different coding languages simply because it's made impossible to be profitable doing so at the moment. And no, I am not going to make one for every language out there either.. The ONLY reason this app exists is because I enjoy these languages SO much that I felt it would be enjoyable sharing my knowledge with people and trying to help them learn.

    I get so many emails "nice app, but why won't you add PHP?" or "I enjoy the app, hut when are you going to make one for Ruby?" people don't realize that above the 700-800 hours it takes to make an App like this, MUCH of it is only possible if you are truly passionate and have a great understanding of the language. So I might as well announce it here, I apologize and hope you can understand where I'm coming from, but I have no plans on making a Ruby or C++ extension of this App. I'm sorry, but that would destroy this hobby of mine and I'd no longer enjoy it. Any amount of money is simply not worth it to me. I did not get into app development solely to make money and I'm not going to start now.

    I appreciate your support for my app though. Thank you for helping me out (:

    - Developer of 'Web Design Cheat Sheet' for BB10 (Posted via CB10)



    Posted via CB10
    abass likes this.
    01-24-14 12:51 PM
  14. SCrid2000's Avatar
    Was law school that boring? J/K lol. Yeah I know you were just joking because I don't think Alex can afford to hire a lawyer like you with his current app revenues. Maybe in a few years unless you want to work in his sweat shop for free

    Posted via CB10
    He already makes me work in his sweat shop. I have to sneak out to post here.
    Help...
    01-24-14 05:14 PM
  15. abass's Avatar
    He already makes me work in his sweat shop. I have to sneak out to post here.
    Help...
    Shhhhh! Get back to work!
    SCrid2000 likes this.
    01-24-14 06:13 PM
  16. qbo's Avatar
    How do I get one of those elite "ambassador" badges for my CB profile?
    01-24-14 07:18 PM
  17. dkonigs's Avatar
    How do I get one of those elite "ambassador" badges for my CB profile?
    By seeking out every other unanswered (or poorly answered) thread on the forums, and making some snarky comment (that sounds high-and-mighty and appears helpful to a casual observer.) :-)
    SCrid2000 likes this.
    01-24-14 09:44 PM
  18. SCrid2000's Avatar
    By seeking out every other unanswered (or poorly answered) thread on the forums, and making some snarky comment (that sounds high-and-mighty and appears helpful to a casual observer.) :-)
    Lol, that does about sum it up
    You're also supposed to do useful tutorials at least once per month.
    I also do a lot of troll-patrol and report posts that I think are trolling, especially anti-BB trolling (it is a BlackBerry fan site after all), but that's just me.
    01-24-14 09:55 PM
  19. qbo's Avatar
    Interesting. What benefit do you get if you're an "ambassador"?
    01-24-14 11:57 PM
  20. SCrid2000's Avatar
    Interesting. What benefit do you get if you're an "ambassador"?
    One of those elite "ambassador" badges for your CB profile lol.
    Basically it's a thing Mobile Nations created to encourage people who were greeting new members, answering unanswered threads, and posting tutorials to continue to do so.
    The program is a good idea. I think the badge is more trouble than its worth though TBH, some have reported that it attracts trolls.
    Last edited by SCrid2000; 01-25-14 at 12:55 AM.
    01-25-14 12:35 AM
  21. Ragbert's Avatar
    What does the badge look like? Not sure it displays in the CB10 app.


    Posted via my Q10, still on 10.1.0.4189
    01-25-14 12:53 AM
  22. SCrid2000's Avatar
    What does the badge look like? Not sure it displays in the CB10 app.


    Posted via my Q10, still on 10.1.0.4189
    Just an orange rectangle that says Ambassador lol. No, CB app doesn't display them.
    01-25-14 12:56 AM
  23. Ragbert's Avatar
    Oh ok - I was just curious. :-)

    Just an orange rectangle that says Ambassador lol. No, CB app doesn't display them.

    Posted via my Q10, still on 10.1.0.4189
    01-25-14 12:59 AM
  24. qbo's Avatar
    Damn I want one

    Developer of Corky Notes, Lazy Lists, and MAKE
    01-25-14 04:02 AM
  25. SCrid2000's Avatar
    Damn I want one

    Developer of Corky Notes, Lazy Lists, and MAKE
    PM a moderator, can't hurt to ask.
    01-25-14 07:59 AM
65 123

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